Where the lands begin...

[bpdodge84]

What would be the most effective way to measure where the lands start in a barrel? I have recently started reloading and before I go any further with my loading I want to be sure of my bullet depth.

Weatherby Vanguard S2 .308 WIN and a Savage Axis .22-250 are the rifles in question.

Thanks in advance!!

[obsessed1]

With out any special tools you can seat a flat based bullet upside down and close your action on it. That will give you the measurement you are looking for...the other way is to seat the bullet normal then blacken with a match or candle then insert an measure the land mark (scratches)and adjust your dies as needed as long as you are careful with this method you can use the COAL measurements to adjust. Note because each bullet is different the measurement to the ogive will be different even though coal is the same length. Welcome to the reloading club

[obsessed1]

If you happen to live near gp I have precion mics for both those calibers that will help get those measurements you could use

[roger]

Shoot a weatherby with 10 mm of freebore and worry not about the whole issue, just longer or shorter

[hardy]

No crazy tools needed just a cleaning rod and some tape. First close the bolt on the rifle but make sure it's empty and cocked! Put the cleaning rod down the barrel till it touches the bolt face, put a piece of tape on the rod flush with the barrel. Next open the action and drop the bullet in question into the chamber(just the bullet not a loaded round) push on the back of the bullet with cleaning rod to snug it in there. Now carefully put the rod back down the barrel until it touches the bullet, put a piece of tape on the rod again flush with the muzzle and measure between the two points marked by the tape. That is the jam length for that bullet.

There will be small variance on loaded rounds because this method measures at the tip not the ogive but it has worked for me.

[260 Rem]

Probably the simplest method is to purchase a Hornady OAL Gauge, Comparator, bushings for the calibers you want to measure, and modified cases. I have no idea of current prices, but maybe a bit over a hundred dollars. These tools are not perfect, but will get you in the ball park within a few thou ... Just remember that number is is only "relative" as you still need to find the sweet spot for each bullet configuration ... by tinkering with different seating depths from the baseline established by the tools.

[Skytop B]

Does anyone else just use the Sinclair rod tool? It is incredibly simple and you use brass fired in your gun and your bullet. I have used it for a while and it seems accurate when compared to other methods.

[Mateo]

Or cut a small slit along the neck of an old case so your bullet can be inserted and removed by hand. Then seat a bullet extra long by hand, chamber it, and the lands will push the bulletin to the case. You need to be careful on extraction that nothing interferes with the bullet. Do it a bunch of times and you will come up with a measurement that keeps repeating itself, then you are good to go. Best part, it's free. No special tools, and any type of bullet can be used.

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by Skytop B

Does anyone else just use the Sinclair rod tool? It is incredibly simple and you use brass fired in your gun and your bullet. I have used it for a while and it seems accurate when compared to other methods.

i do basically the same thing with the bullet i plan to load with but not with that tool

http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod35491.aspx

[DaleJ]

Seat a flat base bullet upside down in a partially sized case. Carefully chamber round. When cartridge chambers with just a slight bit of resistance extract and measure overall length. The Stoney Point / Hornady gauge is a joke. You will never get the same measurement twice.

I find it amusing when someone states their bullet is seated .005" off the lands.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Skytop B

Does anyone else just use the Sinclair rod tool? It is incredibly simple and you use brass fired in your gun and your bullet. I have used it for a while and it seems accurate when compared to other methods.

I use it. It's a cheap way to get the correct answer.

[TangoKilo]

Originally Posted by Skytop B

Does anyone else just use the Sinclair rod tool? It is incredibly simple and you use brass fired in your gun and your bullet. I have used it for a while and it seems accurate when compared to other methods.

I'm on board with the Sinclair tool.
Cheap and simple, just like me


http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadin...prod35491.aspx

[260 Rem]

I think the " rod" style measurement has the potential to be quite accurate. Just keep in mind that the measurement is relative, so if you set your seating die up to a sweet spot that is .005 off the lands based on the AOL you establish ... Does it really matter if the "actual" distance is .009 .... as long as it shoots well?

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

I think the " rod" style measurement has the potential to be quite accurate. Just keep in mind that the measurement is relative, so if you set your seating die up to a sweet spot that is .005 off the lands based on the AOL you establish ... Does it really matter if the "actual" distance is .009 .... as long as it shoots well?

If you are .005 off the lands by "feel" you are likely into them. If that doesn't matter, then yes who cares.

[brobinson]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

Probably the simplest method is to purchase a Hornady OAL Gauge, Comparator, bushings for the calibers you want to measure, and modified cases. I have no idea of current prices, but maybe a bit over a hundred dollars. These tools are not perfect, but will get you in the ball park within a few thou ... Just remember that number is is only "relative" as you still need to find the sweet spot for each bullet configuration ... by tinkering with different seating depths from the baseline established by the tools.

I recently bought all the tools you listed above 260. The Staight OAL guage was around $50, the comparator kit came with a 8 of the common bushings for $50, and then each modified case I bought was about $10. I haven't used this stuff yet, but I have fooled around with it a bit and I think it will work just dandy for me. I bought 3 modified cases, so my cost was about $130 so your thinking about prices is very close.

[hardy]

I think any of the methods listed above will work fine! The only reason I prefer the "rod" method is that I do everything just once. No need to seat chamber seat chamber then average a bunch of diff numbers. I guess I'm just lazy hahaha!

[JCP]

Originally Posted by Mateo

Or cut a small slit along the neck of an old case so your bullet can be inserted and removed by hand. Then seat a bullet extra long by hand, chamber it, and the lands will push the bulletin to the case. You need to be careful on extraction that nothing interferes with the bullet. Do it a bunch of times and you will come up with a measurement that keeps repeating itself, then you are good to go. Best part, it's free. No special tools, and any type of bullet can be used.

This is what I do. A dremel to make a couple cuts is easy to do.

[Robmcleod82]

The sinclair tool is the cats pajamas. Then also purchase the tool to measure from the ogive. A small investment for accurate ammo

[bpdodge84]

So, there is more than 1 way to skin a cat, and more than 1 way to measure.

The method of inserting the flat based bullet upside down and chambering sounds pretty easy, but why not use the modified case ( slits cut for easier bullet extraction ), and chamber with the pointed end barrel side? Then measure the COAL? Is there not enough resistance to seat the bullet in the neck? Then measure the overall length and use that? I do get that the length of each bullet will vary but that should only affect the seated depth not overall length.

Please correct me if i am wrong...

Thanks for all the responses guys! I do enjoy having this wealth of knowledge that you all have and are willing to offer up!

[jkruse]

Wondering if some one with the Sinclair seating depth guage is able to tell me what diameter the bushing or is it bushings are that come standard with the depth gauge. I have the Gunwerks 7LRM with a 0.700 bolt sizeso may require a special bushing?
Thanks

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by Skytop B

Does anyone else just use the Sinclair rod tool? It is incredibly simple and you use brass fired in your gun and your bullet. I have used it for a while and it seems accurate when compared to other methods.

I use the sinclair.

[obsessed1]

Originally Posted by bpdodge84

So, there is more than 1 way to skin a cat, and more than 1 way to measure.

The method of inserting the flat based bullet upside down and chambering sounds pretty easy, but why not use the modified case ( slits cut for easier bullet extraction ), and chamber with the pointed end barrel side? Then measure the COAL? Is there not enough resistance to seat the bullet in the neck? Then measure the overall length and use that? I do get that the length of each bullet will vary but that should only affect the seated depth not overall length.

Please correct me if i am wrong...

Thanks for all the responses guys! I do enjoy having this wealth of knowledge that you all have and are willing to offer up!

By pushing a but bullet into the case ogive out ward(pointy end out) you can only measure the COAL this won't tell you the measurement too the lands necessarily. I don't worry about OAL at all the only measurement I make sure is consistent is the distance from the lands. This may result in slightly different I am as not all bullets are a exactly the same length.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by obsessed1

By pushing a but bullet into the case ogive out ward(pointy end out) you can only measure the COAL this won't tell you the measurement too the lands necessarily. I don't worry about OAL at all the only measurement I make sure is consistent is the distance from the lands. This may result in slightly different I am as not all bullets are a exactly the same length.

I take the actual bullet that I chamber to push the bullet into the case, and then I use that bullet to adjust my seating die approximately .010" or .050" shorter depending on the type of bullet. Doing this avoids the variation in bullet tips, from bullet to bullet. Then I experiment with the seating depth to see how it affects accuracy. I like the micrometer adjustable seating dies, because it makes it easy to adjust the seating depth in .005" increments, which is what I generally use. When I find the optimum seating depth, I just record the micrometer reading on the seating die, rather than the COL.

[obsessed1]

Your right elk I have also used that process but if you are looking for the actual measurement to the lands it it's tough to measure the bullet seated that way.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by obsessed1

Your right elk I have also used that process but if you are looking for the actual measurement to the lands it it's tough to measure the bullet seated that way.

The way that I see it, the precise measurement really doesn't matter, as long as I find the sweet spot for accuracy. Depending on the leade, and the particular bullet, you could probably push the bullet a few thousands of an inch into the lands and not realize it, using most methods.

[TUFFBUFF]

Originally Posted by obsessed1

By pushing a but bullet into the case ogive out ward(pointy end out) you can only measure the COAL this won't tell you the measurement too the lands necessarily. I don't worry about OAL at all the only measurement I make sure is consistent is the distance from the lands. This may result in slightly different I am as not all bullets are a exactly the same length.

I used bullet pointy end out and also upside down and close on action, my best reloading tool is the Sinclair bullet comparator. I put this on after and get my distance to lands with that bullet and record it.
When I load I check with the comparator for distance off lands, I never go buy COAL, especially after loading some hornady 6.5 129 interlocks, coal is all over the place.
The plastic tip bullets (ttsx, accubonds) seem pretty good though. I would use Coal in those if I was at least 30 thou plus off.
I'm a newer loader and this process may wrong and welcome any corrections, seems to work for me haven't blown myself up yet

[260 Rem]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

The way that I see it, the precise measurement really doesn't matter, as long as I find the sweet spot for accuracy. Depending on the leade, and the particular bullet, you could probably push the bullet a few thousands of an inch into the lands and not realize it, using most methods.

X2 ... For me, the masurement to the lands is "relative" as I use it only as a starting point on my quest to find the sweet spot. I typically re-measure after a few hundred rounds to check throat erosion.