Open Spaces ? Afga Resolution - Page 9

LongDraw · #**241** 02-28-2008, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 209x50

Then I'd say he was yanking your chain as nothing I've ever seen says that anyone can double dip or belong to both prograqms at once. Perhaps he knows so little about OS that he was just making things up.
The outfitters I've talked to want to know where the profit is for them in the whole scheme. They sell a mule deer hunt for 6K now and when I quote the 4k figure JUST FOR THE TAG they double over laughing. One even said he'd sell them his tags.

What is to say that land could not be split up under seperate corporations, etc to get around this?

Minds get very creative when there is money to be made.....

russ · #**242** 02-28-2008, 10:31 PM

Oh come on now Long Draw, are you saying corporations could be used to skirt the legal system in the great white north?

Duk Dog · #**243** 02-29-2008, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duk Dog
Upon looking closer at this could there be a potential for conflict? He is appointed to APOS by the Minister that is driving Open Spaces. He also holds positions of strength within HFT and AHEIA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duk Dog

When you look at the OS process does nobody else see this as a conflict of interest? An individual appointed by the minister is involved in the OS process and has his fingers in at least 3 pieces of the pie. How can he possibly argue against OS and the minister that has put him in one of his positions in the first place?

I'll bring this up as a question again. On the "hunter/conservation web" post, Duffy has taken the time to do even further research on this and the waters get even muddier. There should be some real concern here on all the over lap between these "hunter/conservation" groups and the multiple positions of power some people are holding. These are the same people that have been very involved with Open Spaces, and continue to be.

#**244** 02-29-2008, 08:01 AM

I agree with you when one person can sit on three of the boards that are represented on the WG then that one person is garnering a huge amount of pull when he sides one way or the other. I'm trying to get together with Bob this weekend and will let everyone know what he thinks. I would also suggest to give him a call at his office in Calgary the contact info is posted above and on their website. He is very up front and will answer you questions. If anyone is in Red Deer he has a booth at the sportsman show.

Duk Dog · #**245** 02-29-2008, 08:28 AM

Take a look at the thread started by Duffy. There is more than one person that is wearing multiple hats that is involved with OS. Granted there is only one that is also in a minister appointed position.

Duk Dog · #**246** 03-02-2008, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAV

I agree with you when one person can sit on three of the boards that are represented on the WG then that one person is garnering a huge amount of pull when he sides one way or the other. I'm trying to get together with Bob this weekend and will let everyone know what he thinks. I would also suggest to give him a call at his office in Calgary the contact info is posted above and on their website. He is very up front and will answer you questions. If anyone is in Red Deer he has a booth at the sportsman show.

Hey Mav
Any luck meeting up with Bob at all?

#**247** 03-02-2008, 03:07 PM

Working on it, I'll keep you posted.

calgarychef · #**248** 03-02-2008, 06:50 PM

I and a couple others talked to Bob at the outdoorsmen show for quite awhile about open spaces. I really hope I don't step on anyones toes by saying the following:

Origionally AHEIA was at the table, but when they voiced opposition to the way things were going they weren't invited back. The open spaces dudes who are saying that AHEIA has been consulted and is onside are misleading us. Bob is absolutely beside himself over this and he says the whole idea stinks.

Duk Dog · #**249** 03-02-2008, 07:08 PM

Perhaps, but don't forget he is also a Minister appointed director for APOS. Even if AHEIA hasn't been invited back he is still involved with a few other organizations (HFT, APOS) that have been involved with OS. Was he in the AHEIA booth while you were talking to him?

209x50 · #**250** 03-02-2008, 08:15 PM

Duk didn't you say that Bob is the president of HFT? They are still there aren't they?

Duk Dog · #**251** 03-02-2008, 09:27 PM

Looks like he is the Chairman for HFT. I can't say for 100% certain if they are still there, but they have been.

Duk Dog · #**252** 03-03-2008, 10:56 PM

So in the next little while when the politicians roll up their sleeves and get back to it, it'll be interesting to see where OS goes from here. One thing is for sure I don't think it is unreasonable to think that after the resounding vote against OS that the presence of the AFGA at the table could be at risk.

#**253** 03-03-2008, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duk Dog

So in the next little while when the politicians roll up their sleeves and get back to it, it'll be interesting to see where OS goes from here. One thing is for sure I don't think it is unreasonable to think that after the resounding vote against OS that the presence of the AFGA at the table could be at risk.

One other thing. With the resounding vote against Open Spaces by AFGA and other groups, the presence of Ted Morton as SRD minister should be at risk!!!!

Duk Dog · #**254** 03-03-2008, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNIPER

One other thing. With the resounding vote against Open Spaces by AFGA and other groups, the presence of Ted Morton as SRD minister should be at risk!!!!

Don't forget that there are interest groups at the table that are for OS. Not everyone is opposed to it. I've tried to bring up as well that you have a Minister appointed director of APOS, who is also involved with HFT, and AHEIA. Sure seems like a conflict to me. I don't for one minute think that seeing as he is appointed by the Minister that he will oppose OS. So imagine for a minute that is the case, why would he not carry that same OS support to his posts with HFT and AHEIA? I can't help but think if he were to oppose the Minister that put him in that role with APOS in the first place that he wouldn't be in that Minister appointed position for long. AFGA is but one voice at the table - if they will even still be there after the AGM vote.

#**255** 03-03-2008, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duk Dog

Don't forget that there are interest groups at the table that are for OS. Not everyone is opposed to it. I've tried to bring up as well that you have a Minister appointed director of APOS, who is also involved with HFT, and AHEIA. Sure seems like a conflict to me. I don't for one minute think that seeing as he is appointed by the Minister that he will oppose OS. So imagine for a minute that is the case, why would he not carry that same OS support to his posts with HFT and AHEIA? I can't help but think if he were to oppose the Minister that put him in that role with APOS in the first place that he wouldn't be in that Minister appointed position for long. AFGA is but one voice at the table - if they will even still be there after the AGM vote.

With a different minister, a lot of the players could change. Yeah, I know, it's a pipe dream.

Duk Dog · #**256** 03-03-2008, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNIPER

With a different minister, a lot of the players could change. Yeah, I know, it's a pipe dream.

Suppose it is status quo, Morton is still at the helm and OS continues full steam ahead. Now what?

There was a good pre election effort by many people that brought attention to OS and the process that has brought it to where it is today. The election is over now, it is time to recollect and refocus the efforts on things moving forward.

209x50 · #**257** 03-04-2008, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNIPER

One other thing. With the resounding vote against Open Spaces by AFGA and other groups, the presence of Ted Morton as SRD minister should be at risk!!!!

God I hope not! While OS may not have the support he wished for Ted is with out a doubt the best guy we have had in SRD in a long time.

lazy ike · #**258** 03-04-2008, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 209x50

God I hope not! While OS may not have the support he wished for Ted is with out a doubt the best guy we have had in SRD in a long time.

If the PC's ram OS through, Ted will go down as one of the worst.

#**259** 03-04-2008, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 209x50

God I hope not! While OS may not have the support he wished for Ted is with out a doubt the best guy we have had in SRD in a long time.

So, far he has only postponed the IMHA. And tried to sneak OS in behind our backs.

Waxy · #**260** 03-04-2008, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lazy ike

If the PC's ram OS through, Ted will go down as one of the worst.

Without a doubt. That's a black mark I wouldn't want as my legacy.

Waxy

#**261** 03-04-2008, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 209x50

God I hope not! While OS may not have the support he wished for Ted is with out a doubt the best guy we have had in SRD in a long time.

Thats like saying the wifes cooking is great becasue it looks and tastes great, just don't mind the rat poison shes putting in there

#**262** 03-04-2008, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duk Dog

Suppose it is status quo, Morton is still at the helm and OS continues full steam ahead. Now what?

There was a good pre election effort by many people that brought attention to OS and the process that has brought it to where it is today. The election is over now, it is time to recollect and refocus the efforts on things moving forward.

Keep hammering Stelmach's office.

He is choosing cabinet right now.

I was told he is aware Open Spaces was and is not open and transparent so we need to keep reminding him of that.

Rob Miskosky · #**263** 03-04-2008, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNIPER

So, far he has only postponed the IMHA. And tried to sneak OS in behind our backs.

Actually he has not only strongly opposed the IMHA but has also worked hard to open many new areas to Sunday hunting, created a Provincial Hunting Day to honour hunters and hunting, lowered the age limit for new hunters to hunt with a rifle, and strongly supports a Hunting Heritage Act.

More than any other minister I have worked under over the past 10 years.

You have to give credit where credit is due.

MathewsArcher · #**264** 03-04-2008, 09:26 AM

Unfortunately

Quote:

abandoning completely our highly successful North American model of Wildlife CONSERVATION

with the Open Spaces Pilot outways the positives completely in my opinion.

#**265** 03-04-2008, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Miskosky

Actually he has not only strongly opposed the IMHA but has also worked hard to open many new areas to Sunday hunting, created a Provincial Hunting Day to honour hunters and hunting, lowered the age limit for new hunters to hunt with a rifle, and strongly supports a Hunting Heritage Act.

More than any other minister I have worked under over the past 10 years.

You have to give credit where credit is due.

IMHA is not going away and OSA negates all the good things he has done. Ted Morton is about to deliver a major slap in the face to Alberta's outdoorsmen and wildlife through OSA. I also wonder why the Land use Framework hasn't been released, could it be that it's the kick in the crotch that follows the slap in the face?

Rob Miskosky · #**266** 03-04-2008, 09:31 AM

Actually 340, the IMHA has already gone away and no longer exists.

#**267** 03-04-2008, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Miskosky

Actually he has not only strongly opposed the IMHA but has also worked hard to open many new areas to Sunday hunting, created a Provincial Hunting Day to honour hunters and hunting, lowered the age limit for new hunters to hunt with a rifle, and strongly supports a Hunting Heritage Act.

More than any other minister I have worked under over the past 10 years.

You have to give credit where credit is due.

I have always thought that sunday hunting on public land would be a no brainer, but that hasn't happened.
Provincial Hunting Day???? I may be missing something here, but is there something really special about this day?
Heritage hunting act. Will paid hunting be part of our heritage?

Lowered the age limit, I will agree with you on this one.

One good deed does not make up for several bad ones.

Brady · #**268** 03-04-2008, 09:39 AM

Absolutely nothing wrong with letting a minister know that you support some of his decisions, while not supporting another. I think Morton has done us rather well, other then this OS stuff, and I will let him know just that, as well as Steady Eddie. I think they appreciate the feedback, especially when it is done tastefully and respectfully.

Rob Miskosky · #**269** 03-04-2008, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNIPER

Provincial Hunting Day???? I may be missing something here, but is there something really special about this day?

Of course there is. Like I said, it's a day where hunters and hunting are honoured across the province. If you remember correctly there was a fair amount of positive coverage last year. The more things we have like a Provincial Hunting Day and a Hunting Heritage Act, the more protection we have in continuing our outdoor pursuits. How can you find any bad in that?

Waxy · #**270** 03-04-2008, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Miskosky

Of course there is. Like I said, it's a day where hunters and hunting are honoured across the province. If you remember correctly there was a fair amount of positive coverage last year. The more things we have like a Provincial Hunting Day and a Hunting Heritage Act, the more protection we have in continuing our outdoor pursuits. How can you find any bad in that?

Is there anything in the Hunting Heritage Act about paid hunting or privatizing wildlife?

When it comes to politicians and gov't, they're no different than pro athletes, it's "what have you done for me lately". Sure you scored a few goals last year, but if you're not getting the job done to satisfaction, you get benched, or cut.

Waxy