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Old 08-10-2019, 09:10 AM
Pathfinder76 Pathfinder76 is online now
 
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Default Seating depth consistency woes

Reloading for my 6.5 CM I'm having a bear of a time getting consistent seating depth. Now this happens, loads are compressed, brass gets hard, bullets stick in seating stems etc. However, I don't think any of these are an issue and I'm getting over 5 thou variation in seating depth weather measuring off the ogive or the tip. Loads are not compressed, I'm using Lapua brass, 2 thou neck tension and a forster bench rest seater. The bullet is the 130 ELDM and I'm guessing the seater stem shape is to blame. That and the fact that that bullet is super soft up front.

That said, I was shooting it to 1125 yards this week and accuracy wasn't seeming to be an issue but its driving me nuts. I'm tempted to switch to the Redding competition seater and monkey with different stems. Anyone have any words of wisdom? Thanks.
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Old 08-10-2019, 09:33 AM
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I had a bit of an issue at first using Hornady dies but changed the seater stem
That is designed fir the ELDM’s and those issues disappeared
Cat
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Old 08-10-2019, 09:37 AM
Wrongside Wrongside is offline
 
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I get this with the 147ELD and Forster seating dies. Annealed Alpha brass. 2 thou neck tension.

Well, the bullets are marked, but not as much variance in OAL.

I never figured out what causes it, but settled on a similar hypothesis- ELDs are soft. Accuracy is still good at 100M and distance, so I’ve tried to ignore it. Hard on my OCD tho.

Last edited by Wrongside; 08-10-2019 at 09:45 AM.
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Old 08-10-2019, 09:42 AM
Nyksta Nyksta is offline
 
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difference in brass hardness. even if all of the brass is sized to the same 2 thou neck tension, how much work hardening has developed to the brass in the neck will depend how much it resists against the bullet seating. I can seat a number of rounds and they all have the same feel, and all have the same seating depth, then a hard case will come through, and it will be harder to seat, and the seating depth didn't go the same. i set these aside for fouler rounds.
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Old 08-10-2019, 09:48 AM
DLab DLab is offline
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Variance in the Poly tip length,seating stem too shallow for tip clearance on some rounds?
When I switched over to ELD-M's from Amax's my seating stem wouldn't work with the more Secant ogive of the ELD's,had to order a new seating stem for VLD's.While I was waiting for it I decided to drill out the Tangent style stem another 10-20 thou. extra depth.That solved that issue,when the new stem arrived I compared both ,the new one had a slight angle change to match the more Secant ogive profile of the ELD's and extra depth.
After seating with both the main difference I saw was that the old seater stem would leave a very slight ring on the bullet,especially with higher neck tension.
Other than that ,they both worked.
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Old 08-10-2019, 10:04 AM
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My Lee die works perfectly with the ELD-X, not sure if the M is shaped different.

I get +/-0.001” variation measuring off ogive. Starline brass neck sized.
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Old 08-10-2019, 10:05 AM
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Have you tried pausing for a few seconds at the bottom of the stroke?
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Old 08-10-2019, 10:36 AM
Wrongside Wrongside is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DiabeticKripple View Post
My Lee die works perfectly with the ELD-X, not sure if the M is shaped different.

I get +/-0.001” variation measuring off ogive. Starline brass neck sized.
I don't know about the 130 chuck is using, but the tip of the 147 bottomed out on both of my Lee seaters. Experimented with drilling one out with decidedly mixed results.
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Old 08-10-2019, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyksta View Post
difference in brass hardness. even if all of the brass is sized to the same 2 thou neck tension, how much work hardening has developed to the brass in the neck will depend how much it resists against the bullet seating. I can seat a number of rounds and they all have the same feel, and all have the same seating depth, then a hard case will come through, and it will be harder to seat, and the seating depth didn't go the same. i set these aside for fouler rounds.
This I absolutely agree with. However in this case, the brass is annealed and I don’t think that’s the issue. I could be wrong though.
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Old 08-10-2019, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DLab View Post
Variance in the Poly tip length,seating stem too shallow for tip clearance on some rounds?
When I switched over to ELD-M's from Amax's my seating stem wouldn't work with the more Secant ogive of the ELD's,had to order a new seating stem for VLD's.While I was waiting for it I decided to drill out the Tangent style stem another 10-20 thou. extra depth.That solved that issue,when the new stem arrived I compared both ,the new one had a slight angle change to match the more Secant ogive profile of the ELD's and extra depth.
After seating with both the main difference I saw was that the old seater stem would leave a very slight ring on the bullet,especially with higher neck tension.
Other than that ,they both worked.
Measuring to the ogive shows variance as well. And the tips aren’t contacting. I’ve thrown in a 7mm stem to see if that might help.
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Old 08-10-2019, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikergolf View Post
Have you tried pausing for a few seconds at the bottom of the stroke?
I have, I also at times will short stroke a second time. That works quite often but can be hard on concentricity.
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Old 08-10-2019, 11:01 AM
marky_mark marky_mark is offline
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Turning your necks will help with this
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Old 08-10-2019, 11:38 AM
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This is interesting in regards to seating stems.

https://youtu.be/ECUcIeak7CM
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Old 08-10-2019, 11:47 AM
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Here are a couple of tips that have helped me with that.

Setup:
.257WBY
Bullet: GSC 100grHV
Brass: PMC

a) As part of the brass preparation process, I use a product called "FLITZ" (a gentle metal polish), and with a cleaning-patch wrapped around the appropriate cleaning-brush for the caliber, I "FLITZ"-polish the inside of the necks just a bit.

b) When seating the bullet - compress 1/2-stroke ... release ... rotate the shell in the holder 1/2-a-turn, and complete the stroke.

Doing this has shown proven improvements in both seating-depth consistency (as indicated by measuring), and neck-tension (as indicated by the chronograph - speed variations significantly decreased).

Rod
Attached Images
File Type: jpg GSC Bullet.jpg (7.4 KB, 35 views)

Last edited by Artist; 08-10-2019 at 11:58 AM.
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Old 08-10-2019, 05:30 PM
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The answer is usually simple contact bonanza about your issue
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Old 08-10-2019, 06:47 PM
duceman duceman is offline
 
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shooting to 1125 yds with no problem....... so because there’s no problem you feel the need to invent one??
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Old 08-10-2019, 09:33 PM
DLab DLab is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck View Post
This is interesting in regards to seating stems.

https://youtu.be/ECUcIeak7CM
Did you notice the location of the seating stem mark on the loaded round right at the end of the video?Didn't appear to be where I would think the 30 cal. seater stem would contact.Good theory though ,I'll check that out.
He mentions it resolving concentricity issues ,not anything that you're describing with depth variance issues.
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Old 08-11-2019, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DLab View Post
Did you notice the location of the seating stem mark on the loaded round right at the end of the video?Didn't appear to be where I would think the 30 cal. seater stem would contact.Good theory though ,I'll check that out.
He mentions it resolving concentricity issues ,not anything that you're describing with depth variance issues.
Yes, I realize that.
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Old 08-14-2019, 11:43 AM
Buckhead Buckhead is offline
 
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Chuck - just out of curiosity.
I know you are a handloader.
What made you choose the 6.5 CM over the 6.5-284 if you are shooting out to those distances?
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Old 08-14-2019, 02:18 PM
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I had a seating stem that actually gripped the bullet so tight it would unseat (pull) the bullet on the up stroke. I use a Dremel tool with the cone shaped (pink?) stone and gave it a light polish and the problem was solved.
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  #21  
Old 08-14-2019, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckhead View Post
Chuck - just out of curiosity.
I know you are a handloader.
What made you choose the 6.5 CM over the 6.5-284 if you are shooting out to those distances?
I have them both
They are both equally as accurate
The creedmoor just gives up a 300 yard head start to the 6.5x284
I use my creedmoor for practising and the 284 for hunting
The 26 nosler with the new 156 Berger’s would be a great combo
Probably still get a mv of 3300 FPS plus
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  #22  
Old 08-14-2019, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckhead View Post
Chuck - just out of curiosity.
I know you are a handloader.
What made you choose the 6.5 CM over the 6.5-284 if you are shooting out to those distances?
Recoil
Barrel life
Magazine space

I’m not struggling to hit things at 1000 yds with it.
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  #23  
Old 08-19-2019, 07:07 PM
marky_mark marky_mark is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuck View Post
Recoil
Barrel life
Magazine space

I’m not struggling to hit things at 1000 yds with it.
Why do you need the mag space if you don’t have trouble hitting things at 1000 yards? Barrel life I agree with. Recoil is virtually the same
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Old 08-19-2019, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marky_mark View Post
Why do you need the mag space if you don’t have trouble hitting things at 1000 yards? Barrel life I agree with. Recoil is virtually the same
For and aft. Not depth. Recoil is not the same.
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