Another black eye for the Lethbridge range?

[Shanebear]

I wasn't too thrilled about hearing this, considering I just bought a year membership on Tuesday.

[crawfy]

Originally Posted by M70

I imagine they book special training sessions so it is therefore a closed session. If you wanted a special event, a guy could probably book it as well. The few times I've been there at the same time, they've been friendly and polite. We've chatted a little bit about rifles and ammo and from what I figure, we have at least one thing in common.

A few years ago, there was a lot of spent brass from their tac team training session that had not been picked up but that's been the only issue I've ever had with law enforcement training down there.

Yes that is what i would think should happen, however reading the post by browning sharpshooter that does not seem what happened to him, althought it does'nt say that it was'nt booked either. I would just hope that if i spent the time to go down to the range get set up start shooting that another paying member that had not booked a session could not force me off the range.

[crazy_davey]

The LFGA range is now closed until further notice by order of city council.

[elkhunter11]

yes the last incident was due to the police.

Just curious as to whether there were any charges for the careless use of a firearm as a result of the incident?

[Hawkeye]

Yes, it is closed (there is a sign on the gate).

[crawfy]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Just curious as to whether there were any charges for the careless use of a firearm as a result of the incident?

Never heard of any.

[elkhunter11]

Never heard of any.

Not surprising.

[buckfever]

thanks for the updates guys, i was planning on orderign my pistol in the next few days lol so much for that.


i heard it was some kids shooting gophers on the flats but who knows. it would b a shame if they closed the range for good, they just put the plates up to stop this from happening.

[TheClash]

Originally Posted by buckfever

thanks for the updates guys, i was planning on orderign my pistol in the next few days lol so much for that.


i heard it was some kids shooting gophers on the flats but who knows. it would b a shame if they closed the range for good, they just put the plates up to stop this from happening.

not sure how many kids shoot gophers with a .30cal rifle...but you never know. i have my own thoughts on it...but i will wait and see what the outcome is.

too bad, i had a group of friends that a new and interested in shooting want to go to the range this week. hopefully we will get to soon.

[buckfever]

Originally Posted by TheClash

not sure how many kids shoot gophers with a .30cal rifle...but you never know. i have my own thoughts on it...but i will wait and see what the outcome is.

too bad, i had a group of friends that a new and interested in shooting want to go to the range this week. hopefully we will get to soon.

when all u got is gramps old 30-30 or something kickin around your parents house the choice is easy.

so much for starting skeet practices

[TheClash]

Originally Posted by buckfever

when all u got is gramps old 30-30 or something kickin around your parents house the choice is easy.

so much for starting skeet practices

true enough.


i wish the skeet range was still open...

[munyee4321]

Originally Posted by buckfever

when all u got is gramps old 30-30 or something kickin around your parents house the choice is easy.

so much for starting skeet practices

while this is a posibility... its probably not likely lil grand child was shooting FMJs out of gramp's 30-30...

SKS would be my guess...

[Sneeze]

Just curious, isn't the range private property owned by a non-profit group?

How can city council arrange to have the facility closed with-out a court order?

I think the members should pool some money, implement another mundane safety measure... and tell the city to pound sand. Seems to me that LFGA was operating there before Legacy et al. were developed. Perhaps Melcor or the City of Lethbridge should pay for us to re-locate?

[TheClash]

so...here is my latest inside scoop....as i have mentioned i was at the range that day..and more to the point my brother was shooting on the center fire range when the police arrived. today he got a call from the lethbridge police to ask him some more questions etc. the officer explained that what he is doing is due diligence...which is good for the police and as far as i see it good for the range as well..and this is why:

the officer explained that the bullet did come from an SKS they believe..he also said that by measuring the trajectory of the bullet they have determined that it did NOT come from the range, that it would be impossible for it to have come from the range. but rather it came from some other location within north lethbridge. the officer said that there are no holes in the baffle and that all shooters on video obeyed all safety regulations...so..whew!!

here is why i am ok with the range being closed for a few days (hopefully)...i want the LFGA to be able to say that we complied with all requests made by the city to ensure a safe shooting environment for shooters and the public at large..ad that we as a whole obey and go above and beyond what is asked of us. that when an incident happens the LFGA is an integral part of solving the crime and played a huge role in helping the police....this shows that we are as much if not more committed to public safety than anyone else. and instead of a black eye for the LFGA we have now become the shining knight at the forefront of the charge bringing criminals to light. yes it is unfortunate that the range is closed, however....i think it shows a willingness on the LFGA's part to do what is needed to be safe and to continue operations.

[Ryry4]

Originally Posted by TheClash

so...here is my latest inside scoop....as i have mentioned i was at the range that day..and more to the point my brother was shooting on the center fire range when the police arrived. today he got a call from the lethbridge police to ask him some more questions etc. the officer explained that what he is doing is due diligence...which is good for the police and as far as i see it good for the range as well..and this is why:

the officer explained that the bullet did come from an SKS they believe..he also said that by measuring the trajectory of the bullet they have determined that it did NOT come from the range, that it would be impossible for it to have come from the range. but rather it came from some other location within north lethbridge. the officer said that there are no holes in the baffle and that all shooters on video obeyed all safety regulations...so..whew!!

here is why i am ok with the range being closed for a few days (hopefully)...i want the LFGA to be able to say that we complied with all requests made by the city to ensure a safe shooting environment for shooters and the public at large..ad that we as a whole obey and go above and beyond what is asked of us. that when an incident happens the LFGA is an integral part of solving the crime and played a huge role in helping the police....this shows that we are as much if not more committed to public safety than anyone else. and instead of a black eye for the LFGA we have now become the shining knight at the forefront of the charge bringing criminals to light. yes it is unfortunate that the range is closed, however....i think it shows a willingness on the LFGA's part to do what is needed to be safe and to continue operations.

x2 Well said Clash. I too believe we'll walk away from this incident with a good reputation in regards to public safety.

[Soreneck Racing]

Very informative Clash, I appreciate the inside information! And yes it is okay to have the range shut down for a short time. We need to show the citizens that everything is on the up and up.

At the same time, the LFGA membership needs to be very proactive in the community so that future requests by neighbourhood associations/citizen groups can be dealt with in a positive manner. I would hate to see the range turn into something where it is seen as a negative rather than a positive. If relocation was required, it would become a NIMBY (not in my back yard) issue.

Now the next challenge is to find the original location and shooter of the bullet that hit the minivan. Hopefully the police are successful in that endeavor.

[Boss442]

This is definately good news as it is an awsome range.

[Sneeze]

Sorry to pry.... But the Cops actually admitted that the bullet came from an SKS? How did they figure that out with out a suspect or a witness?

I do not know much about forensic identification of bullets, but pretty sure that a used SKS barrell isn't going to stamp "SKS" on the projectile... 7.62 mm bullets are pretty common and unless they can ID the manufacture of the bullet; and that producer only produces 7.62 x 39 mm, understandably it could be predicted its an SKS...but I doubt our wheels of justice turn as effectively as CSI Miami?

Is there another tell-tale sign an SKS leaves? ie: specific ball type ammo used at a wieght only found in 7.62 x 39mm?

I am surprised that they admitted that the bullet did not come from the Range.

So the earliest the range can re-open is the day after the next city council meeting (assuming our local politicians have time in the schedule to discuss)...

[TheClash]

sneeze i asked the same question. and did not get a real answer...other than they believe it was an sks because it is a military style bullet rather than a hunting style bullet.....and notice i said they "believe" the bullet to be from an sks, not that it 100% was...

as far as closing down..the range is on loan to us (the land anyways) and we don't really have much say in it imho...a short time closed to comply with the city to show an act of good faith is a small price to pay to have it open long term.

[TangoKilo]

Originally Posted by Sneeze

Sorry to pry.... But the Cops actually admitted that the bullet came from an SKS? How did they figure that out with out a suspect or a witness?

I do not know much about forensic identification of bullets, but pretty sure that a used SKS barrell isn't going to stamp "SKS" on the projectile... 7.62 mm bullets are pretty common and unless they can ID the manufacture of the bullet; and that producer only produces 7.62 x 39 mm, understandably it could be predicted its an SKS...but I doubt our wheels of justice turn as effectively as CSI Miami?

Is there another tell-tale sign an SKS leaves? ie: specific ball type ammo used at a wieght only found in 7.62 x 39mm?

I am surprised that they admitted that the bullet did not come from the Range.

So the earliest the range can re-open is the day after the next city council meeting (assuming our local politicians have time in the schedule to discuss)...

I would suspect that if the police found a 0.310" diameter bullet (7.62X39 is not a true 0.308") that weighed close to 123Gr and is a steel jacket with a copper wash, there is a very good probability that the cartridge is 7.62X39 and if it is that cartridge it also stands to reason that the cartridge was fired in an SKS.

I realize that is alot of assumptions, but the police may have filled in some of those assumptions through other avenues of the investigation.

[M70]

I agree with you, Sneeze. Matching a spent bullet to a firearm is a time consuming process that isn't done locally. There are only three such places that can do this. If I'm not mistaken the closest lab is in Regina.

I hope this all gets resolved. For those of you that have never been to the Lethbridge Range, it is a great facility that is run by people with pride. I know there are many people that volunteer many hours there but I'd like to publicly thank Al Friesen specifically, for his hard work to keeping this facility going.

[aquariumdudd]

Originally Posted by crawfy

As a current member I also have a right to be down there shooting so my question is, if I am down there shooting and the police come down to shoot can they tell me to leave that range or not, do they have special privilages that the rest of us as members do not have?

As long as they have booked the range they can ask you politely to leave. I am not with the police but with another industry that does use the range for training our staff. We book and pay for the ranges we use which in turn makes them a "closed" range for the time they are booked for. Which means if it is a closed training session (not for public viewing) we can politely ask you to leave. We also pay for any back stops we have destroyed with the rounds from our weapons. Any and all movement past the firing line is also submitted in writing to the Range Officials to be pre-approved.
As for brass, we always clean up after our selves and try to leave the ranges we use a little cleaner then we found them.
All range bookings are listed on the L.F.G.A. website.

[geezer55]

Taken from the Lethbridge Fish and Game site.

For Immediate Release

April 30, 2010



Investigation concludes stray bullet did not come from shooting range

Following investigation Lethbridge Regional Police have determined a stray bullet that struck a mini van along Stafford Road North earlier this month did not originate from the Lethbridge Fish and Game Range.



On April 10, 2010 a Dodge Caravan parked at a residence along the 100 block of Stafford Road North was damaged when a bullet struck the sliding passenger door window in the area where the glass covers the metal door frame. Contrary to some media reports the bullet did not smash through the window and was not found lodged near a child’s car seat. The bullet was recovered on the driveway below the window area among shards of glass. No one was inside the mini van at the time of the incident and no one was injured.

The neighbourhood where the bullet terminated is located on the urban fringe of the city adjacent to pasture land and green space.

Throughout the course of the investigation the Lethbridge Fish and Game Range has been fully cooperative with police. Police reviewed surveillance footage of the range and interviewed users who were in attendance the day of the incident. No careless or improper usage was identified. In addition satellite mapping was utilized to assist in determining the bullet’s trajectory.

After examining all the evidence, investigators have concluded the bullet most likely originated from a rural area to the north/northwest and appears to have ricocheted off the pavement before striking the van. This area includes rural farmland, river bottom terrain and city parkland and police located evidence of firearms being discharged such as signs that have been shot at, dead wildlife and reports of frequent trespassers from the land owners.

The bullet recovered in this incident – consistent with a .30 caliber jacketed round – is a relatively common type. Firearms that accommodate this ammunition are mass produced and inexpensive to purchase. Similarly the ammunition can be purchased cheaply and high power calibers of this variety can travel great distances.

The findings of the investigation have been provided to the City of Lethbridge, Lethbridge Fish and Game Range as well as the owners of the vehicle. Police involvement in the matter is now concluded.

[geezer55]

Was out in the back yard and heard the range was in use.