Red seal ticket, new title.

[tullfan]

So one of our apprentices has completed his 4 year apprenticeship and finally got his certificates in the mail.
He was quite disappointed as the new diploma looks like a 4 year drew it up and had it photocopied at Michaels.
Also no more certificate saying completion was done in Grand prairie, not that that's important to him but it looks good on the wall next to his cert.
Then there is the new red seal card, it looks just like your boating licence. LOL.
The big kicker is that he worked 4 years to have his certs all say you now have the privilege to use the title JOURNEY PERSON. Lol.
So needless to say, he is out first journey person at our shop. Poor kid.
We congratulated him for his accomplishments and follow through, but nothing could fix the disappointment in his face. He doesn't want to put his ticket on the wall next to ours because it looks so different.
Anyway, just a heads up. We'll be getting journey people now.

Tullfan

[Albertadiver]

sigh..... I feel bad for the dude.

Our office wants us to put our pronouns on our email signatures and business cards. In no uncertain terms I told the folks involved in this initiative to not touch my signatures.

So tired of this stuff. Leave things well enough alone IMO.

[Dick284]

So what’s the big deal?

You have zero control over what the gubberment does with certificates, so why get all riled up.

The pronoun game in online signatures I refuse to do as well.

[DirtShooter]

Originally Posted by Dick284

So what’s the big deal?

You have zero control over what the gubberment does with certificates, so why get all riled up.

The pronoun game in online signatures I refuse to do as well.

I'd say the big deal is the kid (a male) doesn't want his identity to be a non binary post national "person"

Journeyman is likely what he wants cause hes a man.

[Smokinyotes]

Originally Posted by DirtShooter

I'd say the big deal is the kid (a male) doesn't want his identity to be a non binary post national "person"

Journeyman is likely what he wants cause hes a man.

Exactly. When tradesman male or female have been called journeyman forever it is just stupid to change it for a very very small portion of the population.

[Dynamic]

I’d be more ****ed about the quality of the paper. I got my mine over 10 years ago and it was a nice thick paper with that red seal embossed on it. It looked official and worthy of being in a frame. Years later I got my Blue Seal. Worked hard to get it and many many hours. The certificate it came with looked like it was printed at my house. Just a peice of paper with a printed Blue Seal.

[jungleboy]

Not sure what I did with my red seal certificate , have the Laminated card but what I was mostly interested in was the journeyman /people kind person of interest etc pay rate I was interested in.

Mind you nobody in the shop I worked in was worried about it either besides the one who signed my paycheque

[tullfan]

I think it’s a bit of everything. Tradition, what he thought he was working for to pin to his wall, and as a young man, a title and some ‘cred’ as the kids say.
At the end of the day, he is qualified and finished and will be on his way to being a well trained and very competent journeyman.
He was more disappointed that the title changed from what it was say when he started 4 years ago.
He’ll get over it. But not without some choice words. Lol

Tullfan

[coolpete1]

"journeyperson" isnt in the dictionary lol , mine is old and says journeyman , but its in a drawer somewhere

[Taiga]

If I get an email at work and the person signs their name with the pronoun garbage the work relationship is done and I no longer do business with that person and their company. Things won’t change until there are consequences.

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by coolpete1

"journeyperson" isnt in the dictionary lol , mine is old and says journeyman , but its in a drawer somewhere

White it out on the certificate and correct it.

[CNP]

Originally Posted by DirtShooter

I'd say the big deal is the kid (a male) doesn't want his identity to be a non binary post national "person"

Journeyman is likely what he wants cause hes a man.

It's so ingrained now that it effects (y)our ability to have a counter argument......when using words like non-binary.

Words that end in man (a suffix) are not defined as words that are interpreted to be a word centered on a male gender. Mankind is gender neutral, journeyman is gender neutral, fireman is gender neutral, policeman is gender neutral, postman is gender neutral. But that isn't good enough for the crowd that supports that there are endless genders. Usually the same people that say follow the science. I laugh at the absurdity.

[Hawkeye]

I refuse to put my preferred pronouns on my Zoom call or email signature.

Sometimes I am tempted to put "Your majesty" or "Sir" or something similar on there, just to see if anyone challenges me.......SO FAR, I have resisted the temptation.......

[dewalt18]

This is what you’re going to be offended about today? Journey PERSON is what it should say. Mine says journeyman, is what it is. I can honestly say after 25 years in the trades I’ve had more female apprentices stand out and shine than “men”. Perhaps it’s because they feel the need to “break stereotypes” and stand out?

If he’s embarrassed because his ticket looks different than the others on the wall, maybe remind him that his is the most valuable out of any of them, because it’s the newest and holds the most potential.

[CNP]

Originally Posted by dewalt18

This is what you’re going to be offended about today? Journey PERSON is what it should say. Mine says journeyman, is what it is. I can honestly say after 25 years in the trades I’ve had more female apprentices stand out and shine than “men”. Perhaps it’s because they feel the need to “break stereotypes” and stand out?

If he’s embarrassed because his ticket looks different than the others on the wall, maybe remind him that his is the most valuable out of any of them, because it’s the newest and holds the most potential.

What's wrong with journeyman? Journeyman is already gender neutral...if you subscribe to the science that there are but two genders. Journey person is just arguing a point that isn't even valid. A woman can be a journeyman can be a woman but it doesn't sound like your getting it The man at the end of journey is just a suffix that denotes a person not a gender. But of course historical revisionism is at play, changing the meaning of words to suit agendas. Should the word "woman" be removed from dictionaries or disdained as some form patriarchal domination?

Rex could explain this better than any of us.

[Talking moose]

It’s a peice of paper. Who cares. Now go to work.

[CBintheNorth]

Couldn't even tell you where my certificate went. Likely tossed it the day after I got it. The card is all that matters.
Congrats to him.

[coolpete1]

Originally Posted by dewalt18

This is what you’re going to be offended about today? Journey PERSON is what it should say. Mine says journeyman, is what it is. I can honestly say after 25 years in the trades I’ve had more female apprentices stand out and shine than “men”. Perhaps it’s because they feel the need to “break stereotypes” and stand out?

If he’s embarrassed because his ticket looks different than the others on the wall, maybe remind him that his is the most valuable out of any of them, because it’s the newest and holds the most potential.

Do you have a hard time with the English language ? Is that why made up words to suit a narrative are ok?

[ram crazy]

I would put a line through journey person and above it I’d write Journeyman. To be honest I couldn’t even tell you where my certificate is. My card is I my wallet and that’s all that matters.

[catnthehat]

When I was in the trade the very best men and women in my union valued themselves journeymen.
In fact I don't recall any member- male or female that insisted on being called a journey person or a "tradesperson".
If they did, they never said it around me

Cat

[elkhunter11]

Just more woke nonsense. I worked wirh women that held journeyman status, that wanted to be called a journeyman . They were proud of their accomplishment, and thought that changing the wording was pure nonsense, and would actually lessen their accomplishment, as if the standards had also changed.

[Sporty]

It's my understanding that the word "Journeyperson" has been used in Canada since 2008. The likelihood that this young man has encountered the word through out his 4 years at some point is probably pretty high. If it didn't connect with him prior to receiving his certification, he wasn't paying attention. The pride in accomplishing his certification should be more important than the wording on the certificate. The paper certificate doesn't define him nor should it.

Most folks I know with a red seal only refer to themselves as a "Red Seal *insert trade here*" anyway.

[-JR-]

Had my ticket for 45 years , and only had to show the card once to get hired on

[zabbo]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Just more woke nonsense. I worked wirh women that held journeyman status, that wanted to be called a journeyman . They were proud of their accomplishment, and thought that changing the wording was pure nonsense, and would actually lessen their accomplishment, as if the standards had also changed.

This is true! When I was an apprentice I worked with a female journeyman a few times. One day I made the mistake of refering to her as a journeywoman! I was told in no uncertain terms "journeyMAN! I earned that she said!


Congrats on the graduation! Don't sweat the name!

[urban rednek]

Originally Posted by tullfan

So one of our apprentices has completed his 4 year apprenticeship and finally got his certificates in the mail.
He was quite disappointed as the new diploma looks like a 4 year drew it up and had it photocopied at Michaels.
Also no more certificate saying completion was done in Grand prairie, not that that's important to him but it looks good on the wall next to his cert.
Then there is the new red seal card, it looks just like your boating licence.

Originally Posted by Dynamic

I’d be more ****ed about the quality of the paper. I got my mine over 10 years ago and it was a nice thick paper with that red seal embossed on it. It looked official and worthy of being in a frame. Years later I got my Blue Seal. Worked hard to get it and many many hours. The certificate it came with looked like it was printed at my house. Just a peice of paper with a printed Blue Seal.

I sense a business opportunity for an enterprising artistic type: heirloom quality certificate reproduction.

Send us a photocopy of your certificate and we will send you a gorgeous reproduction on xx paper* worthy of framing and hanging on your wall.

For authentication purposes, just slot the junk piece of paper you received from the apprenticeship board behind it in the frame.

* parchment or vellum available for additional fee

Could be a profitable side gig.

[58thecat]

Who cares what you call it, show me the money!




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stinky Buffalo]

Originally Posted by urban rednek

I sense a business opportunity for an enterprising artistic type: heirloom quality certificate reproduction.

Send us a photocopy of your certificate and we will send you a gorgeous reproduction on xx paper* worthy of framing and hanging on your wall.

For authentication purposes, just slot the junk piece of paper you received from the apprenticeship board behind it in the frame.

* parchment or vellum available for additional fee

Could be a profitable side gig.

I like how you think!

[Dubz337]

what an insignificant problem. theres womern in the trades too. who cares what your ticket says, the important part is having it.

upset about words on a piece of paper. you know, for a group that likes to call others 'snowflakes', you all sure act like one a lot of the time.

[flydude]

It should be changed to Journeyhomosapien

[tullfan]

Originally Posted by Dubz337

what an insignificant problem. theres womern in the trades too. who cares what your ticket says, the important part is having it.

upset about words on a piece of paper. you know, for a group that likes to call others 'snowflakes', you all sure act like one a lot of the time.

I believe it is less of a problem for him than a disappointment. The expectation was for one cert and he got one that he wasn’t expecting. Really, grand scheme of things, no biggie. Will it settle with time? Sure it will. Does the wording matter? Tbd.
Tullfan