How many fatal overdoses in your world?

[Jimm]

Sorry but if you play stupid games you win stupid prizes. Everyone on the planet knows you role the dice each and every time, no sympathy here except for the people left behind.

[wildwoods]

Originally Posted by Talking moose

X2

X3 no doubt.

[Mr Conservation]

Been to a number of overdose calls. Narcan (naloxone) can be a wonder drug if administered promptly. I've seen a couple of patients almost flat lined (asystole) and a shot of naloxone in a timely manner brought them back almost instantly.

Unfortunately I have also seen a few that couldn't be brought back, including two from the same house within 8 days of each other. You would think that if someone died from an overdose of heroin, probably laced with fentanyl, that others in the same house would pass on shooting up with the same crap.

Its tough on friends and family members, but as Ken can probably attest to, it is also hard on the first responders. Working a patient for an hour, then ceasing resuscitation efforts (based on orders from medical control) because all attempts to revive the patient have failed can take its toll.

Mr Conservation

[3blade]

In my personal life - none. I cut out anyone I knew playing stupid games long ago.

Professionally - who knows, probably triple digits. Certainly for overdoses, probably for deaths as well.

Here’s what the current story is:

EVERYTHING has fentanyl in it. Quite literally everything. Makes the high better, no matter what you’re doing.

If you are expecting a stimulant - ex, crack, cocaine, whatever - it’s mostly meth. All those pills kids take at music festivals - yep, just meth. Cheaper and easier to manufacture and without the hassle of nutcase Mexican warlords. Same source, China.

It screws your brain on the first hit. I know of someone who tried it once, she’s highly educated and successful, decided to do a social experiment...said it was great and wants it every time she hears the word. Hasn’t done it again, but the demon lives in the back of her head now.

[Hiwa]

I have a close friend who just came close to death by excessive drinking.
Acute Liver failure was the diagnosis.
He isn't drinking as far as I know, but haven't seen him in a while.

Lost a few from that years ago , and a couple of suicides as well.

I was on the same path 10 years ago , but changed my life around.

Condolences to those that have lost friends and family.

[does it ALL outdoors]

Originally Posted by dukla

As they say these days, there is no heroin in heroin anymore.

My friends G/F works in harm reduction @ the Boyl St safe injection site.

She says they NIK test everyone's stuff before they shoot it and said 9 out of 10 people that think they are shooting Heroine are actually shooting fentanyl.

She adds that the synthetic looks so much like the real Mc.Coy that even seasoned users can't tell the difference.

Anyone caught selling that crap deserves anything bad that happens to them, zero sympathy.

[10pt]

Excellent topic for discussion. We woke up last July to sounds of sirens ,only to find out my next door neighbors son had passed in the night. A boy my sons had chumed with in their youth. Apparently after a serious car accident he got addicted to OxyContin,which was prescribed by his doctor. Then moved on to heroin? Heartbreaking for everyone.

[calgarygringo]

My fishing partner and is on this forum is a first responder and we talk a bit on some of these calls. I also have a former co worker who lost their teenage son to this crap. Dont get it or understand why there isnt more effort to take out the suppliers etc. but I guess it is what it is. Too bad but even in the 70's in my teen age years I dont recall it quite like this.

Originally Posted by MrDave

My son's group just buried their third friend, 2 he roomed with and one he grew up with. Plus throw in my best friend who was murdered that way. I can't get over these youth thinking its safe to buy pile off a dirt bag on the street. Is the only way to end this letting the dumb ****s die openly the only way others will learn? One of them was fed the pills by his older brother, here take another your not high enough yet.

Seems like the Seventies all over again.

[Jamie]

Can someone please explain how all this works?

Is it just added to the different drugs we all know? Or is it a stand alone thing?

I was talking with my Son about it tonight. I believe it was a straight forward conversation and he was being straight with me. He says it hasn't hit his school. I find that hard to believe.

[wildbill]

Originally Posted by mooseknuckle

Living on east hastings in the late 90's i loved the heroin. After a few years, i dropped it. I think it.can reallt.depend on the person. I like my percocet (oxycocet). Multiple surgeries and arthritis i find its the only pill that i can take that really helps. I take 2 in the morning and 1 in the afternoon. 90 a month never more. And thats been my regiment for the last 3-4 years. However i cant get them perscribed due to my addiction history... so i obtain them illegally. I did invest in a chemistry set to ensure im getting whats expected. And always keep a nax kit around. Thats my story anyways. Guess most would cal me an addict, but its what keeps me going, i find living without serious pain makes my life better. For me, my business, my family and loved ones. Etc. Ive never once in 20 years thought about or had the urge to go from opiodes to harded drugs, been there done that.

A self prescribed opiate user, sound like they still have their hold on you, try and stop for a week, let me know how that works out for ya........

[wildbill]

Originally Posted by Jamie

Can someone please explain how all this works?

Is it just added to the different drugs we all know? Or is it a stand alone thing?

I was talking with my Son about it tonight. I believe it was a straight forward conversation and he was being straight with me. He says it hasn't hit his school. I find that hard to believe.

You know what heroin is?
Fentanyl is an opiate (like heroin) 50X stronger...........
They say all heroin these days is cut with (fentanyl) bad stuff......

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by Jamie

He says it hasn't hit his school. I find that hard to believe.

I can say with 100% certainty it is there...

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by wildbill

You know what heroin is?
Fentanyl is an opiate (like heroin) 50X stronger...........
They say all heroin these days is cut with (fentanyl) bad stuff......

Fentanyl is a synthetic opioid and was always meant to be administered via a patch through adsorption. It was never meant to be handled/sold/used in a powder form like it is now. I do a lot of work at the ME Office in Edmonton and know the Chief and Deputy toxicologists, let’s just say they won’t be out of jobs any time soon. We have some interesting discussions.

LC

[JD848]

Originally Posted by crazy_davey

I can say with 100% certainty it is there...

You are 100 percent correct,tons of kids that are wired on all kinda crap.

[Jamie]

So, its added to Heroin?

Its not a stand alone type thing?

Anything else it is added to?

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Jamie

So, its added to Heroin?

Its not a stand alone type thing?

Anything else it is added to?

The problem with drug dealers is they have no quality control. Weigh out a few grams of fentanyl, them on the same scale a few grams of weed...bingo, your weed is now laced with fentanyl. Not even intentionally most times.

LC

[ctd]

Originally Posted by Jamie

So, its added to Heroin?

Its not a stand alone type thing?

Anything else it is added to?

It can be used on its own. Or can be added to anything. I mean everything. No street drug is safe from this stuff and other more potent drugs.

[dukla]

You know, it's not just the illicit street drugs from China that are responsible. People will go many directions to reach endless levels of mind alteration and addiction. From crushing up Tylenol 3 and Ritalin, to drinking hand sanitizer, there are so many easy "options" for the individual looking for escape.
I've even seen people smoking Grandma's prescribed fentanyl patch. Twice in one day.
But the opioid crisis has taken so many lives. The real numbers are shocking. Almost unbelievable.
I used to have a hard stance and little sympathy as well, saying "to each their own", and "we all choose our own path". From a distance, and if it does not impact you it's easy to come to these conclusions.
But now I am honestly just depressed and saddened by this global tragedy, and I have no answers for our youth.

[Rastus]

"DON'T" get on the user, but get on the dealer, like alcohol, don't get on the user, get on the dealer, because they are the root of the problem, so they say!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by Jamie

So, its added to Heroin?

Its not a stand alone type thing?

Anything else it is added to?

Commonly added to heroin, meth, cocaine, sometimes weed, magic mushrooms, ecstacy and anything else. Some do it as a stand alone. You could put it on your pork chops or sprinkle it on your cereal. Talking to one addict whom I worked with up until 3 weeks ago when he relapsed once again, he tells me when someone dies from an overdose junkies will seek the dealer the person who OD'ed bought the stuff from because they know that if it can kill you it's definitely the "good stuff". He carries a Naloxone kit in his backpack, showed it to me, apparently many junkies do, they don't worry about OD'ing as long as they are with someone who has a kit. He says Naloxone is becoming another tool used by addicts much like needles, spoons, lighters, pipes and whatever else they use. It enables them to have no fear of fentanyl. He told me his personal favorite cocktail was injecting a mix of heroin and meth, said the meth mixed in would keep him from nodding off from the heroin. Naloxone is turning into just another enabler for junkies.

[pinelakeperch]

Originally Posted by Jimm

Sorry but if you play stupid games you win stupid prizes. Everyone on the planet knows you role the dice each and every time, no sympathy here except for the people left behind.

I think it's important to have sympathy for a person who despite knowing the risks, is still willing to chance it. They must be desperately willing to escape their mind, surroundings or circumstances (or all three). There is always much more involved than what meets the eye. Life isn't black and white, and there are very few situations where I don't have sympathy for someone who passes.

Something to think about.

[Jimm]

Originally Posted by pinelakeperch

I think it's important to have sympathy for a person who despite knowing the risks, is still willing to chance it. They must be desperately willing to escape their mind, surroundings or circumstances (or all three). There is always much more involved than what meets the eye. Life isn't black and white, and there are very few situations where I don't have sympathy for someone who passes.

Something to think about.

I live close to the safe injection site in Calgary, never had an issue with vehicle break ins until that site opened, now it happens so frequent. I take everything out of the truck and leave it unlocked, at least no broken windows or door handles, the latest is someone crapped on the seat and spread it all over the dash, widows and door panels, that’s why I got nothin, only sympathy for those left behind.

[Drewski Canuck]

ACCIDENTS HAPPEN, and the unintended overdose from contamination or ill will or deception is terrible.

Then there are the flatliners who get brought back by EMS and First Responders, only to go do it again next day, or sometimes the same day.

In this day of social media, users cannot play dumb to the risks. Heroin users can go on legal lifetime prescription drug treatment if they choose to. Why don't they?

Guys looking for a high can get drunk or smoke weed sold by a licenced shop. Why don't they?

People who are looking for help with addictions have the easiest time to get help either at an AADAC Office, a safe injection site with professional staff, a Hospital, etc. Why don't they?

I feel sorry for the friends and family left behind, but the only thing new about the current situation of drug addiction and abuse is the terminal nature of the current drug of choice.

Eliminating the dealers is actually pretty easy. Legalize it and ensure the quality control.

But really, what more should we as a Society be expected to do for people who choose to use a dangerous and unknown product where there are so many alternatives?

There is a scene from the movie Repo Man. A liquor store robbery goes bad for alot of people including the robber who is shot and dying. He blames Society for who he is and what he does. The reality is it was the robber who set the course of action, and paid the consequences.

However, if you are overcome with an urge to apologize, make a difference instead and volunteer on a crisis hotline, or at any number of the Community Outreach Centers like Boyle Street Coop.

Some people will make bad choices no matter what anyone tells them not to do.

Drewski

[mooseknuckle]

Originally Posted by wildbill

A self prescribed opiate user, sound like they still have their hold on you, try and stop for a week, let me know how that works out for ya........

Stop for a week- 2 every couple of months. When i can find them. Whats your point? Same life... just with a constant limp, unbelievable pain and frustration.

Yes the "have a hold on me" i guess.

[mooseknuckle]

Originally Posted by wildbill

A self prescribed opiate user, sound like they still have their hold on you, try and stop for a week, let me know how that works out for ya........

Stop for a week- 2 every couple of months. When i can find them. Whats your point? Same life... just with a constant limp, unbelievable pain and frustration.

Yes they "have a hold on me" i guess.

Merely sharing my dealings. I bet there are at least 20-25 members of this board that have delt with me, weather it be a wing night, buying/selling, or spending a week in northern sask fishing. I would be suprised if one of them has a negative thing to say towards me? Married happily, four kids, succesful business, house paid for at 40. maybe im trying to save face? Justify my addiction? Just poitning out that there are surcumstances in which a narcotic can be a benefit. I truly feel in this case it is.

[Spidey]

Originally Posted by Drewski Canuck

Eliminating the dealers is actually pretty easy. Legalize it and ensure the quality control.

I was actually at a CCSA conference a few years ago and a social policy analyst made this exact same point. There is a large body of research that would support this type of strategy from a purely harm reduction/public safety point of view.

Another contributing factor to this epidemic is that government and the College of Physicians and Surgeons has come down hard on physicians who prescribe opioids. In some cases this is warranted, but it has also put the fear of god into many docs who have been prescribing responsibly. The result is that physicians started cutting off their patients nearly cold turkey which significantly destabilized people and caused many to resort to seeking opioids on the street (one does not stop regular or chronic opioid use quickly). Here's an article that looks into both sides of this strategy.
https://healthydebate.ca/personal-he...g-back-opioids

Thankfully the pendulum is swinging back to the middle for docs, where there are better policies and training on responsible prescribing, because there is still a need that these medications address. A past psychologist co-worker of mine had severe osteoporosis in his spine and the only way he could function or move was a steady dose of percocet throughout the day. He was an excellent clinician, but after many failed surgeries and other interventions - that medication was the only thing that allowed him to live a more-or-less normal life.

[Okotok]

Originally Posted by wildbill

A self prescribed opiate user, sound like they still have their hold on you, try and stop for a week, let me know how that works out for ya........

I don't know if you listen to Roy Green on 770 and his criticism of the government as it pertains to real people with real (agonizing 12 out of 10) chronic pain. It makes me mad that a lot of people with true chronic pain are basically being left with few choices other than suicide or hitting the street. It's a tough balance for sure but opioids are really the only option for some people. Regarding how close it's come to me, I'm happy to say that nobody within mine or my kids circle has died as a result of OD. Touch wood.

[SamSteele]

Originally Posted by warriorboy10

Lost my youngest son June 18, 2018 at the young age of 25. He had a tough time trying to get off the stuff but it turns your brain to mush. Horrible!!

When I finally got to my son the EMT attendees and RCMP said they found heroine, which I believed as my son told me that is what he was using. Several months later I received a call from the medical examiner, she proceeded to tell me that the tox report was that fentynal and meth was found in his blood. I truly believe that my son thought he was getting heroine but actually got far worse. My youngest son was murdred and not a thing I can or will be done. My son and many others.. so sad!! Nothing worse than losing one of your kids, I wouldn’t wish that on anyone. ����

If there is anyone that needs to talk I would be more than willing because I still need to..



He was my hunting partner, fishing partner, sledding partner and planned to groom him to take over the business. Miss you AJ, you will be on my mind until the day I die!

You have my deepest condolences. My son is 15 and I can’t imagine what it would be like to lose him. I lost my dad to a drunk driver when I was 16. Loosing one half of a father-son relationship is incredibly difficult.

If you ever want to talk, let me know.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by Mr Conservation

Been to a number of overdose calls. Narcan (naloxone) can be a wonder drug if administered promptly. I've seen a couple of patients almost flat lined (asystole) and a shot of naloxone in a timely manner brought them back almost instantly.

Unfortunately I have also seen a few that couldn't be brought back, including two from the same house within 8 days of each other. You would think that if someone died from an overdose of heroin, probably laced with fentanyl, that others in the same house would pass on shooting up with the same crap.

Its tough on friends and family members, but as Ken can probably attest to, it is also hard on the first responders. Working a patient for an hour, then ceasing resuscitation efforts (based on orders from medical control) because all attempts to revive the patient have failed can take its toll.

Mr Conservation

Everything is hard on first responders when it comes to death, in small towns we know everyone. It is worse when it is self induced stupidity, life is hard enough without giving death a boost.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by warriorboy10

Lost my youngest son June 18, 2018 at the young age of 25. He had a tough time trying to get off the stuff but it turns your brain to mush. Horrible!!
When I finally got to my son the EMT attendees and RCMP said they found heroine, which I believed as my son told me that is what he was using. Several months later I received a call from the medical examiner, she proceeded to tell me that the tox report was that fentynal and meth was found in his blood. I truly believe that my son thought he was getting heroine but actually got far worse. My youngest son was murdred and not a thing I can or will be done. My son and many others.. so sad!! Nothing worse than losing one of your kids, I wouldn’t wish that on anyone. ����
If there is anyone that needs to talk I would be more than willing because I still need to..

He was my hunting partner, fishing partner, sledding partner and planned to groom him to take over the business. Miss you AJ, you will be on my mind until the day I die!

Some of us have been able to crawl out of that deep dark hole of addiction, some keep falling back in, and some have never made it out .
Terrible , terrible thing it is, my heart goes out to you
Cat