importing bullets from US?

[vance]

Has anyone brought in projectiles from the US? Brownells has some in stock that I would like to get, but the site states they won't ship to Canada. I am going to Montana in March, so could ship there and bring back if allowed.
Thanks
Vance

[spurly]

I would not advise it.

[elkhunter11]

Brownells won't ship to Canada, because a permit is required to export bullets out of the USA. That applies to individuals , as well as businesses.

[Dubious]

It can be done But the licensing to bring them up cost so much I cancelled order it wasn’t the Canadian side it was the us side you needed to buy some sort of itar? Export permit I think. It’s been a few years but I think the cost was something close to 500us to bring up 2 boxes of bullets. In the end I found a Canadian supplier for what I was looking for and haven’t had a problem since.

If you figure something out let me know I would love to get my hands on some 131gr blackjack ace bullets.

[DLab]

The US has changed Export rules from ITAR back to the Dept. of Commerce,changes to take effect March 9th.I'm sure they will post a simplified copy of the changes soon.Some of these changes pertain to Canada only.
It appears we may be able to import ammo and reloading components once again from the US. or at the very least bring it back ourselves when we visit.
If I read it correctly it should be a $500.00 limit.

[32-40win]

Sorry Dlab, they didn't change the alien purchase/possession/export side of things, still a no go for an alien to buy and export. However, give it a month and things should be clearer on what actually got accomplished, if anything truly useful did. And it may all get held up in State sponsored lawsuits yet, 21 states are suing over it, haven't heard about an injunction,.......yet.

[waldedw]

If you really have to have them and they are not available in Canada then have them imported for you by Clay over at Prophet River

[vance]

thanks everyone. Good idea re Clay. I will ask him. Will also email Anthony at Tradex and see if he has an ETA on more. Norma Vulkan 9.3mm 232gr

[yukon254]

The short answer to your question is, yes you can bring bullets back from the USA. There is no Canadian law preventing it. I do it once or twice a year when we fly down to visit family.

Sometimes I even drive to Skagway AK since its only 120KM from my house. I often buy loaded ammunition and bullets for reloading. I asked Canada Customs if I needed to bring my FAC to show them when I returned to Canada. They said no. When I asked them why I need an FAC to buy ammo in Canada, but dont need it to bring ammo into Canada they didnt have an answer other than it was a loophole no one thought about when they made the law.

I know lots of outfitters who bring back all sorts of reloading supplies from the US when they are down doing shows.

[1899b]

Originally Posted by yukon254

The short answer to your question is, yes you can bring bullets back from the USA. There is no Canadian law preventing it. I do it once or twice a year when we fly down to visit family.

Sometimes I even drive to Skagway AK since its only 120KM from my house. I often buy loaded ammunition and bullets for reloading. I asked Canada Customs if I needed to bring my FAC to show them when I returned to Canada. They said no. When I asked them why I need an FAC to buy ammo in Canada, but dont need it to bring ammo into Canada they didnt have an answer other than it was a loophole no one thought about when they made the law.

I know lots of outfitters who bring back all sorts of reloading supplies from the US when they are down doing shows.

PAL it’s a PAL.... FAC is so 80’s. Lol

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by yukon254

The short answer to your question is, yes you can bring bullets back from the USA. There is no Canadian law preventing it. I do it once or twice a year when we fly down to visit family.

Sometimes I even drive to Skagway AK since its only 120KM from my house. I often buy loaded ammunition and bullets for reloading. I asked Canada Customs if I needed to bring my FAC to show them when I returned to Canada. They said no. When I asked them why I need an FAC to buy ammo in Canada, but dont need it to bring ammo into Canada they didnt have an answer other than it was a loophole no one thought about when they made the law.

I know lots of outfitters who bring back all sorts of reloading supplies from the US when they are down doing shows.

It isn't Canadian law that is the issue, it is the fact that the USA enforces ITAR regulations, so exporting bullets out of the USA without a permit, is illegal under the USA regulations. When two countries are involved, two sets of regulations apply. As for the FAC, nobody cares, because they were replaced years ago with the PAL. And we never required an FAC to purchase ammunition, when the FAC was in effect.

[yukon254]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

It isn't Canadian law that is the issue, it is the fact that the USA enforces ITAR regulations, so exporting bullets out of the USA without a permit, is illegal under the USA regulations. When two countries are involved, two sets of regulations apply. As for the FAC, nobody cares, because they were replaced years ago with the PAL. And we never required an FAC to purchase ammunition, when the FAC was in effect.

I know its US law that is the problem. Canada doesn't care. You can walk into any sporting goods store in the US and buy ammunition or reloading components and then drive or fly home. No export permit needed. You will never see US customs on your way home. I've done it for years, as have many others.

PAL then.....you cant buy ammo in Canada without it..

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by yukon254

I know its US law that is the problem. Canada doesn't care. You can walk into any sporting goods store in the US and buy ammunition or reloading components and then drive or fly home. No export permit needed. You will never see US customs on your way home. I've done it for years, as have many others.

PAL then.....you cant buy ammo in Canada without it..

I was actually coming home from work in Pennsylvania once and when I got home and opened my bags they both had a note in them "inspected by homeland security".
I'd been eyeing up a smoking sale on swaro scopes at cabelas, but wasn't going to take the risk of losing my visa. Got lucky there

[Rackmastr]

Originally Posted by yukon254

You will never see US customs on your way home. I've done it for years, as have many others.

US Customs does export checks (or what they call outbound checks) on a daily rotation at some ports of entry. Others they do export checks weekly or randomly, but nearly every port of entry performs export checks of both commercial and personal vehicles.

[spurly]

Originally Posted by yukon254

I know its US law that is the problem. Canada doesn't care. You can walk into any sporting goods store in the US and buy ammunition or reloading components and then drive or fly home. No export permit needed. You will never see US customs on your way home. I've done it for years, as have many others.

PAL then.....you cant buy ammo in Canada without it..

The day that you do see US customs, on your way home, will be a day you will regret if you have any ITAR controlled goods.
I have been stopped twice, but was aware of the rules, so had no issue.

[leeelmer]

I have been stopped on the USA side of the boarder by homeland security when coming home from the USA.
1000 yards on their side, just before the line up for Canadian customs.
They checked me a my vehicle over, and specifically asked me if I had anything related to firearms or ammo with me, and was told they were looking for this.
And if I had anything with me with out a proper permit that I would be detained and charged under US law.
I had some beer and cigs with me, they said they did not care about that.
When I was released and got to Canadian customs I was asked what they stopped me for. I told them that they were looking for firearms and firearm related stuff, I was then told that Homeland has been doing this for years, and there was two sets of laws, and the Canadian side could care less, but the American side cared alot.

[yukon254]

When I talked to Canada customs about it they led me to believe the export laws ( US ) did not apply to private sales only commercial sales. How many US hunters bring ammunition into Canada each year ?

From the Canadian Customs website :Importation, Exportation and Transportation In-Transit of Ammunition
Any individual can import up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges into Canada without an import permit if they are for personal use (i.e., not for resale). If you plan to resell the cartridges or to import more than 5,000 rounds, you need an import permit. Similarly, you can export and transport in-transit up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges for personal use without an export and transport in-transit permit, but you need a permit if you plan to resell the cartridges or to export and transport in-transit more than 5,000 rounds.

[DLab]

Originally Posted by 32-40win

Sorry Dlab, they didn't change the alien purchase/possession/export side of things, still a no go for an alien to buy and export. However, give it a month and things should be clearer on what actually got accomplished, if anything truly useful did. And it may all get held up in State sponsored lawsuits yet, 21 states are suing over it, haven't heard about an injunction,.......yet.

Thanks,I should have put IF in bold.That sure is one long convoluted document to try make heads or tails out of.
I thought it may have fell under the LVS (Limited value shipment) section.
Hopefully won't have long to wait the version called "Export,Import for dummies"paper back.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by yukon254

When I talked to Canada customs about it they led me to believe the export laws ( US ) did not apply to private sales only commercial sales. How many US hunters bring ammunition into Canada each year ?

From the Canadian Customs website :Importation, Exportation and Transportation In-Transit of Ammunition
Any individual can import up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges into Canada without an import permit if they are for personal use (i.e., not for resale). If you plan to resell the cartridges or to import more than 5,000 rounds, you need an import permit. Similarly, you can export and transport in-transit up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges for personal use without an export and transport in-transit permit, but you need a permit if you plan to resell the cartridges or to export and transport in-transit more than 5,000 rounds.

You understood wrong, ITAR applies to individual sales as well. As to American hunters, they can bring ammunition for their own use, and technically, what they don't use, they are supposed to to take back with them.

Consider yourself lucky, that you have been violating US law, and have not been checked as you leave the USA.

[Rackmastr]

Originally Posted by spurly

The day that you do see US customs, on your way home, will be a day you will regret if you have any ITAR controlled goods.
I have been stopped twice, but was aware of the rules, so had no issue.

No doubt. I'm amazed at how many people say 'Ive done it for years' as if that's a validation or understanding.

It happens a lot and has been happening for the past 15 years at a pretty steady pace (that changes depending on a number of factors)

[DLab]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

You understood wrong, ITAR applies to individual sales as well. As to American hunters, they can bring ammunition for their own use, and technically, what they don't use, they are supposed to to take back with them.

Consider yourself lucky, that you have been violating US law, and have not been checked as you leave the USA.

Yup ,I have a buddy with a nice stamp on his Passport stating 10 year entry ban,for a brick of rimfire and cheap Bushnell scope Homeland found in his car at a Checkstop ,the only reason they didn't impound his vehicle was because he was honest and up front,didn't try to lie to them.If you lie ,they will spank you hard.
A couple years ago the neighbour across the street had just arrived home from visiting his Mom in Washington state,says look what I brought back,4 LBS. of IMR4831 and 3,000 primers.After informing him of the possible consequences if caught his response was"You know what your problem is?You worry too much" lol end of our little talk.

[CNP]

Originally Posted by yukon254

When I talked to Canada customs about it they led me to believe the export laws ( US ) did not apply to private sales only commercial sales. How many US hunters bring ammunition into Canada each year ?

From the Canadian Customs website :Importation, Exportation and Transportation In-Transit of Ammunition
Any individual can import up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges into Canada without an import permit if they are for personal use (i.e., not for resale). If you plan to resell the cartridges or to import more than 5,000 rounds, you need an import permit. Similarly, you can export and transport in-transit up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges for personal use without an export and transport in-transit permit, but you need a permit if you plan to resell the cartridges or to export and transport in-transit more than 5,000 rounds.

This...….again...…...is Canadian law. If you are stopped in the US before arriving at CBSA you are subject to US law...…..none of your quote is applicable in the US

[spurly]

Originally Posted by yukon254

When I talked to Canada customs about it they led me to believe the export laws ( US ) did not apply to private sales only commercial sales. How many US hunters bring ammunition into Canada each year ?

From the Canadian Customs website :Importation, Exportation and Transportation In-Transit of Ammunition
Any individual can import up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges into Canada without an import permit if they are for personal use (i.e., not for resale). If you plan to resell the cartridges or to import more than 5,000 rounds, you need an import permit. Similarly, you can export and transport in-transit up to 5,000 rounds of small arms cartridges for personal use without an export and transport in-transit permit, but you need a permit if you plan to resell the cartridges or to export and transport in-transit more than 5,000 rounds.

Canadian laws mean nothing when you are in the US. As a non resident alien, you are not allowed to possess any of the items controlled by ATIR. they take this very serious, and quite often have checkstops, just before the CDN. border crossings. It is a privilege we have to go to the US, but it can be removed very quickly if you have no reguard for their rules.

[Dubious]

if You use an importer and do it legally it can be minimal cost and pretty painless.

[32-40win]

Always amazes me how people don't seem to comprehend the concept of import and export between two different countries, or even what the definition of two different countries is, or a citizen and an alien, or even the definition of smuggling.

[spurly]

Originally Posted by Dubious

if You use an importer and do it legally it can be minimal cost and pretty painless.

If. Is the key word these guys don’t seem to understand.they are bragging about doing something illegal, and not using an importer.

[yukon254]

I've never even seen a US customs officer on my return trip to Canada and I go south at least twice a year. Its never been a problem for me. I have also mailed boxes of bullets home because I didnt want the weight in my luggage and never had a problem and the packages had declaration tags right on the outside of the box.

[NicoyaHunt]

Is lot of difference to carry across the border 1000 bullet to send it by mail, one is smuggling and other is legal

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by NicoyaHunt

Is lot of difference to carry across the border 1000 bullet to send it by mail, one is smuggling and other is legal

Without a permit both are illegal.

[spurly]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Without a permit both are illegal.

These people clearly don’t get it. Or don’t want to get it.