All electric F150

[Jadham]

Well the rumors keep growing.

Ford confirmed it is building a new factory to have these out by 2022. Ford is also saying it will have the most power (I assume this means torque?hp?towing capacity?) AND the lowest operating costs out of all its F150 engine/powerplant options.

Looks interesting, no word on expected range yet. I am thinking it would have to be in 400-500km range to be competitive.


One of the links:


https://driving.ca/ford/auto-news/ne...-truck-to-date

[Skoaltender]

Expected price is around 100k from what I’ve read.

[EZM]

Pretty cool - but may not be practical to many of us .... it also sounds like they have applied for a patent to sandwich the batteries between the cross members in the frame ...... so that sounds like it would allow a low center of gravity and load of space for batteries with potentially a long range.

https://www.motor1.com/news/386328/e...attery-patent/

Problem for many of us is, even if it has a 500km range ......... what happens to that range when I'm towing my boat into the Northern part of Sask for a trip??? and when I get down to 10% where can I charge it in tim buk nowhere? even of I could, how long will I be sitting there to charge up?

This truck would be limited to a grocery getter and in town run about.

[Jerry D]

What do most 1/2 ton trucks get for mileage? Whats it cost in fuel to drive 200k?

New mid tier trucks are 40 to 45k right now

Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk

[Jadham]

The Battery storage idea looks interesting.

LOL it seems Ford took it personally when the Tesla truck prototype went head to head (or rather tailgate to tailgate) with the F150.

Would be interesting to see how this all plays out... and whether Tesla will stay on top of the electric vehicle curve or slowly lose out its dominance.

[Jerry D]

Ford vs Ferrari was a good movie, I'd be happy to watch Ford vs Tesla

Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by EZM

This truck would be limited to a grocery getter and in town run about.

So, what 95% of the trucks on the road are currently used for 95% of the time? That's still a huge market.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by Jadham

Ford is also saying it will have the most power (I assume this means torque?hp?towing capacity?) AND the lowest operating costs out of all its F150 engine/powerplant options.

It would frankly be a massive fail if it didn't. The Hummer is predicted to have 1,000 hp, the Bollinger B2 614 hp, Cyber Truck 400 to 500/690/794 hp for the respective three models, Badger 906 hp, etc. An electric F150 with less than 450 hp would be a dismal failure. Regarding operating cost, again, makes sense as there are considerably less moving parts and power is cheaper than gas.

The big questions I have are what is the MSRP and range?

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by Jerry D

What do most 1/2 ton trucks get for mileage? Whats it cost in fuel to drive 200k?

New mid tier trucks are 40 to 45k right now

Sent from my SM-A530W using Tapatalk

My 09 4.6 averages 13L/100, my 11 5.0 is 12, my 16 3.5 ecopoof averages 10.9L/100

on a 20+c day with no wind and driving for mileage I have gotten under 10L/100.

so, in the ecopoof at .949 it would cost $18,980

[ren008]

Take whatever range they claim and then halve it for 4 months out of our year due to cold climate. Add that to the reduction when being used for towing, hauling or any real work and I think we are a looong way off.

Sure they will look good and fancy though at the Safeway parking lot getting groceries or picking the kids up at school.

[wildwoods]

Don’t forget the cost to replace batteries. There might be up front fuel savings but I would assume you more than lose that on the back end.

[Stinky Buffalo]

Will be interesting to see what rebates would be available.

https://tc.canada.ca/en/road-transpo...r-izev-program

I did a bit of calculation as I have been thinking of an e-Golf to replace the Jetta for commuting. I wouldn't save enough in fuel to make up for the extra costs, even including the iZev rebate.

Originally Posted by wildwoods

Don’t forget the cost to replace batteries. There might be up front fuel savings but I would assume you more than lose that on the back end.

I recall talking with a Ford parts guy many years ago (pre-EcoBoost) about the Escape Hybrid that was out at the time. Just for fun, I asked what the battery replacement cost would be. Based on a seven year cycle (assuming that we are harder on batteries here in our climate), the replacements essentially made the car a write-off.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by EZM

Pretty cool - but may not be practical to many of us .... it also sounds like they have applied for a patent to sandwich the batteries between the cross members in the frame ...... so that sounds like it would allow a low center of gravity and load of space for batteries with potentially a long range.

https://www.motor1.com/news/386328/e...attery-patent/

Problem for many of us is, even if it has a 500km range ......... what happens to that range when I'm towing my boat into the Northern part of Sask for a trip??? and when I get down to 10% where can I charge it in tim buk nowhere? even of I could, how long will I be sitting there to charge up?

This truck would be limited to a grocery getter and in town run about.

Probably not practical for Canada and the northern third of America. But the southern 2/3 where most people live it sounds like it would be a deal.

[midgetwaiter]

Originally Posted by wildwoods

Don’t forget the cost to replace batteries. There might be up front fuel savings but I would assume you more than lose that on the back end.

Yeah but we're talking about Fords here, you have to consider that in current models an engine replacement is not exactly unheard of.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by wildwoods

Don’t forget the cost to replace batteries. There might be up front fuel savings but I would assume you more than lose that on the back end.

I think they have, or are working on and will likely have in 2022 when this truck comes out, million mile battery packs though. Pretty sure nobody is going to spend $80 bucks on mudflaps on a truck with 1,600,000 km on it let alone a battery pack, kind of a moot argument in my opinion.

[bobtodrick]

Originally Posted by Trochu

So, what 95% of the trucks on the road are currently used for 95% of the time? That's still a huge market.

Yup, hate to say it but I doubt if any of the truck manufactures consider their main buyers to be hard core outdoorsmen.
Even the new Land Rover Defender, most, like the Mercedes G-Wagon will end up being boulevard cruisers for those with lots of disposable income.

[wildwoods]

Originally Posted by Trochu

I think they have, or are working on and will likely have in 2022 when this truck comes out, million mile battery packs though. Pretty sure nobody is going to spend $80 bucks on mudflaps on a truck with 1,600,000 km on it let alone a battery pack, kind of a moot argument in my opinion.

I’ll believe it when I see it....

[Spidey]

Originally Posted by EZM

Pretty cool - but may not be practical to many of us .... it also sounds like they have applied for a patent to sandwich the batteries between the cross members in the frame ...... so that sounds like it would allow a low center of gravity and load of space for batteries with potentially a long range.

https://www.motor1.com/news/386328/e...attery-patent/

Problem for many of us is, even if it has a 500km range ......... what happens to that range when I'm towing my boat into the Northern part of Sask for a trip??? and when I get down to 10% where can I charge it in tim buk nowhere? even of I could, how long will I be sitting there to charge up?

This truck would be limited to a grocery getter and in town run about.

My prediction is that the law of supply and demand will bolster charging infrastructure, even off the beaten path. My prediction is that in 10 years even those one horse towns with no more than a gas station and greasy spoon with have a charging station or two. And while you're waiting for the truck to charge you go next door and order a monte cristo

[Hooter]

A fella that goes to my gym owns a Tesla and he mentioned one day that he needed to replace the battery pack because he was only getting about half the distance on a charge. IIRC the car was about 5 years old and the cost to replace the battery pack was $10K. I think paying for gasoline would’ve been cheaper than replacing the batteries every 5 years, or at minimum a wash.

[Map Maker]

Pretty close. At 20,000 km/year and $75 per fill that would go 500 km.
Gas works out to $15000 for 5 years.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by Map Maker

Pretty close. At 20,000 km/year and $75 per fill that would go 500 km.
Gas works out to $15000 for 5 years.

$15,000 is a really good 2 years for me, and I do not run nearly as much as I used to.

I used to put on 4000 km a week, from 1999-2008

If I had an electric vehicle then, I would have saved ~$90,000 in fuel

[bobtodrick]

Originally Posted by Hooter

A fella that goes to my gym owns a Tesla and he mentioned one day that he needed to replace the battery pack because he was only getting about half the distance on a charge. IIRC the car was about 5 years old and the cost to replace the battery pack was $10K. I think paying for gasoline would’ve been cheaper than replacing the batteries every 5 years, or at minimum a wash.

This is my beef.
So...you want to sell your 10 year old electric.
You figure you paid $50000.00 so you figure $10000.00 is a fair asking price (most calculators say 80% depreciation after 10 years).
The buyer asks if you've ever replaced the batteries...you haven't and he quite rightly says knock $10000.00 off your price because they'll likely have to replace them soon.
So you just give him the car.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by EZM

Pretty cool - but may not be practical to many of us .... it also sounds like they have applied for a patent to sandwich the batteries between the cross members in the frame ...... so that sounds like it would allow a low center of gravity and load of space for batteries with potentially a long range.

https://www.motor1.com/news/386328/e...attery-patent/

Problem for many of us is, even if it has a 500km range ......... what happens to that range when I'm towing my boat into the Northern part of Sask for a trip??? and when I get down to 10% where can I charge it in tim buk nowhere? even of I could, how long will I be sitting there to charge up?

This truck would be limited to a grocery getter and in town run about.

Interesting schematics showing the actual electric motors are replacing the front and rear differentials. That seems to leave the entire area under the hood completely empty and just begging for a 4 cylinder eco boost generator (similar to the Chevy Volt's) to kick in when the battery reaches a certain depletion level. The ability to drive on electric charge 99% of the time, but to have a built in gas generator to prevent any range anxiety would seem to make it more appealing to those who do travel to remote areas.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by Jadham

Well the rumors keep growing.

Ford confirmed it is building a new factory to have these out by 2022. Ford is also saying it will have the most power (I assume this means torque?hp?towing capacity?) AND the lowest operating costs out of all its F150 engine/powerplant options.

Looks interesting, no word on expected range yet. I am thinking it would have to be in 400-500km range to be competitive.


One of the links:


https://driving.ca/ford/auto-news/ne...-truck-to-date

It would be mildly appealing to have a pickup with more power than a Raptor yet cheaper to operate than a Prius.....

[omega50]

[tbiddy]

I use my truck for work. Most days I put on 300-400km. Some days over 500km. Add idling time at a job site and when it’s -30 you can half the distance. It just isn’t practical for most people that use their truck for work purposes. I also don’t have time to wait for a charge when it takes 10 minutes to fill up at a gas pump. Also, I assume charging is feee for now but when these become more popular what will it cost to fully charge a battery? Most places charge for air now so you know they’ll charge you till charge your vehicle battery. Maybe for a grocery getter or a city truck they’ll be fine but impractical in the field.

[IL Bar]

Originally Posted by tbiddy

I use my truck for work. Most days I put on 300-400km. Some days over 500km. Add idling time at a job site and when it’s -30 you can half the distance. It just isn’t practical for most people that use their truck for work purposes. I also don’t have time to wait for a charge when it takes 10 minutes to fill up at a gas pump. Also, I assume charging is feee for now but when these become more popular what will it cost to fully charge a battery? Most places charge for air now so you know they’ll charge you till charge your vehicle battery. Maybe for a grocery getter or a city truck they’ll be fine but impractical in the field.

That is my question. Who pays when you charge your electric vehicle at a charging station? Are they free or is there an account you need to setup?

[HyperMOA]

Originally Posted by Scott h

Interesting schematics showing the actual electric motors are replacing the front and rear differentials. That seems to leave the entire area under the hood completely empty and just begging for a 4 cylinder eco boost generator (similar to the Chevy Volt's) to kick in when the battery reaches a certain depletion level. The ability to drive on electric charge 99% of the time, but to have a built in gas generator to prevent any range anxiety would seem to make it more appealing to those who do travel to remote areas.

Scott this is absolutely correct. A hybrid would outsell any full electric in our climate. It’s much more practical for us.

[Spidey]

Originally Posted by IL Bar

That is my question. Who pays when you charge your electric vehicle at a charging station? Are they free or is there an account you need to setup?

Most places charge, although some spots like IKEA or MEC give you up to 8KW for free. You'll need an account set up with the provider of the electricity (eg ChargePoint). Some towns have fee charging stations and hotels with charging stations offer free charges for guests.

Lots of Petro Cans have charging stations now. A guy I know who owns a 75KW Tesla says it's usually between $8 and $10 to fill and gets about 350km per charge.

We have a plug-in hybrid Toyota Prius Prime. The built in 8KW battery will run the car in pure electric mode for 40-50km before the gas hybrid system kicks in. We've put 56,000km on it and have been averaging 2.6L/100km, or just over 90mpg.

The Prius is a nice compliment to my F250, which we've only used when necessary for hauling or pulling these days.

[Arty]

Originally Posted by Spidey

Most places charge, although some spots like IKEA or MEC give you up to 8KW for free. You'll need an account set up with the provider of the electricity (eg ChargePoint). Some towns have fee charging stations and hotels with charging stations offer free charges for guests.

Lots of Petro Cans have charging stations now. A guy I know who owns a 75KW Tesla says it's usually between $8 and $10 to fill and gets about 350km per charge.

We have a plug-in hybrid Toyota Prius Prime. The built in 8KW battery will run the car in pure electric mode for 40-50km before the gas hybrid system kicks in. We've put 56,000km on it and have been averaging 2.6L/100km, or just over 90mpg.

The Prius is a nice compliment to my F250, which we've only used when necessary for hauling or pulling these days.

How far could you drive in the F250 for the purchase price of the Prius + 2.6L/100 so far? Assume a buck a liter for fuel.
Back of the envelope says $30,000 = (30,000 liters + (56000km/100km)*2.6L) =31456L.
100km/16L*31456L = approx 200,000 kms. Which is break-even on gas alone, never mind extra insurance, extra storage/parking, battery replacement, or electricity charges.

Add in electricity price (from my bill that's 6.6 cents/kWhr + 50 cents/kWhr 'delivery' = $0.57 cents/kWhr). Assume 6 hour complete charge @ 120VAC 1-phase, 15 amps, 0.95 AC power factor = 6hr * 1.7 kWhr * .57 cents/kWhr = $ 5.81 per charge.
So being generous, $ 5.81/50km = $0.1163 per km. Over 200,000kms that's an additional $ 23,256.- on top.

How far further still could you drive that F250 on 23 grand worth of additional gasoline?
Maybe 100km/16L*23256L = 145,000 kms? So now your breakeven is 345,000 kms.

How long would it take you to drive 345,000 kms in your truck? For me, that's half a lifetime.
==
One more thing. How much are (or would be) the total interest charges on financing the Prius? Assuming 10 grand total financing for a Toyota, you've now got 40,000 liters of fuel. And the extra insurance payments? You're now pushing a half million clicks just to break even. Wow.