Opinions on bush guns

[Bushleague]

[QUOTE=catnthehat;4274351]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

That wasn't by chance Francis Sell's article was it?
Cat

Lol, you know me too well Cat.

Allot of what that guy wrote seemed a tad obsessive, and often went against the mainstream grain. But the more years I get under my belt, the more of his offbeat advice I find to be spot on. It seems like he knew a few things about deer hunting that very few other people did.

I still dont take a shot unless I have a clear path to send the bullet down... often that path is pretty small but I dont shoot unless I have it.

[catnthehat]

[QUOTE=Bushleague;4274355]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Lol, you know me too well Cat.

Allot of what that guy wrote seemed a tad obsessive, and often went against the mainstream grain. But the more years I get under my belt, the more of his offbeat advice I find to be spot on. It seems like he knew a few things about deer hunting that very few other people did.

I still dont take a shot unless I have a clear path to send the bullet down... often that path is pretty small but I dont shoot unless I have it.

I always find it interesting that although he ( Francis Sell) was not very well known as one of the premier writers of his day and is almost unheard of these days, my father once remarked to me ( when I was younger) , that Sell was likely one of the most knowledgeable and accomplished white tail hunters he had ever met- and he had met a great many of them during his career !
I never gave it much thought until II started reading the books my father left me.......
Cat

[Coho911]

I am surprised nobody has suggested the Ruger Scout rifle in .450 Bushmaster.

Short barrel (16 or 18 inches), Box mag fed (super nice to reload), hits like a truck.

[Bushleague]

[QUOTE=catnthehat;4274364]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

I always find it interesting that although he ( Francis Sell) was not very well known as one of the premier writers of his day and is almost unheard of these days, my father once remarked to me ( when I was younger) , that Sell was likely one of the most knowledgeable and accomplished white tail hunters he had ever met- and he had met a great many of them during his career !
I never gave it much thought until II started reading the books my father left me.......
Cat

Very cool to hear. I think he never got big because he never championed any revolutionary new type of hunting, and never offered any shortcut or foolproof recipe. With Sell its always simply about understanding stealth, wind, and a huge emphasis on game habit.

Anyhow, I'll quit derailing.

[catnthehat]

[QUOTE=Bushleague;4274397]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Very cool to hear. I think he never got big because he never championed any revolutionary new type of hunting, and never offered any shortcut or foolproof recipe. With Sell its always simply about understanding stealth, wind, and a huge emphasis on game habit.

Anyhow, I'll quit derailing.

I also noticed that his favorite rifle was a Mauser that he stocked himself.
Cat

[catnthehat]

For those who have not heard of the man and were wondering just who the heck Bushleague and II were talking about, here are two pictures from one of his books " The deer Hunter's Guide"
The pics are aa bit washed, but illustrate his idea of an ideal bush carbine.
Cat

[32-40win]

These days, a person can set up a really nice, handy shorter range oriented gun on so many different platforms it is nuts. Short barreled flavours that will still reach out to 300+ is easily doable, scopes like a 1-9 or a 1-10x, various red dot sights that can be used pretty comfortably to a few hundred yards, just a matter of researching them a bit and finding out what can accomplish what for your purposes.

[Stinky Coyote]

ya there's some good options out there, ruger has quite a few, this 10 shot 6.5 Grendel launches 123 gr bullets at 2386 fps and 52,000 psi, reloaders will see more but they have 350 legend, 450 bushmaster, 7.62x39 as well



CZ 527 in 7.62x39 or 6.5 Grendel, Grendel gets you pretty solid 300 yard platform likely another 100 yards easy over the 7.62x39, they have walnut stocked 7.62x39 as well.

[32-40win]

Have to start calling you Gatehouse Jr.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by 32-40win

These days, a person can set up a really nice, handy shorter range oriented gun on so many different platforms it is nuts. Short barreled flavours that will still reach out to 300+ is easily doable, scopes like a 1-9 or a 1-10x, various red dot sights that can be used pretty comfortably to a few hundred yards, just a matter of researching them a bit and finding out what can accomplish what for your purposes.

There are so many options these days it is mind boggling for sure!
I really liked my O/U 6.5X55 and the 9.3X74R O/U as well, but have found over the years that my custom Ruger is the one that I keep going for when it comes to still hunting and stalking!
Cat

[pat brennan]

Sell was a very knowledgeable hunter/shooter and a good writer as well. Very underappreciated, almost unheard of now but still very relevant.

[Positrac]

Ruger M77 Hawkeye stainless compact laminate in 7mm-08. It doesn’t get a lot more handy than that for in the bush. Doing it again I would go with a Leupold vx-II 3-9x33 ultralight because the 4.5-14x40 I had on it was too big. But, the 40mm objective sure made it bright for those cloudy days in the timber.

Personally I wouldn’t look at going to open sights again. A buck popped up in the timber 2 days ago in a spot where I could see 75-100 yards in places. I knew he saw me but didn’t know what I was. Within a few minutes I got a look at him trying to check me out. I had just his neck and head showing at 75 yards. He was a very nice 4x4 Whitetail. I had a look at him in the scope and it was a relatively easy shot. With the naked eye though it was very hard to pick him out. In the end he got to walk.

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by pat brennan

Sell was a very knowledgeable hunter/shooter and a good writer as well. Very underappreciated, almost unheard of now but still very relevant.

Ya, if you want to hunt bush, forget about a new gun and just go buy that book that Cat has pictured. Read it from cover to cover every year in August before the deer season opens... it will have way more impact on your success than a new rifle.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

Ya, if you want to hunt bush, forget about a new gun and just go buy that book that Cat has pictured. Read it from cover to cover every year in August before the deer season opens... it will have way more impact on your success than a new rifle.

I thought I was finished deer hunting for the year but this thread got me flipping through Sell's book again and I want to get back out before the season ends! LOL I even noticed that Tradex has a couple a mannlicher stocked 6.5x55's for sale !
Not that I am going to run out and buy another rifle mind you!
Cat
Sent from my SM-G781W using Tapatalk

[Dick284]

7x57
154gr. bullets will knock stuff down at 0-125 yds.

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by Coho911

I am surprised nobody has suggested the Ruger Scout rifle in .450 Bushmaster.

Short barrel (16 or 18 inches), Box mag fed (super nice to reload), hits like a truck.

For those who only shoot big bodied deer

What a beast....me likey

[Battle Rat]

A good bush gun is the one that feels more comfortable in your hand and where you do not have the urge to sling on your shoulder.
That is more important than the cartridge it shoots.
That and a low power scope or open sights.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Battle Rat

A good bush gun is the one that feels more comfortable in your hand and where you do not have the urge to sling on your shoulder.
That is more important than the cartridge it shoots.
That and a low power scope or open sights.

I agree, the cartridge is actually pretty much inconsequential when it comes to the criteria for a good bush carbine- not totally irrelevant, but certainly not as important as the handling characteristics needed.
Sell, in fact listed portability, speed of getting off the shot, and "woods accuracy" , which I take to be able to put a quick round into a deer's vitals yards. He emphasized an offhand rifle, not one that a person would typically shoot off a bench or prone.
As far as cartridges go, I think he actually went more into actual bullets than cartridges in " The Deer Hunter's guide"
Cat

[Stinky Coyote]

Originally Posted by 32-40win

Have to start calling you Gatehouse Jr.

Dunno who that is but if a 30-30 makes a good bush gun then so does what I recommended. If you like detach mags instead of internal tube mags then nothing wrong with slick handling bolt action carbines. The thread doesn’t have to be old school choices, some modern choices and cartridges fit the bill too. Agree with scope over irons too.

Really like the Ruger 7-08 compact also. There are a lot of options.

[catnthehat]

If there is one thing I can't abide on a carbine it is an extended magazine, more often than not that is where the EXACT point of balance is!
I much prefer flush magazines , hinged floor plates or blind mags on a rifle if it isn't a single shot.
Cat

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

I thought I was finished deer hunting for the year but this thread got me flipping through Sell's book again and I want to get back out before the season ends! LOL I even noticed that Tradex has a couple a mannlicher stocked 6.5x55's for sale !
Not that I am going to run out and buy another rifle mind you!
Cat
Sent from my SM-G781W using Tapatalk

I'm not kidding, I've read that book every year for over 15 years, and I still pick out new tidbits. Every few years a little more experience puts something else into new context and it helps me hunt a little bit better.

I gotta say, his signature track/ stillhunt/ intercept the escape method is a very elegant, velvet gloves type approach too bush hunting. There are some good bush hunters still around these days, but IMO that guy makes most of us look like crude hacks. Maybe someday eh?

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by Battle Rat

A good bush gun is the one that feels more comfortable in your hand and where you do not have the urge to sling on your shoulder.
That is more important than the cartridge it shoots.
That and a low power scope or open sights.

Agree with this, my criteria in order of importance would be.

-sights or scope, this is vital
-weight, that thing needs to stay in hand all day
-length
-caliber
-action

Most of all you need to be super familiar with that gun.

[Positrac]

Originally Posted by 32-40win

Have to start calling you Gatehouse Jr.

Gatehouse is dead....it’s Gateholio now...! Lol.

[270person]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen were hunters?

[JD848]

I used my Marlin 30 30 for decades for thicker bush, to me bush hunting is 50 yards maybe 100 yards shot. Thick bush is under 50 yards,so iron sight I prefer in thicker bush. Lotsa good open sights out there you can track real fast with,I would look at that as much as I do the cartridge.

So even a good 308 or 3006 with a shorter barrel and not to heavy to carry makes a great bush gun ,loaded with 180 grn bullets even round nose can take out any moose or deer,bear .Ammo is cheaper and so are the prices of rifles in common cartridges sometimes

As long as you practice stand up free hand or leaning on a tree shooting .

The 3030 will do the job ,but so will many other cartridges with a good bullet the expands like a interlock or interbond ,keep it simple and good things will happen.

Whether your bush hunting or any other place proper shot placement is still needed.

I like my lever rifle, but when the temp drops to like -30 I go to my bolt,just a personal choice. On my lever I have had snow fall and freeze up my trigger action and even condensation freeze up a tube spring,so I just like a bolt better.

JD

[NCC]

Dick284’s Mennonite machine gun thread and the Benoit Bros. have me thinking about cleaning up my old 760 pump and mounting a low power scope on it for my bush gun. It was my first rifle handed down from my dad and I haven’t shot it since the late 80’s. I currently have a model 7 KS in 7-08 that is also good; light, short, and has some reach if needed.

I have a 30-30 with an XS ghost ring but I know the day I carry it, I’ll see a 180” whitetail on a fence line at 300 yards.

[Athabasca1]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

If there is one thing I can't abide on a carbine it is an extended magazine, more often than not that is where the EXACT point of balance is!
I much prefer flush magazines , hinged floor plates or blind mags on a rifle if it isn't a single shot.
Cat

Exactly my thought as well. I have a Ruger Scout rifle and the extended magazine protruding below the bottom of the stock is a pain to carry as it does not balance at all. I bought one of Ruger's three round polymer magazines with the magazine cover to keep the rounds from popping out but the magazine cover is a finicky affair. The cover pops off quite easily.

[obsessed1]

Originally Posted by Athabasca1

Exactly my thought as well. I have a Ruger Scout rifle and the extended magazine protruding below the bottom of the stock is a pain to carry as it does not balance at all. I bought one of Ruger's three round polymer magazines with the magazine cover to keep the rounds from popping out but the magazine cover is a finicky affair. The cover pops off quite easily.

The only reason I can't LOVE my carbine enfield as a bush rifle is that 10 round mag sticking below the stock....if I could find a 5 R for a reasonable price I would probably jump on it...I want to keep the 10 rounder though so not interested in modding it to a 5 er

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by obsessed1

The only reason I can't LOVE my carbine enfield as a bush rifle is that 10 round mag sticking below the stock....if I could find a 5 R for a reasonable price I would probably jump on it...I want to keep the 10 rounder though so not interested in modding it to a 5 er

Pro tip, so long as its not scoped, flip it upside down and carry with the mag sticking up. Slightly slower to get a shot off, but has the added benefit of protecting the sights from falling snow. Quite comfortable to carry.

This used to drive me crazy about Lee Enfields, as well as some .22s... then one day, out of the blue, after extensive study and experimentation, a brilliant and revolutionary solution came to me in a blinding flash of genius

It was one of those moments where I couldn't decide if I was quite clever or a complete idiot.

[obsessed1]

Originally Posted by Bushleague

Pro tip, so long as its not scoped, flip it upside down and carry with the mag sticking up. Slightly slower to get a shot off, but has the added benefit of protecting the sights from falling snow. Quite comfortable to carry.

This used to drive me crazy about Lee Enfields, as well as some .22s... then one day, out of the blue, after extensive study and experimentation, a brilliant and revolutionary solution came to me in a blinding flash of genius

It was one of those moments where I couldn't decide if I was quite clever or a complete idiot.

I'll have to try that