Flames Wideman getting sued for $10.25M

[JonBoy]

I once unintentionally knocked a hockey player down from behind, exactly in a situation like this. Why? He surprised me by skating backwards into me, even as I was moving slightly away/to the side. I thought he knew I was there and would stop or get out of the way. He didn't.

When he came up against me, I put both hands against his back to try and gently stop him. He dropped like he'd been shot. Why? He didn't know I was there and his balance was all wrong. He left the game, cursing furiously, convinced that I'd made a dirty play. I hadn't done a thing - I just wasn't about to get knocked over myself. He didn't play for weeks as his back was injured on the play. Again, I didn't cross check him or hit him - I merely put my hands out to provide a "bumper" for his back so that he wouldn't knock me over. He was quite a bit shorter as well, so my hands were more at his shoulder level than his mid-back, which meant my hands were in a position to "tip" him rather than "bump" him.

Henderson may or may not have been knocked over intentionally. However, I can speak from PERSONAL EXPERIENCE that what looks like a brutal or intentional hit does not need to be brutal or intentional to have devastating consequences. Wideman, in a concussed state, may not have the necessary presence of mind or balance to evade if he thought that Henderson was aware of his proximity and was going to get out of the way as Wideman was obviously headed to the bench.

I've been concussed three times, once in hockey, so I know what that's like. In the end, a quick "whoa" movement, done on the spur of the moment in a concussed state (not thinking very well and not very well balanced), could easily look like an intent to injure or knock Henderson down.

Wideman is bigger and stronger than Henderson, plus he's the one aware of the contact coming (albeit at the last second). It makes sense than Henderson would get the worst of this collision.

Wideman's attitude on the bench is reflective of someone that KNOWS they're going to be in trouble. That's not necessarily a reflection of guilt or intent, necessarily. Knocking over a ref from behind is going to always get you some negative intention.

[kevinhits]

Originally Posted by JonBoy

Why is the government of Canada suing for costs for "dental surgery services, optometric services, chiropractic services" when they do not pay for those in the first place? Those are not publicly (government) funded practices...

It is not the Government of Canada but actually the NDP (AHS) that is included as a plaintiff.....Unbelievable.....

[Fur]

I watched the hit many times. I am not a psychologist or anything, but it looks like his head was down and he was shaken from his hit. He at first looks like he is trying to avoid the ref and then for some reason hits him like he was defending himself. I think his head wasn't in the right spot. Not defending his hit as it should have never happened but it sort of looked like he thought he was going to get hit again and reacted. Looked like a total brain fart honestly.

[The moose]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Looked deliberate. He didn't accidently skate into him. He raised his arms and cross checked him, hard, from behind. Did you not see the replay? And the NHL doesn't suspend players for accidents.

I have heard and saw the dam thing more times than I would like. First off, I played hockey for 15 years at a competitive level. I was hit very similar to wideman once, I will tell you how I felt. My eyes were spinning in my dam head and could hardly tell what was up or down. Ears rigging . Seeing stars is a saying for a reason, it happens.

Wideman is skating to the bench, Henderson is skating BACKWARDS. I have no doubt in my mind depth perception was severely hampered . Suddenly Henderson is there into Wideman. Widemans hands start in a collapsed position against his body, Elbows pointed down. He is in a reaction position.

If I was to startle you. Will your hands come up to protect yourself? Its human instinct to protect yourself. There is multiple other clips of players coming into contact with officials in similar manners and same thing happens. Hands up.


There is no reverse angle. Where was Wideman looking? Intent is impossible to prove on this. The optics look bad, Henderson was injured. Again, Very unfortunate but I will not label Wideman as a malicious animal as some make him seem.

FWIW, The NHL suspended him on one ruling which, After independent arbitration was successfully overturned for a lack of intent.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by JonBoy

exactly in a situation like this. .

Oh please....

[wellpastcold]

Originally Posted by The moose

I have heard and saw the dam thing more times than I would like. First off, I played hockey for 15 years at a competitive level. I was hit very similar to wideman once, I will tell you how I felt. My eyes were spinning in my dam head and could hardly tell what was up or down. Ears rigging . Seeing stars is a saying for a reason, it happens.

Wideman is skating to the bench, Henderson is skating BACKWARDS. I have no doubt in my mind depth perception was severely hampered . Suddenly Henderson is there into Wideman. Widemans hands start in a collapsed position against his body, Elbows pointed down. He is in a reaction position.

If I was to startle you. Will your hands come up to protect yourself? Its human instinct to protect yourself. There is multiple other clips of players coming into contact with officials in similar manners and same thing happens. Hands up.



There is no reverse angle. Where was Wideman looking? Intent is impossible to prove on this. The optics look bad, Henderson was injured. Again, Very unfortunate but I will not label Wideman as a malicious animal as some make him seem.

FWIW, The NHL suspended him on one ruling which, After independent arbitration was successfully overturned for a lack of intent.

Most Canadian males played hockey. Very few ever attacked a game official. There is a reason referees look like zebras, it ain't a fashion statement. I cant wait to hear Wideman make the argument that "I didn't know he was an official". An even better one " I thought I was trying to take the head off another player, not an official". The true BS of all those defending Wideman is that it happens to players all the time. As a player you have your head on a swivel. You are taught not to put yourself in a position to get hurt. Keep your head up when you carry the puck. Officials are constantly criticized for missing calls, their focus is on the flow of the game and enforcing the rules, not getting slammed from behind no matter the cause.

[JimPS]

Don could never take or deliver a lickin' like his brother Archie could.

Although he might have been the better skater, that's probably why he became an Official instead of a player.

I would have though the Association's medical and retirement benefits would be more than enough to cover his costs and retirement - even without public healthcare kicking in.

His bro never made a lot of money in hockey - so maybe he's just seeking a little family revenge from the business to even up the score.

[Rio56]

Originally Posted by wellpastcold

Most Canadian males played hockey. Very few ever attacked a game official. There is a reason referees look like zebras, it ain't a fashion statement. I cant wait to hear Wideman make the argument that "I didn't know he was an official". An even better one " I thought I was trying to take the head off another player, not an official". The true BS of all those defending Wideman is that it happens to players all the time. As a player you have your head on a swivel. You are taught not to put yourself in a position to get hurt. Keep your head up when you carry the puck. Officials are constantly criticized for missing calls, their focus is on the flow of the game and enforcing the rules, not getting slammed from behind no matter the cause.

you're missing the point completely ... let the lawsuit go thru and pay out 10 million for a 300,000 ref in hockey ... The NHL players association will be on this like crazy ... where does a hit from behind on a ref become liable to this tune , 10 mil ... now think if a 50 mil player takes an "intentional" cross check into the boards with "intent ' to injury and his career is over for life at 22 ... see where this could go ..how bout a fight with intent to injure ... No player signs a waiver for injures to play in the NHL ..actually quite the opposite is that the NHL could be up for mega bucks on the concussion issue ..Swiveling heads as nothing to do with this .....They all play on the ice at the same time ... accident ? intentional ? maybe ? I wanna win?

Big can of worms .. give it to the ref but beware of the players being vulnerable in the future ... Intentional means millions ... OK

[JonBoy]

Originally Posted by wellpastcold

Most Canadian males played hockey. Very few ever attacked a game official. There is a reason referees look like zebras, it ain't a fashion statement. I cant wait to hear Wideman make the argument that "I didn't know he was an official". An even better one " I thought I was trying to take the head off another player, not an official". The true BS of all those defending Wideman is that it happens to players all the time. As a player you have your head on a swivel. You are taught not to put yourself in a position to get hurt. Keep your head up when you carry the puck. Officials are constantly criticized for missing calls, their focus is on the flow of the game and enforcing the rules, not getting slammed from behind no matter the cause.

Go get concussed, then get back to me about having your head on a swivel, not putting yourself in a vulnerable position, being fully aware of what's happening around you, etc.

[The moose]

Originally Posted by wellpastcold

Most Canadian males played hockey. Very few ever attacked a game official. There is a reason referees look like zebras, it ain't a fashion statement. I cant wait to hear Wideman make the argument that "I didn't know he was an official". An even better one " I thought I was trying to take the head off another player, not an official". The true BS of all those defending Wideman is that it happens to players all the time. As a player you have your head on a swivel. You are taught not to put yourself in a position to get hurt. Keep your head up when you carry the puck. Officials are constantly criticized for missing calls, their focus is on the flow of the game and enforcing the rules, not getting slammed from behind no matter the cause.

I dont think you understood any part of my comments.

[pinelakeperch]

I had two serious concussions (several more less serious ones as well) playing competitive hockey. Not once did I ever feel inclined to attack an official. Concussions are commonplace in high speed contact sports, and I don't recall this happening anywhere else. What a terrible, embarrassing excuse.

Do I think he should be banned from hockey due to poor judgment? No. I think he made a terrible mistake, but I don't believe he had intended to seriously cause harm. I just wish he'd take responsibility for his actions. If the official is unable to return to work, I believe he should be compensated for that as well as any other relevant damages. $10.25M does sound a little crazy, but all lawsuits begin with astronomical numbers.

[wellpastcold]

Originally Posted by JonBoy

Go get concussed, then get back to me about having your head on a swivel, not putting yourself in a vulnerable position, being fully aware of what's happening around you, etc.

Partner you are struggling with reality. Concussion is the new rage in all sports. There has never been an era in sports where there was more awareness around it. The simple fact is Wideman's stupidity caused an otherwise able man to lose his livelihood. Justify it anyway you want. I have to wonder if you got piled into while driving your vehicle and you were done working permanently if you would be quite so understanding? I didn't think so.

[tundraltd]

Originally Posted by wellpastcold

Partner you are struggling with reality. Concussion is the new rage in all sports. There has never been an era in sports where there was more awareness around it. The simple fact is Wideman's stupidity caused an otherwise able man to lose his livelihood. Justify it anyway you want. I have to wonder if you got piled into while driving your vehicle and you were done working permanently if you would be quite so understanding? I didn't think so.

X2.

[boah]

There may be a lot of pucks "accidentally" going in the direction of this ref.

[raab]

Originally Posted by boah

There may be a lot of pucks "accidentally" going in the direction of this ref.

Apparently he can't work anymore after the hit. Got to think he's having back and neck issues. Can't see this getting to the courts.

[Xbolt7mm]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

Anyone think that hit was accidental? You can see Wideman wound up for the hit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOx0Cwi6wR0

If it was the other way around, and Henderson grabbed a stick then crosschecked Wideman? You bet there would be a lawsuit.

Then look again your wrong

[Brian Adams]

Originally Posted by Xbolt7mm

Then look again your wrong

lol. That would be you're or you are.

[sdimedru]

Originally Posted by jhutter

I had two serious concussions (several more less serious ones as well) playing competitive hockey. Not once did I ever feel inclined to attack an official. Concussions are commonplace in high speed contact sports, and I don't recall this happening anywhere else. What a terrible, embarrassing excuse.

Do I think he should be banned from hockey due to poor judgment? No. I think he made a terrible mistake, but I don't believe he had intended to seriously cause harm. I just wish he'd take responsibility for his actions. If the official is unable to return to work, I believe he should be compensated for that as well as any other relevant damages. $10.25M does sound a little crazy, but all lawsuits begin with astronomical numbers.

Agreed

[RandyBoBandy]

I think that might be a soft tissue injury..so it's capped at $4000 in AB Better call Saul

[JonBoy]

Originally Posted by wellpastcold

Partner you are struggling with reality. Concussion is the new rage in all sports. There has never been an era in sports where there was more awareness around it. The simple fact is Wideman's stupidity caused an otherwise able man to lose his livelihood. Justify it anyway you want. I have to wonder if you got piled into while driving your vehicle and you were done working permanently if you would be quite so understanding? I didn't think so.

Actually, I have had multiple serious vehicle accidents (caused by others) that resulted in lost work, injury (permanent) and extensive impact on my life (and that of my family).

The ref may work again. He may not work again. We'll see.

[HoytCRX32]

Wideman ******ed up, clear and simple...he was angry no penalty was called and lashed out. A fraction higher and he could have easily broke the ref's neck...then it would (should) be prison time. I have no sympathy or respect for Wideman, I lost it that game.

[hunting4?]

Originally Posted by Rio56

Cat , have a look at some replays and boarding calls, or slashing with a weapon and breaking bones .. see where this goes .. ... and some players have been injured way more than 10 mil ... besides who says the damage is real , the ref , and he's part of the game ... I say leave it or ban all hitting.. the NHL/ref's are looking for revenge because they got the 20 game suspension over turned to 10...

REVENGE?

The guys life has been changed. He has not worked since the assault! I do mean assault by the way. A player under contract knows that a hit is part of the job. He signs a contract and accepts payment for that. The referee did not. He knows that the chance of being hit is there and he accepts that. But he also knows that there is no chance that any player would every ASSAULT him as he is there to officiate a game. He is not there to hit other players or get in fights.

One of the lowest things I have ever seen in hockey that is for sure.

I hope He gets taken to the cleaners and gets ordered to pay the full amount.

Wow just watched a video on it and supposedly he had surgery to remove 2 discs and their is a chance he may never skate again. wow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9vU_7dsodI

BUT there was also talk that he might have been about to be let go by the NHL.

[Canadasnowman]

Hard to watch this, can't believe what was going through his head to do it, never mind him getting hit in the corner. It's completely off the charts and should certainly face some liability if ref dudes life has been altered. I'm surprised he still gets to play. Should be ZERO tolerance IMO

[Okotokian]

We are arguing about intent, and I'm not sure it matters. Wideman did something and the ref suffered a loss. IF someone has a heart attack while driving and smashed into your car, crippling you, you are still going to successfully sue them. Now if Wideman says he was impaired by the hit he suffered, perhaps he should countersue the guy who hit him. But I think he is still going to be responsible for the damage he caused, conscious or not. I wonder if players have insurance for such things.

[Mike_W]

After the game Wideman claimed he seen the ref and was trying to go against the boards to get around him then the ref went close to the boards and he was stuck in the trolly tracks.
So he claimed to see him acknowledged that he hit him yet his actions and lack of care completely suggest intent and lack of remorse. He completely flattened a ref with a cross check to the back if that was unintentional you would think you might stop and try and assist.

[Roderek]

Originally Posted by wellpastcold

Partner you are struggling with reality. Concussion is the new rage in all sports. There has never been an era in sports where there was more awareness around it. The simple fact is Wideman's stupidity caused an otherwise able man to lose his livelihood. Justify it anyway you want. I have to wonder if you got piled into while driving your vehicle and you were done working permanently if you would be quite so understanding? I didn't think so.

Don't get me wrong by any means, Wideman should not have done what he did, and the ref should get compensation for that.

However, when all this happened, I read an article (I think it was TSN) that Don Henderson was going to be asked to retire. Similar to Mike Cvic when he retired.

So I think the grey area here is how many more games would he have still been on the ice for. His compensation should be a little over what his possible Wages lost would have been, maybe even double or triple. but that still only puts it in about the 1-2million range and I think that is being generous.

I agree I feel this will be settled.

The NHL and NHLPA will want this to go away as quickly and quietly as possible. as mentioned already the effect this could have on the league if every player started suing over a dirty hit.

[Trochu]

Just think, if he'd crosschecked him to the head, he would have just gotten a game and the matter would be considered closed.

[Habfan]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Just think, if he'd crosschecked him to the head, he would have just gotten a game and the matter would be considered closed.

Booooooo !!!