Is a Crossbow More Bow or Gun?

[ishootbambi]

simple enough question. do you think a crossbow is closer to a gun in its characteristics and performance, or a bow?

[DJS]

I think anyone who knows anything about crossbows won't argue that they can shoot farther than a bow. But in their characteristics they shoot more like a gun. No draw, alot less movement when preparing for a shot, the abliity to shoot while looking through a scope, so on and so on......

[Huntwriter]

Is a Crossbow More Bow or Gun? A crossbow is definitely a bow. If anything we would have to ask; Is a gun more like a crossbow? The reason being that the crossbow has been in use in its basic shape and design for about 1,000 years before the gun has been invented. The crossbow has been in use at least as long as the longbow. There is archeological evidence that suggests that both bows have been invented around the same time but in different parts of the world.

As for performance compared to a modern compound. Both are about the same. A crossbow generally creates more speed but the arrows are much shorter than normal arrows. A shorter arrow, although it might fly further, quickly looses energy that is needed to kill an animal at any distance over 40 to 50 yards.

Has a crossbow advantages over a regular bow? Not really other than a device that holds the string back. From personal experience with compound, traditional and crossbow I would say that in many regards the crossbow has more disadvantages.

Maneuverability, or better the lack of it, is a considerable disadvantage and the reason why I use my crossbow only from treestands or ground blinds.

Weight is another disadvantage. Most crossbows weigh between 6 to 8 lbs.

A crossbow is a true one-shot weapon. No matter how fast you are there is no way that you can set the string and load another arrow as fast as you can on a traditional or compound bow should you need a second shot. I can nock a second arrow on my compound bow and be ready to shoot in less that 2 seconds if I have to, no way I can accomplish that even close with a crossbow.

Despite all this, it is my firm opinion, based on experience, that a crossbow is a valuable archery weapon and should have its rightful place in the bowhunting season. As I stated elsewhere, 30 years ago the same debates raged about compound bows when they came on the market. Many bowhunters back then feared that this "modern contraption" would be the doom of bowhunting and the bows with heavy lobbying from archery clubs were outlawed in many American states and Canadian provinces.

However, as we all know the compound bow made bowhuting popular beyond the wildest imaginations. Now bowhunting is once more in sharp decline and who knows the crossbow might just be the ticket to popularize it again. The market share of crossbows has North America wide gone up more than 60% over the past four years. That is good news as many new hunters, but also older hunters that would otherwise have to give up bowhunting, purchase now crossbows as more and more jurisdictions make them a legal hunting weapon for all hunters.

[Huntwriter]

Originally Posted by DJS

No draw, alot less movement when preparing for a shot,

Actually I found that the amount of movement is about the same as with a regular bow. I can bring a compound or traditional bow slowly up and pull the string back at the same time, all in one smooth movement. It's one of the reasons why I keep a relatively low draw weight of 65 pounds. Shooting a crossbow I still have to bring it up and get in position too.

... the abliity to shoot while looking through a scope, so on and so on......

Again I find not much difference in aiming at a critter using sight pins or a scope. Besides where legal you can use scopes for compound bows too. All these devices do is to show me where the impact will be. But to get it to do that I still have to put diligent practice time in at the range to get proficient and properly sighted in.

[NBFK]

If there is no advantage with a cross bow why dosnt pope and young recognize it. I will continue to support the ABA in keeping them out of archery seasons. Once they are allowed there goes our general seasons. Harvest levels would increase greatly. My opinion buy a compound bow put time in like the other dedicated bow hunters.

[ishootbambi]

Originally Posted by natural.born.fawn.killer

Once they are allowed there goes our general seasons.

i wont speak for everyone, but im am not calling fellow archers insulting names. the quote here is a very common feeling from bowhunters however and if that doesnt say greed, then how would you describe it? i dont mean to pick on NBFK, he's just the one who said it here. the sense of entitlement to general tags does show a little selfishness. sorry if that offends you.


also NBFK, P&Y once did not allow compound bow killed entries, and up until very recently had a letoff restriction on compound bows. that seems pretty silly now doesnt it?

[Rocks]

Originally Posted by ishootbambi

i wont speak for everyone, but im am not calling fellow archers insulting names. the quote here is a very common feeling from bowhunters however and if that doesnt say greed, then how would you describe it? i dont mean to pick on NBFK, he's just the one who said it here. the sense of entitlement to general tags does show a little selfishness. sorry if that offends you.


also NBFK, P&Y once did not allow compound bow killed entries, and up until very recently had a letoff restriction on compound bows. that seems pretty silly now doesnt it?

Ya but isn' that what the crossbow guys want, the access to general tags? But do they know if the xbow is allowed the general tags may disappear??

[buckfever6]

Originally Posted by natural.born.fawn.killer

If there is no advantage with a cross bow why dosnt pope and young recognize it. I will continue to support the ABA in keeping them out of archery seasons. Once they are allowed there goes our general seasons. Harvest levels would increase greatly. My opinion buy a compound bow put time in like the other dedicated bow hunters.

X2!!!

[DJS]

Originally Posted by Huntwriter

Actually I found that the amount of movement is about the same as with a regular bow. I can bring a compound or traditional bow slowly up and pull the string back at the same time, all in one smooth movement. It's one of the reasons why I keep a relatively low draw weight of 65 pounds. Shooting a crossbow I still have to bring it up and get in position too.



Again I find not much difference in aiming at a critter using sight pins or a scope. Besides where legal you can use scopes for compound bows too. All these devices do is to show me where the impact will be. But to get it to do that I still have to put diligent practice time in at the range to get proficient and properly sighted in.

Come on, are you for real?? The more posts I read of yours the more I really start to question the "hunting expertise" you have previously talked about in the other thread. If you really have hunted with both weapons you know that the movement required to shoot a bow is far more than a crossbow. You could be in a kneeling postion with a crossbow on your knee and stay that way for a long time. In this same postion with a bow you could have the bow at the realy but you still have to draw which takes more movement than just bringing up a crossbow and sqeezing the triigger. I would even go so far as to say you could bring a cross bow up very very slowly with a whitetail looking directly at you and still get off a shot. No way in h--l would you do this with a bow.

Again, the practice time with each weapon is not even close. The average guy could not purchase a bow and in the same day be hunting it (even though I know this probably ahppens) but it's easily done with a crossbow. Just sight it in and away you go.
As for the scope vs pins, do you not agree that magnifying an animal with a scope is an advantage? Be serious.

[Huntwriter]

Originally Posted by DJS

If you really have hunted with both weapons you know that the movement required to shoot a bow is far more than a crossbow.

Maybe it is for you but for me it is not that big of a diference.

You could be in a kneeling postion with a crossbow on your knee and stay that way for a long time.

Most hunters find it very difficult to hold a crossbow in the ready to fire position for an extended length of time due to the relativey heavy weight of the weapon. I can hold a compound or my traditional bow much longer without fatigue. Whereas for the crossbow I require a rest to keep it steady on waiting periods that exceed more than three minutes. This in turn reduced considerably my mobility.

In this same postion with a bow you could have the bow at the realy but you still have to draw which takes more movement than just bringing up a crossbow and sqeezing the triigger.

If you have a moderate draw weight pulling the string slowly back -I do that as I raise bow - you can do that with very little movement. Having said that, as a guide I have seen many bowhunters that pulled 70+ pounds and resort do all sorts of gymnastics to come to full draw, especially in very cold weather.

I would even go so far as to say you could bring a cross bow up very very slowly with a whitetail looking directly at you and still get off a shot.

I tried that once and it didn't work, just like it doesn't work with a compound bow.

Again, the practice time with each weapon is not even close. The average guy could not purchase a bow and in the same day be hunting it (even though I know this probably ahppens) but it's easily done with a crossbow. Just sight it in and away you go.

I never said proficiency could be achieved in the same time with a compound as with a crossbow. However, there is no way that you can achieve proficiency with a crossbow in one day. It is statements like yours that give new and young hunters a false image of crossbows as a buy and hunt weapon. On the other hand a compound bow does not nearly require as much practice either as some make it out to be. Once a compound it sighted in, the bow and arrows are tuned it takes only a few days to get proficient. When compounds came first on the market that was one of the major complaints bowhunters had back then. "It's to easy" they said. That same argument we hear today about crossbows. I just don't get it what the degree of difficulty to become proficient with a weapon has to do with the subject. It's an issue that will puzzle me for ever. As far as I am concerned the easier something is to learn and the faster a hunter can get out in the field and hunt the better.

As for the scope vs pins, do you not agree that magnifying an animal with a scope is an advantage? Be serious.

To be truthful with you magnification at close range can actually be more of a hindrance then a bonus. It's the single reason why my scope is turned always to its lowest setting and often I find this to much too. I've contemplated to install a pin sight on my crossbow because of that.

[CNP]

Ridiculous poll and it has bias written all over it...

It's performance is that of a bow, it's characteristics are that of a firearm. The characteristcs require you to operate it as you would a firearm (you shoulder the xbow, sight down the rail (or scope), remove the safety and squeeze the trigger. It has a buttstock, a forestock, a rear and front sight mounted to the rail (or a scope), a safety and a trigger assembly. It has disadvantages and advantages over a bow. Advantage number one is that you don't need to know how to hunt with a bow......and number two is that you can shoot at anything that comes into view from your treestand without fear of being busted by drawing your bow. Like I said earlier.......almost guaranteed to kill anything that comes into view from your stand. For non-archers, since there is no archery season for bear, it's a great tool for killing bear over bait.

I've bow hunted for many years and I own an Excalibur Exomax crossbow. It's a great crossbow. From a treestand, a crossbow is by far a superior killing machine. If they were legal my tag to harvest percentage would be close to 100% (maybe 100%) on say moose, deer, elk and bear. Now those are some good odds. No wonder there are guys just itchin' to make this happen. Hunters (non-archers) calling other hunters (archers) greedy or selfish or other insulting names for not agreeing that xbows should be included in archery is just wrong. If it isn't wrong then I can say that hunters (non-archers) are just to lazy to take up bow hunting. It's not a season for archers....it's a season for hunters to take up a bow and go bowhunting. But then again some would rather complain year after year after year, never pick up a bow all that time, wear you down until the politicians give in and make it so. Doesn't that sound familiar in politics? Who wants nationally subsidized day-care? Who wants free medical? Who wants free education? Who wants free everything? (besides Jack Layton). People who want other people to pay their way want those things.

[DJS]

Originally Posted by ehntr

Ridiculous poll and it has bias written all over it...

It's performance is that of a bow, it's characteristics are that of a firearm. The characteristcs require you to operate it as you would a firearm (you shoulder the xbow, sight down the rail (or scope), remove the safety and squeeze the trigger. It has a buttstock, a forestock, a rear and front sight mounted to the rail (or a scope), a safety and a trigger assembly. It has disadvantages and advantages over a bow. Advantage number one is that you don't need to know how to hunt with a bow......and number two is that you can shoot at anything that comes into view from your treestand without fear of being busted by drawing your bow. Like I said earlier.......almost guaranteed to kill anything that comes into view from your stand. For non-archers, since there is no archery season for bear, it's a great tool for killing bear over bait.

I've bow hunted for many years and I own an Excalibur Exomax crossbow. It's a great crossbow. From a treestand, a crossbow is by far a superior killing machine. If they were legal my tag to harvest percentage would be close to 100% (maybe 100%) on say moose, deer, elk and bear. Now those are some good odds. No wonder there are guys just itchin' to make this happen. Hunters (non-archers) calling other hunters (archers) greedy or selfish or other insulting names for not agreeing that xbows should be included in archery is just wrong. If it isn't wrong then I can say that hunters (non-archers) are just to lazy to take up bow hunting. It's not a season for archers....it's a season for hunters to take up a bow and go bowhunting. But then again some would rather complain year after year after year, never pick up a bow all that time, wear you down until the politicians give in and make it so. Doesn't that sound familiar in politics? Who wants nationally subsidized day-care? Who wants free medical? Who wants free education? Who wants free everything? (besides Jack Layton). People who want other people to pay their way want those things.

Well said!

[NBFK]

Wow EHNTR you couldn't have put it better plus coming from someone with x bow experience! Glad there's voices of reason out there somewhere!

[pottymouth]

There is NO Right answer for this poll if your an advocate for Xbows not belonging in the Archery season.

The 1st and 3rd are similar answers worded differently !

I vote D

A xbow may have relatively similar characteristics of a bow , limbs, string and arrow tradjectory , but that where the similarity ends ! The rest of the characteristics and components come from the Gun !

[pottymouth]

1) Here is the definition of a bow straight from the Alberta Hunting Regulations.

Persons hunting big game must use an authorized bow and an authorized arrow. An authorized bow is one that is held, drawn and released by muscular power and has a draw weight of not less than 18 kg (40 lb.). This is the number of kilograms (pounds) required to draw an arrow of 71 cm (28 in.) to its head.

Xbows also have mechanical drawing devices, no muscle required

2) If Xbows and Bows are the same, Why is there an eligability permit required for handicap, amputee and injured archers on an annual basis from SRD. If they are the truely same they should be interchangeable in the arms of anyone, much like a gun and xbow are !!

3) If they are the same, I would challenge anyone to; pull back a bow, aim, and accurately arrow an animal while Lying flat on there belly, similar to a Xbow.

4) Bows #1)Do not have rest capabilities, #2) Require muscle strength to draw and release an arrow #3) Do not have a locking mechanism to hold the draw #4) Can not be fired with one hand #5) Major movement of 2 arms , chest and back are required to pull back the bow, seconds before trying to shoot an animal. The challenge of bowhunting. #6) Proficiency with a bow may take alot longer than a crossbow. A crossbow has a faster learning curve , about equal to a gun, to shoot.

[Rocks]

Doesn't matter. The current definition of archery equipment is good. Plus if you are determined to get into hunting, or only hunt with a crossbow you can, during all our general hunting seasons.

I still don't get why the guys who want crossbows added to archery season can't see that it will result in decreased hunter opportunity. Or maybe that's what they want, jealous of the bowhunters??

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by ehntr

It's performance is that of a bow, it's characteristics are that of a firearm. .

That is EXACTLY right. And it's keying in on characteristics instead of performance that has those idiots in Ottawa classing some semi-automatic firearms as "Restricted" because they are BLACK AND HAVE A HANDLE ON TOP!!!!!!!!!

"What can it do?" is the essential question, not "What does it look like?" or "How do you work it?" It takes longer to learn how to use a bow proficently? So what? It's easier to drive an automatic than a stick. Would you advocate separate lanes for cars with manual transmissions?

[YoungBuck]

i hope they NEVER allow crossbows in Archery only seasons. It will introduce a whole other croud that isn't willing to put in the time to ethicaly use a bow to hunt.

[medicmoose]

Ya know I just don’t think introducing crossbows to archery season will change much. The hardest part has been and always will be getting within the effective range of the weapon for an ethical kill. That’s why not many people are willing to put in the effort you out in 10 stalks or more for everyone that goes right. Lots of variables to play with wind, cover, direction of travel act. Modern compounds are simple to shoot and anyone can learn one in an afternoon, Like anything rifle or bow it take practice and experience to be able to stalk and kill and animal in the field. I’m sure crossbow sales will go up (big deal good for the economy). Maybe more guys out there in the field (we learn how to share in kindergarten). But to say so many animals will be getting killed over 50 yards plus is an exaggeration. I think with change or the potential for change people get scared and have there backs up if they think they stand to loose.

Just my 2 cents don’t light me up about it.

Matt

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by YoungBuck

i hope they NEVER allow crossbows in Archery only seasons. It will introduce a whole other croud that isn't willing to put in the time to ethicaly use a bow to hunt.

That's a pretty broad generalization there. Got any evidence?

[Ithaca Dog]

I chose "gun" even though I don't think it shoots farther than a bow. I really didn't like the choice of "Neither" because the poll asked what it was closer to being More like a gun or more like a bow. It is obviously neither and I belive that this choice skews your poll. You need to be a better hunter to kill with a bow than a crossbow and I personally believe that the crossbow should either have its own special season and zone or only be used in the firearms season. Just my 2cents

[Cal]

I think the real question here is "Are crossbow threads more redundant than Native hunting rights threads or just more pointless?" Vote now!

[wilburhunter]

Originally Posted by Cal

I think the real question here is "Are crossbow threads more redundant than Native hunting rights threads or just more pointless?" Vote now!

No I think the real question is, what is worse the fact that you took the time to post on this subject when you obviously had absolutely nothing to add to the discussion just needed to get your cheap 2 cents in , or the fact that I read it and responded. I vote for me actually responding.


Still waiting for an answer from anyone who supports crossbows in archery season.

Why do you personally want crossbows in archery season?

[Cal]

Originally Posted by wilburhunter

No I think the real question is, what is worse the fact that you took the time to post on this subject when you obviously had absolutely nothing to add to the discussion just needed to get your cheap 2 cents in , or the fact that I read it and responded. I vote for me actually responding.


Still waiting for an answer from anyone who supports crossbows in archery season.

Why do you personally want crossbows in archery season?

I dont want crossbows in the archery season, if compound bows being almost as effective is the justifying reason then I'd rather give up compound bows then add crossbows to tell you the truth. We've had a few crossbow threads in the last few days where ISB has made it a full time job to shoot off his big yap. Now that theyve either got closed or people have lost intrest he's got to go and start more threads just so he can keep shooting his mouth off, getting realy old.

[ishootbambi]

Originally Posted by Cal

I dont want crossbows in the archery season, if compound bows being almost as effective is the justifying reason then I'd rather give up compound bows then add crossbows to tell you the truth. We've had a few crossbow threads in the last few days where ISB has made it a full time job to shoot off his big yap. Now that theyve either got closed or people have lost intrest he's got to go and start more threads just so he can keep shooting his mouth off, getting realy old.

well cal, you're johnny come lately i guess. the last several threads on this topic were not closed and the last one which was the first in a while was not closed. however if you read it, youd know i didnt start it. the reason this one took over is because someone asked for a poll. your first couple of posts made me ask myself, why are you even saying anything if you have nothing to add to the discussion? you then made an attempt at sounding like you had a point, but the ludicrous ideas made no sense. toward the last post though, you expressed a valid opinion and i respect that. you think a crossbow is easier to learn and......are you ready.......I AGREE. you dont want them included as you think someone would be less of a hunter for it. well, ok. you are entitled to your opinion as i am to mine. i have no personal interest one way or the other......i just dont like it when guys make an uninformed opinion based on myths. there area lot of guys who have learned a lot from these discussions, and isnt that the point of this forum?

Originally Posted by Cal

had to compete against people using crossbows. ?

now by saying this i have no choice but to feel sorry for you. if you think hunting is a competition, you are missing out on a lot. i cant tell you how to do it or what you should like, but if this is how you feel........wow, seriously i feel bad for you.

a guy told me last year that he was with another hunter who shot a very nice whitetail. it was over 160 and rather than just being happy for what he had done, the first words he spoke were, "Yes! That should beat Dale for this years big buck competition." i felt sorry for that guy as well when i heard that.

[Cal]

Aw rats, I cant beleive I got sucked into this, I must be as dumb as I look but here goes.

Why dont we let people use crossbows in golf? Thats right, make a crossbow that shoots golfballs and then the people who dont have the dedication or time to learn to actualy play golf can just sight the thing in and shoot a great round. It would bring in more golfers, be great for the game. If we make sure the crossbows couldnt shoot any farther than a golf pro can drive a golf ball after years of dedicated practice it would be prety much the same thing .... Well we all can see how stupid that would be, and putting crossbows in the bow season is just as stupid for all the same reasons.

[NBFK]

Aw rats, I cant beleive I got sucked into this, I must be as dumb as I look but here goes.

Why dont we let people use crossbows in golf? Thats right, make a crossbow that shoots golfballs and then the people who dont have the dedication or time to learn to actualy play golf can just sight the thing in and shoot a great round. It would bring in more golfers, be great for the game. If we make sure the crossbows couldnt shoot any farther than a golf pro can drive a golf ball after years of dedicated practice it would be prety much the same thing .... Well we all can see how stupid that would be, and putting crossbows in the bow season is just as stupid for all the same reasons.

Ha x2
But modern compounds are easy to shoot like a cross bow so there is no difference.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by Cal

Why dont we let people use crossbows in golf? Thats right, make a crossbow that shoots golfballs and then the people who dont have the dedication or time to learn to actualy play golf can just sight the thing in and shoot a great round. It would bring in more golfers, be great for the game. If we make sure the crossbows couldnt shoot any farther than a golf pro can drive a golf ball after years of dedicated practice it would be prety much the same thing .... Well we all can see how stupid that would be, and putting crossbows in the bow season is just as stupid for all the same reasons.

I don't care what the foursome behind me is using, as long as it's range is limited and they aren't launching balls into my group. Your whole arguement is based on "It's wrong. I don't like it" How would what someone else is using in a sport possibly impact your enjoyment of it?

A closer golf analogy would be if you used a regular putter and you tried to get your club to ban the use of long-shafted putters. Why? So what if a long-shafted putter is easier to use? What possible difference would it make to you?