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Old 05-23-2016, 10:07 AM
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Question Increased fishing opportunity

What should we be pressuring the ministry of environment to do to increase our opportunity to catch big fish, to catch lots of fish?
First on my list would be to increase the budget for Fish and Wild life to conduct license checks ( and, for that matter, possession checks).
Second would be to turn on the aerators at my favourite spots, but that has been documented in a few other threads.
But what are some other factors that the ministry is either doing wrong, or could do better?
A guy had might as well have a bunch of information when writing e-mails to a minister.

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Old 05-23-2016, 10:46 AM
the local angler the local angler is offline
 
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i agree especially with the aerators, a few of the lakes i fished changed over to the defusers and all you see is dead fish everywhere. i personally don't think they work very well. the srd also needs alot more CO man power to match the fishing hunting population that use the resources, the officers are spread way to thin in alberta.
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Old 05-23-2016, 11:25 AM
waterninja waterninja is offline
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I do agree about the problems this aerator situation has caused. It will take years to get lakes like Miller or Muir back to where they were before this latest winterkill.
As for hiring more CO's, I don't agree. If every angler with a licence in AB were partnered up with thier own personal CO, and every waterbody that was fished had some extra CO's to watch the anglers that fished without a licence, Do you think we would all catch more and bigger fish? I doubt it. Gov't would probably issue a ton more tickets, but fishing would not improve.
Lets face it, we have a finite number of places to fish, with the numbers of anglers increasing every year. Also, the waterbodies we do have are slowly shrinking and being polluted to the point where fish have trouble surviveing. Throw in some invasive species of fish and plant life, mix with a few algae blooms and winter kills, and well I think you get the picture.
I imagine we will see more and more catch and release lakes or even closures in the future. I would prefer more money being spent on stocking programs that include more then just trout, then see the money spent on more CO's.
Don't misunderstand me, CO's and enforcement is important, but simply hiring them in bunches is not going to improve fishing. Also seems strange that our govt. has no problem sending CO's out to give someone a 100.00 ticket for using a barbed hook or drinking a beer while fishing, but allows big industry to destroy entire streams or pollute large area's of water with little or no consequences. Dickson Dam, the Pembina River, and the Athabasca comes to mind recently. How many thousands of fish were killed and are those waters to toxic to fish in now?
Sorry for the rant.
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Old 05-24-2016, 06:58 AM
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Ive said it before many times. Close or make all lakes C&R for a couple years, open for a year then repeat, and let nature take it's course.
Maybe shorten the fishing season a month or two ?
No netting at all in all lakes, including first nation people for at least 10 years.


If every lake had a few hundred more females spawning. the lakes would have millions more fish in them in a couple years. Ten years = billions . More feed = larger fish also.


Like I said, close them all. Sure lots of people would complain at first but in a couple years when the fish are jumping into your boat everyone will be happier !
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Old 05-24-2016, 07:52 AM
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Like Kim said, sell only Saskatchewan licenses in Alberta for awhile and close down all netting.
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Old 05-24-2016, 09:45 AM
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I'm not sure which ministry we should connect with, and which ministries are responsible for making decisions on the liability concerns surrounding our Aeration policy but we definitely should be addressing this.

I think we have become too concerned with protecting people with no common sense who might choose to ignore signs posted that clearly say the ice is thin and potentially dangerous on lakes/ponds where aeration is present.

Post a sign, and those who choose to ignore it and drown, should take the responsibility and accept the risk without any expectation that the province is labile for their poor judgment and choice to put themselves at risk.

In terms of more SRD funding - I would be in favor of adding more resources to a few areas - each with its own merits - but I know for sure, having a few more biologists, able to study/monitor a few more watersheds, would certainly be helpful for us (and our resource).
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Old 05-24-2016, 10:29 AM
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Regarding trout

1) There are a number of lakes that naturally overwinter and do grow big fish. At least a handful of these lakes should be stocked and managed as trophy fisheries. Use the natural lakes for trophy fisheries instead of trying to manage a few sloughs with aerators as trophy fisheries...

2) Stock rainbows and brookies as put and take species. Rainbows are the cheapest and should be the main put and takers. Brookies also have a place as they seem to be able to overwinter better in shallower lakes so should be stocked in more lakes to try and take advantage of that ability(and their better eating quality).

3) Other species like browns, cutties and tigers should be treated as trophy species. There are very limited fishing options for these fish and their eating quality is not that great but it sure is a ton of fun catching a big fish of either of these species. They need to start protecting these fish better like say Obed which is being fished out.

4) Tiger trout are awesome, they need to get regs fixed stat... Someone told me it takes them 18 months to change those regs, well they have now been stocked for 8+ months and were in a hatchery for 2+ years so get on the ball... I would also like it if they stocked them in a couple more remote lakes and made them trophy fisheries.

5) Figure out aeration issue, I heard rumblings they had something in place to go back to the old style aerators if so then we are good already.

Regarding CO's

They definitely need to increase CO budget or they need to change their system. I go fishing every week and in years of fishing I could count the number of times I have been checked on one hand.

Regarding Pike/Walleye

1) They need to quit all netting. Probably out of their hands but natives netting should not be allowed anymore.

2) Open up a few more lakes to walleye retention without tags. Even if those lakes get darn near fished out(which I don't believe they would with the right regs in place) it gives guys more options to go to. This especially goes for down south now where almost everything is closed, maybe things need to stay closed to recover for a few years but in that case they should also stock some fish in those lakes to increase recovery rate.

3) If you are going to play god and mess with ecosystems like Wabamun by dumping walleye in them then be willing to micro manage them properly and once you see the negative effects make the necessary changes to help the lake instead of just screwing them up and then leaving it up to mother nature to fix your mess...

I am sure there are more but those are some of my main thoughts. If extra funding is required they need to look at cutting costs elsewhere or figuring out a way to increase their funding.
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Old 05-24-2016, 10:59 AM
smitty9 smitty9 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waterninja View Post
Don't misunderstand me, CO's and enforcement is important, but simply hiring them in bunches is not going to improve fishing.
Sorry for the rant.
Disagree. Connect all the dots here. Handing out more tickets does not improve the fishing, true. But if handing out more tickets deters poachers, then yes, fishing does improve.

If you don't believe me, see the pic attached. There should be 29 more fish in the Oldman river. But thanks to the selfish actions of Jackarse poachers, those fish aren't available to catch.

That's just one incident.

And I don't believe in false choice either. I think we should lobby the ministry for improved stocking programs and management AND increased enforcement. Too many people come to Alberta and think its the wild west for hunting and fishing.
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Old 05-24-2016, 11:00 AM
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I don't see netting discontinued for the First Nations anytime soon. Let's avoid spinning our wheels and wasting time and effort on that one folks.
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Old 05-24-2016, 11:07 AM
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There are a few things that I'd like to see, in southern Alberta go through every lake individually, there are a number of lakes that walleye harvesting needs to happen in order to bring the lakes back into balance. There are also a number of rivers where they would be able to reintroduce cutthroat and stick them in sufficient numbers to overtake the brookies that are currently there, the red deer river drainage is full of these rivers that could provide that opportunity.
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Old 05-24-2016, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smitty9 View Post
Disagree. Connect all the dots here. Handing out more tickets does not improve the fishing, true. But if handing out more tickets deters poachers, then yes, fishing does improve.

If you don't believe me, see the pic attached. There should be 29 more fish in the Oldman river. But thanks to the selfish actions of Jackarse poachers, those fish aren't available to catch.

That's just one incident.

And I don't believe in false choice either. I think we should lobby the ministry for improved stocking programs and management AND increased enforcement. Too many people come to Alberta and think its the wild west for hunting and fishing.
All revenues from fish/wildlife infraction should go back to the department to increase conservation/enforcement efforts...I'm not sure, but I would bet a pint that the monies from enforcement go to general revenue
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Old 05-24-2016, 03:08 PM
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I think it's easy to suggest more C&R, or more enforcement to catch poachers, and those actions might be needed, but I'm not sure they address one very big problem: namely the impact of industry on fish populations. Forestry, mining, gravel pits, resource roads, culverts, etc are destroying some of our fishery. We need to deal with those too, and make some hard choices. C&R alone or even total closures isn't going to make everything pristine again. If they did we would be swimming in Bull trout, wouldn't we?

We might have to limit fishing opportunities, but the real solution is beyond just that.
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Old 05-24-2016, 03:45 PM
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My opinion:
1) Seasonal closure on bulltrout/grayling/athabow stream, as they do for salmon. Too many people see a small creek with huge fish in it and go nuts.
2) Sturgeon seem to become super popular in the last 5 years (or what I've observed on AO). Solution? Sturgeon tags as they have for white sturgeon in BC. 3) Implement a "fisher training" like a hunting or boating licence. Offer it in the most spoken languages in Alberta; English, Cantonese, Punjabi, Russian, Spanish etc.
4) Rotational closures on lakes, they do this in Ontario for aurora trout lakes and it's been successful.
5) Open up walleye at lakes where pike are getting punished, like calling and Baptiste (except that lake is f*kd anyway)
6) Monitor industry and agriculture discharge and enforce it. Yea fisherman cause huge issues, but fk, it's not like there aren't other factors.
7) lastly hey fishermen bring a blue recycling bag and pick up plastic and trash, that wouldn't hurt anything.
BASICALLY: look at the successes and methods of other provinces and states and mimic them. Who cares about ego
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Old 05-24-2016, 04:46 PM
Bemoredog Bemoredog is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okotokian View Post
I think it's easy to suggest more C&R, or more enforcement to catch poachers, and those actions might be needed, but I'm not sure they address one very big problem: namely the impact of industry on fish populations. Forestry, mining, gravel pits, resource roads, culverts, etc are destroying some of our fishery. We need to deal with those too, and make some hard choices. C&R alone or even total closures isn't going to make everything pristine again. If they did we would be swimming in Bull trout, wouldn't we?
I think most of the ideas shared would all be helpful to rejuvenating Alberta's fisheries, but if I had to pick only 1 it would be to restrict human development near water bodies. Destruction of riparian habitat by us is the greatest contributor to the decline of our fisheries. Poaching and high take numbers don't help, but if the habitat can't support aquatic life addressing poaching and take numbers is moot. We need to curb development and invest in reclamation activities. Even if this is done it will take years to bear fruit, but the gains will (most likely) be permanent.

It isn't just industrial development though, farming is pretty detrimental too in the form of runoff. The excessive nutrients boost plant growth which winds up starving the lake of oxygen and killing the fish.

It's tough though since curbing development is economically undesirable to many folks for obvious reasons. Not an easy policy to pass on a broad scale even with a left of center gov.
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Old 05-24-2016, 07:02 PM
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I think the ministry should introduce an aggressive Yellow Perch stocking program from the Brood of adult fish with the proven genetics capable of reaching Jumbo status. Stock the bajeebers out of them in all of the lakes they intend to also stock with Walleye or the lakes where they intend to have trophy fisheries for both Pike and Walleye etc. Restock as many of the walleye and pike lakes across the province as possible with Perch and various baitfish species too if possible. I think this would be great for the walleye and pike and great for fisherman. Could help buffer the impact of stocking large walleye numbers. Problem today is they stock millions of walleye that eventually grow and consume all of the native forage base of spot tail shiners or Perch for example and then they stunt and turn scrawny or die off. The large numbers of walleye can out compete other species like Trophy class Pike In Wab for example. It can Happen quickly. I don't think it is wise to stock these high numbers of predatory fish without giving the same amount of attention; or more, to forage species like Perch and various minnow species. Some lakes due to biomass probably need some Perch taken out to prevent stunting as well. The Government or SRD could work with and fund Aboriginal communities and private sector to create an aquaculture industry within the province, by region, that could do some heavy lifting for SRD with their rearing and stocking programs of various species. All I know is you can't stock predatory fish;at or near the top of their respective food chains, and do nothing about ensuring a healthy vibrant forage base that can handle the increased biomass of predators. Perch is a perfect solution for the walleye and Pike lakes as they are native to the Province and the only species left where possession limits can still be liberal to moderate......just keep them out of the Trout lakes and ponds for the trout guys!
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Old 05-25-2016, 07:48 AM
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Quite a few years ago, there was a province wide bait ban in alberta. I think if that reg was back in place, you could open the lakes to more fishing. I remember walleye fishing being very tough especially in the winter when you could not use minnows.
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Old 05-25-2016, 01:58 PM
Supergrit Supergrit is online now
 
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One thing for trout I would like to see mixes stocking. Take a lake like Carson put in rainbow trout no restrictions let people take home. Stock a way smaller number of day for example brown trout and put a 18 inch slot size. At least then a person have a chance to get something big.
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Old 05-26-2016, 03:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smitty9 View Post
I don't see netting discontinued for the First Nations anytime soon. Let's avoid spinning our wheels and wasting time and effort on that one folks.
We need to be spending MORE time & effort on that one. Have you ever witnessed one of those nets being pulled? I have, it's downright ugly and horribly unfair for responsible anglers
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Old 05-26-2016, 01:58 PM
smitty9 smitty9 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okotokian View Post
I think it's easy to suggest more C&R, or more enforcement to catch poachers, and those actions might be needed, but I'm not sure they address one very big problem: namely the impact of industry on fish populations. Forestry, mining, gravel pits, resource roads, culverts, etc are destroying some of our fishery. We need to deal with those too, and make some hard choices. C&R alone or even total closures isn't going to make everything pristine again. If they did we would be swimming in Bull trout, wouldn't we?

We might have to limit fishing opportunities, but the real solution is beyond just that.
Wanted to quote this, because I agree with and I don't want it to get overlooked. The province must adopt a "manage all" approach, given the really limited water we have in this province. I am talking about really productive, blue ribbon water. It's quite revealing, and ironic, that one of our most productive trout fisheries - the Bow - is mostly an artificially created fishery. And how much does it contribute to Calgary's economy. I heard the figure of 10 million, and that quote is about 20 years old. I digress. The point is, we actually don't have alot of super productive, fertile water north of the South Saskatchewan basin. Just pockets of some good fishing, in my opinion. And alot of that is limitations by natural factors, so we're already at a disadvantage.

So you're right Okotokian, it will not be enough to manage recreational users. Sure, limit the fishing, tweak the regs, catch poachers, do the rant against illegal OHV use, but by and large, industry has a massive impact. Road density, road intrusion, bridges, sedimentation, logging setbacks from riparian areas, all of these and more create impact. The government simply must make companies more responsible, more accountable to their impacts.

Yes, the real solution is beyond that indeed. Take the Pembina closure; are we really going to see a huge improvement in fishing 5 years from now, if industry - especially oil and gas - is still happily 'blasting' away in that area? What will fish populations look like if left untouched by anglers by 5 years, but industry were to create problems left "relatively" unchecked, unmonitored, and unenforced? What if, say, some of those industrial impacts where to occur in the spawning reaches of that watershed? What was the point then in restricting anglers?

Food for thought.
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Old 05-26-2016, 01:59 PM
smitty9 smitty9 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by does it ALL outdoors View Post
We need to be spending MORE time & effort on that one. Have you ever witnessed one of those nets being pulled? I have, it's downright ugly and horribly unfair for responsible anglers
Be my guest. Lead the charge!
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Old 05-28-2016, 10:26 PM
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Some really good input here, folks. Thank you.
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Last edited by WillyOneStyle; 05-28-2016 at 10:27 PM. Reason: spelling
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