Draws

[honda610]

Sooo I have 2 nephews I am teaching to hunt. Youth. Parents aren't around. My wife and myself also hunt. If people think I will pay 400 bucks for draws there nutz. I will have my own kids to enter as youth very soon. So 800 in draws.
If you want more opportunity to hunt and shorter wait times deal with the elephant in the room. Tell joe first nations to stop shooting the hell out of alberta. Deal with out of province hunters. Get political and end guiding for everything on draw. Typical left wing, we have a problem let's charge more money that will fix it. !!!
I feel sorry for my kids if this is were the world is headed.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

He posted that you pay for the tag when drawn, not when you apply. This would be easy to do if you provide a credit card number when you apply. If the card is no longer valid when you draw, you are disqualified from the following years draws, until you pay for the license that you drew.

I agree. It may sound a little harsh , but just watch the abuse come to a screeching halt. It's a very small move when you consider we follow that very same procedure when buying anything else with a money-back return policy
.
$3.68.00 per draw is such a wussy fee it's ridiculous. No wonder the system went sideways. Hell, $50.00 more than covers 12 draw applications per household the way it is (was).

[ram crazy]

There is an aweful lot of this about my hunting rights being hindered by the long wait times. If you don't like it go buy a whitetail, black bear, elk, sheep, or a cougar tag. If that's not good enough go to the states and hunt, because money is no object for some. Hunting is a privilege not a right. I think we should go back to the good old days of random draw, then watch the crying start. Me I don't care if I kill something, I still like to help others try and fill their tags. Like was said before if you want shorter wait times get rid of the nonresident tags.

[MooseRiverTrapper]

We are behind the times here in Alberta with the cheap draws. Look anywhere else you are going to pay to play and it keeps everyone honest.

No it’s not a rich mans sport. Fuel is $150 a tank. What’s wrong with an antlered tag costing as much as a tank of fuel? We could maybe fund somebody to start managing the wildlife.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by honda610

Sooo I have 2 nephews I am teaching to hunt. Youth. Parents aren't around. My wife and myself also hunt. If people think I will pay 400 bucks for draws there nutz. I will have my own kids to enter as youth very soon. So 800 in draws.
If you want more opportunity to hunt and shorter wait times deal with the elephant in the room. Tell joe first nations to stop shooting the hell out of alberta. Deal with out of province hunters. Get political and end guiding for everything on draw. Typical left wing, we have a problem let's charge more money that will fix it. !!!
I feel sorry for my kids if this is were the world is headed.

I just checked the draw book and whitetail is still general in 99% of Alberta
They also have this thing called a youth partner license. Sobthey can hunt with you, if you get a draw. It’s pretty cheap also

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by Salavee

.
$3.68.00 per draw is such a wussy fee it's ridiculous. No wonder the system went sideways.

Bingo! Cripes, it might as well be free to enter according to some

But, if prices were to rise for both tags and draw entries, then that should be being put right back into wildlife management.

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by MooseRiverTrapper

We are behind the times here in Alberta with the cheap draws. Look anywhere else you are going to pay to play and it keeps everyone honest.

No it’s not a rich mans sport. Fuel is $150 a tank. What’s wrong with an antlered tag costing as much as a tank of fuel? We could maybe fund somebody to start managing the wildlife.

I agree!

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by ram crazy

There is an aweful lot of this about my hunting rights being hindered by the long wait times.

You obviously don’t understand how this works. As Alberta’s population keeps increasing, draw times will get longer and longer. At the price of about one coffee to enter a draw, why wouldn’t anyone throw their name in the hat even if they never have any intention of hunting that animal?

So say I put in for turkey let’s say, 10 years, over those ten years it cost me less than $40. Let’s say at year ten, I decide to draw the tag, oops, no time to hunt do to work or family or just change my mind and want to be lazy. Doesn’t matter much to me, but, some other Hunter could have taken that opportunity. Get it?

Something needs to be changed with our draw system. Period. If it stays the same draw times will get so long that receiving a draw tag will be like winning the lottery. And some draws are already getting to that point.

Don’t believe me, keep things status quo, and find out in a five years.

I’m willing to bet that if we went to say $15-20 to enter a draw, and any draw won, the tag has to be bought immediately (charged to your visa). Draw times would drop immensely. Or something similar to that model...

[honda610]

Oh that makes sense... I get a moose tag every 3 to 5 years on the current system so just the 4 of us could take 20 years to each have a chance to hunt a moose. 5 min from my house.
With the exception of sheep, turkey and speed goat I can hunt all the other species 15 min from my house so hunting is relatively inexpensive as I have owned all the gear for years. This making it cost more to stop abusers is not the answer. As I said before deal with the 3 main issues facing our wildlife.
1. Unchecked shooting by natives
2. Non residents abusing our system. ( this may have started)
3. If it's on draw then the outfitter allocations end.
Do I agree something has to be done yes.
I would agree if you draw the tag then automatic purchase happens.
But charging 50 to 100 bucks per person for a draw is ridiculous. This it's not a cheap sport pay to play bs is garbage. It costs x in the states so we should do the same is about as dumb as saying the Aussies and kiwis outlawed semis so we should do the same.
The system can be fixed without charging a pile of cash
Do you honestly think that money collected will go to wildlife conservation?
Make hunters ed harder and more involved so it weeds out the trigger happy slobs who just write a test online and show up to the bush with cabelas stickers hanging off there boresighted savage axis....
Way to many people got there hunting certification through the win card loopholes. Make anyone who cant prove they took the course before the new system re write. Most out of province people won't walk into a fish and wildlife office show Id make a signed declaration and write the hunters test. That would weed out a pile of transients who abuse the system
Just my thoughts anyone else have a idea other than let's pay to play.

[elkhunter11]

If only people eligible to hunt were allowed to enter the draw, instead of anyone with a WIN card, and all tags were automatically charged to the applicants credit card, only hunters that actually want the tag will apply, so the number of applications will be reduced. And if we adopt a resident qualification like most other provinces, that will also reduce the number of applicants. Then we need to deal with outfitter allocations for species that Alberta residents have to wait five years or more to draw tags for. If we do those things, draw times will be reduced, and we don't have to increase application prices to accomplish that.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by honda610

Oh that makes sense... I get a moose tag every 3 to 5 years on the current system so just the 4 of us could take 20 years to each have a chance to hunt a moose. 5 min from my house.
With the exception of sheep, turkey and speed goat I can hunt all the other species 15 min from my house so hunting is relatively inexpensive as I have owned all the gear for years. This making it cost more to stop abusers is not the answer. As I said before deal with the 3 main issues facing our wildlife.
1. Unchecked shooting by natives
2. Non residents abusing our system. ( this may have started)
3. If it's on draw then the outfitter allocations end.
Do I agree something has to be done yes.
I would agree if you draw the tag then automatic purchase happens.
But charging 50 to 100 bucks per person for a draw is ridiculous. This it's not a cheap sport pay to play bs is garbage. It costs x in the states so we should do the same is about as dumb as saying the Aussies and kiwis outlawed semis so we should do the same.
The system can be fixed without charging a pile of cash
Do you honestly think that money collected will go to wildlife conservation?
Make hunters ed harder and more involved so it weeds out the trigger happy slobs who just write a test online and show up to the bush with cabelas stickers hanging off there boresighted savage axis....
Way to many people got there hunting certification through the win card loopholes. Make anyone who cant prove they took the course before the new system re write. Most out of province people won't walk into a fish and wildlife office show Id make a signed declaration and write the hunters test. That would weed out a pile of transients who abuse the system
Just my thoughts anyone else have a idea other than let's pay to play.

Buddy I hear ya!
We are in the same boat. We have land in the low 500’s. They took away the archery general moose. They dropped the tag numbers because we have reserves all around us.
No matter what the govt does regarding the issues with the draws.
None of it matters if they don’t address non regulated hunting

[calvin]

i think there needs to be some actual thought and research into this system we have. for 3.65$ you are basically purchasing a priority point. we are leaving a lot of money on the table. we should be charging at least 50 for it.
i feel we need to allocate at least 20% of the available tags to random draws. i believe this would encourage people apply for the draws instead of 999 all the time.
i feel priority points should be capped at 10. current points should still be valid.
i think it would be good for some draws to be put on a 'one and you're done' basis. but the wait times are kind of already doing that for us.
i feel we should be able to apply for more than one elk draw. but the undersubscribed does help with that already to a point.
There has to be and Alberta resident hunters should be demanding this, is a requirement of residency for purchase of hunting licenses.
I feel Antlered Mule Deer should be a resident only license. but we could work into a partner license possibility with immediate family members.
i feel we need to some sort of harvest report implemented. all i want to say or have recorded is what was shot and which WMU. no how many days and all the other crap involved. you kill a deer and where. thats it.
i feel that folks that use the Green Zones for whatever purpose, be it hunting, quads, camping, firewood collection, fishing, should be required to have a WIN card.
thats my wish list.

[Wrongside]

Originally Posted by crazy_davey

Bingo! Cripes, it might as well be free to enter according to some

But, if prices were to rise for both tags and draw entries, then that should be being put right back into wildlife management.

Some of us are already spending several hundred dollars annually on draws and tags. It's a fairly substantial cost for me. And we are only a small family.

There are so many other loopholes and abuses that could be tightened and actually enforced, before increasing the cost of draws and licences should even be considered, IMO. (Increased revenues being highly unlikely to go into wildlife management anyways, given long government track records.) Having to purchase the WC prior to applying for draws is a small step in the right direction. I'd love to see auto purchase of licences when drawn also. Outfitter allocations, non-resident/multi-resident hunters, high priority draws going to non-residents, on and on...

[bucksman]

-30,715 hunters used the 999 priority draw code on antlered mule deer last year
-98,791 actually applied with a draw code and 87,653 were unsuccessful. Do the 87653 "hunters" not know about 999 draw code or are there that many anti hunters sprinkled in there. If so, making people buy a license before applying is a good start, but I see a lot of comments saying it should cost more money to apply. They should make applying with a draw code cost more and leave the 999 priority alone or make it cost less than actually applying. I would still pay $5-$10 for boosting my priority, that's the only way anyone in this province gets a draw is by building priority points. 10 years to get an antlered mule deer tag in some spots is a bit ridiculous if a person is paying $50 a pop

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by calvin

i think there needs to be some actual thought and research into this system we have. for 3.65$ you are basically purchasing a priority point. we are leaving a lot of money on the table. we should be charging at least 50 for it.
i feel we need to allocate at least 20% of the available tags to random draws. i believe this would encourage people apply for the draws instead of 999 all the time.
i feel priority points should be capped at 10. current points should still be valid.
i think it would be good for some draws to be put on a 'one and you're done' basis. but the wait times are kind of already doing that for us.
i feel we should be able to apply for more than one elk draw. but the undersubscribed does help with that already to a point.
There has to be and Alberta resident hunters should be demanding this, is a requirement of residency for purchase of hunting licenses.
I feel Antlered Mule Deer should be a resident only license. but we could work into a partner license possibility with immediate family members.
i feel we need to some sort of harvest report implemented. all i want to say or have recorded is what was shot and which WMU. no how many days and all the other crap involved. you kill a deer and where. thats it.
i feel that folks that use the Green Zones for whatever purpose, be it hunting, quads, camping, firewood collection, fishing, should be required to have a WIN card.
thats my wish list.

You obviously don't understand why some people apply simply to boost their priority. It's not just because they need the priority to draw, it's also because many people need to co-ordinate with hunting partners, or with their employer, to be able to go when they draw. For that reason, some of us built more priority than required, to make sure that we draw when we want to. Having lottery tags won't encourage those people to try and draw if anything, more people will apply using the priority only choice, to make sure that they don't draw until they are ready. And except for a draw like the 437 sheep where new applicants will die of old age before they draw, priority caps will accomplish nothing.And by the way , there is no 999 code, it no longer exists, just like the FAC , that some people still talk about.

[ram crazy]

Originally Posted by crazy_davey

You obviously don’t understand how this works. As Alberta’s population keeps increasing, draw times will get longer and longer. At the price of about one coffee to enter a draw, why wouldn’t anyone throw their name in the hat even if they never have any intention of hunting that animal?

So say I put in for turkey let’s say, 10 years, over those ten years it cost me less than $40. Let’s say at year ten, I decide to draw the tag, oops, no time to hunt do to work or family or just change my mind and want to be lazy. Doesn’t matter much to me, but, some other Hunter could have taken that opportunity. Get it?

Something needs to be changed with our draw system. Period. If it stays the same draw times will get so long that receiving a draw tag will be like winning the lottery. And some draws are already getting to that point.

Don’t believe me, keep things status quo, and find out in a five years.

I’m willing to bet that if we went to say $15-20 to enter a draw, and any draw won, the tag has to be bought immediately (charged to your visa). Draw times would drop immensely. Or something similar to that model...

That's none of your business what one decided to do with their tag if they get drawn. I don't tell you what you should do with your tags or priorities and you don't have the right to tell others, get over it! Once again get rid of nonresident tags.

[WinefredCommander]

I think half of newfies who once worked in Alberta and are back East now are still building priority hoping that one day they'll get back in the patch... You should need to PROVE residency annually.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by WinefredCommander

I think half of newfies who once worked in Alberta and are back East now are still building priority hoping that one day they'll get back in the patch... You should need to PROVE residency annually.

Bingo
If you have to buy a wildlife certificate and declare your residency when your applying for draws you would weed out 80% plus of them.

[calvin]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

You obviously don't understand why some people apply simply to boost their priority. It's not just because they need the priority to draw, it's also because many people need to co-ordinate with hunting partners, or with their employer, to be able to go when they draw. For that reason, some of us built more priority than required, to make sure that we draw when we want to. Having lottery tags won't encourage those people to try and draw if anything, more people will apply using the priority only choice, to make sure that they don't draw until they are ready. And except for a draw like the 437 sheep where new applicants will die of old age before they draw, priority caps will accomplish nothing.And by the way , there is no 999 code, it no longer exists, just like the FAC , that some people still talk about.

First off, thanks for the insult. This is exactly the reason nothing gets done with this archaic system. to tell me that i nothing of the system means that i have been ignorant about it since they first rolled it out many years ago.
what i said is that this priority point should cost ya 50 bucks, or whatever. the measly 4 bucks or 2 large coffees is ridiculous.

On the other note, we need to demand of the system to determine residency. this should be done yesterday!!!!

[calvin]

Originally Posted by WinefredCommander

I think half of newfies who once worked in Alberta and are back East now are still building priority hoping that one day they'll get back in the patch... You should need to PROVE residency annually.

this X2

[bucksman]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

You obviously don't understand why some people apply simply to boost their priority. It's not just because they need the priority to draw, it's also because many people need to co-ordinate with hunting partners, or with their employer, to be able to go when they draw. For that reason, some of us built more priority than required, to make sure that we draw when we want to. Having lottery tags won't encourage those people to try and draw if anything, more people will apply using the priority only choice, to make sure that they don't draw until they are ready. And except for a draw like the 437 sheep where new applicants will die of old age before they draw, priority caps will accomplish nothing.And by the way , there is no 999 code, it no longer exists, just like the FAC , that some people still talk about.

999 was the draw code last year.....

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by bucksman

999 was the draw code last year.....

No it was not, the "priority only" option was in use.

http://albertaregulations.ca/2018-Al...ting-Draws.pdf

Go to draw strategies, at the bottom of page 7

[ghostguy6]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

So are you talking about a draw tag animal here or just shooting the first whitetail you see and calling it a season?

I’m only making suggestions and throwing out ideas that could possibly solve the problem with the ever increasing time to get a draw. I’m taking about $100 ish to enter all your draws for the season not being a financial burden for 99.9% of the population. No one would be forcing anyone to pay or forcing people to enter all of the species.
If your talking about blasting the first deer that you see to save money just so you “fill your freezer”. We aren’t having the same conversation.

I was referring to the white tail tag i used but it could apply to both mule deer and moose as well. They are draw only n the zone I hunt. I did not shoot the first animal I saw just to fill the freezer. Im not a trophy hunter so I selected a nice sized healthy looking animal to fill the freezer. It just happened to be on the first day. If I had applied to mule or moose tags I could have filled those as well.

[whitetail Junkie]

Well...got my annual 11 draws in and it was only $43 and change which was great!

I’m really hoping that I get drawn for WMU 438 sheep again for this fall...last time I got drawn for it I couldn’t make it out due to work commitments and didn’t even buy the tag for that matter,however this year I know for sure I have the time!

Good luck to everyone in this years draw!

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by ghostguy6

I was referring to the white tail tag i used but it could apply to both mule deer and moose as well. They are draw only n the zone I hunt. I did not shoot the first animal I saw just to fill the freezer. Im not a trophy hunter so I selected a nice sized healthy looking animal to fill the freezer. It just happened to be on the first day. If I had applied to mule or moose tags I could have filled those as well.

So your opposed to spending $20 per draw application in order to potentially reduce your waiting time by a couple years?

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

So your opposed to spending $20 per draw application in order to potentially reduce your waiting time by a couple years?

Adding $16 per application, will not be as effective as automatically charging a person for the tag if drawn.

[bucksman]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

No it was not, the "priority only" option was in use.

http://albertaregulations.ca/2018-Al...ting-Draws.pdf

Go to draw strategies, at the bottom of page 7

Draw Summaries from last year still use 999 as the draw code

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by bucksman

Draw Summaries from last year still use 999 as the draw code

999 was not an option when applying for the draws in 2018, and it isn't an option now.

Right from the 2018 draw booklet.

If you do not want to be drawn but you want to increase your draw priority use ‘Priority Only’ as your first and only draw choice on your draw application

[CBintheNorth]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

If only people eligible to hunt were allowed to enter the draw, instead of anyone with a WIN card, and all tags were automatically charged to the applicants credit card, only hunters that actually want the tag will apply, so the number of applications will be reduced. And if we adopt a resident qualification like most other provinces, that will also reduce the number of applicants. Then we need to deal with outfitter allocations for species that Alberta residents have to wait five years or more to draw tags for. If we do those things, draw times will be reduced, and we don't have to increase application prices to accomplish that.

100% spot on. I have said all of this several times before.
Paying for successful draws at time of drawing was how it was 25 years ago. Should have never changed.
The rest needs to be implemented sooner rather than later.
And you're right, in this procedure draw application costs don't need to change to effect a serious change in wait times.

[AndrewM]

I thought the number of animals drawn were based on the populations in the zone? If that is the case, then weaning out the people that have no intention on purchasing the tag wouldn't make a difference. All it would do is make hunters pay more and the people that have no intention on drawing pay nothing. Draw frequency would remain unchanged.