Beef (notably STEAK) Prices - Ouch

[recce43]

beef tenderloin for $10.99 lb at stupidstore airdrie had lots of them whole tenderloin

[Mhunter51]

Prime rib has been on sale in Saskatoon at Sobey's and Coop for a couple weeks at 8.99 and back ribs at just over 2.00 a lb. As to one members comments about the numbers of pigs being at an all time high--NO. Pork numbers in Saskatchewan and Alberta are at an all time LOW. One of the reasons for that is the higher grain prices. Hogs have always been an avenue for agriculture to have 'value added' commodities to the farm. You had low priced feed grain as the farmers have had to endure in the past and they convert some of that cheap grain into pork. Pork was quit quick to get into, they reproduced quickly and they didn't take up much room. Now that grain prices have rebounded some and farmers are getting a fair price they are reducing hog numbers. In Saskatchewan there is no slaughter facilities that do large numbers of hogs left at all. They are being shipped into Manitoba mostly. Shipping is taking up most of the meager profits now. Cattle prices are higher now and that is long over-due. It's going to take years to make up for the poor years. And Omega, I respect ALMOST all of your views and from your posts you are very knowledgeable of meat cuts and cooking, but I would think you were kidding ( exaggerating ) on the 300% markup on cheap beef cuts. I have put in over 30 years in the meat retail industry and to tell the truth the more expensive cuts have a higher markup and that is seasonal in that steaks and the like are marked up more in summer BBQ season and roasts and the like more in winter to even the sale of the whole carcass. Now I'm hungry and going to get my steak for a BBQ tonight. Enjoy all.

[vcmm]

This^^^..... And people complain at our rib roast price. $11.60lb/$25.58kg.WTF

[omega50]

Originally Posted by recce43

beef tenderloin for $10.99 lb at stupidstore airdrie had lots of them whole tenderloin

Originally Posted by Mhunter51

Prime rib has been on sale in Saskatoon at Sobey's and Coop for a couple weeks at 8.99 and back ribs at just over 2.00 a lb. As to one members comments about the numbers of pigs being at an all time high--NO. Pork numbers in Saskatchewan and Alberta are at an all time LOW. One of the reasons for that is the higher grain prices. Hogs have always been an avenue for agriculture to have 'value added' commodities to the farm. You had low priced feed grain as the farmers have had to endure in the past and they convert some of that cheap grain into pork. Pork was quit quick to get into, they reproduced quickly and they didn't take up much room. Now that grain prices have rebounded some and farmers are getting a fair price they are reducing hog numbers. In Saskatchewan there is no slaughter facilities that do large numbers of hogs left at all. They are being shipped into Manitoba mostly. Shipping is taking up most of the meager profits now. Cattle prices are higher now and that is long over-due. It's going to take years to make up for the poor years. And Omega, I respect ALMOST all of your views and from your posts you are very knowledgeable of meat cuts and cooking, but I would think you were kidding ( exaggerating ) on the 300% markup on cheap beef cuts. I have put in over 30 years in the meat retail industry and to tell the truth the more expensive cuts have a higher markup and that is seasonal in that steaks and the like are marked up more in summer BBQ season and roasts and the like more in winter to even the sale of the whole carcass. Now I'm hungry and going to get my steak for a BBQ tonight. Enjoy all.

Not joking.
But to be clear 300% mark ups on cheap cuts would be on certain "value added" products produced from so called "cheap cuts" lining the grocery store displays

Every cut is mapped and contributes pre-determined margins based on multiple # of factors and what % of total carcass weight each cut represents.

Premium cuts are of course more expensive, but that in no way should be construed as mark up %.

Almost the entire industry is built on value added products that dramatically increase the revenue stream on cheaper cuts..

How do you add value as a retailer to a Tenderloin steak? What remains to be done to a boneless naturally tender cut? Unless you are Costco-you could inoculate with e.coli at this stage. But in a more reputable grocery- Not too much

But walk the aisle and see what untold treasures await in the marinated, tumbled, stri-fry-kebob displays and look at the bigger picture of those cut locations. Where did all of these stuffed , manipulated and tasty items come from?

The day a steak is removed from the whole-it should be at zenith of it's perfection. It will not improve sitting in the display. Take that steak and look at it on day 4 and the oxidation is evident. Now what. Obviously it should be removed and discarded as the quality deteriorates!!! But that is not exactly what happens next.

Well for cheaper cuts instead of losing money on a degraded product-this is the sweet spot for untold profits in added value products.

A businessman or any smart operator should know exactly how much revenue can be derived from each side of beef. Obviously the goal would be to purchase intelligently, maximize and extend every last saleable bit and scrap while increasing quality and reducing labor and waste.
And when I made calls on restaurants to consult-that is exactly what I successfully trained them to do.

[Snowdog]

FYI

3 weeks ago a bought 150 8oz sirloins for a community assoc bbq at $7/pc (so $14/lb), only 60-70 people showed up and had no trouble selling the rest at $8 to put a few $$ back into the community hall. Could have got ribeyes at $10.50pc or NY striploin @ $9.54 pc.

[Mhunter51]

I agree wholeheartedly with you Omega, but what I was referring to on my comment about the 300% figure was when we did whole or quarter beef cutting test margins, and we did lots. When we had bits and pieces they went into stir-fry, stew and ground trim. That's as far as we processed them. If you were to continue processing into summer sausage, beer sticks wieners and the like your profit 'margin' would go up but your labour input would dramatically go up for the grinding, stuffing and smoking of the product which would cut into to profit margin, so I guess we could say the chuck of beef returned a higher markup on the meat by the pound but the labour cost went up significantly. Still I think there are very good deals on meat right now. Heading to Sobeys as we speak for pork chops for 1.77 per pound. Good deal. And Omega, keep the recipes coming. Gives me inspiration.

[elkivory]

Originally Posted by Mhunter51

Prime rib has been on sale in Saskatoon at Sobey's and Coop for a couple weeks at 8.99 and back ribs at just over 2.00 a lb. As to one members comments about the numbers of pigs being at an all time high--NO. Pork numbers in Saskatchewan and Alberta are at an all time LOW. One of the reasons for that is the higher grain prices. Hogs have always been an avenue for agriculture to have 'value added' commodities to the farm. You had low priced feed grain as the farmers have had to endure in the past and they convert some of that cheap grain into pork. Pork was quit quick to get into, they reproduced quickly and they didn't take up much room. Now that grain prices have rebounded some and farmers are getting a fair price they are reducing hog numbers. In Saskatchewan there is no slaughter facilities that do large numbers of hogs left at all. They are being shipped into Manitoba mostly. Shipping is taking up most of the meager profits now. Cattle prices are higher now and that is long over-due. It's going to take years to make up for the poor years. And Omega, I respect ALMOST all of your views and from your posts you are very knowledgeable of meat cuts and cooking, but I would think you were kidding ( exaggerating ) on the 300% markup on cheap beef cuts. I have put in over 30 years in the meat retail industry and to tell the truth the more expensive cuts have a higher markup and that is seasonal in that steaks and the like are marked up more in summer BBQ season and roasts and the like more in winter to even the sale of the whole carcass. Now I'm hungry and going to get my steak for a BBQ tonight. Enjoy all.

Not sure where you are getting your info, in any case I am correct and here is a little information for you:

Manitoba is the largest pig-producing and pig-exporting province in Canada, accounting for about 30% of national pig production and 60% of national pig exports. Almost all of the province’s pig exports go to the Midwestern United States. This makes an open border and free trade with the U.S. vital to Manitoba’s farmers.

Meanwhile, Manitoba is the second largest pork exporter after Quebec, accounting for almost 24 per cent of Canada’s pork exports. Manitoba pork exports go to 31 countries around the world and are worth about $880 million.

These are the numbers on "Origin Of Hogs Slaughtered In Canadian Packing Plants for 2012".

ORIGIN OF HOGS SLAUGHTERED IN CANADIAN PACKING PLANTS 2012

British Columbia - Alberta: 2,890,650
Saskatchewan - Manitoba: 5,784,752
Ontario: 4,430,997
Québec-Atlantic Provinces: 8,014,106

Total: 21,120,505

With 60% of our Hogs being exported primarily to the USA and China, we in Canada are once again getting screwed and paying more then we have to for pork as we feed other countries. The number of pigs raised in Canada has more then doubled since 1996!

Welcome to Canada, the land or the OVER CHARGED for everything, especially booze!

[Mhunter51]

Numbers are from 'Stats Canada. In 2006 Saskatchewan/Alberta combined had 3.4 million hogs. Manitoba had 2.9 mil by itself. In 2011 numbers in all provinces went down to 2.8 in Man, and 2.4 in Sask/Alberta combined. That's 100,000 less for Man and one million less for Sask/Alberta combined. In the end of 2011 Man, Sask and Alberta took another nose-dive in numbers of hogs and are significantly less even than these numbers, a lot to do with no slaughter houses ( of a large scale) left in Saskatchewan. All on the Stats Can website.

[gitrdun]

Originally Posted by amosfella

The beef my family raises is far from that description. You can ask VCMM if you want. And I despise corn finished beef. That being said, I"m not using pasture grass, but green cut oats and some flax. That produces by far the best tasting beef that I've had, and I've eaten beef all over north america...

There's something in barely finished beef that I just don't like... And I don't feel good after eating it...

I'd like to try your product. We've met and had no idea that you raised your own beef.

[elkivory]

Originally Posted by Mhunter51

Numbers are from 'Stats Canada. In 2006 Saskatchewan/Alberta combined had 3.4 million hogs. Manitoba had 2.9 mil by itself. In 2011 numbers in all provinces went down to 2.8 in Man, and 2.4 in Sask/Alberta combined. That's 100,000 less for Man and one million less for Sask/Alberta combined. In the end of 2011 Man, Sask and Alberta took another nose-dive in numbers of hogs and are significantly less even than these numbers, a lot to do with no slaughter houses ( of a large scale) left in Saskatchewan. All on the Stats Can website.

The information you are sighting is outdated considering I am using 2012 numbers. In the end there are enough pork producers and hogs being produced in Canada, and double then what were raised in 1996 that the inflated prices that have occurred over the last calander year are not justified. JMO friendo.

In the end I prefer to eat moose, elk and deer anyhow and do not typically dine on swine! lol

[Mhunter51]

Wrong again. In 2006 there were 15,043,132 hogs in Canada. In 2011 there were 12,679,104 hogs in Canada. I would think anyone can figure that that is a ( about ) 2.5 Million population DROP. This again is from StatCan.ca. In 2014 the EXPORTS of hogs were 50% BELOW the 2006 numbers. That is one half the exports over all. " TWICE " the numbers of 1996-- not even close. More like one half. StatsCan.ca is your friend. These numbers are from 2014, your 2012 numbers are outdated by two years.

[omega50]

Originally Posted by Mhunter51

I agree wholeheartedly with you Omega, but what I was referring to on my comment about the 300% figure was when we did whole or quarter beef cutting test margins, and we did lots. When we had bits and pieces they went into stir-fry, stew and ground trim. That's as far as we processed them. If you were to continue processing into summer sausage, beer sticks wieners and the like your profit 'margin' would go up but your labour input would dramatically go up for the grinding, stuffing and smoking of the product which would cut into to profit margin, so I guess we could say the chuck of beef returned a higher markup on the meat by the pound but the labour cost went up significantly. Still I think there are very good deals on meat right now. Heading to Sobeys as we speak for pork chops for 1.77 per pound. Good deal. And Omega, keep the recipes coming. Gives me inspiration.

For me the offending cut that is the gold standard for high mark up on a Cheap cut is the Chuck Tender.
It is craze!!

Often seen it rival Prime Rib mark up.

If I could only buy one cut of beef for grilling- It would be a big bag of Ball Tips. Grilled and carved

[greylynx]

Originally Posted by omega50

For me the offending cut that is the gold standard for high mark up on a Cheap cut is the Chuck Tender.
It is craze!!

Often seen it rival Prime Rib mark up.

If I could only buy one cut of beef for grilling- It would be a big bag of Ball Tips. Grilled and carved

Interesting point O50.

I have observed an ethnic element in the purchasing fatty grisly beef.

The price of chuck is quite amazing indeed.

Mind you these are just Super Store observations.

[From The Hip]

I used to be able to buy restaurant quality meat from a food service company at the same price as employees which was 10% over cost.I had a full catalogue of the products that listed both quality and size of the cuts.

Some guys opted for a box of 24 eight ounce striploins that cost $75 but I opted for the same thing but for AAA+ at a cost of $100 because I like better quality.

The last time I had the chance I was offered a box of AAA+ 8 ounce tenderloins because they were being discontinued.They were vaccum packed and looked magnificent....the marbling looked like it was painted in with a 10-0 paintbrush.I was told it would cost $125 and I said SOLD and paid for it on the spot.Five minutes later after I left I get a phone call and I am told that it was the last box and the President of the company wanted it and I get no beef

Best deal I ever got was when a select cut of pork chop got discontinued.I scored a 10 pound box of 1" thick centre loin boneless pork chops that were precut for stuffing them for $5....$5 for 10 pounds of gourmet pork chops

Sadly that hook up no longer exists as it did but I think the possibility is still there but it has a minimum order of $400 on it....given the current prices I dont think I would object to spending $400 at a time and stuffing the freezer once in a while.

I sure miss that hook up.

FTH

[Mhunter51]

Yes Omega, but the chuck tender 'looks" good when cut and displayed properly. My biggest mystery was the eye of the round steak and roast. Don't know how people did them up but most would have been like shoe leather as they have NO marbling, long muscle tissue and usually no fat cover. In all the years I had only one eye steak returned because he BBQ'd it well done and it was tough. Go figure.

[Redfrog]

I had a friend who complained about tough steaks. I asked him what kind they were. He didn't know , steak is steak. He showed me the packaging. It was beef shank. He had fried it. I couldn't believe the price.

[schmedlap]

Originally Posted by elkivory

There have never been more pork producers in Canada, then now. Yet the prices are double of what they were only two years ago.

Just like the Milk board that tosses 100,000s of thousands of litres of milk down the drain to artificially keep the prices high, I suspect that the Pork Producers board or whatever they are call have a lot to do with it.

We get ripped off big time in Canada vs. the consumer is the USA.

On the pork front ... most of the "small producers" ended up in bankruptcy and liquidation 2-4 years back, simply because the cost of feeding one hog to market was much more than it was worth. The Hutterites and some large producers were able to ride out that cycle due to smaller background costs and/or simple macro-economic ability. It is not regulated as to quotas and prices in any way even similar to dairy. There is no "board" that is ripping off the consumer. It is simple supply and demand economics, and the cycles that go with that. The prices 2 years ago were less than the cost of production, for the average "little guy". Please do a little basic research before you spout off on something you clearly know nothing about (?). It is a good thing for the remaining small producer segment that the prices have rebounded. Our top quality pork is still a huge relative bargain, by world standards.

As to beef, it is purely market driven and subject to the same kind of cycles. The producers who are smart business people will take advantage of the current "high end" of the cycle, and will downsize as the inevitable downward trend occurs (consumer factors, drought factors, etc.). The smart ones will have built up reserves from current profitability for the next down cycle (and it will come). In the meantime, if you don't like the prices, no one is forcing you to buy the product (? - part of what will drive the price factor?). And, in fact, no such farmer is forced to deal with "the middle man" - they are perfectly free to do their own butchering and production, alone or via co-ops.

I would like to get status as an "aboriginal farmer" (so long as I don't actually have to do the work that an average farmer does - way too difficult?). Given the combined income tax status of that designation, you would all be paying me a small net fortune to carry out my societal function. This is just for those of you who do not realize the huge tax breaks involved in both such statuses (is that a word?).

[Red Bullets]

I am mentioning this as an alternative. Not to get anyone stoked up or derailing the thread.
With the price of meat per pound it might be cheaper to go to the rural auction mart and buy a llama, alpaca, or horse for cheap and turn it into protein. At some auction marts, there is usually someone buying the horses no one bids on for export to the meat market. They might pay 2 to 6 hundred for a stock horse. Sometimes llamas/alpacas go for 20 bucks a piece. I know one local farmer that butchers an alpaca every year.

Might be something to consider. Any constructive thoughts or criticisms?

[omega50]

Originally Posted by Mhunter51

Yes Omega, but the chuck tender 'looks" good when cut and displayed properly. My biggest mystery was the eye of the round steak and roast. Don't know how people did them up but most would have been like shoe leather as they have NO marbling, long muscle tissue and usually no fat cover. In all the years I had only one eye steak returned because he BBQ'd it well done and it was tough. Go figure.

Ha

Coated in crushed Peppercorns and sliced into steaks

Marketing genius stripped off beside the flat and pressed in Peppercorns-Customers thought they were giant tenderloins Peppersteak

My go to whole muscle jerky meat

[Redfrog]

I'm amused by how little so many people know about meat in the supermarkets. I'm no expert, but I can pick up a piece of meat and ID it.

I see folks, usually women standing and staring in the meat section. I offered to help sometimes, but they are clueless.

[calgarygringo]

As one in the know it was a supplier issue not Superstore. Projected and sold way more than they could supply. We had lots at our store until late Sunday afternoon. None were available after the intial order and some stores got next to none.

Originally Posted by omega50

And I was greeted by no availability on Friday when I went to Stupidstore on Friday in Calgary. I guess they shifted all of the Southern inventory North for Rachel and her cronies in the Provincial Capital

This is a common weekly occurrence on Superstore specials offered in Calgary.

[hayseed]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

I'm amused by how little so many people know about meat in the supermarkets. I'm no expert, but I can pick up a piece of meat and ID it.

I see folks, usually women standing and staring in the meat section. I offered to help sometimes, but they are clueless.

LOL... in our COOP in town, they have the signs, teaching you, or telling you what the cuts are, I have seen so many people holding up cuts up meat to the butcher chart tryin to figger out what , or if they are eatin azz meat..or what type up steak roast etc?? Geez Louise....

Next best thing is a lawn chair at a boat launch...

[elkivory]

Originally Posted by schmedlap

On the pork front ... most of the "small producers" ended up in bankruptcy and liquidation 2-4 years back, simply because the cost of feeding one hog to market was much more than it was worth. The Hutterites and some large producers were able to ride out that cycle due to smaller background costs and/or simple macro-economic ability. It is not regulated as to quotas and prices in any way even similar to dairy. There is no "board" that is ripping off the consumer. It is simple supply and demand economics, and the cycles that go with that. The prices 2 years ago were less than the cost of production, for the average "little guy". Please do a little basic research before you spout off on something you clearly know nothing about (?). It is a good thing for the remaining small producer segment that the prices have rebounded. Our top quality pork is still a huge relative bargain, by world standards.

Not my figures Go To: http://www.canadapork.com/en/industr...n-pork-exports

CANADIAN PORK EXPORTS BY PRODUCT 1998-2014 (Cdn $'000)

Year - Fresh/Chilled/Frozen -Total

1998 - 815,426 - 1,118,737

1999 - 997,256 - 1,315,536

2000 - 1,381,459 - 1,801,277

2001 - 1,739,685 - 2,213,237

2002 - 1,714,393 - 2,186,334

2003 - 1,791,505 - 2,340,653

2004 - 2,077,201 - 2,654,461

2005 - 2,312,563 - 2,842,368

2006 - 2,051,982 - 2,535,885

2007 - 1,920,045 - 2,391,024

2008 - 2,182,115 - 2,735,986

2009 - 2,078,318 - 2,602,141

2010 - 2,290,275 - 2,768,483

2011 - 2,628,487 - 3,205,814

2012 - 2,609,318 - 3,199,027

2013 - 2,631,195 - 3,194,242

2014 - 3,105,359 - 3,714,107

Bottom line, my point is correct. There is no shortage of pigs in Canada and with 60% of or our Pork being exported, we the Canadian Consumers are getting ripped of with the hyper inflated cost of pork.

If you do not believe that we are getting ripped off in Canada, go buy pork in the USA, then go to the liquor store and pick up a 1.75 litre bottle of Smirnoff Vodka. $17.00 there and $58.00 here.

We Canadians take it up the, you know, on everything. I rest my case!

[omega50]

Originally Posted by calgarygringo

As one in the know it was a supplier issue not Superstore. Projected and sold way more than they could supply. We had lots at our store until late Sunday afternoon. None were available after the intial order and some stores got next to none.

Some locations seem to have perpetual supply issues.

Either they are the most successful store in the chain

Or they have some work to do in the supply chain management end of things.

Where is the delineation between accepting responsibility for the availability of advertised products and blaming suppliers.

The end result is the same regardless who is to blame.

Supply issue on Day 1 of the sale-not day 2-6

No Page 1 product-To me-means change needs to happen.

[expmler]

Originally Posted by elkivory

Not my figures Go To: http://www.canadapork.com/en/industr...n-pork-exports

CANADIAN PORK EXPORTS BY PRODUCT 1998-2014 (Cdn $'000)

Year - Fresh/Chilled/Frozen -Total

1998 - 815,426 - 1,118,737

1999 - 997,256 - 1,315,536

2000 - 1,381,459 - 1,801,277

2001 - 1,739,685 - 2,213,237

2002 - 1,714,393 - 2,186,334

2003 - 1,791,505 - 2,340,653

2004 - 2,077,201 - 2,654,461

2005 - 2,312,563 - 2,842,368

2006 - 2,051,982 - 2,535,885

2007 - 1,920,045 - 2,391,024

2008 - 2,182,115 - 2,735,986

2009 - 2,078,318 - 2,602,141

2010 - 2,290,275 - 2,768,483

2011 - 2,628,487 - 3,205,814

2012 - 2,609,318 - 3,199,027

2013 - 2,631,195 - 3,194,242

2014 - 3,105,359 - 3,714,107

Bottom line, my point is correct. There is no shortage of pigs in Canada and with 60% of or our Pork being exported, we the Canadian Consumers are getting ripped of with the hyper inflated cost of pork.

If you do not believe that we are getting ripped off in Canada, go buy pork in the USA, then go to the liquor store and pick up a 1.75 litre bottle of Smirnoff Vodka. $17.00 there and $58.00 here.

We Canadians take it up the, you know, on everything. I rest my case!

You want free health care, vodka is going to cost $58.00.

[elkivory]

Originally Posted by expmler

You want free health care, vodka is going to cost $58.00.

And what does the price of pork have to do with Health Care?

[hal53]

Originally Posted by elkivory

And what does the price of pork have to do with Health Care?

.....or Vodka??>?>

[elkivory]

Used booze as another example of how we Canadians get ripped off.

I think our Government fixes the booze prices so high because they realize that as soon as the consumer realizes that they are getting ripped off the way we do, we would drink ourselves to death if booze was cheap enough. Then there wouldn't be anyone left to pay taxes to fund their retirement plans!

Rant Over LOL!

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by elkivory

And what does the price of pork have to do with Health Care?

Nothin, but the price of booze, cigarettes, gas, etc, does.

[omega50]

Originally Posted by elkivory

And what does the price of pork have to do with Health Care?

The more pork you eat-they more likelihood that you will require Healthcare?