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  #1  
Old 01-18-2015, 02:42 PM
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Arrow Subsistence hunting- OFFICIAL thread

Ok you will get your wish, one of those things, be careful what you ask for.
ZERO tolerance, while we may agree or disagree on the discussion at hand, any one racial slurs, derails and don't conform to forum rules will NOT be acceptable and you will be banned, no warnings, no infractions, just cut to the chase. This is the ONE and only thread, no new threads on native or substitence hunting to be opened and no warning.

Previousl threads will be locked, so you can copy and paste if you like. Rules are in place, so be forewarned
  #2  
Old 01-18-2015, 02:49 PM
albertabighorn albertabighorn is offline
 
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Move the info from the last threads to here please, there was some very valid points made.
  #3  
Old 01-18-2015, 02:57 PM
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Why not just limit the native harvest ? Even numbers with licensed hunters.
500 licensed hunters for cows in Reduction hunt.
400 thus far is native estimate, 100 more then shut it down.

TBark
  #4  
Old 01-18-2015, 03:11 PM
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Well here is a thought, why not give each status have holder one tag per year per animal, in whatever wmu they live in.
You get one moose tag, u shoot one moose per year whenever you choose to.
Maybe have one for mom and pop and when children reach a certain age then they can get one too.
Make them pick up the tags and f&w just like everyone else. But once u get your animals, u are done till next year. Could even make them come to the office to register the kill too.

Now I relize that that might be impossible to monitor, but some kinda system should be in place.
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Old 01-18-2015, 03:18 PM
Full Curl Earl Full Curl Earl is offline
 
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Default Mmmm

Well take care all, I joined a decent conversation about an important topic that the government muzzles, and the same is happening here now. Not sure why folks feel the need to intervene, what's the harm in giving people a place to speak openly...
  #6  
Old 01-18-2015, 03:23 PM
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Welcome to the forum!!!! It gets crazy round here, hope you stick around!
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Old 01-18-2015, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Full Curl Earl View Post
Well take care all, I joined a decent conversation about an important topic that the government muzzles, and the same is happening here now. Not sure why folks feel the need to intervene, what's the harm in giving people a place to speak openly...
They are giving us a chance to discuss openly- minus the bs racism and derailment. Speak away.

Welcome new mod! I see you've come packing heat!
  #8  
Old 01-18-2015, 03:33 PM
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I just don't know why there has to be 400+ animals killed.
2 questions
First question, How many people are they feeding?
Next question, are these natives just from Alberta?
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  #9  
Old 01-18-2015, 03:40 PM
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So it seems to me the biggest problem that people seem to have regarding substinence hunting is the fact a trophy animal is shot. Why can it not just be made mandatory any antlered animal that has been shot for substitnence must have its horns/antlers be cut in half before removal of animal not just skull plate but actual horn or antler. If someone is hunting for food only this should not be a a problem. simple fix to a big problem
  #10  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:08 PM
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They might be shooting bulls for the simple fact that there is more meat on a bull than a cow.Personally I would rather shoot a bull just for this reason alone even if it was just a small one.
  #11  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucktaker View Post
So it seems to me the biggest problem that people seem to have regarding substinence hunting is the fact a trophy animal is shot. Why can it not just be made mandatory any antlered animal that has been shot for substitnence must have its horns/antlers be cut in half before removal of animal not just skull plate but actual horn or antler. If someone is hunting for food only this should not be a a problem. simple fix to a big problem
x2!!!!! this is the simplest fix to this problem. I would even be ok with them auctioning off the antlers and the money going back to conservation. I think the other problem with this is how its been handled at suffield. We all know there is a problem with herd numbers and animals need to be removed, how they have done this by only allowing non status members to harvest cows and status members to harvest whatever they want including monster bulls that non status members have to wait 10 + years to have a chance at. if they wanted bulls and cows gone they should have said how many and split the bulls and cow tags between everybody (status and non status). A lottery would have been the best way to do it. Once those numbers were reached between each group then the hunts are over. I also think there could have been some real good money made top go back to conservation with this type of hunt and auction off a couple bull tags. I know guys would pay lots to hunt one. Maybe thats something that could be done next year assuming they need to take out more elk next year. I think its just been a bad handled situation from the beginning and it seems its one bad decision after another. Where it goes from here is anybody's guess, hopefully those of you with points applying over there have some good bulls left in the future.
  #12  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:27 PM
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The big things about it with me is this.

Number 1... How many animals are killed each year for "subsistence"? If we don't know the real number, how do we allocate the proper number of tags in the respective WMU's?

Number 2... Why in this day and age are we all not Canadian? I get it, they got a raw deal for a long time. I feel that one of the easiest ways to eliminate this type of division is to get rid of it. No one race, religion or color in this great Country should be treated better, differently or whatever than any other.

All of this stuff just keeps the rift open between the cultures. I think the natives should be proud of what they are/were in the past. But that is in the past. We live in a different time now.

The laws allowing these harvests were put into place a very long time ago to aid people without money or access to towns and grocery stores. They could step out into the back 40 and smack a deer to feed the family. Again, it's a different time. Stores and butcher shops are readily available now and the cost of going hunting is actually detrimental to the very theme of sustenance. Gas, rifles, ammo, hotel, truck.... This wasn't what was intended. It was intended to make sure that the peoples had access to protein. Not to shoot the animal with the biggest set of head gear.

The Elk are being slaughtered. They want them gone from the base so I kinda get why the are allowing it. But again, why is it good for the goose but not the gander? There should be no preferential treatment given to anyone.
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  #13  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:39 PM
45-70sapper 45-70sapper is offline
 
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I agree with what has been said before. The easiest, most simple fix is to destroy the trophy value of ANY animal taken under subsistence hunting. Spilt the skill plate, confiscate all of it, whatever, problem solved. Bulls may still be taken but at least it won't be solely as a trophy. And then if they want a chance to take an animal and keep the antlers etc., they have to fall in line with everyone else and wait their turn. This would be so easy to implement, and it would probably give a positive boost to the image of hunting in alberta. To the antis anyways.
  #14  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:45 PM
Dadirk Dadirk is offline
 
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Default The treaties

In the late 1800 and early 1900 the leaders of our country wrote up the treaties with the natives with not a thought about future generations. This is not a god given right like some think it is, it is a Government Given right. When the treaties were written the white people were the the ones wiping out large herds buffalo for fur. The natives were hunting for food and only took what they needed. Now they appear to be hunting for profit. Are the big trophy bulls been taken for just meat probably not, horns are more than likely being sold, maybe not up here but down south I know they have methods for getting stuff like that across the border, And alot of american's will pay huge money for a trophy bull, is it illegal yes it is can we catch them more than likely not.

Between 1871 and 1921, the Crown entered into treaties with various First Nations that enabled the Canadian government to actively pursue agriculture, settlement and resource development of the Canadian West and the North. Because they are numbered 1 to 11, the treaties are often referred to as the “Numbered Treaties.” The Numbered Treaties cover Northern Ontario, Manitoba, Saskatchewan, Alberta, and parts of the Yukon, the Northwest Territories and British Columbia.
Under these treaties, the First Nations who occupied these territories gave up large areas of land to the Crown. In exchange, the treaties provided for such things as reserve lands and other benefits like farm equipment and animals, annual payments, ammunition, clothing and certain rights to hunt and fish. The Crown also made some promises such as maintaining schools on reserves or providing teachers or educational help to the First Nation named in the treaties. Treaty No. 6 included the promise of a medicine chest.


The Facts about Indian Hunting Rights in Alberta
The following information applies to persons defined as Indians under the
Indian Act who hunt game for food within the borders of Alberta.
1. In Alberta, the right of an Indian to hunt for food is recognized without regard to
where in Canada the Indian resides, therefore Indians from Alberta and elsewhere
in Canada may hunt for food on lands to which they have a right of access for
hunting in Alberta.
2. Indians have a right to hunt game for food, at all times of the year without a licence,
on unoccupied Crown lands and other lands on which they have a right of access.
Indians may hunt for food on privately owned lands if they have first obtained the
landholder’s permission to enter for the purpose of hunting. Unless hunting
permission has first been obtained, Indians may not hunt on lands being actively
used for mining, lumbering or other industrial purposes. Similarly, Indians may not
hunt on fenced, posted or cultivated lands, on lands containing buildings, which
may be used or occupied, or on lands on which livestock or other domestically
raised animals may be present without obtaining permission.
3. Indians may not hunt in National Parks, Provincial Parks, Recreation Areas,
Ecological Reserves and other similar lands where no hunting is allowed, nor may
they hunt in Wildlife Sanctuaries, including Road Corridor Wildlife Sanctuaries. It is
unlawful for any person including an Indian to hunt within 365 meters (400 yards) of
the centre-line of a road designated as a Road Corridor Wildlife Sanctuary.
(*Exceptions to this do apply – contact your local Fish & Wildlife Division office for
more information.)
4. Laws dealing with hunting safety apply to Indians in Alberta. For example, no
person, including an Indian hunting pursuant to his/her treaty rights, shall hunt in a
dangerous manner, illegally discharge a weapon or firearm (such as from a primary
highway, or within 200 yards of an occupied building, or at night), discharge a
weapon from a vehicle or have a loaded firearm in a vehicle. Local municipal
bylaws that prohibit the discharge of weapons in some areas may also apply.
5. It is unlawful to allow the edible meat of any game or bird to be wasted, destroyed,
spoiled or abandoned. Because the hunting rights of Indians extend only to hunting
game for food, all meat from a harvested animal or bird must be salvaged and used
for food.
6. For the purposes of conservation and management of the following species, all
Indians harvesting a trophy bighorn sheep or mountain goat must register the kill at
a Fish and Wildlife Division office within 30 days of the kill. Cougar harvested must
be registered within 2 business days and grizzly bears must be registered within 4
business days of the kill, at a Fish and Wildlife Division office.
7. An Indian may hunt migratory game birds, during all seasons, without a licence or
permit in Alberta, however bag limits and other laws concerning migratory game
bird hunting do apply.
8. Export of game outside of Alberta involves both federal and provincial laws.
Certain types of wildlife and certain wildlife parts cannot be exported from Alberta
by any person, including an Indian. Contact your local Fish and Wildlife Division
office for more information about exporting game that has been harvested for food
to a location outside of Alberta.
9. Certain provisions apply for the harvesting of wildlife by Métis in Alberta. The Métis
Nation of Alberta has adopted a Harvesting Policy, which is avaliable on their
website.


Alberta Sustainable
Resource Development
Fish and Wildlife Division
Dial 310-0000 and ask for the nearest Fish
and Wildlife office
Website: www.mywildalberta.com
Canadian Firearms Centre
Federal Firearms Legislation
1-800-731-4000
Web-site: www.cfc-cafc.gc.ca
Canadian Wildlife Service
Indian and Northern Affairs Canada
Phone: 1.800.668.6767
Website: www.cws-scf.ec.gc.ca
Phone: 1.800.567.9604
Website: www.ainc-inac.gc.ca
Métis Nation of Alberta Phone: 780.455.2200
Toll Free: 1.800.252.1553
Website: www.albertametis.com
February, 2011
  #15  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:46 PM
robson3954 robson3954 is offline
 
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For natives:
Per year, per household:
2 deer of either species, antlered or not.
AND 1 either sex moose OR elk.

In addition, you can apply through the normal draw system and take the animals you are drawn for. To be extra nice, native residence priority can start at a 3.
In regards to all other big game species, they can follow the standard alberta regs.
I think that's very generous and to argue you need more, you clearly aren't hunting purely for subsistence reasons.


For alberta residents:
Per year, per hunter
2 deer of either species if drawn or on resident tags
OR 1 deer and either an elk or moose, but not both.

I think that will go a long way to helping our ungulate populations recover from hunting pressure. I just could never justify killing up to 4 deer, a moose and an elk every year.
  #16  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:47 PM
Kurt505 Kurt505 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadirk View Post
In the late 1800 and early 1900 the leaders of our country wrote up the treaties with the natives with not a thought about future generations. This is not a god given right like some think it is, it is a Government Given right. When the treaties were written the white people were the the ones wiping out large herds buffalo for fur. The natives were hunting for food and only took what they needed. Now they appear to be hunting for profit. Are the big trophy bulls been taken for just meat probably not, horns are more than likely being sold, maybe not up here but down south I know they have methods for getting stuff like that across the border, And alot of american's will pay huge money for a trophy bull, is it illegal yes it is can we catch them more than likely not.

Between 1871 and 1921, the Crown entered into treaties with various First Nations that enabled the Canadian government to actively pursue agriculture, settlement and resource development of the Canadian West and the North. Because they are numbered 1 to 11, the treaties are often referred to as the “Numbered Treaties.” The Numbered Treaties cover Northern Ontario, Manitoba, Saskatchewan, Alberta, and parts of the Yukon, the Northwest Territories and British Columbia.
Under these treaties, the First Nations who occupied these territories gave up large areas of land to the Crown. In exchange, the treaties provided for such things as reserve lands and other benefits like farm equipment and animals, annual payments, ammunition, clothing and certain rights to hunt and fish. The Crown also made some promises such as maintaining schools on reserves or providing teachers or educational help to the First Nation named in the treaties. Treaty No. 6 included the promise of a medicine chest.


The Facts about Indian Hunting Rights in Alberta
The following information applies to persons defined as Indians under the
Indian Act who hunt game for food within the borders of Alberta.
1. In Alberta, the right of an Indian to hunt for food is recognized without regard to
where in Canada the Indian resides, therefore Indians from Alberta and elsewhere
in Canada may hunt for food on lands to which they have a right of access for
hunting in Alberta.
2. Indians have a right to hunt game for food, at all times of the year without a licence,
on unoccupied Crown lands and other lands on which they have a right of access.
Indians may hunt for food on privately owned lands if they have first obtained the
landholder’s permission to enter for the purpose of hunting. Unless hunting
permission has first been obtained, Indians may not hunt on lands being actively
used for mining, lumbering or other industrial purposes. Similarly, Indians may not
hunt on fenced, posted or cultivated lands, on lands containing buildings, which
may be used or occupied, or on lands on which livestock or other domestically
raised animals may be present without obtaining permission.
3. Indians may not hunt in National Parks, Provincial Parks, Recreation Areas,
Ecological Reserves and other similar lands where no hunting is allowed, nor may
they hunt in Wildlife Sanctuaries, including Road Corridor Wildlife Sanctuaries. It is
unlawful for any person including an Indian to hunt within 365 meters (400 yards) of
the centre-line of a road designated as a Road Corridor Wildlife Sanctuary.
(*Exceptions to this do apply – contact your local Fish & Wildlife Division office for
more information.)
4. Laws dealing with hunting safety apply to Indians in Alberta. For example, no
person, including an Indian hunting pursuant to his/her treaty rights, shall hunt in a
dangerous manner, illegally discharge a weapon or firearm (such as from a primary
highway, or within 200 yards of an occupied building, or at night), discharge a
weapon from a vehicle or have a loaded firearm in a vehicle. Local municipal
bylaws that prohibit the discharge of weapons in some areas may also apply.
5. It is unlawful to allow the edible meat of any game or bird to be wasted, destroyed,
spoiled or abandoned. Because the hunting rights of Indians extend only to hunting
game for food, all meat from a harvested animal or bird must be salvaged and used
for food.
6. For the purposes of conservation and management of the following species, all
Indians harvesting a trophy bighorn sheep or mountain goat must register the kill at
a Fish and Wildlife Division office within 30 days of the kill. Cougar harvested must
be registered within 2 business days and grizzly bears must be registered within 4
business days of the kill, at a Fish and Wildlife Division office.
7. An Indian may hunt migratory game birds, during all seasons, without a licence or
permit in Alberta, however bag limits and other laws concerning migratory game
bird hunting do apply.
8. Export of game outside of Alberta involves both federal and provincial laws.
Certain types of wildlife and certain wildlife parts cannot be exported from Alberta
by any person, including an Indian. Contact your local Fish and Wildlife Division
office for more information about exporting game that has been harvested for food
to a location outside of Alberta.
9. Certain provisions apply for the harvesting of wildlife by Métis in Alberta. The Métis
Nation of Alberta has adopted a Harvesting Policy, which is avaliable on their
website.


Alberta Sustainable
Resource Development
Fish and Wildlife Division
Dial 310-0000 and ask for the nearest Fish
and Wildlife office
Website: www.mywildalberta.com
Canadian Firearms Centre
Federal Firearms Legislation
1-800-731-4000
Web-site: www.cfc-cafc.gc.ca
Canadian Wildlife Service
Indian and Northern Affairs Canada
Phone: 1.800.668.6767
Website: www.cws-scf.ec.gc.ca
Phone: 1.800.567.9604
Website: www.ainc-inac.gc.ca
Métis Nation of Alberta Phone: 780.455.2200
Toll Free: 1.800.252.1553
Website: www.albertametis.com
February, 2011

Doesn't make it appropriate in 2015, everything from weapons, transportation, shelter, social and economic programs sponsored by the government.

It's a whole new world and as such should have a whole new set of guidelines.
  #17  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:49 PM
Jimmer1 Jimmer1 is offline
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First Nation harvest of animals needs to be reined in. So does the harvest by new Albertans. we got to protect are resourses.

Who agrees?
  #18  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:52 PM
Dadirk Dadirk is offline
 
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Default Yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt505 View Post
Doesn't make it appropriate in 2015
You are right in 2015 it is not appropriate but it is written. Just like everything surrounding the treaties can we change, I have tried to get straight answers from elected officials all say the same thing, We cant
  #19  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:55 PM
airbornedeerhunter airbornedeerhunter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmer1 View Post
First Nation harvest of animals needs to be reined in. So does the harvest by new Albertans. we got to protect are resourses.

Who agrees?
Curious what you mean regarding "new Albertans". Are you saying that someone who moves/is transferred etc to Alberta should not have the same hunting opportunities once they have met resident requirements? Every province has pretty much the same rules regarding this. Remember, the tags/gas/supplies etc etc purchased by all hunters contributes to the economy.

Not even going to touch the native issue, agree or disagree, I think it's beating a dead horse.
  #20  
Old 01-18-2015, 04:56 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucktaker View Post
So it seems to me the biggest problem that people seem to have regarding substinence hunting is the fact a trophy animal is shot. Why can it not just be made mandatory any antlered animal that has been shot for substitnence must have its horns/antlers be cut in half before removal of animal not just skull plate but actual horn or antler. If someone is hunting for food only this should not be a a problem. simple fix to a big problem
That is an excellent idea. The trophy can't be scored, but the hunter still gets the meat, and he can even use the antler material to make knife handles or something else if he pleases. If a person is truly a subsistence hunter, then he should have no issue with this. On the other hand, if the person is just using the subsistence right to trophy hunt, then he will be very opposed to this idea.

As well, all animals killed by subsistence hunters should be recorded, so the F&W people actually know how many animals are killed, and where they are killed, so that they can better maintain our animal populations.
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  #21  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11 View Post
That is an excellent idea. The trophy can't be scored, but the hunter still gets the meat, and he can even use the antler material to make knife handles or something else if he pleases. If a person is truly a subsistence hunter, then he should have no issue with this. On the other hand, if the person is just using the subsistence right to trophy hunt, then he will be very opposed to this idea.

As well, all animals killed by subsistence hunters should be recorded, so the F&W people actually know how many animals are killed, and where they are killed, so that they can better maintain our animal populations.
Agreed....I am smart enough to not post anymore on this thread

LC
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  #22  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:03 PM
Dadirk Dadirk is offline
 
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Default Cutting horns

Cutting horns in the Yukon slowed down the Subsistence hunters up there from taking trophy animals. I agree cut the horns at 2 inches above the base that will eliminate the trophy hunters
  #23  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11 View Post
That is an excellent idea. The trophy can't be scored, but the hunter still gets the meat, and he can even use the antler material to make knife handles or something else if he pleases. If a person is truly a subsistence hunter, then he should have no issue with this. On the other hand, if the person is just using the subsistence right to trophy hunt, then he will be very opposed to this idea.

As well, all animals killed by subsistence hunters should be recorded, so the F&W people actually know how many animals are killed, and where they are killed, so that they can better maintain our animal populations.
It sounds so simple doesn't it, this could really help a lot of the problems but not all.
  #24  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:07 PM
SmokinJoe SmokinJoe is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 45-70sapper View Post
I agree with what has been said before. The easiest, most simple fix is to destroy the trophy value of ANY animal taken under subsistence hunting. Spilt the skill plate, confiscate all of it, whatever, problem solved. Bulls may still be taken but at least it won't be solely as a trophy. And then if they want a chance to take an animal and keep the antlers etc., they have to fall in line with everyone else and wait their turn. This would be so easy to implement, and it would probably give a positive boost to the image of hunting in alberta. To the antis anyways.
You think anti hunting advocates care who's doing the hunting?

Fact of the matter is treaties are not going away.... Ever. Fact is and will always be, you can have an opinion on the topic but it will never come to light. These threads usually come with opinions of people who don't understand that First Nation people have a right to hunt, they are not subsistence hunters, you keep mixing up First Nations hunters with people whom live out in the middle of nowhere and nowhere near a grocery store.

Who cares if it's about trophy or not? Why wouldn't First Nations people have a right to put the skills handed down to them over thousands of years to the test and honor the people who have handed them down through taking mature animals that are harder to get than a young one. The meat is better is a matter of opinion, First Nations people traditionally boil everything... I don't care if it's a day old or 20 years old meat tastes the exact same when it's cooked in this manner.

Suffield elk? It's a herd that was introduced to an area, it might as well be a farm that has no fences. The population is out of control, and who better than First Nations people to get it in check? That meat goes to family's that are still feeling the effects of over a hundred years of mistreatment. If you want to have First Nations people the same as all Canadians treat them as such, encourage your politicians to make sure they get equal opportunity as all Canadians and are no longer regulated. If you knew what happens behind the scenes of a reserve you would change your thought process. It's not easy trying to make something out of nothing.

The actual numbers of First Nations hunting in this country is greatly outweighed by the number of non.. If your worried about First Nations people killing all the animals in the country consider these 2 points,

1) remember the buffalo?
2) maybe the problem lies in ESRD and thier lack of ability to maintain funding to achieve proper numbers is the route of all evils in numbers going down? Maybe the energy sectors influence in politics may have something to do with numbers being drive down? Why is it that moose populations in areas like 349 are almost none compared to what it used to be? Is it because the spike in gas findings have gotten the province to drive down herd numbers for safety sake and to once again regulate the indian by driving up tag numbers? Once again starving the indian?

All I ask is that you learn the facts before posting an argument, don't be totally ignorant to what's actually happening in this great province of ours. And mostly share the sence of entitlement. First Nations have been sharing this great nation long before any of us were born.

Get over the greed
  #25  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:15 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Quote:
Get over the greed
I am for all Canadians being equal under our laws. Wanting all Canadians to be equal is as far from greed as a person can get.
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  #26  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:21 PM
Winch101 Winch101 is offline
 
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Default The only way this will change

Is by Federal and Provincial intervention.
United Canadian non sustenance hunters ,I think
Is a pipe dream .
Some points that affect this situation are .
Native populations are growing considerably quicker
Than other segments of the Canadian peoples .

I have métis relatives in several provinces ,they are adamant
That native rights are in their near future .

The management of wildlife by government in most provinces
Is very suspect . The health of quadrupeds is questionable due
To disease , pollution , lack of habitat . Leaving fair chase aside , their days
Are numbered . I'm not sure I want to eat a deer today from a large portion
Of Alberta . Our children will be in the courts someday ,sued by the
Indigenous because we killed all the game by the pursuit of industry .
Some irony there .

Our saving grace to counteract treaties ,is the increasing immigration
From foreign countries . When Caucasians ( 3rd generation Canadians )
Are the minority , then we will be bringing some sanity to this situation.

When you are getting benefits from Canadian taxpayers , free education
Medical , pay no taxes , housing etc ,etc . How realistic is it that you
Can help yourself to valuable resources as well . Not very
Throwing off the yoke of British Colonization will be of great assistance
To none indigenous Canadians as well .

Why would natives agree to having their hunting treaty rights legislated .
I would like to see what per centage of natives hunt , I think we would
Be very surprised at the low number .

It's not a race thing ,it's a dollar thing , I say buy back the treaties .

By the way .....Natives have shared nothing with Caucasians ,,

We have payed dearly for everything , or have had to take it .
For the benefit of all Canadians . The history of settling this country
With civilized populace , is similar to raising Thankless Children .

Last edited by Winch101; 01-18-2015 at 05:34 PM.
  #27  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:23 PM
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ex811 ex811 is offline
 
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I believe we have evolved as a society well past 'subsistence' hunting.
There simply Has to be a better way, and I will support any government that is willing to take up that challenge.
  #28  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:25 PM
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So cow elk is opened up for non natives at suffield. If Natives went in and took cows as well, non natives would say natives have an unfair advantage. So they go in and take bulls and non natives say they have an unfair advantage. To me there seems to be a population problem that natives have been asked to help stem. One could say natives can't participate but then the elk problem would go on and on. So it should be asked do you want our help or not?
  #29  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:25 PM
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ESOXangler ESOXangler is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 357xp View Post
Well here is a thought, why not give each status have holder one tag per year per animal, in whatever wmu they live in.
You get one moose tag, u shoot one moose per year whenever you choose to.
Maybe have one for mom and pop and when children reach a certain age then they can get one too.
Make them pick up the tags and f&w just like everyone else. But once u get your animals, u are done till next year. Could even make them come to the office to register the kill too.

Now I relize that that might be impossible to monitor, but some kinda system should be in place.
I like this idea the best. It also enables us to monitor the numbers of game more properly. Pretty tough to get an accurate numbers count based off air and hunter surveys when you gave a group that doesn't have to report anything.

Also I feel like they should have active participants in all discussions. One bio/ one elder. It's all about compromise.
  #30  
Old 01-18-2015, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cowtown guy View Post
The big things about it with me is this.

Number 1... How many animals are killed each year for "subsistence"? If we don't know the real number, how do we allocate the proper number of tags in the respective WMU's?

Number 2... Why in this day and age are we all not Canadian? I get it, they got a raw deal for a long time. I feel that one of the easiest ways to eliminate this type of division is to get rid of it. No one race, religion or color in this great Country should be treated better, differently or whatever than any other.


All of this stuff just keeps the rift open between the cultures. I think the natives should be proud of what they are/were in the past. But that is in the past. We live in a different time now.

The laws allowing these harvests were put into place a very long time ago to aid people without money or access to towns and grocery stores. They could step out into the back 40 and smack a deer to feed the family. Again, it's a different time. Stores and butcher shops are readily available now and the cost of going hunting is actually detrimental to the very theme of sustenance. Gas, rifles, ammo, hotel, truck.... This wasn't what was intended. It was intended to make sure that the peoples had access to protein. Not to shoot the animal with the biggest set of head gear.

The Elk are being slaughtered. They want them gone from the base so I kinda get why the are allowing it. But again, why is it good for the goose but not the gander? There should be no preferential treatment given to anyone.
This exactly what I ask my self every time I see a native hunter!

My father made me buy my first car...He said I would appreciate more and would feel the pain of a dollar. 20 years later, I still have my first car, in pristine condition. I look at all my friends that had cars given to them, and none of those cars(most brand new) lasted more than 5 years!!!

It's a proven fact, that give people something for free, or " special " freedoms, they will never take care of it, or themselves! Because more is coming around the corner!

Equality is what I'm after! ( not just in hunting) But hunting is an easy reminder of how things can get out of control!

I ran into a native hunter hunting Grizz this year! Knowing that his luck, would likely be another blow to our opportunity to get a hunt reinstated! And if I believe ESRD, one step closer to Extinction! and nothing can be said or done!

Until now! hopefully, we can unite and do something!
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