Grazing Lease Question - No Rifle Hunting?

[Kawibunga]

Just curious, was calling about for some access and came across one voice mail that said no rifle hunting. Which is neither here nor there and I'll respect that and not hunt that particular grazing lease........... But is that condition not supposed to be reflected in the "lease holder conditions as approved my the Minister"? As it certainly wasn't so I was a bit perplexed. Or is the lease holder able to dictate your method of hunting. Note I'm assuming we're done grazing at this point so there should be no cows out there.

And don't get me wrong, this is not belly aching etc. Just curious. I know we wouldn't let someone rifle hunt our pasture land in SK if we had cows or horses in it, but I'm curious about this instance.

[C2C3PO]

I am not aware of such a condition although I suppose it is possible if the land agent/agronomist felt it was justified for some odd reason.
Look up the lease on the Alberta website and contact the land agent responsible and ask them.
If it is not one of the conditions they have on file then inform them of this so that they can reach out to the leaseholder and educate them on this.
Sometimes people just try and do stuff all on their own......

[landowner]

Depending on the lease, it could still have cows on it, many leases are used for winter grazing.

[Dubious]

Look it up and see if it’s listed as a condition.

https://maps.alberta.ca/RecAccess/Vi...ewer=RecAccess

[Kawibunga]

Originally Posted by Dubious

Look it up and see if it’s listed as a condition.

https://maps.alberta.ca/RecAccess/Vi...ewer=RecAccess

Looked it up, not a condition. Could potentially be an old voice mail. Or they have cows in there still. Tried to call the ranch manager for clarification but he didn't get back to me. No biggie, I have other plans now so won't press the issue. Was just hoping to actually speak to a person to get an answer.

Good news is we have permission just north of there where the older gentleman I spoke to was very accommodating. So hopefully my 17 year old can get his first muley buck.........

[KyleSS]

The other condition that people often over look, is access can be restricted if there is livestock in an adjacent pasture. In my dealings with the Ag land managers, this often comes into play with rifle hunting.

[Headwaters]

could be that there is a residence nearby. I have relatives who have had their houses shot during hunting season, so depending on the lay of the land they may simply be trying to limit the risk to adjacent property.

[Kawibunga]

Originally Posted by Headwaters

could be that there is a residence nearby. I have relatives who have had their houses shot during hunting season, so depending on the lay of the land they may simply be trying to limit the risk to adjacent property.

Nope, huge ranching country down in the SE, 1000s of acres. Could be cows, Could be a case of being just burnt by some idiots and putting in conditions regardless of their validity. Is what it is........

[Who Da Fisherman]

Follow the written lease conditions and hunt by them, no verbal changes count.
WDF

[fishnguy]

Originally Posted by Dubious

Look it up and see if it’s listed as a condition.

https://maps.alberta.ca/RecAccess/Vi...ewer=RecAccess

Neat. Thanks for posting. I don’t hunt leases that much, so I didn’t know it existed.

[TrapperMike]

Because of the drought this year some of the conditions have been laxed so farmer can take advantage of a longer grazing season. I know of a farmer who was given permission to graze some Duck’s Unlimited land because of the dry conditions.

[Peebles]

like WDF said the leaseholder can't add restrictions however they want, but the reality is they often have significant latitude to deny you access or make it miserable. expect any leaseholder willing to add these restrictions to also be willing to play hardball in other ways.

if you have a problem good luck getting out of stage one. my attempts at escalation have not been taken seriously.
https://www.alberta.ca/stage-one-inf...ilitation.aspx

conclusion: grazing leases are like accessing private land with active government enforcement for the title holder

fortunately the majority of leaseholders play nice, and quite a few go above and beyond their duty. when you run into the occasional obstruction the best thing to do is move on.

[thumper]

I disagree. The best thing to do when a leaseholder is not following the rules is to report them to the appropriate land manager. Just as you'd report a hunter that is poaching to the appropriate agency. If not for your own benefit, then for the benefit of others that follow.

'Just move along' is condoning their breaking their leaseholder conditions. Report it, in writing, with a clear cc to your MLA.

[newguy]

Originally Posted by thumper

I disagree. The best thing to do when a leaseholder is not following the rules is to report them to the appropriate land manager. Just as you'd report a hunter that is poaching to the appropriate agency. If not for your own benefit, then for the benefit of others that follow.

'Just move along' is condoning their breaking their leaseholder conditions. Report it, in writing, with a clear cc to your MLA.

X2

[Peebles]

I wonder if the people chiding me have ever engaged in the process. I reported a particularly egregious violation and got this reply:

Dear Peebles,
Thank you for your report. Agrologist Joe will be in contact with the disposition holder and their designated recreational access contact to clarify the Recreational Access Regulation.

If you want to discuss the Recreational Access Regulation, feel free to contact Agrologist Joe in the office at 555-XXX-XXX or myself at the contact information below.

Further email at "the contact information below" was ignored, and when I called I was told that because the specific date I wanted access on had already passed there was no possible remedy. There was also no discipline, fine, or other consequence. I was never able to access the lease, even after intervention.

I wish the system worked differently, but I'd rather spend my time hunting than hiring a lawyer to argue over this and I assume most other hunters would too. I hope you get better resolutions.

[smith88]

Originally Posted by Peebles

like WDF said the leaseholder can't add restrictions however they want, but the reality is they often have significant latitude to deny you access or make it miserable. expect any leaseholder willing to add these restrictions to also be willing to play hardball in other ways.

if you have a problem good luck getting out of stage one. my attempts at escalation have not been taken seriously.
https://www.alberta.ca/stage-one-inf...ilitation.aspx

conclusion: grazing leases are like accessing private land with active government enforcement for the title holder

fortunately the majority of leaseholders play nice, and quite a few go above and beyond their duty. when you run into the occasional obstruction the best thing to do is move on.

That is what they hope hunters will do, to further whatever agenda they have.

[Mick288]

This in WMU 148 by any chance? If so, I spoke to them and they said because of fire restrictions it was bow hunting only. It's since rained and snowed out there but the restriction still stands on the Alberta fire website.

Saw a nice buck on the Northwestern-most lease 2 weeks ago. If you want any more details PM me.

[Kawibunga]

Originally Posted by Mick288

This in WMU 148 by any chance? If so, I spoke to them and they said because of fire restrictions it was bow hunting only. It's since rained and snowed out there but the restriction still stands on the Alberta fire website.

Saw a nice buck on the Northwestern-most lease 2 weeks ago. If you want any more details PM me.

Bingo! That's them, and thanks for the info! I tried but they never did get back to me so we hunted the leased land just north of that on the river last weekend. I wasn't going to continue to chase someone for a direct answer as we had our other permission. The boys and I did see a good sized buck on the SW corner of where we hunted, so close to the NW corner of the "no rifle" piece, could be the same buck. But it was in some serious nastiness drainages at about 800 yards. And after my game retrieval adventure of last year (see Rifle Harvest Thread from 2020!) We didn't pursue him. I need to work on the gutlless method and get a better pack, then I would have considered it...

Wind was howling though last weekend in the afternoon, everything stayed bedded down, so unfortunately it's tag soup for the 17 year old's muley draw, as that was the only weekend he could go, it's unfortunate we could spend more time out there.......