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  #151  
Old 09-08-2020, 08:48 AM
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Dr Tam's message for today.

This summer, Canadians by-and-large followed public health guidance and as a result, nationally, Canada has been able to keep COVID-19 under manageable control, allowing us to carefully resume activities that are important to our social and economic wellbeing. With this said, the average daily case count has been increasing in recent weeks. This is a concern and a reminder that we all need to maintain public health measures to keep COVID-19 on the slow-burn path that we need.

My largest concern is the "slow burn" she speaks of is too slow. There are only 9 people with the Rona in intensive care in the entire province. I understand the need to preserve life but at what cost? The longer we draw this out the bigger the financial hangover is going to be. Just like having too many drinks, one more whisky seems like a brilliant idea at the time but mother of god do you regret it the next day.
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  #152  
Old 09-08-2020, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
Yes,..yet sadly you won’t read it

Easy read one.

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/41...-masks-prevent

Can we leave it to you to understand how social distancing prevents spread?

And you are very correct that everyday more is learned about Covid19 from long term lung and heart damage even in mild cases to treatments.

Some people make a permanent judgement opinion based upon a quote from January that was retracted after further evidence in April.

People will find conspiracy sites on use the quotes they like and never backtrack and instead double down.
If it saves just one life huh? At what point does it start to become ridiculous?
6 out of 4.5 million....remember that number. Car wrecks take more lives. Why aren't we curbing automobile use. Obesity is probably the second leading cause of death (diabetes, heart, ect...), and yet we do NOTHING about that
When will this foolishness end? When they hollered "all aboard", I'm truly amazed how many jumped on.

6 out of 4.5 million? Can you figure out that %? My calculator doesn't have space for that many zeroes.

Will I take the vaccine if it ever comes to fruition? As I said before, I have a better chance of winning the Oilers 50/50 draw. Think I'll be all right. Save it for those who need it (elderly, obese, COPD, ect...)
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  #153  
Old 09-08-2020, 09:37 AM
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If you die and are tested for Covid-19, and the test comes back, positive that is what you died of. The root cause is not the reason you passed on.
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  #154  
Old 09-08-2020, 09:40 AM
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If you die and are tested for Covid-19, and the test comes back, positive that is what you died of. The root cause is not the reason you passed on.
Yup and last night my father told me of A long time family friend that died of a heart attack as he had heart disease and they have Covid 19 on the death certificate and they will not change it to heart disease which he suffered from for years but lately tested positive for Covid.

Pad those stats..... lol
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  #155  
Old 09-08-2020, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Flyer80 View Post
I particularly don’t like the math where the mortality rate is the total deaths over confirmed cases. There are a lot more actual COVID cases than the confirmed cases. And plenty of ways estimate the number of actual cases.
Absolutely. Alberta did a great job of posting the results of their earlier serology antibody tests showing that 36,000 Albertans had in fact been infected. Good science cuts through a lot of the bull.
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  #156  
Old 09-08-2020, 11:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainTi View Post
6 people out of 4.5 million. What's your calculator tell you that percentage is?
Waiting....

Fall in line
4.5 million people have not been infected in Alberta.
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  #157  
Old 09-08-2020, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
Yes,..yet sadly you won’t read it


And you are very correct that everyday more is learned about Covid19 from long term lung and heart damage even in mild cases to treatments.
That's an issue that will haunt a lot of people long into the future......

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-...s/art-20490351
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  #158  
Old 09-08-2020, 11:14 AM
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4.5 million people have not been infected in Alberta.
The way the infection rate was predicted, there should be by now. Is that how they got you?

So that must mean it's not nearly as serious as once believed to be?

I mean, after all.....6? 230ish? Going on for at least 10 months now, mostly likely longer. Save more lives by banning pop and shutting down fast food restaurants.
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  #159  
Old 09-08-2020, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by MountainTi View Post
The way the infection rate was predicted, there should be by now. Is that how they got you?

So that must mean it's not nearly as serious as once believed to be?

I mean, after all.....6? 230ish? Going on for at least 10 months now, mostly likely longer. Save more lives by banning pop and shutting down fast food restaurants.
I actually got the numbers from the earlier serology test results. It's much more accurate than picking a number out of thin air. As for the lower rate of spread, do you really believe that all the sacrifices people have made to control it had no effect? Really?
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  #160  
Old 09-08-2020, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by 1899b View Post
Yup and last night my father told me of A long time family friend that died of a heart attack as he had heart disease and they have Covid 19 on the death certificate and they will not change it to heart disease which he suffered from for years but lately tested positive for Covid.

Pad those stats..... lol
I’ve heard of two other cases where the exact same thing has happened. I bet over 50% of the cases have this same issue.

Last edited by Kurt505; 09-08-2020 at 12:38 PM.
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  #161  
Old 09-08-2020, 12:28 PM
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I’ve heard of two other cases where the e act same thing has happened. I bet over 50% of the cases have this same issue.
You know it old buddy...
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An awful lot of big game was killed with the .30-06 including the big bears before everyone became affluent enough to own a rifle for every species of game they might hunt.
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  #162  
Old 09-08-2020, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by 1899b View Post
Yup and last night my father told me of A long time family friend that died of a heart attack as he had heart disease and they have Covid 19 on the death certificate and they will not change it to heart disease which he suffered from for years but lately tested positive for Covid.

Pad those stats..... lol
People have to justify their over reactions somehow.
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  #163  
Old 09-08-2020, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott h View Post
I actually got the numbers from the earlier serology test results. It's much more accurate than picking a number out of thin air. As for the lower rate of spread, do you really believe that all the sacrifices people have made to control it had no effect? Really?
The arrows at Walmart absolutely kept us from hitting the 800000 mark by the end of May. And social distancing on the beaches of Sylvan stopped the second wave.

Fear causes over-reaction. Fear was encouraged.
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  #164  
Old 09-08-2020, 01:30 PM
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Interesting info/video on a Law that was passed today (Sept 8) by a council of citizens’ assemblies that struck
down and criminalized all COVID measures requiring masking, distancing, quarantining, and vaccines.
Not sure how much power they actually bestow, but bravo..

https://commonlawcourtaus.org/kanata...-restrictions/
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  #165  
Old 09-08-2020, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tri777 View Post
Interesting info/video on a Law that was passed today (Sept 8) by a council of citizens’ assemblies that struck
down and criminalized all COVID measures requiring masking, distancing, quarantining, and vaccines.
Not sure how much power they actually bestow, but bravo..

https://commonlawcourtaus.org/kanata...-restrictions/
I'm rather confident I know how much power they do have........somewhere slightly less than zero....
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  #166  
Old 09-08-2020, 01:40 PM
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I'm rather confident I know how much power they do have........
somewhere slightly less than zero....
Don't really care.
I like the spirit behind the action, the anti dictatorship mindset..
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  #167  
Old 09-08-2020, 01:41 PM
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Here are some interesting numbers from Alberta last week. They illustrate the fatalities related with Covid and the number of comordibities that are associated with the patients. The comorbidities that are listed in the data set as quoted from the Alberta Covid19 stats site are as follows:


The following comorbitities are included in respective analyses: Diabetes, Hypertension, COPD, Cancer, Dementia, Stroke, Liver cirrhosis, Cardiovascular diseases (including IHD and Congestive heart failure), Chronic kidney disease, and Immuno-deficiency.


Some of these ailments are unavoidable but many are. Smoking, poor diet and exercise regimen, alcohol abuse definitely play a part in avoiding these health issues. Since these are the actual cause of death and Covid 19 is the catalyst, should we not be attempting as a society to solve the root cause?

In a total of 239 deaths in Alberta as of last week here is the breakdown.

0 comorbitities = 8 deaths.
1 comorbitities = 14 deaths.
2 comorbitities = 43 deaths.
3+ comorbitities = 174 deaths.

So as a society should we also push people to improve their health in a similar fashion that we are imposing social distancing and mask usage?
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  #168  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by MountainTi View Post
If it saves just one life huh? At what point does it start to become ridiculous?
6 out of 4.5 million....remember that number. Car wrecks take more lives. Why aren't we curbing automobile use. Obesity is probably the second leading cause of death (diabetes, heart, ect...), and yet we do NOTHING about that
When will this foolishness end? When they hollered "all aboard", I'm truly amazed how many jumped on.

6 out of 4.5 million? Can you figure out that %? My calculator doesn't have space for that many zeroes.

Will I take the vaccine if it ever comes to fruition? As I said before, I have a better chance of winning the Oilers 50/50 draw. Think I'll be all right. Save it for those who need it (elderly, obese, COPD, ect...)


https://www.statista.com/statistics/...-tests-canada/

As of September 6, 2020, there had been 131,895 confirmed coronavirus cases and 9,145 deaths from the disease in Canada. Over 5.7 million people had been tested for COVID-19 infection.

Your numbers are incorrect for a discussion.

It is 5.7 million infected. 9145 deaths.

Unless you are looking at it purely selfishly and don’t fall into a higher risk group and therefore care less about others.

Freedom55 potentially falls into a risk category. He is an outdoorsman. Should we care less about him under your premise?
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  #169  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by 1899b View Post
Yup and last night my father told me of A long time family friend that died of a heart attack as he had heart disease and they have Covid 19 on the death certificate and they will not change it to heart disease which he suffered from for years but lately tested positive for Covid.

Pad those stats..... lol
Yes. The fall back of conspiracy folks is “I have this friend.”

Lol
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  #170  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...-tests-canada/

As of September 6, 2020, there had been 131,895 confirmed coronavirus cases and 9,145 deaths from the disease in Canada. Over 5.7 million people had been tested for COVID-19 infection.

Your numbers are incorrect for a discussion.

It is 5.7 million infected. 9145 deaths.

Unless you are looking at it purely selfishly and don’t fall into a higher risk group and therefore care less about others.

Freedom55 potentially falls into a risk category. He is an outdoorsman. Should we care less about him under your premise?
You're not keeping up. I live in Alberta so we shall stick to Alberta stats. First off, my chances of catching the rona are extremely slim (check the numbers). And if I do catch it my chances are quite good having no underlying health conditions and my age (once again, check the numbers)



Lol. On a soapbox or horse? Is that a fallback argument?
I would think there are people out there in a higher risk category than myself that actually take responsibility for their own well being. Wear a mask and safety glasses (and do so properly otherwise it's useless. Wash your hands. Better yet self isolate. I know I would do all of that if I felt I was at risk.
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Last edited by MountainTi; 09-08-2020 at 02:19 PM.
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  #171  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:14 PM
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I wonder what they write in death certificates of people who died of flu-related causes. Sarcasm intended, but I seriously wonder.
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  #172  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Bergerboy View Post
Here are some interesting numbers from Alberta last week. They illustrate the fatalities related with Covid and the number of comordibities that are associated with the patients. The comorbidities that are listed in the data set as quoted from the Alberta Covid19 stats site are as follows:


The following comorbitities are included in respective analyses: Diabetes, Hypertension, COPD, Cancer, Dementia, Stroke, Liver cirrhosis, Cardiovascular diseases (including IHD and Congestive heart failure), Chronic kidney disease, and Immuno-deficiency.


Some of these ailments are unavoidable but many are. Smoking, poor diet and exercise regimen, alcohol abuse definitely play a part in avoiding these health issues. Since these are the actual cause of death and Covid 19 is the catalyst, should we not be attempting as a society to solve the root cause?

In a total of 239 deaths in Alberta as of last week here is the breakdown.

0 comorbitities = 8 deaths.
1 comorbitities = 14 deaths.
2 comorbitities = 43 deaths.
3+ comorbitities = 174 deaths.

So as a society should we also push people to improve their health in a similar fashion that we are imposing social distancing and mask usage?
Post your link please.

https://www.albertadiabetesfoundatio...ainst-diabetes

1,000,000 people in Alberta have diabetes or pre-diabetes.

Pretty significant number of people at risk.

https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...berta-2012.pdf

One in two people will develop cancer in Alberta. Pretty significant risk.

I will let you look at the rest of the risk factors. They all amount to a significant number of friends, family, neighbours, co-workers.

So your post highlighted the huge benefits seen by many Albertans in conducting ourselves in this pandemic.

Had we done nothing. Wow. Deaths would of been through the roof as you noted co-morbidity is a factor for the majority of Albertans.
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  #173  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by MountainTi View Post
You're not keeping up



Lol. On a soapbox or horse? Is that a fallback argument?
I would think there are people out there is a higher risk category than myself that actually take responsibility for their own well being. Wear a mask and safety glasses (and do so properly otherwise it's useless. Wash your hands. Better yet self isolate. I know I would do all of that if I felt I was at risk.
No. You seem to be lacking the point. Your stats were wrong. The co-morbidity factors into many Albertans. Because you feel not at risk doesn’t negate the fact there is a significant risk for many.
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  #174  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:21 PM
fishnguy fishnguy is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
Post your link please.
https://www.alberta.ca/stats/covid-1...statistics.htm

It’s under Comorbidities.
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  #175  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...-tests-canada/

As of September 6, 2020, there had been 131,895 confirmed coronavirus cases and 9,145 deaths from the disease in Canada. Over 5.7 million people had been tested for COVID-19 infection.

Your numbers are incorrect for a discussion.

It is 5.7 million infected. 9145 deaths.

Unless you are looking at it purely selfishly and don’t fall into a higher risk group and therefore care less about others.

Freedom55 potentially falls into a risk category. He is an outdoorsman. Should we care less about him under your premise?

I went the Canadian site to have a look at the numbers as the "statista" is a pay site. I found something interesting about the mortality distribution between Alberta and Quebec.

Alberta 242 deaths from 14,474 cases = 1.67% fatality rate.
Quebec 5,770 deaths from 63,713 cases = 9.06% fatality rate.

Why does a Quebec case have 5 times the chance of fatality as an Albertan case? I would accept a province to province deviation of maybe 20% but this is 542% different. If these numbers are gospel, then why is the government not identifying the cause? This should be case for alarm.

Here is the link to where I got this info if you would like to dig around more.
https://www.canada.ca/en/public-heal...ection.html#a1
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  #176  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Sundancefisher View Post
Post your link please.

https://www.albertadiabetesfoundatio...ainst-diabetes

1,000,000 people in Alberta have diabetes or pre-diabetes.

Pretty significant number of people at risk.

https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...berta-2012.pdf

One in two people will develop cancer in Alberta. Pretty significant risk.

I will let you look at the rest of the risk factors. They all amount to a significant number of friends, family, neighbours, co-workers.

So your post highlighted the huge benefits seen by many Albertans in conducting ourselves in this pandemic.

Had we done nothing. Wow. Deaths would of been through the roof as you noted co-morbidity is a factor for the majority of Albertans.
I understand what you are saying. My point was should we start trying to prevent cancer and diabetes in our society?

As per usual, here is my link https://www.alberta.ca/stats/covid-1...statistics.htm


On a side note, why do you keep bringing up "friends, family, neighbors, co-workers" etc? Seems really weird to me.
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  #177  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Bergerboy View Post
I went the Canadian site to have a look at the numbers as the "statista" is a pay site. I found something interesting about the mortality distribution between Alberta and Quebec.

Alberta 242 deaths from 14,474 cases = 1.67% fatality rate.
Quebec 5,770 deaths from 63,713 cases = 9.06% fatality rate.

Why does a Quebec case have 5 times the chance of fatality as an Albertan case? I would accept a province to province deviation of maybe 20% but this is 542% different. If these numbers are gospel, then why is the government not identifying the cause? This should be case for alarm.

Here is the link to where I got this info if you would like to dig around more.
https://www.canada.ca/en/public-heal...ection.html#a1
It shows how doing things wrong can significantly increase the risk. Seniors are most at risk and Alberta did a better job.

For instance. Government said to not have healthcare workers move from seniors home to seniors home and instead only work one.

Quebec took that as a recommendation and didn’t follow it. Alberta did.
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  #178  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Bergerboy View Post
Why does a Quebec case have 5 times the chance of fatality as an Albertan case?
From an article at CBC, back from June:

In all, Quebec has recorded 5,029 deaths from COVID-19, along with 53,185 confirmed cases.

More than 80 per cent of the dead were residents of the province's long-term care facilities, known as CHSLDs, and people with more autonomy living in private seniors' residences, or RPAs.

The province's nursing homes, already short on staff and resources before the pandemic, struggled to contain the virus.

At the height of the crisis last month, nearly half of the province's 412 CHSLDs were dealing with at least one confirmed case of COVID-19.
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  #179  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Bergerboy View Post
I understand what you are saying. My point was should we start trying to prevent cancer and diabetes in our society?

As per usual, here is my link https://www.alberta.ca/stats/covid-1...statistics.htm


On a side note, why do you keep bringing up "friends, family, neighbors, co-workers" etc? Seems really weird to me.
There seems to be a pervasive feeling some feel they are not at risk so let people die to help the economy

Hence the response it is more about others and the fact there are a significant number of people at risk.

As for cancer prevention...why bring that up when it or not a pandemic. You can’t catch cancer the same way. Sure HPV vaccine prevents cancer but again...Covid19 and cancer are entirely different topics.

Start a should we work to stop cancer thread. Likely most will say yes and others will say let nature take its course.
And yes. Encouraging people to be healthier is great. Can save the economy and save lives. Win/win.
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  #180  
Old 09-08-2020, 02:34 PM
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No. You seem to be lacking the point. Your stats were wrong. The co-morbidity factors into many Albertans. Because you feel not at risk doesn’t negate the fact there is a significant risk for many.
Which stats are wrong?

As I said, if i felt at risk, I would take some responsibility for myself
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