Model 70 Question

[shortaction]

I had a local fellow stop in last night with a Model 70 Stainless Synthetic in 300 WSM.

Last Moose season he was loading the firearm and when he went to push the bolt forward on the 1st round it fired with the bolt only part way forward. It blew the brass apart and the bullet was just sitting in the chamber. No one was hurt and he hasn't had any problems since but he is very nervous about it.

I actually mounted the scope for him two years ago on this firearm and sighted it in and never had a problem with it.

When I was looking at it last night I took the bolt apart to have a look inside and inspect the firing pin and it is hard to turn every half turn. I am wondering if the firing pin is bent? Maybe it always was and just got stuck out and that was why the cartridge fired? The other thing is that when you close the bolt in the rifle and then open it the catch that holds the bolt together slides up past the slot.

I have told him to take it to a Gunsmith and have it gone over. Just wondering if any one has ever heard of this happening? I have a couple of Model 70's and have had several in the past, never had a lick of problem with them.

One of those things that makes you go, hmmmm.

[ShawnM]

I have a Model 70 in .30-06 that has seen many seasons and have never encountered that problem. Even when I was a young lad and suffered from severe buck-fever it fed reliably. I'm not really sure how it could happen since the pin isn't under tension until the bolt locks down.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by ShawnM

I have a Model 70 in .30-06 that has seen many seasons and have never encountered that problem. Even when I was a young lad and suffered from severe buck-fever it fed reliably. I'm not really sure how it could happen since the pin isn't under tension until the bolt locks down.

Model 70's cock upon opening the bolt so the firing pin is under tension when the bolt is open. The only time the firing pin is not cocked or under tension is after it has been fired and the bolt hasn't yet been lifted/reopened to recock it.

Short Action if what your friend explained to you actually happened then there is something defective with the safety and it could happen again. I'm thinking he had the safety in the middle position and somehow inadvertently flipped the safety lever to the fire position as he was closing the bolt and the safety catch somehow released the firing pin thus exposing a defect with the safety that might not show in the normal cycling of the bolt. I would have it looked at by a competent gunsmith.

Hopefully one of our resident gunsmiths will reply to this thread.

[209x50]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Model 70's cock upon opening the bolt so the firing pin is under tension when the bolt is open. The only time the firing pin is not cocked or under tension is after it has been fired and the bolt hasn't yet been lifted/reopened to recock it.

Short Action if what your friend explained to you actually happened then there is something defective with the safety and it could happen again. I'm thinking he had the safety in the middle position and somehow inadvertently flipped the safety lever to the fire position as he was closing the bolt and the safety catch somehow released the firing pin thus exposing a defect with the safety that might not show in the normal cycling of the bolt. I would have it looked at by a competent gunsmith.

Hopefully one of our resident gunsmiths will reply to this thread.

I think Bushrat is on the right track here. Usually the culprit is a poorly adjust trigger. Done wrong the trigger will some times fire when the safety is taken off.

[ShawnM]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Model 70's cock upon opening the bolt so the firing pin is under tension when the bolt is open. The only time the firing pin is not cocked or under tension is after it has been fired and the bolt hasn't yet been lifted/reopened to recock it.

If that's the case then why are you able to hold the trigger while closing the bolt and not have any tension on the pin? Not saying I know better, just curious because I thought that's how all bolt actions worked.

[Leeper]

In this particular instance, I don't think trigger adustment has anything to do with it. It sounds to me like the bolt sleeve lock failed in it's duty and the notch at the rear of the bolt is either inadequate or non-existent.
Because the Model 70 is a CRF action, the cartridge fed up behind the extractor which held it sufficiently tight against the bolt face that it fired when the bolt sleeve rotated to the "bolt-closed" position.
That this happened once, means that the firearm should be checked out by someone who is aware of what the potential problem may be. It is important that he understands to origin of the problem. Otherwise, the 'smith is likely to cycle the bolt a couple of times, say, "it looks OK to me", and send your friend on his way with a still-defective rifle. Leeper.

[Dmay]

Originally Posted by ShawnM

If that's the case then why are you able to hold the trigger while closing the bolt and not have any tension on the pin? Not saying I know better, just curious because I thought that's how all bolt actions worked.

They cock-on-opening. When you close the bolt (hopefully on an empty chamber) and hold the trigger, you are releasing the tension on the firing pin, exactly the same as firing it, only slower.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by ShawnM

If that's the case then why are you able to hold the trigger while closing the bolt and not have any tension on the pin? Not saying I know better, just curious because I thought that's how all bolt actions worked.

My previous statement in my previous post was a bit misleading, cocked or uncocked the firing pin is always under tension. When closing the bolt while releasing the trigger the pin moves ahead to the fired or uncocked position the same as if it had been cocked and fired. There is still much tension on the pin in that position, it is not resting loosely inside the bolt, in all actuality it is being held bottomed out against the pin stop inside the bolt face with the pin tip protruding out through the arpeture in the bolt face into the indentation it made on the primer when the pin tip struck it and fired the round. The pin does not withdraw from the firing pin arpeture until the bolt handle is lifted camming the pin back to the cocked position. Take note that quite a few people will slowly close the bolt while pulling the trigger with a live round in the chamber believing that all tension on the pin is released and that it is a safe way to carry a rifle not realizing that the pin is under near full tension and resting directly on a live primer and that the only thing holding the pin from completing its full travel is the primer of the loaded round. A good rap to the bolt shroud or impact from dropping the rifle can cause enough force/jar on the pin that is resting on a live primer under much tension to accidentally discharge.

[shortaction]

Thanks for all the replies.

One thing I might not have made clear is that the bolt was only in its forward motion when it fired(had just picked up the cartridge out of the magazine) so maybe 1/3 of the way forward from its rear most position.

Leeper

Is there anyway the firing pin could stay forward under pressure with the sleeve problem you are referring to? Just wondering if the firing pin was stuck out under spring tension when the cartridge came up from the magazine under the ejector and pushed back when the rim of the cartridge passed up past it and then snapped into the primer once it cleared the cartridge over the primer?

Thanks again everyone.

Todd