Housing shortage - young people moving back home

[DirtShooter]

Originally Posted by HVA7mm

Doubtful, at least any that were born in Berta. I'm curious which demographic you fit into as you're not openly denying culpability but maybe you are, lol.

FYI

1968 Alberta Liberal won 4 out of 19 seats, PC got 15
1972 Alberta Liberal won 0 out of 19 seats, PC got 19
1974 Alberta Liberal won 0 out of 19 seats, PC got 19
1980 Alberta Liberal won 0 out of 21 seats, PC got 21

A pretty blue province during PET's reign.

Man I'm 35, I hold memberships to both UCP and CPC.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by -JR-

When I talk to the younger generation , they are saying prices are very high in Edmonton, as they are looking for there first home . Then I found out they are looking at brand new homes as their first house . I think they need to wake up Most big cities like Edmonton and Calgary have older nabber hoods that were built in the mid 50s on very big lots . These are solid homes that have been up dated and are going for under $ 300. Even the rent in these areas are cheep .
Its there choice I guess . Buying an older house were the monthly mortgage is less than renting it is a no brainer to me . At least you get it back when you move out .

Not any more.


The run down house in a historically crime riddled Calgary 'hood will cost you 500k for the privilege to clean up on your dime.

-----


For every baby born in Canada, 49 people will immigrate here.
This is unsustainable for the lower end of the economic spectrum.
The Liberal Federal government is purposefully devastating the average Canadian and Canadian business.

All of these new condo towers in the cities are being built on the promise of more immigration. Communities are being bulldozed to make room for more new immigrants.

The vast majority of the $ earned through this construction is also going to International firms.
In Calgary, all of the millwork shops that used to manufacture kitchens and bathrooms are going out of business because the Condo and new home developers are buying their boxes from China.

Building more houses at the current immigration rate is not good for the smaller Canadian business, or Canadian kid.

We need to slow down and catch up, teach and support our kids so that they can afford to have a home and a family.

[roper1]

^^^^^^^Immigration^^^^Well said

[Drewski Canuck]

Walking Buffalo,

on the point of immigration and low Canadian birth rate, I agree with you.

If you remember Fort McMurray in the early 2000's it had the highest per capita birth rate in Canada. Young people moved there, married or co habited and had the prosperity to afford having kids.

Starting a family now only exists for the very poor as the Child Tax Credit is the backbone of their existence.

Imagine if young people had the prosperity that they could afford to start a family again in Alberta. That would of course mean a return to the way things were in the early 2000's in Alberta, which the Liberals will never let happen as it shifted too much power from Quebec and Ontario.

Drewski

[The Cook]

Originally Posted by DirtShooter

Man I'm 35, I hold memberships to both UCP and CPC.

Well you're very good at playing the liberal blame game.
#1- Get a job
#2- Save Money
#3- Buy house or condo.
Really pretty simple no matter what age.

[Scott h]

It's telling that so many want to blame immigration (yes the rate is probably much too high) yet many of those same immigrants arrive in Canada, get jobs, work very hard, and buy homes. They then put their kids into school and graduate the next generation of nurses, etc. . I've got life long friends that still live in SE Calgary with 4 kids from 35 on down, and not one of them went to school to get ahead. Yes 2 (maybe 3) of them are still at home, and only one of them owns anything (a trailer).
And some how this is immigrants or the federal governments fault???? Really??

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by Scott h

It's telling that so many want to blame immigration (yes the rate is probably much too high) yet many of those same immigrants arrive in Canada, get jobs, work very hard, and buy homes. They then put their kids into school and graduate the next generation of nurses, etc. . I've got life long friends that still live in SE Calgary with 4 kids from 35 on down, and not one of them went to school to get ahead. Yes 2 (maybe 3) of them are still at home, and only one of them owns anything (a trailer).
And some how this is immigrants or the federal governments fault???? Really??

I think you're living in a dream world, the majority of immigrants don't come under a guaranteed job preference, Even the foreign student thing has turned out to be a scam to get people into the country, with diploma mills turning out questionably qualified people who will qualify for permanent residency. the bulk of new comers, including "refugees" live in large family groups and do the menial jobs Canadians won't. The idea that they will fill the place of the extinct tax payers is the faint hope clause.

[Talleyrandophile]

Originally Posted by Scott h

It's telling that so many want to blame immigration (yes the rate is probably much too high) yet many of those same immigrants arrive in Canada, get jobs, work very hard, and buy homes. They then put their kids into school and graduate the next generation of nurses, etc. . I've got life long friends that still live in SE Calgary with 4 kids from 35 on down, and not one of them went to school to get ahead. Yes 2 (maybe 3) of them are still at home, and only one of them owns anything (a trailer).
And some how this is immigrants or the federal governments fault???? Really??

Scott, I think it's less about the immigration itself than it is the downstream effects of the massive increase in the rate of immigration. Few people have issues with immigrants or the concept of immigration. The concern is that people arrive and put pressure on a housing market that was struggling to accommodate existing Canadians.

[Smoky buck]

Immigration ( population growth in general) is an issue because infrastructure and housing is not being built at a rate to accommodate. There is also not enough rentals to support it

Between the labor costs, the headache's/costs of permits, and material costs it’s also not cheap to build to offset the issue. The reality is it’s not going to be possible to bring down costs in major hubs because of the cost of land alone.

The only thing that would assist in improving or stabilizing housing costs is development infrastructure and build up smaller communities that are already more affordable. Focus on improving job opportunities, infrastructure, and housing in more affordable locations will make these areas more attractive. This will also take pressure off of the market in larger hubs in turn stabilizing or even lowering costs

All the BS quick fixes are not going to work. Really the only way to improve cost is spread out the demand.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams1

I think you're living in a dream world, the majority of immigrants don't come under a guaranteed job preference, Even the foreign student thing has turned out to be a scam to get people into the country, with diploma mills turning out questionably qualified people who will qualify for permanent residency. the bulk of new comers, including "refugees" live in large family groups and do the menial jobs Canadians won't. The idea that they will fill the place of the extinct tax payers is the faint hope clause.

Go spend some time in a hospital and see how many immigrants, or children of, are looking after you.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by Talleyrandophile

Scott, I think it's less about the immigration itself than it is the downstream effects of the massive increase in the rate of immigration. Few people have issues with immigrants or the concept of immigration. The concern is that people arrive and put pressure on a housing market that was struggling to accommodate existing Canadians.

I don't disagree that the rate is way to high currently, and that lands directly on JT's lap. The only issue is blaming them for the lack of getting ahead. A one minute search on MLS and I found some pretty cheap places to buy in Calgary, and god knows theres a ton of jobs if you choose to work. They may not be someones idea of a dream home, but they are out there if you want to own one.

[Big Sky]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

The run down house in a historically crime riddled Calgary 'hood will cost you 500k for the privilege to clean up on your dime.

Agree that there are not a lot of houses in Calgary for less than $500k. Most of them would be east of Deerfoot in areas accessed by Memorial or 17th SE. I will say that there are a lot of good, hard working people in those communities, but sadly, these communities also have way more than their share of problematic people.

From 2018 to 2023, my wife and I have helped several extended family members find homes in Calgary. The home buying experience has changed immensely in that time and it hasn't been for the good.

As a fun exercise last night I went onto the realtor map and set the low price at $400k and the high price at $600k. It's amazing the lack of properties that you see available in Calgary in that price range. In nicer older areas, you will typically find nothing available; maybe some townhouses. Do the same search in Edmonton and there is still quite a a bit available. People should give it a try.

For those that say move to a smaller town to live, you have keep in mind that for some jobs you can only work in the larger centers and that commuting brings it's own issues.

[DirtShooter]

Originally Posted by The Cook

Well you're very good at playing the liberal blame game.
#1- Get a job
#2- Save Money
#3- Buy house or condo.
Really pretty simple no matter what age.

I did that, bought a house at 23.

Don't blame me cause you voted for Pierre 30 years ago.

[Sundancefisher]

Hearing about people buying a new home with kid and parent splitting cost and designing the home as two separate living areas for some privacy but also some communal space.

Parents take on the largest financial cost… kid takes on some mortgage.

Moving back to the nuclear family concept I guess.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

Hearing about people buying a new home with kid and parent splitting cost and designing the home as two separate living areas for some privacy but also some communal space.

Parents take on the largest financial cost… kid takes on some mortgage.

Moving back to the nuclear family concept I guess.

Somehow creative solutions don't enter into the conversation for some, they want it all RIGHT NOW! In my 20's I bought a house with 3 friends and had a blast. Imagine a hot tub on the rear deck, with a large screen TV (for the day) set up next to it. The back yard was a collection of motorbikes, mountain bikes, and trucks. The basement was the ski repository. We had a blast. We had a 10% mortgage that we never thought to bitch about, and split 4 ways it was much cheaper than rent. When it finally finished up we split the cash and each went our own way, just a little bit richer.
Some see lemons; some make lemonade.

[W921]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

Hearing about people buying a new home with kid and parent splitting cost and designing the home as two separate living areas for some privacy but also some communal space.

Parents take on the largest financial cost… kid takes on some mortgage.

Moving back to the nuclear family concept I guess.

Haha ive heard of parents buying their kid a house so he would move out just to get rid of him

[-JR-]

How can there be a shortage when there are so many for sale !

[densa44]

There are solutions to this and other problems related to housing that we can solve without worrying about the nasty government in Ottawa.

Require every devloper to provide 10%,20%,or 30% or what every you like in every new subdivision for first time hme buyers, the poor, the elderly etc. These houses will be cheap and on small lots, Canada has done this before and it works. A couple of problems, it p**sses off the well to do who buy the rest of the houses and the developers who own the land, on the plus side the neighbourhood will have full schools and great youth sport teams.

Lets stop whinning, the west was built by people who lived in holes in the ground with sod roofs! We can do this.

This can be solved by local governments and the banks, if the banks don't want to help, set up your own like the Alberta Treasury branches.

Why does everything have to be someone elses fault?

[HVA7mm]

Originally Posted by Scott h

Somehow creative solutions don't enter into the conversation for some, they want it all RIGHT NOW! In my 20's I bought a house with 3 friends and had a blast. Imagine a hot tub on the rear deck, with a large screen TV (for the day) set up next to it. The back yard was a collection of motorbikes, mountain bikes, and trucks. The basement was the ski repository. We had a blast. We had a 10% mortgage that we never thought to bitch about, and split 4 ways it was much cheaper than rent. When it finally finished up we split the cash and each went our own way, just a little bit richer.
Some see lemons; some make lemonade.

That's pretty much what it's been like for the majority of immigrant families for the last 30 years. Most immigrants to Canada have come from South Asia, China and the Philippines where multi-generational multi-family homes were the norm. It certainly makes things a lot more affordable when you have a few wage earners and some pensioners as well, one mortgage, one property tax, insurance, utilities etc. The mortgage gets paid down more quickly then another property is purchased and so on. It's a pretty foreign concept to most that have grown up in Canada, as we've all grown pretty accustomed to having our own place and a great deal of independence. Does it work to make things more affordable, of course it does. However the pooling of resources has also inadvertently driven up the price of real estate especially in areas that the largest number of immigrants have moved to (southern Ontario, Lower Mainland etc.), and the trickle down effect is now being felt in many other parts of the country due to prohibitively high housing costs in those areas.

Then again, in the last 10 or 15 years Canadian home buyers were more than happy to sign on the dotted line when paying inflated prices for real estate, especially when interest rates were driven down to unrealistic levels. Now that interest rates have risen to historical norms a lot of people are really feeling the pinch and dreams of home ownership are becoming just that. I was kind of hoping that rising interest rates would drive down real estate a bit, but as long as the market is willing to keep paying exorbitant house prices nothing will likely change. I'm not saying if it's right or wrong, but Canadians will eventually be forced to do the same thing as immigrant families if they want to own any property in their lifetime. It really doesn't make a lot of sense for a country that has such a sparse population density.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by densa44

There are solutions to this and other problems related to housing that we can solve without worrying about the nasty government in Ottawa.

Require every devloper to provide 10%,20%,or 30% or what every you like in every new subdivision for first time hme buyers, the poor, the elderly etc. These houses will be cheap and on small lots, Canada has done this before and it works. A couple of problems, it p**sses off the well to do who buy the rest of the houses and the developers who own the land, on the plus side the neighbourhood will have full schools and great youth sport teams.

Lets stop whinning, the west was built by people who lived in holes in the ground with sod roofs! We can do this.

This can be solved by local governments and the banks, if the banks don't want to help, set up your own like the Alberta Treasury branches.

Why does everything have to be someone elses fault?

Lol.... why do you think it will take charity to solve this issue?

Subsidized housing is already being done.
Realtors and developers are already scamming this game.
Few of them get caught.

-------------

Look at that shiny new 30 story high rise condo.
300 new homes.
294 of those homes will be for brand new immigrants.


This is not sustainable.

[W921]

Originally Posted by HVA7mm

That's pretty much what it's been like for the majority of immigrant families for the last 30 years. Most immigrants to Canada have come from South Asia, China and the Philippines where multi-generational multi-family homes were the norm. It certainly makes things a lot more affordable when you have a few wage earners and some pensioners as well, one mortgage, one property tax, insurance, utilities etc. The mortgage gets paid down more quickly then another property is purchased and so on. It's a pretty foreign concept to most that have grown up in Canada, as we've all grown pretty accustomed to having our own place and a great deal of independence. Does it work to make things more affordable, of course it does. However the pooling of resources has also inadvertently driven up the price of real estate especially in areas that the largest number of immigrants have moved to (southern Ontario, Lower Mainland etc.), and the trickle down effect is now being felt in many other parts of the country due to prohibitively high housing costs in those areas.

Then again, in the last 10 or 15 years Canadian home buyers were more than happy to sign on the dotted line when paying inflated prices for real estate, especially when interest rates were driven down to unrealistic levels. Now that interest rates have risen to historical norms a lot of people are really feeling the pinch and dreams of home ownership are becoming just that. I was kind of hoping that rising interest rates would drive down real estate a bit, but as long as the market is willing to keep paying exorbitant house prices nothing will likely change. I'm not saying if it's right or wrong, but Canadians will eventually be forced to do the same thing as immigrant families if they want to own any property in their lifetime. It really doesn't make a lot of sense for a country that has such a sparse population density.

Its good that immigrant families can work and live together. Kind of sounds like kids want to help their parents. I wonder why they seem to be able to get a long and trust each other because apparently a lot of us can't do this.
Is it religious? No internet? Wonder what the difference is?

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by densa44

There are solutions to this and other problems related to housing that we can solve without worrying about the nasty government in Ottawa.

Require every devloper to provide 10%,20%,or 30% or what every you like in every new subdivision for first time hme buyers, the poor, the elderly etc. These houses will be cheap and on small lots, Canada has done this before and it works. A couple of problems, it p**sses off the well to do who buy the rest of the houses and the
developers who own the land, on the plus side the neighbourhood will have full schools and great youth sport teams.

Lets stop whinning, the west was built by people who lived in holes in the ground with sod roofs! We can do this.

This can be solved by local governments and the banks, if the banks don't want to help, set up your own like the
Alberta Treasury branches.

Why does everything have to be someone elses fault?

And Trudeau will throw immigrants into those smaller homes, subsidized with taxpayer dollars, and it won't help our young people at all.

[lmtada]

Originally Posted by W921

Its good that immigrant families can work and live together. Kind of sounds like kids want to help their parents. I wonder why they seem to be able to get a long and trust each other because apparently a lot of us can't do this.
Is it religious? No internet? Wonder what the difference is?

True. Kids do want to help there parents. The immigrants know that pensions don’t exist in there countries, so they are conditioned to take care of family. Whereas Canadian government has taken on that privledge of taking care of the family in later years with pension system. Therefore Canadian families pay into CPP, to pay for later years. However at 700-1200/month nowhere can one barely exist. Trust towards government is waning, as the benefits of CPP are meagre at best. Pensions truly go towards theose working for the government. This is why we, and many western countries have immigrantion commitments. The pension system needs bodies to pay for it. Canada isn’t producing enough offspring, to pay for Canada Pension system. It’s literally a Ponzi scheme, needed more and more people to make it work. Government will open doors, borders to make this work (as is happening in Canada, America). Exploit the immigrants for pension contributions, encourage families to have more children (why do think liberals have given so many entitlements to those having families, child care, etc (never existed before except in Quebec)j. Now with $1.3 Trillion dollar debt, and interest rates normalizing. The bill is coming due……

[DirtShooter]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

And Trudeau will throw immigrants into those smaller homes, subsidized with taxpayer dollars, and it won't help our young people at all.

Exactly this. The middle class, if you can call it that, earns too much. The immigrants earn nothing and therefore will qualify for the turds handouts.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by densa44

There are solutions to this and other problems related to housing that we can solve without worrying about the nasty government in Ottawa.

Require every devloper to provide 10%,20%,or 30% or what every you like in every new subdivision for first time hme buyers, the poor, the elderly etc. These houses will be cheap and on small lots, Canada has done this before and it works. A couple of problems, it p**sses off the well to do who buy the rest of the houses and the developers who own the land, on the plus side the neighbourhood will have full schools and great youth sport teams.

Lets stop whinning, the west was built by people who lived in holes in the ground with sod roofs! We can do this.

This can be solved by local governments and the banks, if the banks don't want to help, set up your own like the Alberta Treasury branches.

Why does everything have to be someone elses fault?

Look into the cost of land and building a house in the expensive cities that is what the real factor is

The land cost alone are a huge issue not the developers.

As I posted earlier without development of more affordable communities and efforts to enhance employment the demand in cities will remain high keeping housing costs high.

[jstubbs]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

It’s funny how many are saying that people in their 20’s 30’s are getting what they asked for. You guys do realize the liberals were not voted into power by even these generations in Alberta or most of western Canada. There is a ton of people in theses generations that can’t stand present government or can’t stand any of the political parties and don’t vote

Don’t kid yourselves there is plenty of woke yuppies in the older generation that voted for social programs to get free stuff or wanted to feel good voting to save the world

The reality is we are all getting screwed by the way Canada has been managed. It’s not simply “if you work hard and budget” you can get it done. The cost of living vs wages and taxes are through the roof and if you do the math it’s actually a tough go out there getting started compared to what most here have gone through

The cities are stupid expensive yet families try to encourage their kids to stay close. You can find more affordable living in rural areas but it’s not the lifestyle for everyone. Really that isn’t that cheap but it gives kids a better opportunity

I have friends with younger siblings or older kids that have worked hard and saved but it’s not easy. Most are couples where both work and trying to save for their first home. I have know of 3 different couples that had to move back to their parents temporarily after huge rent increases. Some have saved a down payment for homes and have been out bid on homes do to demand for anything affordable in the area

Really Canada is a mess it’s not just a matter of work harder and save. We have friends in other countries that left Canada and hearing the difference in cost of living is crazy. My wife’s friend is in LA and here expenses are much lower than someone living in Calgary

It’s definitely tougher to get life started for younger people than it was for my generation. This is coming from someone who started life at 16 with no money and a backpack without any help from family.

Some of the BS posted here makes me think this is the old A&W crowd sitting around yelling at clouds thinking they could do no wrong and everyone else is a problem

Sorry guys we had it easier than those trying to get their adult life started theses days

Thanks for a good post. It’s sad watching those here continue to stick their fingers in their ears and refuse to acknowledge, despite the mountains of evidence, that today’s younger generations have all been worse off than their parents in terms of disposable income and housing affordability. Yes, it doesn’t mean that young people can never afford to buy a house, and exceptional young people will always be OK, but we’re talking on average here.

Just wanted to add one more significant hurdle that isn’t mentioned enough: the fact that the same jobs available today that require bachelors, masters, etc degrees are a lot of the same ones that only required a highschool education 20+ years ago. In addition to that, university costs have skyrocketed in that same time period—some programs have literally tripled and beyond in cost.

So now young people are starting in the workforce on average four years later, and if they don’t have the bank of mom and dad, are a cool $30-50k in debt. That can take years to pay off, and is all money that could have been saved toward a down payment.

Yes, they could choose to go work a trade instead, or work in the oilpatch, where you’re still making basically the same money (if not less) that someone 10-15 years ago was making, but not everyone can be out there on a rig or pulling wire. The whole white collar industry virtually requires you to have a degree today, unless you happen to already have a long established career, which again, most young people don’t.

Overall, the disdain for young people by the older generations in this country is pathetic and truly sad. You can see it all across this thread—people deflecting about what is really driving the issues with irrelevant anecdotes and soapboxing their meaningless partisan rhetoric of it being all the fault of some “leftist ideology” boogieman— when really the primary problem is the “f*** you, I got mine” mindset and an overall lack of empathy. Otherwise, there would be solutions and sacrifice being made by those older generations to ensure that young folks have a chance.

[calgarychef]

Originally Posted by The Cook

Well you're very good at playing the liberal blame game.
#1- Get a job
#2- Save Money
#3- Buy house or condo.
Really pretty simple no matter what age.

How long have you had your house? I’ll bet that a lot of people in here myself included couldn’t afford to buy our own houses. It’s not that realistic anymore to say, save money and buy a house.

We bought ours with $12,000.00 down. The same house today would be well over $100,000.00 down payment. Not many young people or first time buyers have that kind of savings. And with rent so high how are they even supposed to save anything?

[lmtada]

Originally Posted by jstubbs

Thanks for a good post. It’s sad watching those here continue to stick their fingers in their ears and refuse to acknowledge, despite the mountains of evidence, that today’s younger generations have all been worse off than their parents in terms of disposable income and housing affordability. Yes, it doesn’t mean that young people can never afford to buy a house, and exceptional young people will always be OK, but we’re talking on average here.

Just wanted to add one more significant hurdle that isn’t mentioned enough: the fact that the same jobs available today that require bachelors, masters, etc degrees are a lot of the same ones that only required a highschool education 20+ years ago. In addition to that, university costs have skyrocketed in that same time period—some programs have literally tripled and beyond in cost.

So now young people are starting in the workforce on average four years later, and if they don’t have the bank of mom and dad, are a cool $30-50k in debt. That can take years to pay off, and is all money that could have been saved toward a down payment.

Yes, they could choose to go work a trade instead, or work in the oilpatch, where you’re still making basically the same money (if not less) that someone 10-15 years ago was making, but not everyone can be out there on a rig or pulling wire. The whole white collar industry virtually requires you to have a degree today, unless you happen to already have a long established career, which again, most young people don’t.

Overall, the disdain for young people by the older generations in this country is pathetic and truly sad. You can see it all across this thread—people deflecting about what is really driving the issues with irrelevant anecdotes and soapboxing their meaningless partisan rhetoric of it being all the fault of some “leftist ideology” boogieman— when really the primary problem is the “f*** you, I got mine” mindset and an overall lack of empathy. Otherwise, there would be solutions and sacrifice being made by those older generations to ensure that young folks have a chance.

Trades are way to go. Both my nephews, 24, and 26. Both took electrical trade route. Both busy working for contractor in Regina. Both have $500,000.00/ houses. Both are married, and kids. No one helped in purchasing a home. They went school for two years, then jobs immediately out of school. They hang in a group whom all graduated same year, all were hired by same company. Work all over Canada, USA, restoring grids after hurricanes, tornadoes, etc. Best thing they started work, stacking shelves at Coop while in high school. With COVID, they were busy starting there families.

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by calgarychef

How long have you had your house? I’ll bet that a lot of people in here myself included couldn’t afford to buy our own houses. It’s not that realistic anymore to say, save money and buy a house.

We bought ours with $12,000.00 down. The same house today would be well over $100,000.00 down payment. Not many young people or first time buyers have that kind of savings. And with rent so high how are they even supposed to save anything?

At one time, a male who hadn't gone past high school, could buy a house and raise a family on one income, while the wife raised the kids. Now they both work full time and parenting as well as home ownership are out of reach.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by jstubbs

Thanks for a good post. It’s sad watching those here continue to stick their fingers in their ears and refuse to acknowledge, despite the mountains of evidence, that today’s younger generations have all been worse off than their parents in terms of disposable income and housing affordability. Yes, it doesn’t mean that young people can never afford to buy a house, and exceptional young people will always be OK, but we’re talking on average here.

Just wanted to add one more significant hurdle that isn’t mentioned enough: the fact that the same jobs available today that require bachelors, masters, etc degrees are a lot of the same ones that only required a highschool education 20+ years ago. In addition to that, university costs have skyrocketed in that same time period—some programs have literally tripled and beyond in cost.

So now young people are starting in the workforce on average four years later, and if they don’t have the bank of mom and dad, are a cool $30-50k in debt. That can take years to pay off, and is all money that could have been saved toward a down payment.

Yes, they could choose to go work a trade instead, or work in the oilpatch, where you’re still making basically the same money (if not less) that someone 10-15 years ago was making, but not everyone can be out there on a rig or pulling wire. The whole white collar industry virtually requires you to have a degree today, unless you happen to already have a long established career, which again, most young people don’t.

Overall, the disdain for young people by the older generations in this country is pathetic and truly sad. You can see it all across this thread—people deflecting about what is really driving the issues with irrelevant anecdotes and soapboxing their meaningless partisan rhetoric of it being all the fault of some “leftist ideology” boogieman— when really the primary problem is the “f*** you, I got mine” mindset and an overall lack of empathy. Otherwise, there would be solutions and sacrifice being made by those older generations to ensure that young folks have a chance.

When it comes down to the whole education vs trades deal both can be good and it comes down to the path you choose

You can take the education path and not end up with large debt but unfortunately there is a lot of young people who choose to go to school “to find themselves” my son has buddies that are going to school on dads dime with no direction taking useless courses. I know adults who did the same thing a racked up personal debt to get a degree that doesn’t really help them get a good job. But I know others who have taken reasonably priced courses with a reasonable completion time and know have good jobs with minimal debt

That said the education system is a joke that is milking money out of people and often makes it difficult to complete courses in a timely manner. Decided to go back to school myself and what a disorganized, over staffed, and overpriced crap show ( my course is not that bad compared to many options)

Trades can be great if you get in early and put in the work. My son’s one buddy is doing well working towards being a heavy duty mechanic. Problem is a lot of employers dangle a carrot offering apprenticeships screwing guys around too. Some trades come with a gypsy nature and tough conditions. But if you choose the right trade with the correct company you can do awesome with a good career

Both paths can be good and bad. It really depends on the individual making realistic and smart choices

Still don’t fix housing costs and government won’t solve the cost in the expensive high demand location. I stopped living in these areas long ago for a reason. Cost will only change when demand changes