Just witnessed a crazy accident!

[threeforthree]

[QUOTE=tirebob;3479735]I just got to work this morning after watching a mildly lifted F250 on Duratracs lose control on the Deerfoot at no more than 100kph on bare bare, cold pavement. QUOTE]

maybe driver error more than a tire issue??

[Who Da Fisherman]

Slow down on ice!!!!!!!!

I have seen this a few times, either on the QEII or Deerfoot. Too fast for road conditions and the tires you are riding on.
I run duratracs and have a lift-level kit and know the limits on my tires.
This morning I kept it around 85km and that was pushing it. Hello, it's snowing and packing flat on the road, best assume it is icy.
New Year's Eve I was coming back from Edmonton and just past red deer it started snowing pretty good (snow started packing down) and nobody was slowing down, only 2-3 I saw in the ditch as it wa early in the snow. By the time my wife who was 2hrs behind me came by, there was a dozen plus in the ditch (she has real winter tires on).
Jst slow down and drive to the conditions.
WDF

[tirebob]

[QUOTE=threeforthree;3480060]

Originally Posted by tirebob

I just got to work this morning after watching a mildly lifted F250 on Duratracs lose control on the Deerfoot at no more than 100kph on bare bare, cold pavement. QUOTE]

maybe driver error more than a tire issue??

Driver error is absolutely the main factor as it is in almost every single accident, but that does take away from the fact that the tires lost traction in an area most people who buy these types of tires assume they will not lose traction in.

My entire point of this thread is not to argue what is better for each individuals specific needs or circumstances, but more to remind people to drive within the capabilities of whatever tire they are running on.

[wheeler]

Originally Posted by overhere

i myself don't believe in any winter tires or studs i drive to the conditions. I have seen people have too much confidence in winter tires. And we all see what happens.

Dumbest statement I have heard in a long time.........

[Rustynail21]

Not sure if its too late but the SASC has been holding courses on Ghost Lake and for $150 you get 8 hours of driving with an instructor in the car with you. Been out with my Truck and my X5. On the ice its a great chance to figure out the settings, AWD, 4x4, 2wd, traction control, stability control etc. Learned some amazing skills that I've already used and got a good idea what both cars can do.

Also they show you how much better studs do on the ice, its stunning. In both cars I was able to hold my own, unless a studded car drifted past at full tilt kicking everyones butt. I have my jeep with studs on it and with the conditions lately and the handling, all my winter tires will be studded from now on!

If you get a chance get out to the lake (if safe) and test your car to help you truly understand your limits and your car. Real eye opener.

[CaberTosser]

Anyone saying that they just drive for conditions and don't bother with winter tires must never have had the pleasure of driving with good winter tires or they'd not be saying something so ridiculous.

Similar but equal statements:

"I've never previously lost an eye so I don't bother wearing safety goggles when using angle grinders"

"I've not fallen to my death out of an elevated work platform yet so I don't bother wearing a safety harness"

"I've not been hit and killed by a C-Train yet so I wear headphones and stare into my smartphone when crossing LRT tracks"

Good winter tires are basic safety equipment. Of course attentive driving is as well but the sum of the two are even better than either by themselves.

[elkhunter11]

. I have seen people have too much confidence in winter tires. And we all see what happens.

Actually that is a very true statement. I have seen people driving way too fast for the conditions, because they had too much confidence in their tires. I have seen the same issue with people driving 4x4 vehicles. It doesn't matter what tires you have, or how many tires you have driving, you still need to drive to the road conditions.

[sjr]

Originally Posted by bruceba

Yep and those split rims made changing out your tires a piece of cake for the handy kind of guy.

Yes there were . Common sense was very common back then .
Drum brakes all around manual steering , 360 4spd std no air bags , no ABS and no cell phones how in the hell did we ever survive .Lets not forget listening to CFCW too .

[does it ALL outdoors]

Originally Posted by overhere

i myself don't believe in any winter tires or studs

You have obviously never drivin a vehicle that has them. They are superior in every way to all seasons. All seasons are good for no season

[couleefolk]

Originally Posted by tirebob

Studs definitely help! I have a 2wd F150 and use studded Firestone Winterforce myself. Even still I can find myself slipping around if I am not paying attention, but recovery is soooo much easier!

I tried the studded Winterforce tires, and they don't come near the performance I get from the Grabber AT2s studded, I was not impressed at all with the Winterforce. I have been caught off guard while running studs though, got out on a highway to test drive a vehicle, and almost ditched it because I had no idea we had come in on black ice due to my studded tires. I use studs, but you still have to respect them.

[I-Love-Eyes]

Originally Posted by sjr

Jezz wonder how we ever survived driving back in the 70's with the old factory high rise Ford F250 with bias ply 7:50 x16 Goodyear tires

Because bias ply tires got square when it got cold--you couldn't go very fast on those puppies!!

[tirebob]

Originally Posted by couleefolk

I tried the studded Winterforce tires, and they don't come near the performance I get from the Grabber AT2s studded, I was not impressed at all with the Winterforce. I have been caught off guard while running studs though, got out on a highway to test drive a vehicle, and almost ditched it because I had no idea we had come in on black ice due to my studded tires. I use studs, but you still have to respect them.

Is your truck a half ton or heavy duty? As I mentioned earlier, if it was a LRE, it doesn't have the specialty compounding of the P rated, which is what I am using. I like tbem because they dig hard in snow and studded is good on ice. 2wd I like having both those bases covered.

On my 4th set over 2 trucks and they have never let me down.... Knock on wood!

[sjr]

:

Originally Posted by I-Love-Eyes

Because bias ply tires got square when it got cold--you couldn't go very fast on those puppies!!

Hummmm ......... yes 70-75MPH for those that remember those ### were fast enuff .
Hell it only took a few miles and everything rounded up and away we go .

[58thecat]

Zambonis drive hundreds of thousands of miles on pure ice with studded tires with no issues...key to this is drive to the conditions...there is no do all tire etc just the person behind the wheel and the grey matter between thier ears that makes the difference.

[couleefolk]

Originally Posted by tirebob

Is your truck a half ton or heavy duty? As I mentioned earlier, if it was a LRE, it doesn't have the specialty compounding of the P rated, which is what I am using. I like tbem because they dig hard in snow and studded is good on ice. 2wd I like having both those bases covered.

On my 4th set over 2 trucks and they have never let me down.... Knock on wood!

I ran the winterforce on a f150, no payload or towing, and couldn't get 3 winters out of them, they turned hard and wore poorly. Switched to Grabbers on our Tahoe, E range, and still going good after 3 winters. I may have had a bad batch, but not the only set of Firestones that have been bad for me.

[Erik]

Originally Posted by YYC338

Understand the math. Population increase would account for 2.2 times the number of accidents assuming there weren't any advancements in vehicle safety.

I'm guessing were seeing more than 2.2 times the number of accidents even with the advancements I mentioned although I don't have the data to back it up.

What I referenced was a ratio to miles driven which would be irrespective of population increase.

Except you haven't accounted for population and traffic density.

[YYC338]

Originally Posted by Erik

Except you haven't accounted for population and traffic density.

Feel free to enlighten me on how much of an off set that would be to major increases in vehicle safety equipment. Also what's your opinion on driver quality and ability levels over the years?

When I got my drivers license back in the 70's, the term "distracted driver" didn't exist.

[threeforthree]

Originally Posted by YYC338

When I got my drivers license back in the 70's, the term "distracted driver" didn't exist.

it was called Driving Without Due Care and Attention

[Erik]

Originally Posted by YYC338

Feel free to enlighten me on how much of an off set that would be to major increases in vehicle safety equipment. Also what's your opinion on driver quality and ability levels over the years?

When I got my drivers license back in the 70's, the term "distracted driver" didn't exist.

I feel the proportion of stupid people hasn't changed much from one generation to another...If anything it's gone down due to education levels rising. What has increased is the number and density of people and the ability to broadcast stupidity. Not only are you more likely to see stupidity because you simply see more people but also stupidity has this fascinating ability to show up even when you aren't looking for it, largely thanks to the internet, thereby implanting the myth that stupidity is far more prevalent then it actually is.