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  #31  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:34 AM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by silverdoctor View Post
yep... It's what the governments in Canada expect... Defeated as a nation.

Most of us are well aware of the solution, but the elections are around three years away, and as individuals, we can't stop people from re-electing the fools that are in power now.
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  #32  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:37 AM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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What's that Jefferson quote about people putting up with their chains...up to a certain point? Maybe we'll reach that point in the future? The way to change it is to vote. It may be small incremental change in one direction or the other, but I do know that not voting is for sure not going to solve anything.

Will there be a difference between Trudeau and Maxime Bernier (just as an example)? Likely. Significant? Hopefully, but more than likely it will be a small incremental change.
I can tell you one thing, voting doesn't fix squat. You keep on voting my friend, I'll keep on not voting. Like I say, I haven't seen anything in the last 20 years of government giving back.

Guns? you're still waiting for a politician to give you - on a silver platter - the burning of gun laws. Keep on waiting. It's never going to happen. Know why it's not going to happen? Because people won't stand up and do anything about it.

And I'll tell you something else - pretty sure if my GGF stepped out of his grave after fighting on the Somme in WW1 seen the state the country was in now? The lack of freedoms that he fought for?

BF Skinner was right about one things - free will is definitely an illusion.
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  #33  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:40 AM
KinAlberta KinAlberta is offline
 
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"NDP Leader Brian Mason blasted the government's latest campaign as "propaganda" and as wasteful spending of taxpayer dollars. "

source:

PR Blitz to Cost $268,000
PR blitz rolls out as oilsands protest grows
Tories spending $268,000 to silence critics
By Kelly Cryderman And Renata D'Aliesio, Calgary Herald August 4, 2010 http://www.albertasurfacerights.com/articles/?id=383
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  #34  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:40 AM
rugatika rugatika is offline
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I can tell you one thing, voting doesn't fix squat. You keep on voting my friend, I'll keep on not voting. Like I say, I haven't seen anything in the last 20 years of government giving back.

Guns? you're still waiting for a politician to give you - on a silver platter - the burning of gun laws. Keep on waiting. It's never going to happen. Know why it's not going to happen? Because people won't stand up and do anything about it.

And I'll tell you something else - pretty sure if my GGF stepped out of his grave after fighting on the Somme in WW1 seen the state the country was in now? The lack of freedoms that he fought for?

BF Skinner was right about one things - free will is definitely an illusion.
Voting got rid of the gun registry. Just one example of something that happened thanks to people that voted and took the time to talk to their MP's.
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  #35  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:48 AM
dmcbride dmcbride is offline
 
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Originally Posted by KinAlberta View Post
"NDP Leader Brian Mason blasted the government's latest campaign as "propaganda" and as wasteful spending of taxpayer dollars. "

source:

PR Blitz to Cost $268,000
PR blitz rolls out as oilsands protest grows
Tories spending $268,000 to silence critics
By Kelly Cryderman And Renata D'Aliesio, Calgary Herald August 4, 2010 http://www.albertasurfacerights.com/articles/?id=383
LOL. Seems like money well spent considering the economic benefits the oil sands provide. By the way, the NDP are in power now.
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  #36  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:49 AM
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I'm confused.

4.5 millions for hot air to fight gerbil warming???
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  #37  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:50 AM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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Voting got rid of the gun registry. Just one example of something that happened thanks to people that voted and took the time to talk to their MP's.
And what did we get in return? you as a firearms owner got small pittance for everything else that b'tard ran through parliament. But, people hail Harper as a hero - should have used a different term - "heil". Personally, I'd rather have you register your firearms and have the Charter of Rights back (such as it was), but that's been shredded. There are many examples.

Politician signs up here talking about firearms, people jumped on board - did he ever come back? How many people signed up?
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  #38  
Old 12-08-2016, 11:59 AM
rugatika rugatika is offline
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And what did we get in return? you as a firearms owner got small pittance for everything else that b'tard ran through parliament. But, people hail Harper as a hero - should have used a different term - "heil". Personally, I'd rather have you register your firearms and have the Charter of Rights back (such as it was), but that's been shredded. There are many examples.

Politician signs up here talking about firearms, people jumped on board - did he ever come back? How many people signed up?
I just gave an example of one thing that was "fixed". Voting does fix things. We just need more intelligent people voting.
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  #39  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:04 PM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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I just gave an example of one thing that was "fixed". Voting does fix things. We just need more intelligent people voting.
One thing fixed, thousand things broken. Intelligent people did vote - they just got tired of the Harper scare tactics. There were no real choices for Canadians to vote on - Harper, Trudeau or angry Tom.

If you really go through all the laws Harper passed, you'll see that the firearms registry is the least of your concerns when it comes to guns. Enjoy your vote.
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  #40  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:13 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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One thing fixed, thousand things broken. Intelligent people did vote - they just got tired of the Harper scare tactics. There were no real choices for Canadians to vote on - Harper, Trudeau or angry Tom.

If you really go through all the laws Harper passed, you'll see that the firearms registry is the least of your concerns when it comes to guns. Enjoy your vote.
Given the choice of the so called Harper "'scare tactics" , and the Trudeau, "the budget will balance itself" nonsense, voting for Trudeau hardly qualifies as a sign of intelligence.

We are in a major recession, with low oil prices, increased unemployment and continuing terrorist activities, with no end to this in sight so perhaps we have a reason to be a little scared.
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  #41  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:20 PM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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Given the choice of the so called Harper "'scare tactics" , and the Trudeau, "the budget will balance itself" nonsense, voting for Trudeau hardly qualifies as a sign of intelligence.

We are in a major recession, with low oil prices, increased unemployment and continuing terrorist activities, with no end to this in sight so perhaps we have a reason to be a little scared.
Ahh, ok. So neither Trudeau or Notley got the anger vote - only thing that would have made it better would be Mulcair getting a majority. What a joke Canadian politics has become. Harpers arrogance lost him the election - just like Prentice.

It truly saddens me to realize that voting is the only choice we have.
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  #42  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:22 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Ahh, ok. So neither Trudeau or Notley got the anger vote - only thing that would have made it better would be Mulcair getting a majority. What a joke Canadian politics has become. Harpers arrogance lost him the election - just like Prentice.

It truly saddens me to realize that voting is the only choice we have.
So you are telling us that voting out of anger is intelligent voting?

Looking at the results, that doesn't appear to be the case.
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  #43  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:24 PM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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So you are telling us that voting out of anger is intelligent voting?

Looking at the results, that doesn't appear to be the case.
Are you saying voting for Harper just because of his stance on firearms is intelligent?

Canadians don't give a crap anymore Elk. People vote because it's expected. We are done, stick a fork in us.


Free will is definitely an illusion...
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  #44  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:31 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Are you saying voting for Harper just because of his stance on firearms is intelligent?

Canadians don't give a crap anymore Elk. People vote because it's expected. We are done, stick a fork in us.


Free will is definitely an illusion...
I voted Conservative, because to me it was the lesser of the three evils. And it appears that I was correct.
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  #45  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:35 PM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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I voted Conservative, because to me it was the lesser of the three evils. And it appears that I was correct.
And there inlies the problem. you seen what you wanted to see - you take what you think is good and screw everyone else.

Do you think Harper give a crap about what you want? Trudeau? Notley? Any other premier in this country?

I'll start voting when i see something worthy of voting for. I don't do lesser of all evils - and in that sense, I don't care who runs the country cause they are all in it for themselves. One is as bad as the other - the agenda is the same.

Our country is going down the crapper, finger is on the flusher.
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  #46  
Old 12-08-2016, 12:37 PM
rugatika rugatika is offline
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At least I'm complaining and not whining.
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  #47  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:22 PM
Bitumen Bullet Bitumen Bullet is offline
 
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.....I don't do lesser of all evils....
If only more voters would do that we might be able to get a system that would answer to the people.

IMO Democratic ideas are seriously undermined when someone votes "Lesser Evil". It is the "Lesser Evil" vote that gives us governments that manipulate the voting public, that pit region against region, voter against voter, voter against their own interests.

Voting Lesser Evil gives a fig leaf of democracy for governments to hide behind while they act against the interests of the Nation and it's people. It gives Nations leaders that should never get the reigns of power, and never would otherwise.

But it is what our government tells us to do. Our government wants people to vote, even when there is no one running that can or will represent our interests. Just vote, because voting gives the system a legitimacy it does not deserve. As we have seen a system that has us voting Lesser Evil sells out us and our Nation to the highest bidder while hiding behind that fig leaf of democracy.

IMO Lesser Evil is truly Evil when it comes to maintaining a healthy democracy.
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  #48  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:38 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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And there inlies the problem. you seen what you wanted to see - you take what you think is good and screw everyone else.

Do you think Harper give a crap about what you want? Trudeau? Notley? Any other premier in this country?

I'll start voting when i see something worthy of voting for. I don't do lesser of all evils - and in that sense, I don't care who runs the country cause they are all in it for themselves. One is as bad as the other - the agenda is the same.

Our country is going down the crapper, finger is on the flusher.
No all parties are not all as bad as the other. No none of them care what each voter wants, but some are smart enough not to destroy the entire economy through incompetence, which means that everyone loses. Right now , we are seeing what happens when totally incompetent people are put in charge.
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  #49  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:40 PM
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30-06
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  #50  
Old 12-08-2016, 05:59 PM
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Ahh, ok. So neither Trudeau or Notley got the anger vote - only thing that would have made it better would be Mulcair getting a majority. What a joke Canadian politics has become. Harpers arrogance lost him the election - just like Prentice.

It truly saddens me to realize that voting is the only choice we have.
Your head is in the sand if you think Harper's arrogance cost him the last election.You obviously did not follow the hustings much as the leftist media absolutely crucified the Conservatives through the hustings.They kicked up more of a fuss over the $90,000 paid back via Nigel Wright's personal money than over the Lieberals stealiing 250 million from Canadians.It did not matter how small the gaffe was by the Conservatives the media attacked it like a rabid wolf and at the same time Trudeau and the Lieberals got a free pass on everything.

As an after thought...since you dont vote why are you even posting on this thread?Or any thread that has anything to do with politics?If you dont vote you dont get to have an opinion

FTH
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  #51  
Old 12-08-2016, 06:28 PM
Bitumen Bullet Bitumen Bullet is offline
 
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....If you dont vote you dont get to have an opinion...
Exactly what the system wants you do think, it wants you to attack those not supporting it!

A system that does not give you, or at least some people, the option of voting for a Representative or Party that will represent their interests or their country or a desire to do better. A system that even after a 150yrs can't get Canada beyond being a resource dependent economy with a single customer.

It's good that you give the system your vote, your statement that they are giving you fair and reasonable options and representation or are giving you the Canada you want but that isn't the case for all Canadians. Some think we can do better and will not give legitimacy to a system preventing that.
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  #52  
Old 12-08-2016, 06:34 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Exactly what the system wants you do think, it wants you to attack those not supporting it!

A system that does not give you, or at least some people, the option of voting for a Representative or Party that will represent their interests or their country or a desire to do better. A system that even after a 150yrs can't get Canada beyond being a resource dependent economy with a single customer.

It's good that you give the system your vote, your statement that they are giving you fair and reasonable options and representation or are giving you the Canada you want but that isn't the case for all Canadians. Some think we can do better and will not give legitimacy to a system preventing that.
So how would you choosing not to vote help to change the system?
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  #53  
Old 12-08-2016, 06:56 PM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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So how would you choosing not to vote help to change the system?
What if nobody voted?

Albertans complain that the election is won in the east... How are you going to make change?

By waiting for a politician to do it.
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  #54  
Old 12-08-2016, 07:05 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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What if nobody voted?

Albertans complain that the election is won in the east... How are you going to make change?

By waiting for a politician to do it.
Regardless of whether you vote or not, some people will vote.And if it gets to the point where very few people vote, you could see a muslim refugee party formed and voted into power. How would you like living under sharia law?
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  #55  
Old 12-08-2016, 07:11 PM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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Regardless of whether you vote or not, some people will vote.And if it gets to the point where very few people vote, you could see a muslim refugee party formed and voted into power. How would you like living under sharia law?
like i said earlier, give me something worthy of voting for and i'm in. Politics makes me sick - Canadians' complacency even more so. We will never exact change in this country for the better, divided nation.

And if you don't believe that - how divided are gun owners? Hunters? Outdoorsmen in general - and that's just a small part of Canada.

Guess Erin never came back eh? Anyone expect him to?
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  #56  
Old 12-09-2016, 10:49 AM
Bitumen Bullet Bitumen Bullet is offline
 
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How would you like living under sharia law?
Keep voting as we are and we will all know. Maybe we should stop voting for our own execution, of course that wouldn't be patriotic. To me that's idiotic.

Voting is telling everyone you agree with the choices you were presented with. You might have held your nose, but you are telling everyone it is acceptable. Even as each election moves you further from where you think we should be going and closer to sharia law.

Voting, and continuing to vote is giving the system legitimacy it is using against your interests. Not voting removes that legitimacy.

Not voting requires the system, those winning under the current system to dismiss such actions as lazy, consequences should include no representation for those people, not allow any opinion, explanation or input from those obviously ignorant, uneducated, lazy welfare bums.

That will be suggested even when it is obviously in the interest of welfare bums, those getting more from government than they give, those with special status due to race, language, ethnicity or religion to vote and vote often. And I would suggest the results of our elections shows those groups are getting out and voting.

Or most are voting while they hold their nose.

Those people who vote Lesser Evil just so they can say they voted are voting against their own interest. I don't know how many they are but it would be far better for them to check None of the Above or not vote at all.

Our systems cannot work for people when people vote against their own short and long term interest.

Don't like your choices? Don't vote!

Sure it is going to end up with you being ruled by someone not representing your interests, but that is already happening, and you are telling them it is OK when you vote and support the choices they gave you, at least tell them it isn't OK.
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  #57  
Old 12-09-2016, 11:02 AM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is offline
 
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Keep voting as we are and we will all know. Maybe we should stop voting for our own execution, of course that wouldn't be patriotic. To me that's idiotic.

Voting is telling everyone you agree with the choices you were presented with. You might have held your nose, but you are telling everyone it is acceptable. Even as each election moves you further from where you think we should be going and closer to sharia law.

Voting, and continuing to vote is giving the system legitimacy it is using against your interests. Not voting removes that legitimacy.

Not voting requires the system, those winning under the current system to dismiss such actions as lazy, consequences should include no representation for those people, not allow any opinion, explanation or input from those obviously ignorant, uneducated, lazy welfare bums.

That will be suggested even when it is obviously in the interest of welfare bums, those getting more from government than they give, those with special status due to race, language, ethnicity or religion to vote and vote often. And I would suggest the results of our elections shows those groups are getting out and voting.

Or most are voting while they hold their nose.

Those people who vote Lesser Evil just so they can say they voted are voting against their own interest. I don't know how many they are but it would be far better for them to check None of the Above or not vote at all.

Our systems cannot work for people when people vote against their own short and long term interest.

Don't like your choices? Don't vote!

Sure it is going to end up with you being ruled by someone not representing your interests, but that is already happening, and you are telling them it is OK when you vote and support the choices they gave you, at least tell them it isn't OK.
Do you really think that the political parties care how many people vote? As long as Trudeau or Notley win, they could care less if 50% of eligible voters vote, or if 10% of eligible voters vote. By not voting, you are sending the message that you don't care how our country is run, or who is running it. If people don't care, then why would anyone make any changes to the system? Then end result, is that there would never be any change, unless of course, as I posted earlier, the number of voters gets so low that a radical group manages to get elected, and changes our laws to the point where we may lose the right to vote altogether.
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  #58  
Old 12-09-2016, 11:17 AM
silverdoctor silverdoctor is offline
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Do you really think that the political parties care how many people vote? As long as Trudeau or Notley win, they could care less if 50% of eligible voters vote, or if 10% of eligible voters vote. By not voting, you are sending the message that you don't care how our country is run, or who is running it. If people don't care, then why would anyone make any changes to the system? Then end result, is that there would never be any change, unless of course, as I posted earlier, the number of voters gets so low that a radical group manages to get elected, and changes our laws to the point where we may lose the right to vote altogether.
People have lambasted me over the years for not voting.

What does voting solve? Yeah, different party, same crap and people are happy with that. Erin O'toole steps onto the forum, buys some votes - and that's all people see is the stance on firearms. Did the same with Harper - Harper good, he likes guns - but ignore how the man ripped the country apart. The saddest part is, many Canadians are too ignorant to read and research anymore.

I don't care who is running the country or provinces - they are all the same and in it for themselves. That's what it boils down to - my vote will not make a difference - neither will yours, that's the sad reality.

When Canadians decide to get off their collective keisters, make some noise and actually exact change? i'll be long dead if i hold my breath. We basically live in a dictatorship - we do what we are told. We live by someone else's whim. That's our reality.

Freedom and "free will" are illusions.
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