Small claims court and Liens

[Icallwalleyepickerel]

Thought I’d reach out and try to get some input (non legal of course) to the above.

I did some work for a client back in Dec and Jan. The amount owing is not really all that significant (under $900) however I’ve been chasing this guy for 3 months. Each time he tells me some other reason why payment is coming “at the end of the week”. Frankly I’m tired of all these deadbeats who have found ways to screw somebody over, so it’s time to channel my inner “Falling Down” (Michael Douglas) and fight back.

My thoughts are two fold.

The guy is selling his house, so I thought I would investigate the possibility of putting a lien on the house. As I understand it he would have to clear the lien before selling.

I want to also fill out all the necessary paperwork for Alberta Small Claims Court and make him explain to a judge why he is a deadbeat. My thinking is that I would make a claim against the monies owing and all additional costs for the filing and the lien.

I have never done the above, but I can tell you that it would feel good.

Has anyone gone down the route of filing a lien against a property? Can I even do that? Also, any advice of SCCourt? Seems easy enough to file the paperwork, albeit at a cost.

Would appreciate any advice I could get.

Thanks

[CranePete]

Where’s Ken when we need him…

[Cement Bench]

U as a contractor should know the limitation period for a lien

if you don’t know Y R U in business ?

and probably you cannot just go back on site to renew the period within which to file a lien

sue the bugger in small claims NOW is it still 100 bucks to file this small amount

was the contract in their names personally

cannot advise to file a bad lien but if he is selling mmmmmmmmm

U need to take better care of your business affairs buddy

later off to the city

[Grizzly Adams1]

sue the bugger in small claims NOW is it still 100 bucks to file this small amount

And a court date would be months down the road, by that time he's probably sold and might be gone. After you get a judgement. it's up to you to collect.

[Twisted Canuck]

Your window for a lien is closed.

[-JR-]

na

[makin tracks]

why bother wasting your time, going to court will still cost you money, just have your accountant right it off, it's a tax deduction, you get full $value! no court bs, no application fees no time lost.

[Dewey Cox]

Right off?
Right on!

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by makin tracks

why bother wasting your time, going to court will still cost you money, just have your accountant right it off, it's a tax deduction, you get full $value! no court bs, no application fees no time lost.

If you're a small business , not an option. Every penny counts.

[Cement Bench]

NOT ADVICE
A FRIEND DID THIS AND IT WORKED FOR HIM
DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME


friend said the agreement was to pay upon closing of the real estate sale and it was for flooring
attended at the guys house and they argued, the friend asked to see the flooring and had some crazy glue with him
said one board was up and out a drop of crazy glue on it
didn’t get a cheque but another promise to oay

filed lien for 3 g
sure in small claims niw called click court or something else
money was held in trust but not sent on as the lawyer said the time for the lien had passed

judge heard all the evidence and said

lien might be invalid
claim is good 100%

and since the money is still in trust it is to be paid from trust

guy could have been sanctioned by the court for falsely trying to get a new time frame for a lien that was definitely out of time

BUT

it was a quite old judge who didn’t put up with bs and knew the homeowner who was moving to another province was just shafting trades so he granted a judgement and made the money from trust cover the claim plus interest and costs

again DONT Try this AT HOME

but I would

[makin tracks]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams1

If you're a small business , not an option. Every penny counts.

it's your time your money, good luck collecting. full right off, gets you money you will be paying to government

sounds like he is past 45days, if he is, can try lawyer, wonder how much that will cost

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by makin tracks

it's your time your money, good luck collecting. full right off, gets you money you will be paying to government

sounds like he is past 45days, if he is, can try lawyer, wonder how much that will cost

He missed the boat on a lien, his Bad, Small Claims court is a do it yourself thing, no lawyer required.

[makin tracks]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams1

He missed the boat on a lien, his Bad, Small Claims court is a do it yourself thing, no lawyer required.

he should hire you to get his small claim going, the guy who owes the money sounds like he has been around the block more than once!
it may cost 2 days wages arbitration, court. I think it is $75 to file? appears to be looking for revenge, ok! still you have to collect if you win, plaintiff is going to come up with some excuse to not pay! u might get awarded 900 or 400, you get $400 you lose $500 , tax write off gets you the full $900 you don't lose 2 days work or the filing fee. you can be dumb or you can win! up to you.

[CanuckShooter]

Originally Posted by Dewey Cox

Right off?
Right on!

It's 'Write off' my man.

Right on!

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by makin tracks

he should hire you to get his small claim going, the guy who owes the money sounds like he has been around the block more than once!
it may cost 2 days wages arbitration, court. I think it is $75 to file? appears to be looking for revenge, ok! still you have to collect if you win, plaintiff is going to come up with some excuse to not pay! u might get awarded 900 or 400, you get $400 you lose $500 , tax write off gets you the full $900 you don't lose 2 days work or the filing fee. you can be dumb or you can win! up to you.

Hey, Most of my working life was spent as a small building contractor, if you don't follow through, you develop a reputation as a push over.

[KGB]

Here is the most reliable way to get your money back and a revenge: hire a couple of Italians who love baseball… or a couple of Russians or Ukrainians who also love baseball…. Ask them to stop at his house on their way to the game and politely explain him that he is deadly wrong in this matter and they are here to collect the debt and an apology or satisfaction….

[Cement Bench]

Originally Posted by KGB

Here is the most reliable way to get your money back and a revenge: hire a couple of Italians who love baseball… or a couple of Russians or Ukrainians who also love baseball…. Ask them to stop at his house on their way to the game and politely explain him that he is deadly wrong in this matter and they are here to collect the debt and an apology or satisfaction….

OR

see post 10

[Who Da Fisherman]

New lien act is 60 days and 90 days if concrete related.
WDF

[Dewey Cox]

Originally Posted by CanuckShooter

It's 'Write off' my man.

Right on!

Wright on!

[Okotok]

Originally Posted by Who Da Fisherman

New lien act is 60 days and 90 days if concrete related.
WDF

Important dates to remember:
1. The lien MUST be filed at Land Titles within the following calendar (not business) days:
a. 45 days for a regular lien, OR
b. 90 days for an oil and gas lien
*From the date the work was completed, or the last materials supplied.
2. Your lien is only valid for 180 calendar days from the date it is registered on the land title.
3. If you want your lien to last longer, you must file a statement of claim at the Court of King’s Bench and obtain a Certificate
of Lis Pendens (CLP) from the clerk of the court and file it at Land Titles.
If you do not file a CLP before the 180 days, your lien will expire and CANNOT be filed on the land title
again.

[NCC]

Originally Posted by makin tracks

why bother wasting your time, going to court will still cost you money, just have your accountant right it off, it's a tax deduction, you get full $value! no court bs, no application fees no time lost.

In my simple mind, a small business pays about 30% tax, so if he writes off the $900 he'll get about $300 back in tax and leave $600 on the table.

The thought off getting ripped off would bother me a lot more than the $600. I'd pay a lawyer $900 to get my $900 from the guy just on principle, or sell the debt to a collection agency. The more often these deadbeats get away with these antics, the worse it is for everyone else.

[Drewski Canuck]

I have had friends ask that I draft contracts for them for use on home renovations contracts for their businesses.

First, Interest must be set out before and after Judgement, monthly with the annual rate to reflect the annual compound rate.

Second, the title to goods do not pass until paid for, and the failure to pay permits removal of the goods supplied and any consequential damages occasioned by the removal are the responsibility of the home owner.

Third, any collections steps are charged at Solicitor - Client costs both before and after Judgement, and shall have interest added on the Contract rate until payment.

Fourth, the contract debt can be filed as a Caveat to Title for the amount owing and is a charge against the land.

The deadbeat will say they will think about it.

There is no risk of cost of collection being more than the contract value.

For those who go ahead with the work and are then slow on paying, the reminder that collections will only make the bill grow is usually enough motivation to pay.

But for some reason, I don't get to that point of having to use the threat of my legal fees to collect being added to my legal fees for the work I have done.

$900 buys alot of gas and bait to go fishing. The time is more enjoyable over doing deck work as well.

Drewski

[Who Da Fisherman]

Originally Posted by Okotok

Important dates to remember:
1. The lien MUST be filed at Land Titles within the following calendar (not business) days:
a. 45 days for a regular lien, OR
b. 90 days for an oil and gas lien
*From the date the work was completed, or the last materials supplied.
2. Your lien is only valid for 180 calendar days from the date it is registered on the land title.
3. If you want your lien to last longer, you must file a statement of claim at the Court of King’s Bench and obtain a Certificate
of Lis Pendens (CLP) from the clerk of the court and file it at Land Titles.
If you do not file a CLP before the 180 days, your lien will expire and CANNOT be filed on the land title
again.

Here is a link you should read, few rule changes.

https://www.alberta.ca/prompt-paymen...ction-industry

WDF

[Okotok]

Originally Posted by Who Da Fisherman

Here is a link you should read, few rule changes.

https://www.alberta.ca/prompt-paymen...ction-industry

WDF

Thanks. Prompt payment is new but the lien periods are the same as what I posted. Verified by the information video in your link.

[EZM]

I wish I had a dollar for every time someone says "write off" and has no clue what that actually means and what it actually gets you ...... It's like a magical golden check for the $900 shows up in the mailbox????

Reminds me of when Michael Scott declared bankruptcy .....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-m3RtoguAQ



right off ..... right on !!!

[Dewey Cox]

[Who Da Fisherman]

Originally Posted by Okotok

Thanks. Prompt payment is new but the lien periods are the same as what I posted. Verified by the information video in your link.

Typical government, that video is 3yrs old.
For contracts entered into after August 29, 2022, construction liens must be registered within 60 days of the contract’s completion, increasing from 45 days under the Builders’ Lien Act.
WDF

[rasbok]

This guy sounds like a real beauty.. Sounds like you have had to put plenty of liens on property and end up in court a lot. Maybe you need to look after your business a little better.

The guy asked a quick question how about a polite answer..

Originally Posted by Cement Bench

U as a contractor should know the limitation period for a lien

if you don’t know Y R U in business ?

and probably you cannot just go back on site to renew the period within which to file a lien

sue the bugger in small claims NOW is it still 100 bucks to file this small amount

was the contract in their names personally

cannot advise to file a bad lien but if he is selling mmmmmmmmm

U need to take better care of your business affairs buddy

later off to the city

[Icallwalleyepickerel]

Originally Posted by rasbok

This guy sounds like a real beauty.. Sounds like you have had to put plenty of liens on property and end up in court a lot. Maybe you need to look after your business a little better.

The guy asked a quick question how about a polite answer..

Appreciate the kind words. Personally I take it like water off a duck’s back. I always consider the source. The internet for some reason always brings out the worst in people.

As for the original post, a little update. I have read everyone’s opinion and have decided to go the Small Claims route. I’ve told the dead beat as much, but need to first give him a solid deadline in writing to settle the dispute. Once the date has come and gone (I have no doubt that it will come and go), I will file with the Court of Queen’s Bench.

Honestly I have a feeling that this will drag on for quite some time yet. I have little faith in the “legal” system.

I will try and update as I go.

[Cement Bench]

it is now king’s bench based on the passing of the queen

and I would not file in kings court but in provincial court civil division if it is still available

and I would lien his property saying he agreed to let me file the lien and pay out of the proceeds, but that is just me