Bear defence

triguy · #1 03-16-2018, 11:45 AM

Spring is coming? This is an interesting article. In this fine country it seems like we are not allowed this line of defence.

https://www.ammoland.com/2018/...ents-by-caliber/amp/

walking buffalo · #2 03-16-2018, 12:00 PM

But doesn't this debunk the claims about bear spray being the most effective bear defence?

This info must not be disseminated....

roughneckin · #3 03-16-2018, 06:35 PM

Linky no worky

bergman · #4 03-16-2018, 07:18 PM

Ii just searched the website for the word "bear". Link came up here:
https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/def...ts-by-caliber/

It is enough for me to support a wilderness carry in Canada, that's for sure. And yes, I carry bear spray. But if I can carry bear spray and lead spray, too, all the better.

Question about #6 British Columbia: A Grizzly Bear, a .44 magnum, and a brush with death June 2010
...How on earth did "Leon Lorenz" get a permit to carry a .44 magnum as a photographer/videographer???? In the Robson valley of BC??

Doesn't compute.

Dubious · #5 03-16-2018, 07:18 PM

Everyone is so bear scared these days uncle Steve rinella had some interesting thoughts.

“We have hundreds of thousands of black bears in the U.S.,” says Rinella. “Every year, statistically, less than one person gets killed by a black bear. Yet people live in fear of these creatures, and that is distracting from the things that can really be problematic.”

Rinella has spent much of his life in the backcountry in bear territory. But the closest calls for both himself and those around him have been from hypothermia, while traveling in remote Alaska. “The problem with hypothermia is that you lose your ability to troubleshoot,” he says. “You’re already in a bad spot because you have hypothermia, then it strips you of your ability to deal with it. There’s this downward spiral.”

Point? Worry less about traveling with bear pepper spray and more about having the proper equipment for weather and plenty of water.

58thecat · #6 03-17-2018, 08:59 AM

How about just be prepared....completely prepared when heading out into the back country.

Jimvinny · #7 03-17-2018, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dubious

Everyone is so bear scared these days uncle Steve rinella had some interesting thoughts.

“We have hundreds of thousands of black bears in the U.S.,” says Rinella. “Every year, statistically, less than one person gets killed by a black bear. Yet people live in fear of these creatures, and that is distracting from the things that can really be problematic.”

Rinella has spent much of his life in the backcountry in bear territory. But the closest calls for both himself and those around him have been from hypothermia, while traveling in remote Alaska. “The problem with hypothermia is that you lose your ability to troubleshoot,” he says. “You’re already in a bad spot because you have hypothermia, then it strips you of your ability to deal with it. There’s this downward spiral.”

Point? Worry less about traveling with bear pepper spray and more about having the proper equipment for weather and plenty of water.

Steve has changed his tune after a recent incident where their group had a grizzly tear through them. No one got more than bumps and bruises, but he's not quite as complacent as he once was. If you want to listen to the podcast, it's a two part deal, episodes 86 and 87. 87 has a detailed description of the incident.

coyoteman · #8 03-17-2018, 12:46 PM

Of course an attack by a black bear is rare, but who wants to be next on the list--Bear spray is small light easy to carry--also good for-dogs-yotes-lynx- mountain lion--bad boy humans.
I had one close incounter in AB with a black bear, always carry.
During a spray test, I took a good shot in the face--If you have any doubts about how effective it is, spray into the wind'

Grizzly Adams · #9 03-17-2018, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dubious

Everyone is so bear scared these days uncle Steve rinella had some interesting thoughts.

“We have hundreds of thousands of black bears in the U.S.,” says Rinella. “Every year, statistically, less than one person gets killed by a black bear. Yet people live in fear of these creatures, and that is distracting from the things that can really be problematic.”

Rinella has spent much of his life in the backcountry in bear territory. But the closest calls for both himself and those around him have been from hypothermia, while traveling in remote Alaska. “The problem with hypothermia is that you lose your ability to troubleshoot,” he says. “You’re already in a bad spot because you have hypothermia, then it strips you of your ability to deal with it. There’s this downward spiral.”

Point? Worry less about traveling with bear pepper spray and more about having the proper equipment for weather and plenty of water.

Yeah, read the article and my theory is that it's much more important to be bear smart, avoidance of a difficult situation is better than having to deal with one. Hypothermia is more likely to kill you.

Grizz

Luckybrand · #10 03-17-2018, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bergman

Ii just searched the website for the word "bear". Link came up here:

https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/def...ts-by-caliber/

It is enough for me to support a wilderness carry in Canada, that's for sure. And yes, I carry bear spray. But if I can carry bear spray and lead spray, too, all the better.

Question about #6 British Columbia: A Grizzly Bear, a .44 magnum, and a brush with death June 2010

...How on earth did "Leon Lorenz" get a permit to carry a .44 magnum as a photographer/videographer???? In the Robson valley of BC??

Doesn't compute.

He’s had that permit for a very very long time, I’m from there and it is possible for people who regularly work in the bush to get said permit. A number of people whom I’ve worked with timber cruising also had the permits. Me I choose old defender over pistol, a little bulkier but I’m still much more confident in it then any pistol, my brother in laws s&w 500 included. You can also check out the close call of Leon’s on YouTube https://youtu.be/MCP0Xhx6sfw

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Delavan · #11 03-17-2018, 04:53 PM

Check this out!

https://ruger.com/products/superRedh...an/models.html

Those are nice! Sad that they are prohibs in Canada. I remember reading that short is best when using a firearms against bears. Long guns are getting in the way when the bear charges. If bear is almost on you, a handgun is better.

also, hard cast bullets is what you should use.

Got that from an article...

Dubious · #12 03-17-2018, 06:13 PM

I think the point of that quote is not to be unprepared for bear attacks but to be prepared for everything and not just fixated on bears or cougars ext. bear spray only works if it’s on your hip if it’s in your pack or not where you can get it right away you might aswell not have it. I haven’t bear sprayed anything other than my self by accident but I have used bear bangers on black bears with mixed results.

Scruffee · #13 03-17-2018, 07:19 PM

Black bear encounters are extremely rare for the average Canadian.

The average Canadian also doesn't walk to a bear bait in spring then climb up a tree 30yds away from said bear bait with a bow... I cary a compact shotgun with me when baiting/hunting bear. I'd rather be burdened by a 7lb piece of metal that I hump around and hope never to use, and return home safely after every hunt.

But it'd be even nicer if I were allowed to take a pistol instead...

.257Weatherby · #14 03-17-2018, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bergman

Ii just searched the website for the word "bear". Link came up here:
https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/def...ts-by-caliber/

It is enough for me to support a wilderness carry in Canada, that's for sure. And yes, I carry bear spray. But if I can carry bear spray and lead spray, too, all the better.

Question about #6 British Columbia: A Grizzly Bear, a .44 magnum, and a brush with death June 2010
...How on earth did "Leon Lorenz" get a permit to carry a .44 magnum as a photographer/videographer???? In the Robson valley of BC??

Doesn't compute.

It was probably just his artistic/journalistic writing abilities that he fabricated for the story.
SSS if your worried about bears or stay home.
Rob
Rob

fordtruckin · #15 03-17-2018, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delavan

Check this out!

https://ruger.com/products/superRedh...an/models.html

Those are nice! Sad that they are prohibs in Canada. I remember reading that short is best when using a firearms against bears. Long guns are getting in the way when the bear charges. If bear is almost on you, a handgun is better.

also, hard cast bullets is what you should use.

Got that from an article...

If I was going to buy a hand cannon for bear defense I wouldn't get it with any less than a 4" barrel and call it good in a .44mag. The extra 1.5" of barrel over that Ruger Alaskan would not get in the way. If it did, the bear is probably already on you and your chances have already gone way down... Give me the slightly higher velocity and sight radius. On a side note, I WOULD buy a Ruger though. I'm not a big fan of any S&W products and don't believe others such as Taurus are quite up to snuff.

Smokinyotes · #16 03-17-2018, 11:00 PM

I don’t think you can shoot +P loads in a S&W can you? I wouldn’t want to be a bear facing a 300 gr +P load.

DRE75 · #17 03-18-2018, 08:41 AM

After a grizzly encounter 2 springs ago, I've always thought it would be nice to be able to have my TT-33 Tokarev with me. That hot little 7.62x25mm round would be good for a close encounter if it went sideways, methinks.

58thecat · #18 03-18-2018, 10:02 AM

Read more: https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/def...#ixzz5A7IFasql
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution
Follow us: @Ammoland on Twitter | Ammoland on Facebook

But the second grizzly, also a boar, didn’t veer away, the hunters reported. When it got within 10 feet of one of the men the entire party opened fire, letting loose nine rounds from two .44 magnum revolvers and the .45-70 rifle.

Only two of the shots connected,

Funny as this reminded me of a story when I was hunting moose in Hudson Bay Area Saskatchewan....heard a barrage of shooting, then three guys run out on this trail, huffing and puffing...said a black bear attacked them and they shot the heck out of it....my buddy and I went in to have a looksie with these well armed gents....no bear....no blood....lots of ground disturbance....they swear they dropped it not but a few paces from them....there was a foul poop odour in the air though.

fordtruckin · #19 03-18-2018, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 58thecat

Read more: https://www.ammoland.com/2018/02/def...#ixzz5A7IFasql
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution
Follow us: @Ammoland on Twitter | Ammoland on Facebook

But the second grizzly, also a boar, didn’t veer away, the hunters reported. When it got within 10 feet of one of the men the entire party opened fire, letting loose nine rounds from two .44 magnum revolvers and the .45-70 rifle.

Only two of the shots connected,

Funny as this reminded me of a story when I was hunting moose in Hudson Bay Area Saskatchewan....heard a barrage of shooting, then three guys run out on this trail, huffing and puffing...said a black bear attacked them and they shot the heck out of it....my buddy and I went in to have a looksie with these well armed gents....no bear....no blood....lots of ground disturbance....they swear they dropped it not but a few paces from them....there was a foul poop odour in the air though.

Hehe whose poop bear or hunters...

coyoteman · #20 03-18-2018, 10:29 AM

Over the years as a hunting guide I was called on to track a wounded bear, most of the time, the blood trail ran out,or i found it. On a few occasions however the bear waited,of course now extremely dangerous. Not a time for bear spray, a pump action 12ga short barrel, with iron sites.and slugs, the weapon of choice, steady nerves, and make the 1st shot count, stopped them in there tracks, remember one time fireing three shots when the bear was dead on the 1st one.

Big Grey Wolf · #21 03-18-2018, 10:43 AM

Coyoteman is right, in extreme bear(especially grizz) wounded situation the short 12 gauge pump loaded with slugs only reliable medicine. Grizz will wait to ambush you in heavy bush so not easy to protect your skin.

roughneckin · #22 03-18-2018, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coyoteman

Over the years as a hunting guide I was called on to track a wounded bear, most of the time, the blood trail ran out,or i found it. On a few occasions however the bear waited,of course now extremely dangerous. Not a time for bear spray, a pump action 12ga short barrel, with iron sites.and slugs, the weapon of choice, steady nerves, and make the 1st shot count, stopped them in there tracks, remember one time fireing three shots when the bear was dead on the 1st one.

If you are already attempting to kill a bear that makes sense, but for purely defensive purposes on an not wounded bear I have seen bear spray be highly effective

coyoteman · #23 03-18-2018, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roughneckin

If you are already attempting to kill a bear that makes sense, but for purely defensive purposes on an not wounded bear I have seen bear spray be highly effective

Absolutely correct, I worked for Brewster, 12 seasons in Jasper park, Of course no guns, on in country hikeing trips, in groups, everyone carried bear spray, very careful with food and garbage--stayed together--stayed alert---I never had occasion to use bear spray, one gentleman on the thread said dont carry it in the back pack---very good advice--a carry pouch on the belt for quick draw makes sense.

walking buffalo · #24 03-18-2018, 01:06 PM

I think some are missing the point of the article.

It's not about which gun.

The conclusion is that despite years of anti-gun rhetoric that guns are not a good bear defence tool, the truth is otherwise.

Handguns are VERY good at ending bear attacks with a positive outcome for the human.

58thecat · #25 03-18-2018, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roughneckin

If you are already attempting to kill a bear that makes sense, but for purely defensive purposes on an not wounded bear I have seen bear spray be highly effective

Only if it really doesn't want you, if it did it would blow through the cloud like a lighten bolt...you would be a spicy meat product.

The spray works on a bear that is not really sure about eating or killing you.

A sow will if she thinks your a threat to her cubs like I said above just keep on coming unless you anchor her with a weapon.

titegroup · #26 03-18-2018, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by triguy

Spring is coming? This is an interesting article. In this fine country it seems like we are not allowed this line of defence.

https://www.ammoland.com/2018/...ents-by-caliber/amp/

Yup. In this country only select politicians & the PM. can have the right to armed protection. Not even off duty LEO'S can carry. So the best bear defence is to send your wonderful PM. & his unarmed bodyguards in ahead of your outdoor excursion, which would give you time to escape an attack . Maybe-- just maybe--- but I doubt it , after they messed their shorts, would they have a change of thought about allowing wilderness carry protection for us law abiding gun owners. But I don't think so.____ the conservatives?--- maybe.

roughneckin · #27 03-18-2018, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 58thecat

Only if it really doesn't want you, if it did it would blow through the cloud like a lighten bolt...you would be a spicy meat product.

The spray works on a bear that is not really sure about eating or killing you.

A sow will if she thinks your a threat to her cubs like I said above just keep on coming unless you anchor her with a weapon.

Spray is highly effective when it comes to almost every type of bear and the studies prove it and my experience using it backs it, but as stated above the best defence is being bear aware. People get hurt more when they use a gun rather than not due to being injured and/or ****ed off. I’ve had to use it twice, once with a sow with cubs and once with a boar. Both times they backed off quick and left. Not sure if I had waited that they might have backed down but wasn’t waiting to find out. In 4 summers working every day in BCs backcountry I ran into many bears and not one of them seemed to want to eat me. I would’ve hated it if I killed the sow though knowing now that she left with her cubs and no injuries sustained by me.
A handgun would be nice as a backup though if one did get mauled. Nice and close but could push more injuries onto you if the bear is only wanting to put you down and then leave but now it’s ****ed off and going to kill you.

https://above.nasa.gov/safety/docume...vs_bullets.pdf

ctd · #28 03-18-2018, 02:12 PM

How many Conservation Officers carry bear spray?
How many carry bear spray when dealing with bears?

titegroup · #29 03-18-2018, 02:29 PM

Goodales title should read " public & personal" safety minister, too much focus on the general public ( usually reg; -major cities) nothing reg: personal safety for individuals in riskier activities, where 4 legged predators roam. Its all in the wording, this should be amended into the firearms act pertaining to lawful specific activities, in remote areas.

Slicktricker · #30 03-18-2018, 02:55 PM

As much as I'd love to be able to carry a handgun while bow hunting just to look cool it'll never happen though. No matter how whinning you do it'll never come with current gun laws.