.223, good practice caliber?

[Salvelinus]

Just wondering if people think that small bore centerfire rifles are really good practice for the bigger calibers. I shoot a .270, but it is way too expensive to shoot 500-1000 rounds through it a year. .223 surplus ammo with a similar flight trajectory to the .270 can be had for about 1/4 the price. So really, at 75c a round saved, it will only take about a year of shooting for a nice rifle to pay for itself. And no, I do not reload or plan to get into it.

Of course, the recoil, noise and other factors such as wind deflection will not be the same between the 2 cartridges, but it still seems like it is a good way to go for practicing for the bigbore when the hunting shot counts.

Anyone seen a CZ 527 lux behind a gun counter recently?

[Dick284]

Now here's a guy grasping the big picture.
Although there is no replacement for the actual caliber if recoil is the issue. But you certainly cant go wrong with a easy on the shoulder and easy on the wallet caliber. I would'nt even look past a good rimfire rifle, the 17HMR is really getting legs for just the application you mentioned.
As for the CZ check out P&D's website
www.p-d-ent.com

good luck

[Salvelinus]

I don't know if the rimfires are great for practice simply because you are not physically shooting as far. Sub-200 yd shots with the .270 are easy, at least at a deer (vitals) sized target. It's those 200-400 yd shots that I need to build confidence for because as it stands now, I simply do not feel right pulling the trigger on an animal that far away.

I bought a 223 last year for practice and for varmints if i get time. I chose it due to the cheap readily available ammunition and comparable trajectory to big game rifles. I shoot a lot more as its a fun caliber, is easy on the shoulder, and easy on the pocketbook. I have a model 200 Stevens with a browning 4-12 scope, what a great gun and a fun caliber.

[220swifty]

just remember, any shooting is good shooting. This rings truer the more your rifles match. i currently have a 243 and 338 in the ruger all weather, and plan to add a 22 mag to the mix in the future. Familiarity breeds proficiency, regardless of caliber, you still know the gun.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Salvelinus

I don't know if the rimfires are great for practice simply because you are not physically shooting as far. Sub-200 yd shots with the .270 are easy, at least at a deer (vitals) sized target. It's those 200-400 yd shots that I need to build confidence for because as it stands now, I simply do not feel right pulling the trigger on an animal that far away.

There is something that many shooters do not realize about 22 rimfires, and that is the amount of barrel time is incredible compared to
a modern centerfire generally about three times at least!!
Practicing with a .22 can greatly improve a shooter's accuracy, simply because they have to be completely aware of their form.
I practice often at 200 with a .22 match rifle.
the distance is very comparable to shooting at 1K with my center fire match rifles.

Put a small target up at 100 yards , check your Automatic alignment, breathing, aiming, breathing, trigger squeeze , trigger follow through , relax, and watch your groups improve!
Cat

[Salvelinus]

forgive my ignorance... what is barrel time?

[sullijr]

Originally Posted by Salvelinus

I don't know if the rimfires are great for practice simply because you are not physically shooting as far. Sub-200 yd shots with the .270 are easy, at least at a deer (vitals) sized target. It's those 200-400 yd shots that I need to build confidence for because as it stands now, I simply do not feel right pulling the trigger on an animal that far away.

Glad to hear that, see you at the Ponoka Rifle Rodeo Sept long weekend

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Salvelinus

forgive my ignorance... what is barrel time?

Barrel time is the amount of time the bullet is in the barrel from ingition to exiting the muzzle.
For instance, for arguments sake,a 270 130 grainer will leave a 26" barrel aproximatley 3,000FPS
A .22LR match bullet will leave a 27" barrel at about 1,040,FPS, or there abouts, depending on the ammunition and rifles used.
But you get the picture - the longer the bullet is in the barrel, the more time you have for your nerves to move it around, and believe me when I tell you, your nerves are a LOT faster than a bullet!
Cat

[Salvelinus]

I see, so as a general rule, slower cartridges are inherently more difficult to shoot.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Salvelinus

I see, so as a general rule, slower cartridges are inherently more difficult to shoot.

In that regard, yes.
Your nerves can twitch a bunch before a bullet gets out of a barrel, and the slower the bullet is, well, yoou get the picture!
This is why smallbore shooters go nutz about form.
The average guy doesn't realize it, but the same thing applies to center fire cartridges as well, hence form practice or dry firing.
However, unless you concentrate on PROPER form, it doesn't matter how much practicing you do.
Cat

[Brady]

Good tips there catnthehat. I have one of those 3 piece metal spinners, and I like to set it up around the 100 yard mark, and try to smoke the little one with the .22. Feels good when she spins.

[Alberta Bigbore]

this was a real good post, very informative!!

[JohninAB]

I have always believed that shooting my 22 as much as possible in the off months was good practice. The days spent in the field plinking gophers back home had to help I thought and it is good to see it being confirmed here.

[Big Buff]

I

also like to shoot my .22 to get some practice. Every time when I have a big hunt coming on where I have to take the .458 out of storage, I spend some time with my .22 Musgrave beforehand. It is much cheaper, helps to get the eye in, especially on the open sights, and definitely a lot easier on shoulder.

[Roughneck12]

I thought .223 ammo was going to be cheap, and bought one of the new Ruger target minis'. Love the rifle but ammo is hard to find and expensive when you do find it. I'll stick to my .17. Keep the Ruger but shoot the Savage.

Originally Posted by jrs

I bought a 223 last year for practice and for varmints if i get time. I chose it due to the cheap readily available ammunition and comparable trajectory to big game rifles. I shoot a lot more as its a fun caliber, is easy on the shoulder, and easy on the pocketbook. I have a model 200 Stevens with a browning 4-12 scope, what a great gun and a fun caliber.

[twofifty]

Regular practice with a smallbore HP and quality RF rifle is time very very well spent. Having similar trigger pulls - with reasonable weights - and stock configurations is helpful. Imo, part of good shooting involves developing ingrained motor and propio-sensory habits - this is what practice does.

Practice can be fun if you put some imagination into it: mix it up with different targets, distances, time to make the shot(s), positions, calibers.
I have teamed up with another motivated hunter, and we practice weekly with our 22s and our smallbore HPs. The 22RF practice (and SB silhouette competitions) have really tightened our HP offhand and position shooting, increasing confidence when taking a 'difficult' shot.

For example, I like to hit 2 litre cardboard orange juice jugs (4" wide & 10" tall; the kind with a screw-on cap, filled with water) that we set at 200 and 235 yards. When we started on the jugs, they were set at 100yds. We shoot these offhand, or with a post rest that mimicks a tree. Over time, the 200yd jugs go kafloosh on an increasingly regular basis - the 235yd ones are really tough esp. offhand.

[aulrich]

My shooting skill markly improved when I started shooting a resetting flipper target with my 22. I stand firm that every rifleman should have at least one rimfire.

Though I have not tried them yet I got these target that are scaled to simulate shooting things at really long range like a goat at 475 yards but you shoot them with a 22 at 25 yards.

[Salvelinus]

topic back from the dead!

I did indeed pick up a .223 shortly after I posted this and have put several hundred rounds down the barrel.

Couldn't have asked for better practice. I actually got the identical rifle to my big bore and adjusted the triggers for the same pull. Indeed, when I switch to the big bore I have noticed a big improvement.

Very happy with this choice, although the fundamentals of shooting can be had at the rimfire range, shooting the .223 is very similar to the .270. Still centerfire noise, some muzzle jump, same shooting distance, nearly the same trajectory as the big bore, same damn rifle (even the same action in the tikkas). Shooting it has really eased the learning curve.

The big diasdvantage? My damn spotting scope can't see .223 bullet holes at 400 yds!

[twofifty]

Salvenius, nice to see that practicing with the .223 is useful to you.

Are the scope magnifications/crosshairs similar as well? I find that switching from 10x on the CF to 18x on the 22LR takes some adjusting.

[Salvelinus]

Optics are not identical, but I found it's been pretty easy switching between them. Any of the offhand shooting I practice though I bump them both down to 6X anyways.

[twofifty]

Choosing the right power level seems counter-intuitive.

I used to think it is easier to shoot at lower power levels (my only scoped HP rifle has a 10x), so my experience was limited.

Then I started shooting SB .22LR silhouette at 40, 60, 77 and 100 meters, using a 24x scope, and doing poorly of course. Couldn't keep the dang thing still. The very same day, I shot a similar SB rifle, but with a 6-18x, and kept it on 18x. This I could barely manage as what was familiar to me was the HP 10x. After thousands of 22LR rounds, shot at 18x, I am ready for a 20x or 24x. Shooting the .22LR at lower power levels is a real disadvantage to me. Come to think of it, I wish my HP rifle had a 6-18x scope as well; the 10x it has now seems a handicap, esp. if I don't train on it every week.

Why is this?

I think a shooter can get accustomed to the higher power levels. After awhile, you realize that the higher power lets you notice much sooner that the reticle has drifted from the target's centre. So you correct sooner. And you learn to fine tune your muscle control so as not to overcorrect. The reward is that your reticle ends up spending more time on the target, where you want it. A higher power scope helps to build a steadier hold!

Now if I could only figure out to release the shot when the reticle is on target, rather than waiting for a better sight picture. Doh. ;-)

Here's a funny about my first ever PD hunt, and the down side of high magnification. I was using my .22LR, and couldn't find a damn thing (and when I did, it was usually to see it killed before my very eyes by my more experienced buddies). WTF. Then a bud asked me if I still had the durn thing on 18x.... Doh again.