Lead Free Ammo

[DirtyBert]

Anyone out there use lead free ammo for big game hunting?
What are your thoughts.
I would be looking at using it in my .300WM.
Thank you,

[DiabeticKripple]

Lots of guys are running monometals.

Nosler E-Tip
Federal Trophy Copper
Barnes TSX and TTSX
Hornady GMX

I’ve have good success with the GMX in factory loads, but I switched to the TTSX with my handloads and haven’t shot an animal with them yet.

[elkhunter11]

I have used Barnes TTSX/TSX for several years. As long as the impact velocity is adequate , they perform very well. Using light for caliber bullets helps to keep the impact velocity adequate.

[obsessed1]

Have used lead free in both a 308 , 300 wm, and 30-30. In 308 I have shot Barnes 130gr,150gr,and 180gr. Also 168gr etip. Had issues with the 130gr on a WT not opening I think.mv was 3100 fps. Deer was shot at 35-40: yds
The 168 etip is my current hunting load for one of my 308s and has killed a few elk 1 moose and a few deer.
30-30 load was gmx and Barnes. Went back to cup and cores cause there was no real performance increase

300 wm 180 Barnes and etip. Have shot a few elk moose and deer and had no issues

[SHORTMAG]

My cousins hubby, a veteran hunter of 70 years switched over to factory TTSX's in his 30-06 3 yrs ago...he lost his second deer in 3 years this past week...had a good broad side standing shot @ 60 yds, the deer hunched and almost went down, regained his feet and slipped back into heavy cover, never offering a second shot...and no blood trail what so ever. They spent the rest of that day(6 hrs) and all the next day looking for it...nada !
He's going back to the Winchester PSP's again.

I tried last year reloading a box of TTSX's for my Tikka 6.5X55. Used the 120's...couldn't get a decent group to save my soul. Tried different powders...OAL's, Lots more than I would normally do to get a good load for a hunting.
My TTSX 6.5 loads was just over 2 inches at best and chrono'd slower by 170 +fps and more !
Went back to my pet load 120 Nos BT's with RL19. Sub MOA..and when I did MY stuff ...one ragged hole at 100 yds , and another dead 120 lb doe 2 weeks ago !

I'm still not convinced 100% with them. I have some E-Tips, and have been putting off reloading them...just because of the over pressures with normal loads...*** everything must be reduced to starting loads and you must watch for pressure signs*** with the new monolithic / solid copper bullets.
Slower velocities means even less expansion with em, especially in the lesser calibers.
I'm not totally done with them, just putting them on the back burner till were voluntold we HAVE to use non-lead !

That's my humble opinion anywho.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by SHORTMAG

My cousins hubby, a veteran hunter of 70 years switched over to factory TTSX's in his 30-06 3 yrs ago...he lost his second deer in 3 years this past week...had a good broad side standing shot @ 60 yds, the deer hunched and almost went down, regained his feet and slipped back into heavy cover, never offering a second shot...and no blood trail what so ever. They spent the rest of that day(6 hrs) and all the next day looking for it...nada !
He's going back to the Winchester PSP's again.

I tried last year reloading a box of TTSX's for my Tikka 6.5X55. Used the 120's...couldn't get a decent group to save my soul. Tried different powders...OAL's, Lots more than I would normally do to get a good load for a hunting.
My TTSX 6.5 loads was just over 2 inches at best and chrono'd slower by 170 +fps and more !
Went back to my pet load 120 Nos BT's with RL19. Sub MOA..and when I did MY stuff ...one ragged hole at 100 yds , and another dead 120 lb doe 2 weeks ago !

I'm still not convinced 100% with them. I have some E-Tips, and have been putting off reloading them...just because of the over pressures with normal loads...*** everything must be reduced to starting loads and you must watch for pressure signs*** with the new monolithic / solid copper bullets.
Slower velocities means even less expansion with em, especially in the lesser calibers.
I'm not totally done with them, just putting them on the back burner till were voluntold we HAVE to use non-lead !

That's my humble opinion anywho.

I have had no issues matching the velocity of my cup and core bullets with the TTSX/TSX, Accuracy wise, moa was easy, and my 7mmstw rifles are averaging around 1/2 moa with the TTSX. My 300RUM rifles did as well with the TSX..

[Thunder Elk Hunter]

Federal trophy copper have worked for me very well. Got 1 out of a Kudu in SA and one out of shoulder / neck shot moose. The Kudu was shot thru both shoulders and the bullet was just under the hide on the far side. The others have passed right thru with quick recovery. Would use them at reasonable range out of my 300 wsm on any Alberta game.

[6.5 shooter]

I tried them on several rifle/load combo...never seem to be able to get them to shoot as accurately as cup and core bullets..But then not everyone needs, or wants minute of flea accuracy out of their big game rifles...

[Bleat]

I've used the Trophy Copper in 165 grain at the range and was getting phenomenal accuracy through a stock 30-06 Vanguard. I wasn't even aware I'd be able to achieve that with factory ammo to be honest. Have never used solids while hunting for some of the same reasons posted here regarding expansion. I've had fantastic results (with both accuracy and performance) using plain-Jane Interlocks. Have witnessed the same with SST's. Although not as accurate as the TC, it's been great nevertheless. I don't feel I'd use anything else unless I was maybe in open country somewhere or going after thicker skinned game. Bang-flops on thin skinned game has been very common with the Hornadys......at least so far. Any cup\core would do the same, I'm sure. Mine just so happens to prefer the Interlocks. And they're cheap to boot. I would love to try the TC hunting one day, though. I admit that I'm very curious to see how they'd perform in the field.

[Andrzej]

Originally Posted by DirtyBert

Anyone out there use lead free ammo for big game hunting?
What are your thoughts.
I would be looking at using it in my .300WM.
Thank you,

I am using Barnes TTSX 180 gr in my 300 Win Mag. They are accurate bullets.
I have 100 y 5 shot group .626

[buckchaser]

I've been impressed with the performance of Federal Trophy Copper 150 grain 308 on the my 2017 whitetail buck (30 meters) and 2018 whitetail buck (135 meters). Will definitely continue using them.

[lastlatvian]

I shoot Barnes in 150 grain out of my 30-06. I switched three years ago. I can put 3 of them touching at 200 yards with a old winchester model 670 (cheap old gun). They have good accuracy and killing power imo. This year I shot a white tail buck at 136 yards, dropped on the spot, exit hole was the size of a apple. Last year shot a doe at 286 yards, took 2 steps. The year before my first year with them I took a mule deer buck at 70 yards and he took about two bounces before dropping.

I have had great experience with them and really like the accuracy, pretty close to the hand loaded boat-tales I shot before -- for a hunting rifle.

[leo]

I switched to Barnes bullets in all my magnum rifles. Accuracy is as good as any other hunting bullet. In my experience, they seem to shoot most accurate at near, or slightly over max published velocities. If you use them ensure your Bullet is at least .030 or more off the lands, and watch for pressure signs.

[HuntinGuy]

I shot my whitetail with a 150g Etip this year from my 280 Rem. Muzzle velocity 2600 FPS impact velocity 2090 FPS at 285 yards.
Double lung/heart shot, half of one lung was gone, the other had a 3” hole, also took out a couple arteries on top the heart. Deer ran 130 yards.

Solids do not have the explosive effect lead bullets do, but they are reliable and don’t destroy as much meat, also don’t pepper your meat with lead!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[kayaker]

Used TSX and TTSX in 6.5x55, .308 Win and .300H&H. Used Lapua Naturalis in 9.3x62. No complaints.

Have a good accurate load with 55gr MPG in .223. Will test them on fur this winter. The V-Max works very well but I don't like leaving lead for scavengers in coyote carcasses where we control them on a sheep farm.

Friends are using TTSX in .260 Rem, .270 Win and .30-06 with good results.

Like someone else said I really battled to get them to shoot well in my 6.5x55. The 130gr TSX shot best, the 120gr TTSX was acceptable, 120gr GMX was terrible despite playing with multiple load variables. A friend uses the 100gr TTSX in a .260Rem and that will be my next experiment. He almost got full penetration with it on a quartering shot on cow elk this year.

[Bleat]

Thanks for providing the examples HuntinGuy. Those results really do speak for themselves. The Federal shoots so well out of my rifle that I'll definitely have to give them a shot the next time I'm out.

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by HuntinGuy

Double lung/heart shot, half of one lung was gone, the other had a 3” hole, also took out a couple arteries on top the heart. Deer ran 130 yards.

i've had quicker kills with a bow!!!

if it was big bush country the coyotes probably would have found that one first

[JTRED]

I started using Federal Trophy Copper 100gr last year in my 25-06rem. Killed a decent buck this past weekend. Approximately 130m+/- deer went 60-70m after the bullet passed through ribs-lungs-took off the top of the heart-lungs-ribs-off side knee joint. Accurate and if on game performance remains the same, effective.

[Battle Rat]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

i've had quicker kills with a bow!!!

if it was big bush country the coyotes probably would have found that one first

And I have seen arrowed deer lost.
A deer that drops is from a disruption of the CNS, arrow or bullet.

[338Bluff]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

I have used Barnes TTSX/TSX for several years. As long as the impact velocity is adequate , they perform very well. Using light for caliber bullets helps to keep the impact velocity adequate.

What weight worked best with 7mm rem mag? Recall you mentioning it earlier.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by 338Bluff

What weight worked best with 7mm rem mag? Recall you mentioning it earlier.

I typically use the 140gr TTSX in the 280AI, 7mmremmag, and the 7mmstw, but the 150gr shoots better in my current 7mmstw. I generally get 3200fps to 3250fps using the 140gr in the 7mmremmag.

[Battle Rat]

I use Barnes Triple shock 7mm, not because they are lead free but because they are work good at STW velocities.
I'm contemplating trying them in 308/30-06 when my current supply of projectiles runs out.

[catnthehat]

I have done s bunch of shooting with the only Barnes I could for my 303,150 grain TSX’s .
They Shot fairly well but not as well as some, and I shot a deer at just under 125 yards with one and it went straight down .
I saw really no more or less damage with it than any of my other bullets .
Cat

[Long Ranger]

As leo said back a couple of posts, seat the Barne's bullets about .030" or more off of the lands. I used Barnes XLCs 100gr. in my .257AI, Barnes XLCs 130gr. in my .270Win, Barnes TSXs 210gr. in my 338L, and Barnes X 400gr. in my 416 Rigby (built by Leaper of Guncraft days). For the last 12 to 14 deer taken with the 257 Barnes 100 grainers, all were taken with a single shot, dropped them in their tracks, no escapes. I love the Barnes bullets, but seating depth was critical for accuracy for all the calibers I have worked with. The 257AI went from a 3.5" to 4.0" shooter to a .5" shooter just working with seating depth and no other changes to the load.

[gunluvr]

My only complaint about monometal bullets is the extra length. Been shooting 165 gr. Speer BTSP out of my 30-06 with 57 gr. of IMR4350 which is pretty much max load and they shoot very well @ 2870 MV. Had a box of 165 gr. TTSX so decided to try them with same powder charge. Barnes' manual says max load is 57.4 gr. and I was actually able to seat them to same COAL as the Speers and still over max COAL as suggested in the Barnes manual. The TTXSs cronied @ 2900 MV. and showed some pressure sign at the range. (flattened primers), but not too bad, or so I thought.
Got a surprise though when I shot my cow moose with the TTSX a couple weeks ago. The bolt was difficult to open, and though the empty case ejected, there was something wrong with the bolt. I didn't have time to worry about it as my moose was in death throws. Later, when I examined the brass, there was an obvious mark on the headstamp from the ejector pin and the spent primer was inside the magazine. The primer is much smaller than the primer pocket and falls right out of it. The firing pin mark is deeply cratered. I think the primer was at first welded to the bolt face, or the firing pin, and later fell off. Hence the funny thing going on with the bolt. The extra length of the TTSXs must be compressing the powder charge.
I'm going to have to pull the bullets from the rounds I have left and reduce the powder charges, if I can find one that shoots as well.
As for the cow, she fell dead pretty much on the spot. I thought it was interesting that I saw the bullet splash in the snow behind her as it passed through. It went between ribs, destroyed heart and lungs, and exited other side between ribs. Small entrance and exit wounds.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by gunluvr

My only complaint about monometal bullets is the extra length. Been shooting 165 gr. Speer BTSP out of my 30-06 with 57 gr. of IMR4350 which is pretty much max load and they shoot very well @ 2870 MV. Had a box of 165 gr. TTSX so decided to try them with same powder charge. Barnes' manual says max load is 57.4 gr. and I was actually able to seat them to same COAL as the Speers and still over max COAL as suggested in the Barnes manual. The TTXSs cronied @ 2900 MV. and showed some pressure sign at the range. (flattened primers), but not too bad, or so I thought.
Got a surprise though when I shot my cow moose with the TTSX a couple weeks ago. The bolt was difficult to open, and though the empty case ejected, there was something wrong with the bolt. I didn't have time to worry about it as my moose was in death throws. Later, when I examined the brass, there was an obvious mark on the headstamp from the ejector pin and the spent primer was inside the magazine. The primer is much smaller than the primer pocket and falls right out of it. The firing pin mark is deeply cratered. I think the primer was at first welded to the bolt face, or the firing pin, and later fell off. Hence the funny thing going on with the bolt. The extra length of the TTSXs must be compressing the powder charge.
I'm going to have to pull the bullets from the rounds I have left and reduce the powder charges, if I can find one that shoots as well.
As for the cow, she fell dead pretty much on the spot. I thought it was interesting that I saw the bullet splash in the snow behind her as it passed through. It went between ribs, destroyed heart and lungs, and exited other side between ribs. Small entrance and exit wounds.

How far are you seating the TTSX off of the lands?

[gunluvr]

I just re-checked the max COAL in my Vanguard 30-06 using a Hornady COAL guage. With the TTXSs max COAL is 3.363. With the Speers it is 3.350. Both bullets are seated @ 3.330.

[gunluvr]

I also measured with a Sinclair comparator. Max COAL to ogive is 2.635 (TTSX)
Loaded rounds to ogive measures 2.602.
So roughly .030 off the lands?

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by gunluvr

I just re-checked the max COAL in my Vanguard 30-06 using a Hornady COAL guage. With the TTXSs max COAL is 3.363. With the Speers it is 3.350. Both bullets are seated @ 3.330.

I would try seating the TTSX .050" off of the lands, back off the powder charge a couple of grains, and see how they shoot. The closer you seat a monometal bullet to the lands, the more sensitive they are to pressure. And if you see any sign of pressure , back off the powder charge, as " a little hot" often turns out to he "way too hot", which is where you are now.
The max load in my Barnes manual, is a full two grains too hot or my rifle, so don't assume that all loads listed in the Barnes manual are safe in your rifle.

[gunluvr]

Thanks. Good advice.
I only have 20 or so TTSXs left so I'll probably just keep using the Speers. They shoot just fine, and kill just fine too.