Edmonton safe injection site location

[Spooner]

If you're overweight, you're no different than a heroine addict, and a FAR bigger drain on the tax payer.

You might not stick it in your arm, but you definitely stick it in your maw.

Take responsibility for yourself.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by 1899b

Grandfather died of a heart attack. My father had stints put in because of heart attacks. Heart disease runs in my family. Last check up I am fine. Heart disease is absolutely preventable. You don't just just shrug your shoulders and say it's hereditary and be done with it. You friggen do something about it!

Drug abuse is bad, being an obese unhealthy person is bad too but way more socially acceptable. SAD...

^^^^^ agree^^^^Sometimes one inherits jeans that predispose him/her to certain medical conditions. The condition is not always automatic and is not always your fate no matter what, The condition usually requires some other factor such as lack of exercise and a diet that causes the condition to manifest.

One problem may be that many are eating what appears to be a normal American Canadian diet and maybe even a diet recommended by the government or the medical profession. Many of the foods that we think of as common and even healthy are often not the fuels that our bodies are meant to thrive on.

[Albertadiver]

Originally Posted by Spooner

If you're overweight, you're no different than a heroine addict

Wow. That's quite the correlation.

[Spooner]

Originally Posted by Albertadiver

Wow. That's quite the correlation.

Is it?

If someone eats themselves into type 2 diabetes, should we regard it as anything other than an addiction and mental health issue?

Why are other substances stigmatized and this much more common and expensive problem isn't?

Safe injection sites should be accessible.
Needles and drugs should be free for addicts.

Turning addicts into criminals ensures they won't be treated and the cycle will continue.

Keep in mind that a huge proportion of opioid addicts get their first taste from the medical/pharma industry. Thanks Doc.

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Spooner

If you're overweight, you're no different than a heroine addict,

It's hard to believe how judgmental people can be. Next time you go to a grocery store, imagine a weigh scale in your mind. Now put all the fresh whole foods on one side of the scale - and all the processed and junk foods on the other side. Doesn't quite balance out does it? We are a society of convenience, and we are being lied to and tricked by food producers. Yes, there's always personal choice, but as BF Skinner proved - free will is an illusion.

People say once an addict, always an addict. Alcoholics can stop drinking, drug users can stop drugs. You can't quit eating, it's a necessity for life and is likely the hardest of addictions to break.

[Spooner]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

It's hard to believe how judgmental people can be. Next time you go to a grocery store, imagine a weigh scale in your mind. Now put all the fresh whole foods on one side of the scale - and all the processed and junk foods on the other side. Doesn't quite balance out does it? We are a society of convenience, and we are being lied to and tricked by food producers. Yes, there's always personal choice, but as BF Skinner proved - free will is an illusion.

People say once an addict, always an addict. Alcoholics can stop drinking, drug users can stop drugs. You can't quit eating, it's a necessity for life and is likely the hardest of addictions to break.

Do you mean that food addicts are more addicted than opioid addicts?

[covey ridge]

..

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Spooner

Do you mean that food addicts are more addicted than opioid addicts?

No. I'm not.

People get addicted because something feels good. I've never used hard drugs, so all I can use is what others tell me. A good friend was hooked on coke - and the way he put it? That first high is the best, you keep taking it trying to achieve that first high but you'll never get there. Meth will basically destroy dopamine production, feels good when a user starts - but eventually they get to the point where they keep taking it just to feel normal.

People get the dopamine kick off foods as well. People can be addicted to soft drinks. People can be addicted to a whole variety of foods. I'm saying you can't quit food cold turkey, there is no methadone for food addiction.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by Spooner

If you're overweight, you're no different than a heroine addict, and a FAR bigger drain on the tax payer.

You might not stick it in your arm, but you definitely stick it in your maw.

Take responsibility for yourself.

[QUOTE=Spooner;3647193]If you're overweight, you're no different than a heroine addict, and a FAR bigger drain on the tax payer.

You might not stick it in your arm, but you definitely stick it in your maw.



^^^^^
There is an epidemic in the modern world that is killing more and costing more than the health plans can afford. Overweight and obesity are a symptom of the problem but not the cause. Other symptoms are high blood pressure, cardiovascular disease, type 2 diabetes and a whole bunch other symptoms. The cause of this epidemic is a diet that causes an excessive insulin response to the food we choose to eat. The foods we choose cost our healthcare way more than heroin ever will.

[Spooner]

[QUOTE=covey ridge;3647219]

Originally Posted by Spooner

If you're overweight, you're no different than a heroine addict, and a FAR bigger drain on the tax payer.

You might not stick it in your arm, but you definitely stick it in your maw.



^^^^^
There is an epidemic in the modern world that is killing more and costing more than the health plans can afford. Overweight and obesity are a symptom of the problem but not the cause. Other symptoms are high blood pressure, cardiovascular disease, type 2 diabetes and a whole bunch other symptoms. The cause of this epidemic is a diet that causes an excessive insulin response to the food we choose to eat. The foods we choose cost our healthcare way more than heroin ever will.

It sure does!

Drug addicts deserve treatment.

Safe injection sites and treatment options.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

People say once an addict, always an addict. Alcoholics can stop drinking, drug users can stop drugs. You can't quit eating, it's a necessity for life and is likely the hardest of addictions to break.

Right, you can not quit eating, but you can quit eating addictive foods. Most processed foods are manufactured to be addictive.

Potato chips! I bet you can't eat just one

Most of us have programed ourselves to crave a hit of easily digested carbs or sugar on a regular basis or we will crash.

One slice of whole wheat toast will cause your blood glucose level to rise as much as a tablespoon of pure table sugar. Insulin will check the immediate danger of too much sugar in the blood but will cause a crash that demands even more sugar to prevent a crash. Insulin pulls sugar from the blood and deposits it under the skin as blubber and saves it for a time of famine. Trouble is we are eating for famine but never have a famine. Insulin can be a miracle hormone if triggered sparingly but if triggered three time a day will quit working or cause other problems. Body fat can not be burned if one is constantly feeding on sugar.

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Right, you can not quit eating, but you can quit eating addictive foods. Most processed foods are manufactured to be addictive.

Potato chips! I bet you can't eat just one

Most of us have programed ourselves to crave a hit of easily digested carbs or sugar on a regular basis or we will crash.

One slice of whole wheat toast will cause your blood glucose level to rise as much as a tablespoon of pure table sugar. Insulin will check the immediate danger of too much sugar in the blood but will cause a crash that demands even more sugar to prevent a crash. Insulin pulls sugar from the blood and deposits it under the skin as blubber and saves it for a time of famine. Trouble is we are eating for famine but never have a famine. Insulin can be a miracle hormone if triggered sparingly but if triggered three time a day will quit working or cause other problems. Body fat can not be burned if one is constantly feeding on sugar.

And I fully agree. I'm not what you call a food junkie. 5'10", 160 pounds, definitely not overweight. But I'm a carb addict, and now know it - and have been all my life and I realized it a few years ago. It's a side effect of growing up no so well to do.

We had our meal, fill up on bread. Go hunting or fishing, take sandwiches. I tried to give up bread and many of the carbs a few years ago and go all whole foods for a couple of weeks, couldn't do it. Cravings? Wow, didn't know what a craving was til I got to that point.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

And I fully agree. I'm not what you call a food junkie. 5'10", 160 pounds, definitely not overweight. But I'm a carb addict, and now know it - and have been all my life and I realized it a few years ago. It's a side effect of growing up no so well to do.

We had our meal, fill up on bread. Go hunting or fishing, take sandwiches. I tried to give up bread and many of the carbs a few years ago and go all whole foods for a couple of weeks, couldn't do it. Cravings? Wow, didn't know what a craving was til I got to that point.

I have had little trouble ditching bread and cake and I do not think I have had more than 3 slices of bread in the last year. One thing I am having trouble cutting out is fruit which is loaded with sugar and causes carb cravings. Fruit in nature was only eaten seasonally and lots of it causes a layer of fat that helped get through winter or famine. Very few of us experience famine and the freshest of fruit can be had every day of the year and is often over consumed several times a day.

I have found that eating significant amounts of fat curb my carb addiction and I actually loose quite a bit of belly fat, but just a few poor choices can get me back into cravings. My problem is that my wife is a vegetarian and does consume a lot of carbs and she is a good baker and when she makes a plate of goodies for the office, I often can not resist sampling.

BTW a slice of bread will raise glucose level higher than a snicker bar

I am not advocating snickers bars.

[Redfrog]

So what would it take to get rid of recreational drug use. Or at least relegate back to what it was in the 50's.
I never heard the term 'street drugs', recreational drugs, none of the chemical drugs, meth crack etc.
Musicians were known to use Marijuana and maybe the odd one would use heroin, but I never saw it in daily life or on the tube or anywhere else. Today you can't walk down the street in a city and not see it used openly.

So at one time there was a world without safe sites and open drug dealing on the street. How do we get back to that? And don't say big pharma is too blame. I doubt big pharma wants the competition of street drugs.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by Spooner

If you're overweight, you're no different than a heroine addict, and a FAR bigger drain on the tax payer.

You might not stick it in your arm, but you definitely stick it in your maw.

Take responsibility for yourself.

You live on fantasy island pal.

I know bigger heavy people that are far healthier than skinny little rails.

I am by no means underweight, far from it but I have not had to go to a Dr in decades. (knock on wood)

I wonder what you say about cancer victims. All their fault too??

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

I have had little trouble ditching bread and cake and I do not think I have had more than 3 slices of bread in the last year.

BTW a slice of bread will raise glucose level higher than a snicker bar

I am not advocating snickers bars.

Oh that sucks so bad to read. I live on bread and have very little junk food or pop. I am down to about 5% of what I used to eat for junk food, now I guess I should cut bread too.

Thanks for the info though

[1899b]

Originally Posted by Albertadiver

Wow. That's quite the correlation.

Overeating beyond what you need to sustain your everyday activity is acceptable. Snorting a line or jamming a needle into oneself is absolutely forbidden. Both are unhealthy...

[1899b]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

I have had little trouble ditching bread and cake and I do not think I have had more than 3 slices of bread in the last year. One thing I am having trouble cutting out is fruit which is loaded with sugar and causes carb cravings. Fruit in nature was only eaten seasonally and lots of it causes a layer of fat that helped get through winter or famine. Very few of us experience famine and the freshest of fruit can be had every day of the year and is often over consumed several times a day.

I have found that eating significant amounts of fat curb my carb addiction and I actually loose quite a bit of belly fat, but just a few poor choices can get me back into cravings. My problem is that my wife is a vegetarian and does consume a lot of carbs and she is a good baker and when she makes a plate of goodies for the office, I often can not resist sampling.

BTW a slice of bread will raise glucose level higher than a snicker bar

I am not advocating snickers bars.

Totally agree. Its sad that the majority dont know or undertsand this or have no clue about what foods generate an insulin spike or response. and what puts your body into fat storeage mode. but thats another thread and has nothing to do with safe injection sites. Holy derail batman

[Spooner]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

So what would it take to get rid of recreational drug use. Or at least relegate back to what it was in the 50's.
I never heard the term 'street drugs', recreational drugs, none of the chemical drugs, meth crack etc.
Musicians were known to use Marijuana and maybe the odd one would use heroin, but I never saw it in daily life or on the tube or anywhere else. Today you can't walk down the street in a city and not see it used openly.

So at one time there was a world without safe sites and open drug dealing on the street. How do we get back to that? And don't say big pharma is too blame. I doubt big pharma wants the competition of street drugs.

Where did you live in the 1950's?

To answer your question: A time machine.

[Spooner]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

So what would it take to get rid of recreational drug use. Or at least relegate back to what it was in the 50's.
I never heard the term 'street drugs', recreational drugs, none of the chemical drugs, meth crack etc.
Musicians were known to use Marijuana and maybe the odd one would use heroin, but I never saw it in daily life or on the tube or anywhere else. Today you can't walk down the street in a city and not see it used openly.

So at one time there was a world without safe sites and open drug dealing on the street. How do we get back to that? And don't say big pharma is too blame. I doubt big pharma wants the competition of street drugs.

It's cognitive dissonance.

In the 50's it wasn't unusual for a man to get drunk and beat his wife. Bet you heard of that.

Things haven't changed that much. There's just more of us.

[FXSB]

I have no problems with safe injection sites. There should be some thought given about location. How about that big entry way at city hall or possibly somewhere in the legislative building?

[Redfrog]

Originally Posted by Spooner

It's cognitive dissonance.

In the 50's it wasn't unusual for a man to get drunk and beat his wife. Bet you heard of that.

Things haven't changed that much. There's just more of us.

I don't know where you grew up or where you live now. but it was not common for a man to beat his wife. I'm talking the 1950's not the 1750's.

"There's just more of us" Wife beaters?

Did you ever see one free drunk drop in center. Have you ever seen one?

Were you around in the 1950's ? If you were did you know even one addict?

Are you saying that the world is a better place because of the commonplace use of drugs and all that is associated with it?
Were there not enough issues with alcohol?

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

So what would it take to get rid of recreational drug use. Or at least relegate back to what it was in the 50's.
I never heard the term 'street drugs', recreational drugs, none of the chemical drugs, meth crack etc.
Musicians were known to use Marijuana and maybe the odd one would use heroin, but I never saw it in daily life or on the tube or anywhere else. Today you can't walk down the street in a city and not see it used openly.

So at one time there was a world without safe sites and open drug dealing on the street. How do we get back to that? And don't say big pharma is too blame. I doubt big pharma wants the competition of street drugs.

I can't go back to the 50's, but even in the 80's, drugs weren't that prevalent back in Newfoundland. The weed was pretty weak, oil was cut to death. i'd heard of a bit of heroin and cocaine but not very often - or people never really spoke of it. I'm sure there were more drugs floating around than we knew.

Historically, doctors have been the legal drug dealers. Go back to the civil war, how many injured troops got addicted to opium due to doctors treating pain and injury? All the way through history, same thing. many meds were opiate based, cough syrups, any kind of pain killers.

Many of the hard drugs we know today were created and used by militaries worldwide.

Today, doctors are still legal drug dealers. If you have an hour and want to understand a little better, watch the documentary "The oxycontin express" on youtube. Doctors and pain clinics in Florida - where there were no prescription drug monitoring plans - were legally dealing drugs. This is only one small aspect of it. How is it possible that pain clinics could get away with ordering so much oxy and others from big pharma? The stuff must have come in by the truckloads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGZEvXNqzkM

[guywiththemule]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

I don't know where you grew up or where you live now. but it was not common for a man to beat his wife. I'm talking the 1950's not the 1750's.

"There's just more of us" Wife beaters?

Did you ever see one free drunk drop in center. Have you ever seen one?

Were you around in the 1950's ? If you were did you know even one addict?

Are you saying that the world is a better place because of the commonplace use of drugs and all that is associated with it?
Were there not enough issues with alcohol?

Excellent questions R F .

[Spooner]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

I don't know where you grew up or where you live now. but it was not common for a man to beat his wife. I'm talking the 1950's not the 1750's.

"There's just more of us" Wife beaters?

Did you ever see one free drunk drop in center. Have you ever seen one?

Were you around in the 1950's ? If you were did you know even one addict?

Are you saying that the world is a better place because of the commonplace use of drugs and all that is associated with it?
Were there not enough issues with alcohol?

The point is, addiction and substance abuse are not new at all. Common in the 50's as it is today. Maybe not in your experience, but it was common.

Drop in centers for alcoholics and other substance abusers are in every city. Come on.

We do a very poor job of dealing with substance abuse, but are improving.

Safe injection sites are a no brainer. They open sites where they are needed, the alternative is driving the issue underground.

Most people know someone that has struggled with alcoholism. Many people know someone that is dead because of it.

Addicts need treatment. They don't need to be criminalized. It's counter productive.

[Iron Brew]

Yes, i know it’s from the hated CBC.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...rugs-1.4351816

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Spooner

The point is, addiction and substance abuse are not new at all. Common in the 50's as it is today. Maybe not in your experience, but it was common.

Drop in centers for alcoholics and other substance abusers are in every city. Come on.

We do a very poor job of dealing with substance abuse, but are improving.

Safe injection sites are a no brainer. They open sites where they are needed, the alternative is driving the issue underground.

Most people know someone that has struggled with alcoholism. Many people know someone that is dead because of it.

Addicts need treatment. They don't need to be criminalized. It's counter productive.

Yep.

Vancouver has sent medical response to some 30.000 drug overdoses in the last year and a half. While many will say it's the addicts fault - think of the costs of this? That's ambulance, fire, police - all working the front lines. They have to go to a hospital for treatment, can't just leave them on the road. They had to put a mobile unit in downtown Vancouver to handle some of the load. How many addicts end up in jail - and what's the related cost to house them? Never mind the social costs... This is a crisis that's spreading across Canada. Safe injection sites are saving millions of dollars.

Medicinal weed? BC is handing out medicinal heroin.

Canada is freaked out cause Trudeau wants to legalize weed? BC is calling to decriminalize hard drugs. Imagine trying to sell that to Joe Canada, but it seems to have worked in Portugal.

This war on drugs has been ongoing for 40 years now? Trillions of dollars thrown at the issue, and it's getting worse. What's the answer? Don't know.

[Spooner]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

Yep.

Vancouver has sent medical response to some 30.000 drug overdoses in the last year and a half. While many will say it's the addicts fault - think of the costs of this? That's ambulance, fire, police - all working the front lines. They have to go to a hospital for treatment, can't just leave them on the road. They had to put a mobile unit in downtown Vancouver to handle some of the load. How many addicts end up in jail - and what's the related cost to house them? Never mind the social costs... This is a crisis that's spreading across Canada. Safe injection sites are saving millions of dollars.

Medicinal weed? BC is handing out medicinal heroin.

Canada is freaked out cause Trudeau wants to legalize weed? BC is calling to decriminalize hard drugs. Imagine trying to sell that to Joe Canada, but it seems to have worked in Portugal.

This war on drugs has been ongoing for 40 years now? Trillions of dollars thrown at the issue, and it's getting worse. What's the answer? Don't know.

Hard rugs should be free to addicts and other street drugs should be legal.

[Redfrog]

Originally Posted by Spooner

The point is, addiction and substance abuse are not new at all. Common in the 50's as it is today. Maybe not in your experience, but it was common.

Drop in centers for alcoholics and other substance abusers are in every city. Come on.

We do a very poor job of dealing with substance abuse, but are improving.

Safe injection sites are a no brainer. They open sites where they are needed, the alternative is driving the issue underground.

Most people know someone that has struggled with alcoholism. Many people know someone that is dead because of it.

Addicts need treatment. They don't need to be criminalized. It's counter productive.

So did you lose your train of thought or just don't want to answer my questions?

Your second statement is pure fiction. Drugs and substance abuse were not common in the fifties.

[Albertacoyotecaller]

Hey I have lots of extra dollars to throw at taxes for stuff like this. It's not like I spend about $14k every year on my diabetic daughter. My daughter that wants to live!

**** me, what a waste of ****ing resources.