GMO corn planting destroys Bees

[Red Bullets]

Another reason we don't need GMO foods. Could be our undoing.

http://livingtraditionally.com/37-mi...mo-corn-field/

[FCLightning]

Except that GMO has absolutely nothing to do with the problem with the bees.

Read your article, not just the headline fabricated by some group with an agenda which it is not above lying for it. Neonictonoids are being implicated as the problem - a pesticide made by Bayer science. Not really a problem till the widespread use of air seeding technology is making the seed coating airborne.

[Red Bullets]

Thanks for correcting me. I did read the article but maybe worded my post wrong.

[expmler]

Alberta is Canada's biggest honey producer, about 32 million pounds. Ontario produces 6 million pounds.

Alberta's bees main crop is neonicotinoid treated canola.

http://tdaynard.com/2014/05/01/what-...enty-actually/

[Hunter Trav]

Interesting article, really adds to the discussion of this issue and actually makes alot of sense. Thanks for posting it...

[avb3]

We have to be careful when we read headline with the letters GMO in them. GMO plants in themselves are not dangerous anyone, the problem becomes when they broadcast themselves, and the potential impact on natural habitats. We don't know what kind of cross hybridization may occur, and that is the greater danger.

What is also become obvious, is that the use of GMO crops has resulted in both weed and insect pests developing resistance to this phrase used to knock down them. This is a much greater danger then the plant itself.

Thanks for posting a good article but be careful those headlines. We all get caught by that trap every once awhile.

[Grizzly Adams]

Once the corn started to get planted our bees died by the millions,

The crops were sprayed with so-called “neonics”

Not quite the same thing, is it? GMO or neonics ? Think I'll take this story with a grain of salt.

Grizz

[lmtada]

No Corn where my hives are. 100% alfalfa fields. Canola nearby. Long winters have been the hardest on my hives. However this year, warm winter 90% survival rate. Requeened. Good to go.

[greylynx]

Originally Posted by lmtada

No Corn where my hives are. 100% alfalfa fields. Canola nearby. Long winters have been the hardest on my hives. However this year, warm winter 90% survival rate. Requeened. Good to go.

That is good to know.

[FCLightning]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams

Once the corn started to get planted our bees died by the millions,

The crops were sprayed with so-called “neonics”

Not quite the same thing, is it? GMO or neonics ? Think I'll take this story with a grain of salt.

Grizz

The other thing with that story is that the "problem" was 3 years or something ago and they are grabbing on to it now to make a headline.

[Peter Abelard]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams

Once the corn started to get planted our bees died by the millions,

The crops were sprayed with so-called “neonics”

Not quite the same thing, is it? GMO or neonics ?

Or was it the corn?

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Peter Abelard

Or was it the corn?

Not sure what Bees would be doing in a corn field. Corn is wind pollinated.
There is nothing in a corn field that a bee would want.

[silverdoctor]

Has anyone ever talked to a bee keeper or just following articles?

Had a long conversation with a bee keeper a few weeks ago, the main issue seems to be a fungus and bee keepers are finding wild and wonderful ways to combat the problem with much success. He's even fumigating hives with ammonia I believe, his hives have grated bottoms.

[connexion123]

Originally Posted by avb3

We have to be careful when we read headline with the letters GMO in them. GMO plants in themselves are not dangerous anyone, the problem becomes when they broadcast themselves, and the potential impact on natural habitats. We don't know what kind of cross hybridization may occur, and that is the greater danger.

What is also become obvious, is that the use of GMO crops has resulted in both weed and insect pests developing resistance to this phrase used to knock down them. This is a much greater danger then the plant itself.

Thanks for posting a good article but be careful those headlines. We all get caught by that trap every once awhile.

False.

Double helical strands of rNA used to silence genes in apples and potatoes were thought not to affect insects nor cross the blood brain barrier, however they did.

In one study it silenced nearly 1/10th of the entire bee's genome and another it silenced key genes in mouse livers.

It is a dangerous thing and not properly researched. Not to mention the carcinogenic effects of glyphosate spliced into the genes of plants.

GMO may have some good science backing it sometimes, but too often, the answer to if it affects humans is : "we don't know."

Not good enough.


This is also in addition the glyphosate kelating arsenic and lead where it unbinds once entering the renal system in humans.

Other studies have shown almost complete sterility in mammals by the 3rd generation.

No thanks.

I'm all for gmo labelling. I'll pay more and eat my non gmo. You eat your gmo.

It's a free country, and if you want to consume poison, hit it up G. I however do not want to.

[russ]

Originally Posted by connexion123

False.

Double helical strands of rNA used to silence genes in apples and potatoes were thought not to affect insects nor cross the blood brain barrier, however they did.

In one study it silenced nearly 1/10th of the entire bee's genome and another it silenced key genes in mouse livers.

It is a dangerous thing and not properly researched. Not to mention the carcinogenic effects of glyphosate spliced into the genes of plants.

GMO may have some good science backing it sometimes, but too often, the answer to if it affects humans is : "we don't know."

Not good enough.


This is also in addition the glyphosate kelating arsenic and lead where it unbinds once entering the renal system in humans.

Other studies have shown almost complete sterility in mammals by the 3rd generation.

No thanks.

I'm all for gmo labelling. I'll pay more and eat my non gmo. You eat your gmo.

It's a free country, and if you want to consume poison, hit it up G. I however do not want to.

Interesting claims, where did you find these studies?

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by connexion123

It is a dangerous thing and not properly researched. Not to mention the carcinogenic effects of glyphosate spliced into the genes of plants.

I guess the scientific papers I read are different then the ones you read.

To produce the Roundup Ready canola, two genes were introduced into the canola genome. One is a gene derived from the common soil bacterium Agrobacterium strain CP4, that encodes for the EPSPS enzyme. The other is a gene from the Ochrobactrum anthropi strain LBAA, which encodes for the enzyme glyphosate oxidase (GOX). The CP4 EPSPS enzyme has naturally high tolerance to being affected by glyphosate, so the plants can still create aromatic amino acids even after glyphosate is applied. GOX helps break down glyphosate within the plant

I've applied a lot of herbicides over the years, to employers crops.
I like to know as much as I can about the job I'm doing and applying herbicides is no different. To that end I have read everything I could lay my hands on concerning not only glyphosate but all the other herbicides I've used over the years and I paid close attention to how plants and animals reacted to what I applied. I'm a curious kinda guy.

All I've seen and read leads me to believe that introducing glyphosate into any living plant tissue would immediately kill that plant.

In other words I don't think what you claim is even possible, but I have no doubt you got it from a source you trust.

That doesn't mean I support GMOs. I do not. I trust very little of what big business offer us. Too many have proven they can't be trusted.

But I am no more impressed by the fear mongering spread by the internet.

A lot of good people have been lead to believe outright fabrications by what they have seen on the internet. Most of this misinformation is spread by opponents of big business, but to my thinking what they are doing is no better then what so many big businesses have been caught doing.

If the truth is not sufficient reason to oppose something then it ought not be opposed.

[connexion123]

I'm on my mobile so copy and paste is hard but here is an interesting article. I will dig some stuff up and post it later.

This one was posted in the NY Times, and in my opinion leans towards pro GMO, neither the less, a good article discussing what I claimed.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/01/28...html?referrer=

[russ]

It really needs to be pointed out that you're citing a newspaper article not a peer reviewed paper.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by connexion123

I'm on my mobile so copy and paste is hard but here is an interesting article. I will dig some stuff up and post it later.

This one was posted in the NY Times, and in my opinion leans towards pro GMO, neither the less, a good article discussing what I claimed.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/01/28...html?referrer=

That is scary stuff even though it is still theory only.

In all honesty I'm not so concerned about the present GMO technology, I'm more concerned about attempts to make farmers slaves to big business, most especially Monsento. And future attempts to manipulate nature for profit.

I had not heard about this new attempt to manipulate genetics to kill crop pests but I have no trouble believing it is being researched.
This is partly why I don't trust big business. They have the resources to do things that should not be done and the political clout to get away with it.

Killer bees were just such an attempt. A crude old fashioned attempt that went wrong as is inevitable with all such experiments done by big business.
Safety is never their priority, making money is and big business has no conscience. Anything that makes a profit is of interest to them.

Genetic manipulation has been going on for a very long time but until recently it mostly used natural means to achieve it's goals. This method left natural means mostly in control of the outcome.

If they succeed in removing that control who knows what will happen.

Killer Wheat !!!!

[hunted]

This article has so many wrongs it's actually kind of funny. People read an article on the Internet and instantly become an expert. The fact is these huge bee deaths aren't even real! A few people with a hidden agenda.

In fact I think these bee keepers should be charged with bee neglect. If the deaths are real there are many factors: varo mite, cold winter, new bee keepers with lack of know how not feeding the hives enough sugar in fall, a lot of Ontario bee keepers are cashing in on sending bee to the maritimes to pollinate berry crops and the transporting back and forth is hard on them.....

Don't these bee keepers know where their bees go? In fact a lot of farmers are now closing their fields to bee keepers as they are scared of liabilities. But the fact is bees travel up to 3 miles for food who knows what the hell they get into and some farmers aren't going to take the chance anymore. These protesters are screwing up relations between farmers and bee keepers that have lasted decades.

Insectides including neonics have been used safely for many years. They are extensively tested by health Canada and proven safe. Neonics replace 3-4 in crop over sprays which is a good thing as in crop foliar insectides kill not only the pests but beneficials as well. If in deed this dust factor is proven true the best stewards of the land we have, the farmers! will figure out how to get rid of the dust.

Did you know bees aren't even native to Canada?

[FCLightning]

Originally Posted by russ

It really needs to be pointed out that you're citing a newspaper article not a peer reviewed paper.

I don't know what it may have to do with the original left field assertions, but here is a paper on the idea referenced in the NY Times article.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23308063

[Beeman]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

Has anyone ever talked to a bee keeper or just following articles?

Had a long conversation with a bee keeper a few weeks ago, the main issue seems to be a fungus and bee keepers are finding wild and wonderful ways to combat the problem with much success. He's even fumigating hives with ammonia I believe, his hives have grated bottoms.

Yup. The fungus is called nosema and a new strain has shown up in recent years. Fumigation dead hives, before reusing them, with acetic acid has shown some improvement in controlling it. Two different mites, one of which has shown an amazing adaptibilty to any chemical controls we throw at them and viruses and bacteria all take a toll on the health of our hives.

I don't know much about the gmo corn situation but almost all the canola planted around me has been treated with neonicotoid seed treatment and hasn't been a factor as far as I can tell. Canola is one of main honey crops here and the bees actively forge both the nectar and pollen.

A couple of bad long winters the past couple years has cost me dearly in bee losses and the combanation of factors has been almost devastating. Still we carry on. The big losses of bees in this area seem to be spread out amongst a few very experienced beekeepers on a rotating baises meaning one or two different people each year. My family has been keeping bees for around a hundred years and I am drawing experience from the collective knowledge of around 300 years of experience. I still have a hard time knowing what is the right way.

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Beeman

Yup. The fungus is called nosema and a new strain has shown up in recent years. Fumigation dead hives, before reusing them, with acetic acid has shown some improvement in controlling it. Two different mites, one of which has shown an amazing adaptibilty to any chemical controls we throw at them and viruses and bacteria all take a toll on the health of our hives.

I don't know much about the gmo corn situation but almost all the canola planted around me has been treated with neonicotoid seed treatment and hasn't been a factor as far as I can tell. Canola is one of main honey crops here and the bees actively forge both the nectar and pollen.

A couple of bad long winters the past couple years has cost me dearly in bee losses and the combanation of factors has been almost devastating. Still we carry on. The big losses of bees in this area seem to be spread out amongst a few very experienced beekeepers on a rotating baises meaning one or two different people each year. My family has been keeping bees for around a hundred years and I am drawing experience from the collective knowledge of around 300 years of experience. I still have a hard time knowing what is the right way.

Acetic acid, thank you. You folk are pretty passionate about your bees, makes for interesting conversation.

[hunted]

Originally Posted by Beeman

Yup. The fungus is called nosema and a new strain has shown up in recent years. Fumigation dead hives, before reusing them, with acetic acid has shown some improvement in controlling it. Two different mites, one of which has shown an amazing adaptibilty to any chemical controls we throw at them and viruses and bacteria all take a toll on the health of our hives.

I don't know much about the gmo corn situation but almost all the canola planted around me has been treated with neonicotoid seed treatment and hasn't been a factor as far as I can tell. Canola is one of main honey crops here and the bees actively forge both the nectar and pollen.

A couple of bad long winters the past couple years has cost me dearly in bee losses and the combanation of factors has been almost devastating. Still we carry on. The big losses of bees in this area seem to be spread out amongst a few very experienced beekeepers on a rotating baises meaning one or two different people each year. My family has been keeping bees for around a hundred years and I am drawing experience from the collective knowledge of around 300 years of experience. I still have a hard time knowing what is the right way.

Question for you as an actual bee keeper. Are you for or against a neonic ban?

[score]

As soon as some read 'GMO' they get all in a flap even though they know nothing about it......

[Bobby B.]

Just to put honeybees in perspective, they are not native to North America.

https://www.agriculture.purdue.edu/a...111199OSL.html

According to my friend, a horticulturist, the most efficient pollinators here are the bumblebee and the masonbee.

Bobby

[hunted]

http://albertabuzzing.com/2015/07/accountability/

Here is a very good read on the situation. Once we start pointing a finger at someone remember there is 3 pointing back.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Bobby B.

Just to put honeybees in perspective, they are not native to North America.

https://www.agriculture.purdue.edu/a...111199OSL.html

According to my friend, a horticulturist, the most efficient pollinators here are the bumblebee and the masonbee.

Bobby

He forgot about leaf cutter bees ?

The native bees may be the most efficient but there can be no denying they are far outnumbered by imported honey bees.

As I recall, about twenty years ago there was a mite that attacked a lot of honey bee hives. At that time all Bee imports were banned in an attempt to stop the infestation.

Bees are a major economic factor in farming not only for their pollinating service. Actually that is a secondary consideration. But honey production is a major contributor to local economies returning millions of dollars to those economies..

[Bobby B.]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

He forgot about leaf cutter bees ?

The native bees may be the most efficient but there can be no denying they are far outnumbered by imported honey bees.

As I recall, about twenty years ago there was a mite that attacked a lot of honey bee hives. At that time all Bee imports were banned in an attempt to stop the infestation.

Bees are a major economic factor in farming not only for their pollinating service. Actually that is a secondary consideration. But honey production is a major contributor to local economies returning millions of dollars to those economies..

Yes, of course, there's no denying the honeybees outnumber the native bees. It's a direct result of the honey industry.

Mike and Gilbert Wolfe of Falher are the nephews of my BIL, Rene. IIRC, Rene once stated that, combined, Mike and Gilbert are the largest honey producers in the country. I've never validated this claim. Nonetheless, I'm quite aware of the monetary aspect of honeybees.

Bobby

[Matt L.]

Threads like these I wish Beeguy was still around. He was immensely knowledgable on this subject.