hornady superformance... failure???

[johnschmidt]

Hey guys, I'm just wondering how many of you have used the hornady superformance bullets? I went hunting with my cousin last Sunday, he's a first time hunter, he went to cabelas and got a sako A7 in 30-06 and a box of cheapoes for target practice and sighting his scope, as well as a box of superformance for hunting, the gun shot well, and he bagged 2 whitetails with it, but I was not impressed with the performance of the bullets, the first deer was 100 yards broadside, he went for a lung shot, he hit about 6 inches behind the right shoulder, the bullet hit a rib and deflected and shredded the guts and exited about 10 inches in front of the left hip, made a horrible mess out of what should have been an excellent shot. The second deer was a front shot that went in just left of center about 4 inches above the sternum, the bullet hit a rib and split, part of it took out the left shoulder and lodged just below the hide, and part of it skidded along the ribs and sheared off 5 of them before deflecting and ended up in the tenderloin. I have been hunting since I was old enough to get a junior deer tag, and I have only once before seen a bullet bounce around like that, (a friend of mine got a broadside on a deer with a 243 and the bullet exited the belly button ) is this common behavior for these bullets? I personally have never used these, but I'm a long time hornady fan, I have been reloading for almost 20 years.

[silver lab]

I thought superformance was the powder. Never seen a superformance bullet. But it sounds like it kills.

[Groundhogger]

I can't speak to what the bullet did/didn't do...or why, but, reading that account makes me wonder whether or not the rifle's scope was zeroed using the "cheapos", or the Hornady Superperfomance? It's fine to use lesser/cheaper ammo to get you on paper, to even get it close...but you ought to to the final scope set-up using the same ammo you'll be hunting with. Point of impact between 2 different ammo can be drastically different, and usually is.

[Bergerboy]

Common with many bullets. They do weird things.

[Salavee]

Sounds like a pretty tough bullet. What was it ?

[Slicktricker]

How is that a failure???

[tikka250]

sounds like it killed the deer and didnt blow up when it hit bone i dont see much of an issue.

[JD848]

IT's more likely an sst,about 200 feet faster than your average load,it was good seller for a while and may still be,but that's what bullets do when you hit a rib.

LOTSA guys don't care for them because of damage at close ranges,but if you still want a bullet to expand past 400 to 800 the sst will do a great job.the only other that I know is the boat tail speer point that use to be loaded for superperformance.

I seen them make a mess on a bad shot,but in the butt most bullet do damage,if it doesn't do damage I won't load it,if your just going for head shots then you may as well use a steel jacket,lotsa new stuff is boarder line steel jacket with almost zero expanding past 300 ,but different strokes for different folks.If you get mixed up with all the new stuff just use a partition and your set.But the deal you were out to do that day was killing your deer and that it did,if I shoot I want it down in front of me,not will look in the morning for,that's just not right,so the bullet he used did it's job.

[Flight01]

Originally Posted by Groundhogger

I can't speak to what the bullet did/didn't do...or why, but, reading that account makes me wonder whether or not the rifle's scope was zeroed using the "cheapos", or the Hornady Superperfomance? It's fine to use lesser/cheaper ammo to get you on paper, to even get it close...but you ought to to the final scope set-up using the same ammo you'll be hunting with. Point of impact between 2 different ammo can be drastically different, and usually is.

This^^

[johnschmidt]

The deer died, no doubt about that! They only went about 50 yards before they piled up, but I'm not fond of all the ricocheting that went on when they impacted, the bullets he was using were 180 grain gmx, I put 3 150 grain btsp into a moose last year, all 3 did as I have come to expect from hornady, they smashed a couple ribs and opened up nicely, but didn't deviate from their path, they plowed right through the lungs and out the other side, I put 3 good shots into the moose, and I got 3 good results, the lungs were pulped, but no exploded guts to deal with. I do all my own butchering, so I'm much more fond of a clean carcass than one that I have to use a pressure washer to clean it, not to mention I prefer to keep as much as possible for myself rather than using it for coyote bait, an animal that I shoot, is not supposed to look like roadkill.

[waterhaulerhunter]

Sounds like a case of poor shot placement or shot taking than bullet performance. The gmx is designed like the Barnes tsx and that is to hold together under impact and drive deep. I find it hard to believe that in two instances the bullet came completely apart. I just about exclusively shoot them and have shot some pretty tough animals with them and they've never came apart.

[johnschmidt]

The bullet as far as I know did not come apart on the first deer, it exited about 10 inches ahead of the left hip, I didn't recover that bullet, but the second deer he got, the bullet did come apart, I found 2 pieces of it, one in the left shoulder, and the other piece in the tenderloin. The first one was a perfect broad side shot, good shot placement,a few inches behind the right shoulder, should have been a good lung shot, but it deflected on a rib and ricocheted into the guts before exiting.

[elkdump]

Originally Posted by johnschmidt

The bullet as far as I know did not come apart on the first deer, it exited about 10 inches ahead of the left hip, I didn't recover that bullet, but the second deer he got, the bullet did come apart, I found 2 pieces of it, one in the left shoulder, and the other piece in the tenderloin. The first one was a perfect broad side shot, good shot placement,a few inches behind the right shoulder, should have been a good lung shot, but it deflected on a rib and ricocheted into the guts before exiting.

Sounds exactly like the " Magic Bullet Theory in the JFK Assassination " I doubted it could happen when in 1963 the FBI said it was true,( a bullet changing directions several times ) ,,,

But now after hearing the Theory again on AO Forum,,

I believe it is true

[waterhaulerhunter]

The bullet did what it was designed to do then, kept driving through. My guess is the second one of the petals came off on a full frontal shot, which can happen. And my guess with the first one the perfect broadside might have not been quite perfect and a little quartering towards. Combine that with a shot a little back and a little deflection and you have bullet exiting far back. Not all kills are text boom but nevertheless both deer are dead.

[johnschmidt]

Thanks for all the input guys, we're going after elk next weekend, so I guess we'll see what happens with that, hopefully we don't have to feed so much of it to the dogs.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by johnschmidt

Hey guys, I'm just wondering how many of you have used the hornady superformance bullets? I went hunting with my cousin last Sunday, he's a first time hunter, he went to cabelas and got a sako A7 in 30-06 and a box of cheapoes for target practice and sighting his scope, as well as a box of superformance for hunting, the gun shot well, and he bagged 2 whitetails with it, but I was not impressed with the performance of the bullets, the first deer was 100 yards broadside, he went for a lung shot, he hit about 6 inches behind the right shoulder, the bullet hit a rib and deflected and shredded the guts and exited about 10 inches in front of the left hip, made a horrible mess out of what should have been an excellent shot. The second deer was a front shot that went in just left of center about 4 inches above the sternum, the bullet hit a rib and split, part of it took out the left shoulder and lodged just below the hide, and part of it skidded along the ribs and sheared off 5 of them before deflecting and ended up in the tenderloin. I have been hunting since I was old enough to get a junior deer tag, and I have only once before seen a bullet bounce around like that, (a friend of mine got a broadside on a deer with a 243 and the bullet exited the belly button ) is this common behavior for these bullets? I personally have never used these, but I'm a long time hornady fan, I have been reloading for almost 20 years.

I would expect that for a just about broadside shot with a soft bullet going at warp 9 velocity at short range. Your 6 inch behind right shoulder to 10 inches in front of left hip is close to what I would predict could happen with any broadside shot.

I would do my final sight in with the ammo that I intend to hunt with.

I have tried Hornady Superformance ammo with SST bullets and for me was just about the worst accuracy from factory ammo that I can recall. Just my experience!

The second presentation I usually decline to take.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by johnschmidt

The deer died, no doubt about that! They only went about 50 yards before they piled up, but I'm not fond of all the ricocheting that went on when they impacted, the bullets he was using were 180 grain gmx, I put 3 150 grain btsp into a moose last year, all 3 did as I have come to expect from hornady, they smashed a couple ribs and opened up nicely, but didn't deviate from their path, they plowed right through the lungs and out the other side, I put 3 good shots into the moose, and I got 3 good results, the lungs were pulped, but no exploded guts to deal with. I do all my own butchering, so I'm much more fond of a clean carcass than one that I have to use a pressure washer to clean it, not to mention I prefer to keep as much as possible for myself rather than using it for coyote bait, an animal that I shoot, is not supposed to look like roadkill.

GMX bullet? I am now convinced that shot placement or angle of shot is more the issue.

[catnthehat]

Bullets have been proven to change direction By hitting brush or after entring a body of any sort, be it an animal or person
The fact that the first shot changed direction and caused lots of damage do proves nothing really except that it killed the animal .
I have killed 10 deer now with the same rifle using bullets ranging from 150 grains to 215 grains and three different brands .
Bullets were both cup and core and mono metal.

Results were everything from straight through to 45 degree changes .
It is all conjecture about how a bullet will behave once it hits an animal .
Cat

[dgl1948]

If the gun was sighted with cheap ammo it was a copper jacketed lead bullet. GMX is a mono based bullet. Being mostly copper it is a lot longer and in my expierence with them they will not have the same impact point as the jacketed bullet. The super performance ammo would be a lot faster than the stuff he sighted in with as well. He was shooting a gun that was not properly sighted. I am sure that is why the bullet did not go where he was shooting.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by dgl1948

If the gun was sighted with cheap ammo it was a copper jacketed lead bullet. GMX is a mono based bullet. Being mostly copper it is a lot longer and in my expierence with them they will not have the same impact point as the jacketed bullet. The super performance ammo would be a lot faster than the stuff he sighted in with as well. He was shooting a gun that was not properly sighted. I am sure that is why the bullet did not go where he was shooting.

The question was not why the bullet did not hit where the rifle was aimed but what it did snd thr direction it took after it hit .
Cat

[dogslayer403]

I had simular experience with TSX bullets was shooting 165g in a 300wm was getting crazy deflections at close range placed a bullet just behind the shoulder on a whitetail and it exited the off hip was a broadside shot.

[Bearbreath]

If the bullet is a SST, they will break up at close range. Get the interbonds or GMX if you want a bullet that sticks together.

[dgl1948]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

The question was not why the bullet did not hit where the rifle was aimed but what it did snd thr direction it took after it hit .
Cat

When it is not sighted properly you do not know what direction the bullet took.

[Wazy.338]

Sounds like the bullet acted exactly how i would expect a GMX to perform. Little side note, let a 165 gmx out of a 300wm go on a calf moose a few weeks ago, quartering to shot, bullet cut through like hot butter in and out barely changed directions. Broke shoulder blade and demo'd both lungs.

The first shot sounds like the deer was quartering to a little more than what is described. But hey bullet killed and ya got some tenders in the freezer...cant complain!

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by dgl1948

When it is not sighted properly you do not know what direction the bullet took.

There is no proof that the gun was not shooting where he pointed it .
I have seen bullets do strange things from rifles that very extremely accurate using them
Cat

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

There is no proof that the gun was not shooting where he pointed it .
Cat

As usual you are probably correct. Actually there is no proof of the cause of anything described here. It is most probable that the cause of death was the wound inflicted by shooter rifle ammo combo. Everything else is speculation.
I assume and hope that the shooter will eat well

[calgarychef]

Perhaps the deer was quartering toward the shooter and that's why the bullet ended up by the hip. It's a dead deer none the less

[bat119]

Any high power rifle bullet can take an erratic path

Oswald's bullet did or at least that's the theory

[IMG][/IMG]

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by bat119

Any high power rifle bullet can take an erratic path

Oswald's bullet did or at least that's the theory

[IMG][/IMG]

[Kellykrahn]

All I've shot with my 30-06 since I got it 2 years ago is Hornady Superformance 150 sst and they seem to be a good round for me, heart shot a deer last Thursday and the bullets path was as straight as if it had been an arrow, this was at ~150yrds,

One thing I want to remind everybody of is that different barrels and rates of twist effect different ammo in different ways, so sticking with one ammunition for one rifle should keep the groups consistent, or just constantly resight your gun lol


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