Seyfried article

[Pathfinder76]

I read this yesterday and just saw it was posted on another site. I like it and hope someone else does as well.

http://forums.gunsamerica.com/yaf_po...Cartridge.aspx

[MountainTi]

Yep, it is certainly a good article on one persons opinion, but that is all it is-an opinion. There are lot's of others.

[robfraser]

Great article. Could not agree more.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

Yep, it is certainly a good article on one persons opinion, but that is all it is-an opinion. There are lot's of others.

I've found that not all opinions are created equal.

[209x50]

Originally Posted by chuck

I've found that not all opinions are created equal.

Of course the opinion of a personal hero would be much louder in your ears than in someone else's less infatuated ears. LOL!

[flint]

Originally Posted by chuck

I read this yesterday and just saw it was posted on another site. I like it and hope someone else does as well.

http://forums.gunsamerica.com/yaf_po...Cartridge.aspx

There is alot of truth and fact to that article.....95% of my cartridges have been mid-size.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by chuck

I've found that not all opinions are created equal.

Nope, you're right there. Some are of the opinion that their opinions should be listened to above all others. Might even go so far as to say it even happens on here occasionally.

[Jadham]

People that don't like these type of articles are usually the ones that have been wasting their ears and money on the magnums.

Gun and ammunition companies remind me of drug companies... coming up with new and more expensive products that are marginally better (if at all) in order to increase their profit margin.

I guess they also remind me of tech companies... why do my computers and cellphones have to be replaced every couple of years?

[Pathfinder76]

The best part is Ross Seyfried has been a magnum fan for a long time. As he puts it in the article, a "disciple" of Elmer Keith.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by Jadham

People that don't like these type of articles are usually the ones that have been wasting their ears and money on the magnums.

It's funny how the non-magnum, recoil sensitive shooters are typically the most vocal with their opinions on their caliber of choice. If you can't handle them, I don't have a problem with that, but many can shoot them and shoot them well, so why knock them for it.
Good luck in many of the countries with minimum caliber requirements, I don't think your .270 or 30/06 will cut it. Ever think there might be a reason for these requirements?

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

It's funny how the non-magnum, recoil sensitive shooters are typically the most vocal with their opinions on their caliber of choice. If you can't handle them, I don't have a problem with that, but many can shoot them and shoot them well, so why knock them for it.
Good luck in many of the countries with minimum caliber requirements, I don't think your .270 or 30/06 will cut it. Ever think there might be a reason for these requirements?

Apparently you didn't read the article.

He didn't mention it either but Ross Seyfried was a PH in Africa. So I believe he is aware of caliber restrictions. Funny enough, I had a friend that shot two Cape Buffalo with his 300 Win Mag and being a good shot killed them cleanly. Another friend killed his two Cape Buffalo with a 7X57 Mauser. Also cleanly.

[Jadham]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

It's funny how the non-magnum, recoil sensitive shooters are typically the most vocal with their opinions on their caliber of choice. If you can't handle them, I don't have a problem with that, but many can shoot them and shoot them well, so why knock them for it.
Good luck in many of the countries with minimum caliber requirements, I don't think your .270 or 30/06 will cut it. Ever think there might be a reason for these requirements?

"Handling" them isn't my beef, it's the company marketing strategy to the masses - as well as those who spout off company b.s. You would think elk were unobtainable game until the .338 WM came along.

And the noise is highly intrusive (which has been shown to cause permament hearing damage even when wearing hearing protection).

Of course, some of the magnum calibers may be minimum requirements in other places, but certainly not here. However, if we found a lost pack of mastodons, that could change.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by chuck

Apparently you didn't read the article.

He didn't mention it either but Ross Seyfried was a PH in Africa. So I believe he is aware of caliber restrictions. Funny enough, I had a friend that shot two Cape Buffalo with his 300 Win Mag and being a good shot killed them cleanly. Another friend killed his two Cape Buffalo with a 7X57 Mauser. Also cleanly.

There was always the story of the old lady that killed one of the highest scoring grizz in Canada, and did it with a .22 rimfire to boot. Perhaps we should change our minimum caliber requirements here in Alberta. Sure would be a lot cheaper hunting with a .22 than reloading for a Weatherby. Why not go one step further and legalize .17 caliber. I know I can constistently shoot 5 shot groups all touching the same hole at 100 yds. That outta knock out the eye of a cape buff. Easy on the ears and recoil is also pretty minimum

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by MountainTi

There was always the story of the old lady that killed one of the highest scoring grizz in Canada, and did it with a .22 rimfire to boot. Perhaps we should change our minimum caliber requirements here in Alberta. Sure would be a lot cheaper hunting with a .22 than reloading for a Weatherby. Why not go one step further and legalize .17 caliber. I know I can constistently shoot 5 shot groups all touching the same hole at 100 yds. That outta knock out the eye of a cape buff. Easy on the ears and recoil is also pretty minimum

So the gist of the article is shooting more will create a better rifleman and more successful hunter. Some shoot big rifles well, most don't and the 270 and it's ilk are great cartridges and will kill an Elk handily. And the problem is?

[elkhunter11]

So the gist of the article is shooting more will create a better rifleman and more successful hunter. Some shoot big rifles well, most don't and the 270 and it's ilk are great cartridges and will kill an Elk handily. And the problem is?

The problem with his reasoning, is that many people that shoot rifles in cartridges like the 270 don't shoot any more than the people shooting the more powerful cartridges.I know many people shooting the less powerful cartridges that never shoot,except for a few shots just before hunting season,then whatever shots that they take at game animals.

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by chuck

So the gist of the article is shooting more will create a better rifleman and more successful hunter. Some shoot big rifles well, most don't and the 270 and it's ilk are great cartridges and will kill an Elk handily. And the problem is?

I don't disagree with the shooting. Practice does of course make perfect, no arguments here. Just wondering where you are getting your info that most do not shoot big rifles well. Can't seem to find any stats on that one. If you are more than capable of shooting the big magnums with the same skill as the small stuff, then why not? I STILL have yet to see an animal over killed. You seem to be proving my point about the lighter/non- magnum caliber shooters typically being the most vocal on their opinion

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

The problem with his reasoning, is that many people that shoot rifles in cartridges like the 270 don't shoot any more than the people shooting the more powerful cartridges.I know many people shooting the less powerful cartridges that never shoot,except for a few shots just before hunting season,then whatever shots that they take at game animals.

I think he was imploring people to shoot more regardless of what your cartridge choice is.

[elkhunter11]

I see that Seyfried takes credit for designing the 300RUM,and the 338RUM.I wonder if he designed those cartridges before the 300 Imperial Magnum,and 338Imperial Magnum were released here in Canada.I was shooting the Imperial Magnum cartridges myself,several years before the RUMs were introduced.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

I see that Seyfried takes credit for designing the 300RUM,and the 338RUM.I wonder if he designed those cartridges before the 300 Imperial Magnum,and 338Imperial Magnum were released here in Canada.I was shooting the Imperial Magnum cartridges myself,several years before the RUMs were introduced.

And people were shooting the 404 Jeffery years before that.

[Arn?Narn.]

The idea of practice practice practice is one that I figured most people knew...

As for uber magnums and mid range etc..

I have seen both shine and both fail...but I have definitely seen more people practicing and using "religiously" their non big magnum rifles...
This is from my experience..

While a 300 WM may not be the biggest magnum, my hunting partner shoots one. He is pretty accurate with it, and like the results for the most part...

This Spring he said something to me that I thought a little odd,...
"I like the gun, it's a nice gun and I have taken lots with it,...but man, I don't enjoy shooting it"

I don't need anyone to tell me my Marlin is a POS, ...underpowered,...etc etc.
I know what a Marlin Costs, I know the ballistics...and because I enjoy shooting it and have enjoyed it for many years, I can hit with it...and that's all I want...
It doesn't need to be able to make dinner, or get me chicks (it certainly wouldn't) or impress.

Rifles don't impress me,...hitting it in the field does, no matter the rifle or cartridge.

[elkhunter11]

And people were shooting the 404 Jeffery years before that.

He is not taking credit for the 404 Jeffery,he is taking credit for the 300RUM,and 338RUM.The 300 Imperial mag and 338 Imperial mag are nearly identical to the 300RUM and 338RUM.The 404 Jeffery uses the same parent case,but it isn't even close to being the same as a 300RUM or a 338RUM,just by virtue of the difference in bullet diameter.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

The problem with his reasoning, is that many people that shoot rifles in cartridges like the 270 don't shoot any more than the people shooting the more powerful cartridges.I know many people shooting the less powerful cartridges that never shoot,except for a few shots just before hunting season,then whatever shots that they take at game animals.

My 270 shoots 130 grain bullets at the same speed as my 280 AI shot 140 grain bullets of inconsequential diameter difference. I'm curious if you will notice a discernible difference in killing efficiency between the 280 AI and the the STW/RUM cartridges.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

He is not taking credit for the 404 Jeffery,he is taking credit for the 300RUM,and 338RUM.The 300 Imperial mag and 338 Imperial mag are nearly identical to the 300RUM and 338RUM.The 404 Jeffery uses the same parent case,but it isn't even close to being the same as a 300RUM or a 338RUM,just by virtue of the difference in bullet diameter.

I don't think he was taking credit for being the fist person to shoot an overbore 30 either.

[elkhunter11]

I'm curious if you will notice a discernible difference in killing efficiency between the 280 AI and the the STW/RUM cartridges.

An extra 300fps or 400fps does reduce wind drift,so it makes wind doping less critical in order to obtain a vital hit.Making a more accurate shot definitely increase the odds of a clean kill.

I don't think he was taking credit for being the fist person to shoot an overbore 30 either.

He never made that claim,but in the article he very specifically posts that he designed the 300RUM and 338RUM.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

An extra 300fps or 400fps does reduce wind drift,so it makes wind doping less critical in order to obtain a vital hit.Making a more accurate shot definitely increase the odds of a clean kill.

While true, that isn't what I asked.

[elkhunter11]

While true, that isn't what I asked.

So better shot placement doesn't increase the killing efficiency?

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

He never made that claim,but in the article he very specifically posts that he designed the 300RUM and 338RUM.

Sorry, I wasn't sure what you were getting at with saying you'd shot the imperial magnums years before the RUMS or what that had to do with the article.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

So better shot placement doesn't increase the killing efficiency?

I suppose it would. So I guess I'll add the caveat. If you can hit the animal in the vital organs given the 5" difference in wind drift in a 30 mile an hour wind at 400 yds I'd be curious to know the observations on the difference in efficiency.

[elkhunter11]

I suppose it would. So I guess I'll add the caveat. If you can hit the animal in the vital organs given the 5" difference in wind drift in a 30 mile an hour wind at 400 yds I'd be curious to know the observations on the difference in efficiency.

Given that 5" can mean the difference between a lung shot and a gut shot,I would think that 5" could greatly increase the killing efficiency.In fact 2" could make a difference.

And if that extra 400fps of muzzle velocity meant that the bullet impact was 2000fps rather than 1600fps,it could mean the difference whether the bullet would expand properly or not.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Given that 5" can mean the difference between a lung shot and a gut shot,I would think that 5" could greatly increase the killing efficiency.In fact 2" could make a difference.

Yes, but remember that 5" is included in 40" of wind drift. If you know that a 35" hold is required to put a bullet in the vitals you will know what 40" is as well. If your banking on the hope that that 5" will put your bullet where you want your guessing. A guess that could just as easily put the bullet of the faster cartridge in the guts on an animal facing the other direction.