copper fouling on tikka stainless

[Jamie Black R/T]

Originally Posted by chuck

It sure doesn't.

ive got about 20 soiled patches in a garbage bag right now that say(smell) otherwise.

its not a strong odor like other solvents...but its there.

check again.

[gitrdun]

I know the smell that you speak off JB, it's very mild, but there, a bit sour kind of like vinegar, but not blow your head off like amonia. Wipeout does turn patches blue, which I always attributed to a chemical reaction between copper and amonia. But, the front of the can clearly states that it contains NO AMONIA. So, I don't know what gives? I just know that it works well.

[Johnny7604]

Originally Posted by gitrdun

^^^ I've looked down many bores and can honestly say that I haven't personally identified copper fouling bad enough to see with a flashlight. I have however cleaned out many bores that were suspect and brougth them back to standard using amonia bearing solvents that turned the patches blue. My feeling is that if you can literally see it with a flashlight, shooting....no spraying patterns would be your initial indicator.

On another side note, this KG stuff claims to not contain ammonia, neither does Wipeout. We all know how effectively amonia attacks copper, but hey, I'll give anything a try at least once. We all know how copper fouling will deteriorate accuracy in a jiffy.

Sometimes it can be difficult to see the copper. I usually run a patch or two of Butches down the tube first. That gets rid of the powder residue on top and shines the copper up real nice. If you can't see any after that it's probably not there. I have not seen any deterioration in accuracy with a little copper fouling. In fact after cleaning to bare metal it usually takes a few shots for everything to tighten back up again.

Alot of copper is a different story.

The only reason I mentioned the KG-12 is that it stright up works. For some reason it hasn't gained much ground up here but I can guarantee you it has outperformed every other cleaner I have ever used with the exception of Coppermelt (don't think it exists anymore).

If you don't believe me fine, I'll be happy to prove it to anyone in my area. If you want to order a bottle and it doesn't work I'll buy it off you, that's how confident I am.

Not trying to start any arguments, just trying to help save people money in patches and a little elbow grease.

Cheers,

[Jamie Black R/T]

Originally Posted by gitrdun

I know the smell that you speak off JB, it's very mild, but there, a bit sour kind of like vinegar, but not blow your head off like amonia. Wipeout does turn patches blue, which I always attributed to a chemical reaction between copper and amonia. But, the front of the can clearly states that it contains NO AMONIA. So, I don't know what gives? I just know that it works well.

i just started using wipe out a year ago...i smelled it right away and i was curious...i have requested an msds sheet from Sharp Shoot-R several times with no response.

its not a bad odor...but its there....and yes it works well and doesnt make your eyes water so im not gonna stop using it....just curious is all.

[Jamie Black R/T]

speak of the devil. I just recieved an email from them.

"What you smell is UREA. It will flash off after about 60 seconds. We use it to start the work of dissolving copper"

that settles that

[sparkster]

Maybe a stupid question, but what brushes are people recommending if you don't recommend a brass brush?
I take care of my guns as good as I know how and want to use the best so let me know what is the best?

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by sparkster

Maybe a stupid question, but what brushes are people recommending if you don't recommend a brass brush?
I take care of my guns as good as I know how and want to use the best so let me know what is the best?

When I use Wipeout I don't use a brush, just jags and patches.
Cat.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Jamie Black R/T

speak of the devil. I just recieved an email from them.

"What you smell is UREA. It will flash off after about 60 seconds. We use it to start the work of dissolving copper"

that settles that

Urea releases ammonia in the presence of H2O.

LC

[CoreyPR]

I dont know if you have checked into the recoil plate in the stock or not. It is just a thin plate made of aluminum in the T3 and each shot puts stress on it. I dont know if it will be significant stress in a .243 but I know my 7mm aluminum recoil block inside was showing signs of wear after about 3 boxes of ammo down the barrel. I switched it out for a fabricated plate a little thicker then the plate installed made from steel and used epoxy to hold it tight. I also reinforced the bedding screws with a fabricated rod hollowed out made from brass and again used epoxy to install them after boring out the holes abit. It is not alot of work but you will notice a great increase in strength in the otherwise weak areas of the firearm as well as better grouping from your Tikka.

[Dmay]

Originally Posted by sparkster

Maybe a stupid question, but what brushes are people recommending if you don't recommend a brass brush?
I take care of my guns as good as I know how and want to use the best so let me know what is the best?

Nylon brushed are typically used by those who shy away from brass ones. They are available from most all companies producing bore brushes now-a-days. Check Sinclairs if you want to see whats available. While there, check out their new "Custom Shop Jags". I think they are one of the best new products to have come out lately in the field of bore cleaning.

[fletcher]

how many passes of a brass brush will have significant wear on a barrel im hoping its a very high number because i cant clean my guns without it i now use wipeout its great but not a miracle. i tried a nylon brush it was useless. is there a good reason not to use a brass brush? there is certainly a good reason to use one. i spray mine off with brakleen to get the solvent off when im done

[Pathfinder76]

It is dragging them back over the crown that can cause damage.

[fletcher]

Originally Posted by chuck

It is dragging them back over the crown that can cause damage.

i do that all the time but i can see how that would concentrate wear on that crown corner i will push it through and remove it in the future

[silver]

There is a very good article in Rifle magazine on cleaning barrels this month, what to do and not do, and tells of the damage that can happen.

[elkhunter11]

how many passes of a brass brush will have significant wear on a barrel im hoping its a very high number because i cant clean my guns without it i now use wipeout its great but not a miracle. i tried a nylon brush it was useless. is there a good reason not to use a brass brush? there is certainly a good reason to use one. i spray mine off with brakleen to get the solvent off when im done

If the proper chemicals and patches are used,and the barrel is cleaned often enough,it is not common for any of my barrels to end up with fouling severe enough to require resorting to a brass brush. If I find myself using a brass brush, I clean off the chemicals by rinsing in water, and drying with a hair drier.

[sparkster]

Where can I find Wipeout in Calgary?

I have check WSP and also shooter edge (the guy looked at me like I was speaking another language when I asked for it or another copper solvent)

Wouldn't mind picking up some synthetic brushes as well as has been discussed but didn't see those either.

Thanks

[gitrdun]

Don't know about Calgary, but Fly's Etc. in High River always has it on the shelf now. Nylon brushes also.

[RUSTY262]

was at the range tonight and after all the dark blue patches with six overnight soakings of wipeout and now completely clean patches, the gun is still firing all over the place. I shot a .75" group of 3 with my t3 3006 and can't keep 8" with my t3 243. Does anyone know of a gunsmith that will also test fire and diagnose a rifle??? please help.

[bigshell]

Sounds like you have a binding problem some where,check the recoil lug area for binding or even loosnes/wear in that area change the lug if its just a shim.Also check the magazine well area for binding could be when taking of and re-installing yer stock somthing got put in outa place.Torque the action screws to factory specs( I don't know them off hand) Check the crown for dings,recrown if necessary.Check the scope bases I've shot more than a few loose.Shoe goo on the threads keeps them snug.Finaly a hairling crack in the wrist can cause alot of wonkiness sometimes as it increases/changes the vibration of the whole unit.A good gunsmith will check all this out for you.If you lived here in the east koot I would recomend Ben Roberts in Wasa but I dunno where yer located.

[gitrdun]

PM sent.

[Tactical Lever]

Grab the barrel and see if you can wiggle it, and detect some rattle. Check your stock, does the action fit tightly? Tighten your action screws evenly; do they stay tight? Is the barrel floated or is it solidly bedded? Tight spots, loose spots?
Do you have cold bore accuracy? How many shots?

Clean it again to see whether there is fouling again. Which way is your rifling spinning?

[gitrdun]

How does the direction of rifling spìn affect accuracy? His gone was shooting fine, then one day it didn't.

[Tactical Lever]

Originally Posted by gitrdun

How does the direction of rifling spìn affect accuracy? His gone was shooting fine, then one day it didn't.

In respect to copper fouling if the barrel was put on backwards in accordance to the way the rifling was cut, it will foul much worse and faster.

Haven't seen it myself, and maybe it's a little out there, but maybe it might not be noticed immediately. Especially if it's shot infrequently.

Just theory, moving from most to least probable, as the easy ones are checked.

[ruttnbuckcojack]

Just wondering if anyone uses sweet 7.62 to clean your bore out and if so what's you option

[RUSTY262]

happened to stop by a well known and well respected gunsmith who no longer works on guns but he was able to take a look at it for me and informed me that I had shot out the last inch of my barrel. He said that this is very common from getting dirt or dust in the end and then firing. Especially happens on quads while getting to hunting grounds which i do a lot of. Since i manage a machine shop, I had the tools needed to chop off the barrel and recrown it. It was amazing to see how the rifling was completely wiped out and how pitted the barrel was on the end. His best suggestion to me to avoid it was a piece of electrical tape over the end of the barrel while hunting which will have no effect on accuracy. i hope to make it to the range this weekend to test out my shortened barrel. Thanks for all the suggestions and input but that gunsmiths set of trained eyes showed me the problem in less than 2 minutes after 3 years of frustration. I'll post the accuracy updates as soon as I have them.

[eric2381]

I'll be waiting anxiously to see your results.

Do you have a pic of the damaged muzzle and of the new crown on your barrel?

[gitrdun]

Great news, you'll likely loose a bit of muzzle velocity but have gained a slightly stiffer barrel. Looking forward to seeing your new targets. I have a Koplin gun case on my quad, the one with the fuzzy wool inside. best thing there is if you like rusty guns. Once moisture is introduced way down in there at the muzzle end, good luck getting it dry.

[Metalmike123]

Originally Posted by RUSTY262

happened to stop by a well known and well respected gunsmith who no longer works on guns but he was able to take a look at it for me and informed me that I had shot out the last inch of my barrel. He said that this is very common from getting dirt or dust in the end and then firing. Especially happens on quads while getting to hunting grounds which i do a lot of. Since i manage a machine shop, I had the tools needed to chop off the barrel and recrown it. It was amazing to see how the rifling was completely wiped out and how pitted the barrel was on the end. His best suggestion to me to avoid it was a piece of electrical tape over the end of the barrel while hunting which will have no effect on accuracy. i hope to make it to the range this weekend to test out my shortened barrel. Thanks for all the suggestions and input but that gunsmiths set of trained eyes showed me the problem in less than 2 minutes after 3 years of frustration. I'll post the accuracy updates as soon as I have them.

It's good to hear it's fixed, I started doing the electrical tape thing just last year too

[Tactical Lever]

Right on. Glad to hear the problem's solved. Never would have suspected that one.

I have a Kolpin Gun Boot as well, mine is not the fuzzy one. It's the one with the sleeve that sticks in there. I left the sleeve unstuck, and just put one of my soft cases in, with the rifle already inside.

Used to see the muzzle "condoms" in the stores; anyone know if they still sell those?

[RUSTY262]

finally managed to get some time in at the range and shot a group of 7 that a dime would touch all holes with hornady 80 gr gmx superformance factory loads. I think my crown job has solved the problem after a very frustrating 3 years. thanks for all the suggestions and ideas.