Some questions from my last few days.

[BugChuckingFlies]

Hello everyone!

As many have read, I am finally catching fish with my new fly fishing setup. After 7 days of frustration I finally caught not only my first trout in Friday but managed to catch 6. Then caught 2 yesterday, and 1 this morning. Needless to say i am a happier fishermen.

However, a few questions have now come up over the last few days I hope fellow experienced fly fishermen can answer for me. I will number them for easier response.

some background before this first question: Out of my 9 trout they have all been between 4 inch and 7 inch. I have been fishing a wet fly, named royal coachmen. I have been casting 12ft - 20ft let it sink a little then retrieving it. the conditions of the water have always been the same. small trout splashing about on the water (not sure if they are feeding on top, or are chasing bugs from deeper and splashing on the top as they catch them)

1) While at Muir today, a fellow fishermen had warned me that fishing the way i am will only produce the small trout, as all the big trout are on the bottom. Why would this be? why would only small trout be on the surface, or feeding just below the surface, and the bigger trout on the bottom?

2) I want to make sure i have this accurate on fishing the different zones. This is what i have so far; is this accurate?

• floating flyline with dry fly - fishing on surface
  
• floating flyline with wet fly - fish from just below the surface to whatever depth you allow it to sink
  
• wet flyline with wet fly - fish along the bottom.

3) my leader (it came with a built in tippet) is 9ft 4X take so long to sing even with a wet fly, and doesn't seem to sink all the way. only up to where the tippet thickens up. During during this 2-3 minutes when I'm waiting for the fly to sink what should I be doing? retrieving slowly, or simply waiting for it to sink?

[3blade]

1) kind of. Bigger trout have learned to avoid predators, and don't splash about the way the aggressive little ones do. They also tend to find bigger food items closer to the bottom. But given the right conditions they can be caught on the surface - hoppers, big caddis hatch, salmon fly hatch, etc.

2) need to read some books, or check out the orvis vids. Lots of different strategies, depending on conditions and what you are trying to imitate.

3) tie your own. You can use different tapers/weights to tweak your presentations. Back to back uni knots between different line types, loop knot on your leader for a loop to loop connection to your fly line.

Fluorocarbon will sink much faster than standard monofilament. The strategy you are using is highly effective on pond trout, this is what I do when fishing wet flys: 6-8 ft of 6 lb vanish fluorocarbon line, loop to loop connection to the fly line, small strike indicator right at the fly line. Cast out wet fly, which slowly sinks while moving with the wave action. Give it a couple min, repeat, casting where you have seen fish rise. Got way more hookups doing this than fishing drys, cause with drys the little hyper-aggressive fish tend to push the fly out of the way.

You only need a tapered leader if the fly must turn over for proper presentation, wet flys or nymphs don't matter unless they are super heavy, and then its just to avoid tangles

[grinr]

BCF,I would highly reccomend that you pick up a book or two that will literally shave YEARS off the learning curve of flyfishing."The Orvis Guide To Beginning Flyfishing" and/or "The Orvis Flyfishing Guide".Both rookie and seasoned veteran flyfishers alike would benefit from these books.I'll admit I've never read the second book,but the "beginner" book was available in an online version on Orvis' website several years ago.At the time,I had been avidly flyfishing for almost 20years when I stumbled upon it browsing the web and I picked up several useful tips,tactics and techniques from it.I can only assume that the second book is a more advanced version?Both are authored by Tom Rosenbauer.Again,I haven't read the 2nd book,but the begginer book is just simply very well done and will completely demystify the sport and science of flyfishing.Ive reccomended it to several aspiring new flyfishers over the last decade.
For less then the cost of a dozen flies,I gaurantee it will save you years of frustrating trial and error and listening to nonsense BS spewed from random strangers that will tell you big fish don't feed on the surface.

[densa44]

I've fished with all the wet flys that you'll ever see, about 100 years ago but if I was starting out now, get the books and as the boys how to fish nymphs.

The big fish lie at the bottom, for the reasons mentioned plus they can lay behind large rocks and don't have to fight the current.

Tie your own flies is excellent advice too, you will lose 100's and that is OK.

Ask to see some of the AO member's favourite nymph patters, and some are large.

Welcome to the club, careful wading will do more for you than long casts, also when you fish drys (grasshoppers or caddis flys) plus nymphs you will be working up stream.

Put the big ones back.

[boner54]

If you are ever up around Red Deer, let me know. I will take you out for an afternoon. Fly fished for many many years and use to guide. Would love to pass on any experience and knowledge

[damaltor]

All excellent info posted already by other members.

Fishing Muir & other pothole lakes from shore can be tough, but can produce some nice fish. For Muir in particular, best results at this time, will be had using leeches and chironomids hung a foot or so off the bottom under a strike indicator.

For starters try a black or olive leech in around size 10 or 8, for chironomids try black w/red rib white beadhead, chromie silver w/red rib black beadhead w/antron gills & dark olive w/silver rib black beadhead w/antron gills tied on size 12-10 scud hook. Although the colors, sizes, etc. are almost endless for leeches and chironomids, these are go to choices and are usually very productive.

As I have read you are fishing off the dock at Muir, try this... hang your fly around 6' under your indicator and try to cast 30'-40' straight out and to the right. Let it sink and sit static for a good while, keeping your line as straight to the indicator as possible. If it starts to drift or you just can't take starring at it anymore, give it a slow short retrieve and cast again. Watch for any movement on your indicator, slight bob, sideways pull or it goes right under and SET!!!

This is by know means the end all, do all of fly fishing this lake or any other lake, but hopefully might get you into some bigger fish. As others have stated read all you can and talk to more experienced anglers and it all will begin to make sense.

BTW, welcome to the addiction!

[Flieguy]

one thing I'd like to add:

you can get down 10 feet or more with floating fly line. Use heavy flies and 12-15' 4x or thinner leaders. Also try a small split shot or two (this will really mess with your casting though).

you can also cheat a little and use a spey sink tip right on your regular WF floating line, it's just not super graceful.


also, google "catatonic leech method"

[Chernobyl Ant]

Originally Posted by Flieguy

one thing I'd like to add:

you can get down 10 feet or more with floating fly line. Use heavy flies and 12-15' 4x or thinner leaders. Also try a small split shot or two (this will really mess with your casting though).

you can also cheat a little and use a spey sink tip right on your regular WF floating line, it's just not super graceful.


also, google "catatonic leech method"

X2