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Old 06-15-2021, 07:37 AM
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catnthehat catnthehat is offline
 
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Default Loading th 577 Snider

As promise, I am putting this thread up for those interested in loading the 577 Snider.
First off, a picture of one of my original paper cartridge rounds next to a 24 gauge Mag tech case , and two 5.56 rounds, and a little history of thhe carttridge
The Snider was made with foil wrapped brass cases, the paper case as pictured, and drawn brass as well. The drawn brass I have seen is marked "57 Snider" and was made by Dominion cartridge company, which was later became C.I.L.
It was loaded with shot charges as well as bullets.
The bullet itself was hollow based like a Minnie ball, but had a wooden plug inn the base to help the bullet obturate and grab the rifling of those converted muskets, but I am not sure if the cases marked 57 Snider had a hollow based bullet.
There was a filler made up of carded wool between the powder and the bullet.
Many shooters use a .58 Minie designed for the Enfield musket - which is essentially what the Snider is, a converted musket.
However, accuracy is spotty at best from what I have read.
The Minie is often used however when fire forming the brass.
I do not use them, preferring to use solid based cast bullets .

Loading can be done by hand without dies if the cases are already formed, which is very cool!
Cat
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Old 06-15-2021, 08:29 AM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default .577 Snider

I will be getting a Snider from my uncle's estate at some point.Not sure of the providence but free is good. The dies are crazy expensive.There is a guy on a website that loads his in 24ga brass and fills the airspace between the bullet and charge with cornmeal topped with a 20ga overshot card.He was getting 4" groups at 100 yards or thereabouts.I'll have to wait and see what model I am getting and if it has an iron or steel barrel .ROT varies as I understand some shoot better with a .600 ball and 24ga cut plastic shotgun hulls.
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Old 06-15-2021, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Pioneer2 View Post
I will be getting a Snider from my uncle's estate at some point.Not sure of the providence but free is good. The dies are crazy expensive.There is a guy on a website that loads his in 24ga brass and fills the airspace between the bullet and charge with cornmeal topped with a 20ga overshot card.He was getting 4" groups at 100 yards or thereabouts.I'll have to wait and see what model I am getting and if it has an iron or steel barrel .ROT varies as I understand some shoot better with a .600 ball and 24ga cut plastic shotgun hulls.
My rifle is an iron barreled MK1 and although I stRted using rolled oats ( accuracy wad good) I have dlso switched to cornmeal for several reasons.
One, it us more consitant , and two, I THINK it helps in scrubbing the bore fouling from the previous shot.
I can go 20 rounds and still make mreliable hits on the 200 meter steel .
Cat
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Old 06-15-2021, 09:26 AM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default Reloading

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAEfDVq8cIQ&t=117s
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  #5  
Old 06-15-2021, 09:45 AM
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First off, you need to get some MagTech 24 gauge brass, trim it down , anneal it and form it in a sizing die.
HOWEVER here are the tools you need too load your snider cases after they have been fireformed , notice the absence of any dies.

Decapping is a simple procedure of holding the case in a gloved hand , and knocking out the primer

The new primer is seated using a Lees punch with a hole in the end ( the MagTech brass has a dome in it) Or a dowel with a small hole in the end.
There is no danger o9of settiing ioff thhe primer is there iis full contact on the cup. I showed the pic on my vice anvil, but you can do it on the bench using nickel under the case


The powder is then measured ( note that this measure is set at 70)
and the appropriate amount of cornmeal set right on top of it-I doo not use a wad to separate them.


After that, an .035 wad or similar thickness is placed on to of the cornmeal to stop the lube from migrating down and getting stuff stuck onn the base of the bullet


The final step is to lube the bullet. You can use several different types, I have shown Bore Butter here buut my favorite is a lube from Paul Mathews' book on BPCR loading. Some people use a 50/500 mix of beeswax and lard, and I think that is close too what the original was.
After that, the bullet is simply pushed down until you hit the end of the grease l=groove, that gives you 2.5" if the brass is trimmed correctly.
Fire away with any questions or comments , because I have surely taken something for granted that is important!
Cat
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Old 06-15-2021, 10:41 AM
Boogerfart Boogerfart is offline
 
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Awesome! Since dies are expensive and hard to find but only really needed for forming would it be possible to make a Lee Loader style forming die on a small lathe to let you get going?
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Old 06-15-2021, 10:52 AM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default components

From what I remember as a kid the Snider was a carbine [one band] so not sure if it's original or Bubba got ahold of it? ROT and bore condition remains to be seen. Guess I'll have to wait and see before selecting a projectile.What are the bullets you are using? Jet bullets has some Snider hollow based and solid ones as well.I'll get a box of brass and the two punches for now and go from there.
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  #8  
Old 06-15-2021, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boogerfart View Post
Awesome! Since dies are expensive and hard to find but only really needed for forming would it be possible to make a Lee Loader style forming die on a small lathe to let you get going?
I see no reason why a simple set of dies could not be made by someone handy with a lathe!
Cat
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Old 06-15-2021, 02:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pioneer2 View Post
From what I remember as a kid the Snider was a carbine [one band] so not sure if it's original or Bubba got ahold of it? ROT and bore condition remains to be seen. Guess I'll have to wait and see before selecting a projectile.What are the bullets you are using? Jet bullets has some Snider hollow based and solid ones as well.I'll get a box of brass and the two punches for now and go from there.
If it is a cavalry carbine it will have a coupon studs on the stock for a sight cover

My bullets are a flat base made from a mold designed by Martini/ Snider guru Kerry Jenkinson , and sold to Lee for manufacture .
It is a single lube groove type weighing 450 grains
Cat
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Old 06-16-2021, 05:58 PM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default bullet

Do they still sell the mold?
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Old 06-17-2021, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Pioneer2 View Post
Do they still sell the mold?
I am not too sure, you would have to phone and check
I know Accurate molds makes one as well, but they are more expensive .
I do know that Jet makes bullet but a guy should maybe slug the bore first to see the proper size needed.
Cat
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  #12  
Old 06-17-2021, 07:04 AM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default Jet has two choices

https://jetbullets.com/soft-cast-bullets
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Old 07-01-2021, 01:33 PM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default molds?

There is a fellow in Washington that makes formed brass from mag-tech reasonably priced as well as two different molds .A .600 dia 440gr SWC "bumblebee" and a 530gr RN also at the correct .600 dia.Which would be preferable IYO ? He also makes a 7/8 die /rod to size your cast bullets to .600 I realize fireforming will be necessary to fit the chamber with likely a hollow based mini. Thoughts?
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Old 07-08-2021, 07:13 PM
Rusty P. Bucket Rusty P. Bucket is offline
 
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Would love to see a range report on that one, Cat!
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Old 07-08-2021, 11:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty P. Bucket View Post
Would love to see a range report on that one, Cat!
Well, I am not sure of the velocity, but that st5eel in 24" across at 200 meters.
I took it to 300 but had to call it quits before we could try 500
Cat

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  #16  
Old 01-16-2022, 09:33 AM
Slinky Pickle Slinky Pickle is offline
 
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Default .577 Snider sizing die

I just recently got into reloading for the.577 Snider and like I saw mentioned above, I didn't want to purchase a sizing die for the 24ga brass. I have stumbled across a lovely little bit of serendipity though... a #2 Morse taper drill adapter is almost exactly the same taper and is typically made of very hard tool steel. If you chuck the brass in a lathe, you should able to simply wind the tail stock onto the brass with the #2 adapter installed and you're done.

My brass is still in transit but if someone else has the opportunity to try this before I do, please let me know.

P.S. This thread is an absolute gem. I am sure that I will reference it often when I'm load mine up. Thank you very much to the O.P.!
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Old 01-16-2022, 09:45 AM
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Big mama

Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
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Old 01-16-2022, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pioneer2 View Post
There is a fellow in Washington that makes formed brass from mag-tech reasonably priced as well as two different molds .A .600 dia 440gr SWC "bumblebee" and a 530gr RN also at the correct .600 dia.Which would be preferable IYO ? He also makes a 7/8 die /rod to size your cast bullets to .600 I realize fireforming will be necessary to fit the chamber with likely a hollow based mini. Thoughts?
Sorry I missed your post Dean, I don't have any of these threads subscribes!
The factory loading was a 480 grain bullet, it would be great to try that 530 bullet.
Cat
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Old 01-16-2022, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slinky Pickle View Post
I just recently got into reloading for the.577 Snider and like I saw mentioned above, I didn't want to purchase a sizing die for the 24ga brass. I have stumbled across a lovely little bit of serendipity though... a #2 Morse taper drill adapter is almost exactly the same taper and is typically made of very hard tool steel. If you chuck the brass in a lathe, you should able to simply wind the tail stock onto the brass with the #2 adapter installed and you're done.

My brass is still in transit but if someone else has the opportunity to try this before I do, please let me know.

P.S. This thread is an absolute gem. I am sure that I will reference it often when I'm load mine up. Thank you very much to the O.P.!
I wish II still had a lathe available to me!
Cat
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  #20  
Old 01-20-2022, 10:18 AM
Slinky Pickle Slinky Pickle is offline
 
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It looks like I'll have to butcher the Morse taper adapter I have. Once I get the brass sized in the adapter I'm going to have to tap it back out with a mallet and dowel so I'll have to cut off the tang end to put the dowel through. I may also run out of depth before I get the taper right so I may have to shorten the adapter's wide end too. Not a big deal... I got the adapter with something I bout 15 years ago and I've never used it so I'll call it free.






In prep for my bullets arriving, I made up a little lube. From what I've read, the standard lube in the day was a 50/50 mixture of lard and beeswax. I had a jar of my own bear lard and a bunch of wax from my own bees so here's my bee/bear bullet lube.

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Old 01-20-2022, 10:41 AM
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That mix should work perfectly!
The modified Morse adapter will be interesting for sure!
Cat
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  #22  
Old 01-25-2022, 08:16 PM
Slinky Pickle Slinky Pickle is offline
 
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Catnthehat did you ever measure your velocity for that load? I'm just curious as to where I might end up.

The brass arrived today and once I get a few other things done I'll post up how things go. So far it's looking pretty positive.
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Old 01-26-2022, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slinky Pickle View Post
Catnthehat did you ever measure your velocity for that load? I'm just curious as to where I might end up.

The brass arrived today and once I get a few other things done I'll post up how things go. So far it's looking pretty positive.
I will chronograph it today and let you know.
I never did check the velocity on these loads.
Cat
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Old 01-26-2022, 09:52 AM
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I disassembled one of those old DC Co 577 rounds to examine how they were loaded. I will see if I can find the pics/details.

Edit: I went and took a couple of pics. Left is Kynoch - Right is DC Co. I cannot say for certain if the DC Co cartridge had a wisp of cotton in it although I do not think so.



Quite the difference in the amount of powder between the two rounds and not the different type shape of the grains




I had also disassembled a 56-50 Spencer round at some point.

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  #25  
Old 01-26-2022, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slinky Pickle View Post
Catnthehat did you ever measure your velocity for that load? I'm just curious as to where I might end up.

The brass arrived today and once I get a few other things done I'll post up how things go. So far it's looking pretty positive.
Average velocity for five rounds os 1,050 FPS.
Cat
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  #26  
Old 01-26-2022, 04:54 PM
Kawibunga Kawibunga is offline
 
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Don't own one, but the thread had me googling to learn a bit about the 577

Came across this. A day late and a dollar short as they say as I'm sure it might have been of interest......

https://joesalter.ca/products/reload...-t6-577-snider
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  #27  
Old 09-14-2022, 06:11 AM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default My Uncle's Snider is OTW

I'm a little excited my uncle's Snider is on the way should be here in 10 days or so.I refrained from purchasing components until I see what I've got and it's condition.
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  #28  
Old 09-15-2022, 02:44 PM
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Slinky, I am curious to see how your taper adapter worked out. My Brass just arrived last week and I have the same problem to solve. I was gifted some old dominion brass but it wont chamber due to a bulge just above the base.

Kirt at Prairie Projectiles https://prairieprojectiles.ca/ hooked me up with some bullets to start with.
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  #29  
Old 09-22-2022, 07:47 AM
Pioneer2 Pioneer2 is offline
 
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Default trim length

I have read different accounts for trimming brass 24ga some say 2" others a little shorter? Which is correct or will it vary gun to gun re: chamber cut? I noticed the Dominion round is shorter than the paper rolled round and the Kynoch. Will the 3 groove shoot conicals or better with .600 ball? I'll be shortening brass with a small plumbing pipe cutter and appropriately sized hardwood or aluminum dowel inserted in the case. Then chamfer the neck inside and out. Annealed 10 seconds with a blow torch with brass in a cordless drill socket to hold it without burning your hands then each dumped to cool.
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Old 09-22-2022, 09:07 AM
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I nirmally hold my brass and turn it in my fingers until it is too hot to hold then drop it onto a towel.
I have yet to try the socket system but plan to.
Cat
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