.223 vs .308 for paper and varmints

[lowlife72]

Hi All

Looking for some final confirmation before I actually lay down the cash.

I have decided on a Remington SPS Tacical as the rifle of choice for me (good starting price with lots of possible upgrades later). I plan on using it primarilly for punching paper with some varmint hunting as well. I expect that the range I will be shooting at most of the time will be between 100 and 500 yards. However, there is a local range that gets out to 1000 yards and I am certainly interested in doing some shooting out to that distance. There is a small chance that I may paticipate in some competative shoots at ranges from 400 to 900 yards.

The appeal of the .223 is of course the cost of ammo (I know that there is very little cost difference if you reload but I currently do not). Plus, I like the idea of light recoil. But, I am not sure about the range and accuracy and have not been able to find much info using search or googling.

The .308 seems to be the caliber of choice for longer range shooting. However, it is slightly more expensive to shoot (about 35% more on average over a variety of loads where I live). The recoil will be heavier although still mild (not much different than my .243 I expect).

I only own 2 rifles at the moment which I suppose does play a part in making a final choice. They are a Ruger 10/22 and a Ruger M77 in .243 and I have owned both for about 20 years.

I know the easy answer is just buy the .308. But I find he .223 to be interesting and appealing for really no specific reason. I'd probably just pick one up but I'm concerned about being dissapointed in the range and accuracy. Any feedback, advice, or information about the 2 calibers would be appreciated.

Thank you in advance.

[Jerry D]

If varminting is on the to shoot list I'd go with the .223. The .308 is more of a "bigger game" round mind you it'll do fine on varmints with the "light" 110grain bullets of which are rare if not nonexistent in factory ammo meaning you'd have to reload. It'll do fine with the normal hunting bullets too but recoil/muzzle blast will increase and its a little pricey for shooting varmints.

The .308 is a popular round... probably because it's the Nato 7.62x51, as well its in a short action, and North America has always been fond of the .30 cals

If your just looking at shooting paper many smaller rounds have better ballistics compared to the .308 such as a .243, .260, or 7mm08 (to an extent I believe) - along with a slew of other 6mm, 6.5, and 7mm rounds. The .308 will have the best barrel life of all though, about 2x some of the others.

If you haven't considered it yet, your .243 could work well as a long range rig.

PS - expect 2x the recoil from a .308 compared to your .243

[Dick284]

Have you spent any time shooting either caliber?

[lowlife72]

I don't beleive that I have ever fired either a .223 or a .308. Most of my shooting has been on my .243 and .22-250. Both of which I like. Plus a handfull of shots from a 7mm mag, .303, and 7.62x39.

I suppose that the .243 is essentially a necked down .308 may be part of the reason that a .223 seems appealing.

Mostly I just want a new toy. But, it has to be really accurate. Trying to shoot better every time is more fun to me than just throwing a ton of lead and hoping it hits something. (OK, that's fun too, but a different topic all together)

[Dick284]

Accuracy is a very relative sort of subject.
Are you talking BR sub .3 MOA sort of stuff, or simply be able to hit a basket ball at a given range.

Until you determine the games you want to play a requirement for accuracy is hard to define.

223's although very economical really start to get taken out of the race in the 600 yd relm's, heavier bullets with custom fast twist BBL's will maybe get you into the 800 yd game, but a 75gr. or 80 gr. bullet at low velocity is still pretty much at the whim of gravity, and wind.

The 308 with it's heavier bullets does'nt suffer in the wind to the same degree as the 223, but it is more costly and has more recoil.

The 243 is prone to pressure spikes especially with heavier bullets, this fact probaly is why you dont see it too much in competitions.
The 6PPC or 6BR on the other hand will likely give a good account of themselves in similar situations as you discribe.

Then there are the 6.5mm's, 260, 6.5x55, and 6.5-284, they seem to couple the light recoil high BC, and MV suited to LR shooting.

And then there is the 7mm-08, pushed from illigitamate offspring to factory fodder, by the silhouette community.

Have fun choosing one, because it seems most of us gun cranks cant, you might as well admit it, if you have a real passion for this game, more than one pony will be in the stable.

The .223 and .308 are incomparable. The .223 is an excelllent varminter round particularly if you want to save the hides. The .308 is inherently amazingly accurate out to 600 yds. thus making it a caliber of choice for competition. In my humble opinion, the .223 is unbeatable as a varmint round, but the .308 is the caliber of choice to shoot paper out far away.
As far as I'm concerned, there is no cross-over between the two, pick your choice of sport and then pick the caliber and rifle accordingly.

[Jerry D]

In your 2nd post you said you have a 22-250? If that's the case I'd get a .308 so you'd have something in the larger end of the spectrum.

[Cappy]

If you want a rifle to shoot paper and varmints. Than IMHO the .223 is a good bet. Between the two there isn't a lot of difference between the .308 shooting 168-175gr bullets and the .223 shooting 75gr and heavier match bullets. If memory serves me correctly the SPS tactical is a 1-9" twist so it should shoot the 75gr Amax bullets in the very least. It will absolutely get bounced around by the wind more, but that helps with attention to detail which will make you a better marksman anyways.

I've seen the .223 driven out to mile in good conditions. The 75gr Amax seems to still stay stable after they have gone sub-sonic.

Nothing wrong with the .308 either, it will really depend on what you want to primarilly use it for.

[Tcon]

Originally Posted by gitrdun

... The .308 is inherently amazingly accurate out to 600 yds....

There is a never ending debate about inherent accuracy but the .308 is a fully capable 1000yard cartridge.

[lowlife72]

Originally Posted by Tcon

There is a never ending debate about inherent accuracy but the .308 is a fully capable 1000yard cartridge.

It's a tough choice when you are only planning on buying 1 as there seem to be pro's and cons to either caliber. Here is an interesting chart detailing recoil of different calibers. http://www.accuratereloading.com/recoil.html

Sort of makes me wonder how enjoyable shooing the .308 is when you are going through 40 - 60 rounds at a time.

[Cappy]

Unless you are recoil sensitive, shooting a heavy tactical type rifle in .308 is no big deal. I've burned through upwards of 150 rounds in a day with no problems at all. Although it was out of a rifle that sits around 12-13lbs. My 9lb LTR thumps a little bit if I load 178gr bullets hot, but shooting the 155-168's is nothing.

If you want to spot your own shots than you are better off with a .223 unless you plan on shooting long. Then you can usually recover in time to see your shot coming in.

[lowlife72]

Hey guys, thank you for all the help. I bought a new .223 today.

Now, I just have to find out where I can shoot it without having to drive to Brooks all the time.