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  #1  
Old 01-15-2018, 07:13 PM
Huevos Huevos is offline
 
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Default Organized wolf trapping

There is a thread on huntbc where a bunch of guys are pooling resources to support the trappers in their hunting areas to take care of some wolves. I thought it might be something to think about. I know the past few years have been increasingly worse for wolves where my family hunts.... Check it out and let me know what you think.
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Old 01-15-2018, 07:30 PM
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Yup....Govt refusing to acknowledge and address the real problem in BC. Ungulates getting whiped out. Good on guys stepping up to help lend a hand and trappers for doing their part.
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Old 01-15-2018, 07:32 PM
Newview01 Newview01 is offline
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So what can non-trappers do to help trappers?
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Old 01-15-2018, 08:37 PM
Sitkaspruce Sitkaspruce is offline
 
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We are setting up EMT's to local trappers and help pay for their trapping, specifically wolves. They have to be registered and known trappers from others, like having references, before they are getting involved. And they have to be trapping wolves!!

There is a grounds root movement starting and it is by the guy who is known as Proguide66 on FB and owner of How to Hunt app. He is deadly of wolves!!

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showth...f-Wolf-Talk-eh

It sounds like this is going to be big here in BC!!!

Cheers

SS
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Old 01-15-2018, 09:06 PM
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I help out my trappers by donating trim & bones etc to them

call them when i spot pack activity in a area

staying away from bait sites

defend them publicly in conversations

go to Rendezvous and volunteer

1 pack of 15 wolves need's a lot of ungulates a year(1=22 less)

trappers are a friend indeed

Thanks to all of them

2018 wildlife management plan

David



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  #6  
Old 01-15-2018, 09:13 PM
slough shark slough shark is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speckle55 View Post
I help out my trappers by donating trim & bones etc to them

call them when i spot pack activity in a area

staying away from bait sites

defend them publicly in conversations

go to Rendezvous and volunteer

1 pack of 15 wolves need's a lot of ungulates a year(1=22 less)

trappers are a friend indeed

Thanks to all of them

2018 wildlife management plan

David



David
That’s a great idea with the bait donating, I will have bones, trim, hide etc... if any wolf trappers anywhere close to airdrie need them. They would be available in around a week or so after I take butcher the elk
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Old 01-15-2018, 09:48 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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I just read the Wolf funding thread on the BC forum and it sure sounds like something that could be done, or at least started, right here on A/O.
I think the OP indicated it was funding for hardware,fuel and other day to day expenses that the Trappers would require to really get things going. Most of them aren't overly flush with cash.

Can't see where a cash stake of $5-800.00 or whatever wouldn't entice most of them to get going and target the Wolves. .. register 5 or so kills with the donors and get another stake etc. and on it goes. Whatever the method it sounds to me like a great initiative. Just needs a bit of work to set it up. However way it goes, I'm in for $200.00 if we want to get this off the ground.
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Last edited by Salavee; 01-15-2018 at 09:55 PM.
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Old 01-15-2018, 09:55 PM
Huevos Huevos is offline
 
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Ya, a guy is going to have to find the local trapper and see if they are interested. If there are any trappers that would target wolves if they had more funds on here, now is your chance to make yourselves known.
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Old 01-15-2018, 11:59 PM
StenneS StenneS is offline
 
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Is there a way of contacting trapper by area? I know there are some trap lines in a specific area I was hunting and actually ran into him and his wife and couple they had out helping them with their cabin during archery elk season. Is there a way of finding out who this might be as I forgot to grab his info but I really like the idea of helping them out with some resources and information through some game cameras I have up in his area.
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Old 01-16-2018, 12:20 AM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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ATA might have some ideas.
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Old 01-16-2018, 10:02 AM
nube nube is offline
 
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Here is my take on it as one of the trappers that has done a lot in my area to clean up the wolves.....

I need a ton of bait. This is my biggest issue. I take what I can when I go up and scrounge around to get a bit but I need a lot of it and when you start hauling bait and finding it it costs a ton of money.

Each wolf on the market will fetch $150-$300 on average. I get a bit more for my good ones selling private. I would say half or more of the wolves I have caught are mange and grossly infested useless hides. Garbage basically. Mostly because they are starving and not healthy I must add....

Most times a wolf trapper will catch a couple a year hear or there with limited bait or equipment out. It will not do anything to kill the odd wolf or 2 out of a pack. They still have killing power. You need to wipe out a min. of half a pack to do the ungulates any good.

You ask why trappers don't do more and it all comes down to money. I put bait out and work hard to catch a pile of useless wolves when I have had $125 coyotes running under my wolf snares all season long that I don't catch. I have done it for the fun of catching them and also my area has been destroyed by our so called expert biologists and all the ungulates are scarce.
I have wiped out a few packs now and have seen triple the deer , moose and elk sign this year. It took years but I am now seeing rewards of it. It is getting better.
But... at a cost to me!
I have continued this year because of a new program to save some caribou..... I figured we will see if there is funding at the end of it and maybe cover my costs or make a few bucks but I am skeptical. If it doesn't work out I might just go back to killing coyotes instead of wolves.

If I was supported by funding I would continue.

Also the other issue is that nobody can trap on a registered trapline except the trapper. If I could bait all over Alberta I would for sure be snaring more wolves. Lots of trappers don't even use their lines anymore and they sit there untouched. Most would agree this is not right. I also asked about buying another trapline and was told I already have one so I wouldn't most likely be approved for it.....

In the end it comes down to 2 things and that is money and bait for myself.
My take on it from a guy who actually does it and sees what the effects are.

You have to break those packs down in size. Hunters can not do it. They can't kill enough to make a difference. You need to knock a pack down to 3-4 animals and they will hunt smaller game and not kill a moose a week like a pack of 6-12 will. You have to realise if you got 2-3 packs in an area what that is doing to the moose populations. It's unreal!
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  #12  
Old 01-16-2018, 10:05 AM
jawa jawa is offline
 
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Bait is a big one need lots to run a good bait hides trim and bones all work find out who is trapping in your area and phone them
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Old 01-16-2018, 10:19 AM
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Can non trappers help out boots on the ground? I'd definitely help out any trappers near by (I am located in Calgary). Even if it's just grunt work like helping get bait out to the spots
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Old 01-16-2018, 10:32 AM
nube nube is offline
 
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Can non trappers help out boots on the ground? I'd definitely help out any trappers near by (I am located in Calgary). Even if it's just grunt work like helping get bait out to the spots
I have the odd guy come out but for me it is sometimes a pain. It's like trying to organize a hunt with someone.
When I go I leave at the craziest hrs. I leave sometimes after the kids go to bed and drive late at night to get up there. Then work my arse off to get things done and come home. I don't stop for food. I go go go.
I am also a last min. kinda guy where I don't know when my next trip will be. I have an idea of a timeframe but will up and go when I see I have a day or 2 to go. It's hard for others to come along with my schedule. Not sure about how others do things tho.
Hauling bait would be helpful though if I had big chunks of bait.

One real big way of helping would be if guys froze meat scraps in buckets for trappers. I know if I had guys collecting bait and freezing it in tupperware containers for me so I could just swing by and grab bait that would be HUGE!.

I had a crazy idea of a hunter drop off. I thought of getting a bin and have guys drop off their scraps after they butcher them. Issue with that is I am in town and I don't think the neighbors would like that lol
I also don't need people I don't know knowing where I live either and having people around I don't know. It's an issue every year with people tossing their scraps on roads or trespassing on some farmers field to dump them. I am sure guys would like a place to dump their stuff
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Old 01-16-2018, 10:46 AM
pgavey pgavey is offline
 
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What happens to all the road kill animals ? Does F&W collect these, or the highway crews pick them up?
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Old 01-16-2018, 11:00 AM
nube nube is offline
 
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What happens to all the road kill animals ? Does F&W collect these, or the highway crews pick them up?
Yup but some F and W only let you use them in the area you trap in and you can't take them in other areas. Worries about CWD kinda stuff. I have 2 places I grab some from but sometimes the locals get it first for resident trapping or their own baits. Other times it is frozen and hard to get a whole moose on your truck and I don't have the equipment. Again it costs a lot to haul a big trailer around in hopes you find a moose to pick up....kinda thing
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Old 01-16-2018, 12:07 PM
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Nube

Is there not some meat processor like Shawn's or H and M in GP, or meat stores that butcher like Superstore etc that would produce all the trim and leftover you could ever use?
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Old 01-16-2018, 12:24 PM
play.soccer play.soccer is offline
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Contact highway companies like Carillion, they remove roadkill all the time and they have a place they dump them.
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Old 01-16-2018, 12:33 PM
nube nube is offline
 
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Nube

Is there not some meat processor like Shawn's or H and M in GP, or meat stores that butcher like Superstore etc that would produce all the trim and leftover you could ever use?
Do u want me to drive 5 hrs from home and a couple hrs from my trapline at my expense and thousands of dollars to haul it to my trapline? What good does that do for me. Even driving half hr or an hr to a butcher store with a trailer full is not worth it. How many wolves at an average of $150 at auction is it going to take to recoup my money let alone all the thousands I am missing from targeting wolves and not coyotes at my baits lol
It is not worth it to the trapper and that is what I am trying to get across.
Even a bounty of $300 a piece like some counties is not worth it to really target them.
To do it right you need a large amount of bait like a truckload per 2 weeks or less. Then try running 5-8 baits in an area and the KM in between. I trap them because it was new to me and fun and wanted to do some good for the Ungulates. After this year I will see if I will continue but I doubt it at the scale I have done.

It's all great and dandy if hunters want to contribute to a fund to help out but I think it won't work. How many would actually contribute? How much would they contribute? I doubt that many or that much. There will also be some that take advantage of the system as well. Do you pay trappers per wolf or do you pay them for their time and how many baits they run no matter if they catch one or 2 a year? Easy to get around the system unless you got dead wolves in hand but it isn't fair for the guy that sucks at trapping or doesn't have many wolves to trap and tried as hard as he could.
Personally I think a dead wolf takes as much work as me killing 20 coyotes. Coyotes are worth more right now and if I was in it just for the money there is no way I would even bother with wolves unless u paid me $2K or more per wolf. Basically that is what the Gov't pays out when they wage their war on them from what I have heard. Wish that was in my pocket instead of doing it for free.
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Old 01-16-2018, 12:37 PM
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Contact highway companies like Carillion, they remove roadkill all the time and they have a place they dump them.
Yup and Like I said it's not all you think it would be.
It gets picked through by a lot of guys. They are not going to store it for you. Do I spent the money pulling a trailer in hopes there is something more there than the odd deer? Again it is not worth it!

Plus it has to be close to the area you trap as F and W are worried about disease transfer like I previously mentioned
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Old 01-16-2018, 12:41 PM
play.soccer play.soccer is offline
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Yup and Like I said it's not all you think it would be.
It gets picked through by a lot of guys. They are not going to store it for you. Do I spent the money pulling a trailer in hopes there is something more there than the odd deer? Again it is not worth it!

Plus it has to be close to the area you trap as F and W are worried about disease transfer like I previously mentioned
Maybe you should make friends with a foreman at a shop in a location you like.
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Old 01-16-2018, 01:06 PM
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Nube

Take a chill pill buddy. I was NOT trying to be an ahoe. I used GP meat processors as an example because they are ones I am familiar with. I presume there would be something similar close to you. I know Superstore and groceries with in house butchers are pretty prevalent across the province.

If, as you say, driving even a half hour for unlimited bait is not feasible then you are probably right, baiting Wolves is not a feasible deal in your view. Does however make me wonder just what the return per wolf would have to be for it to make economic sense in your books if even $450 (150 for hide and 300 bounty) isn't enough to make it feasible.

Personally I would be quite happy to contribute to someone who does want to do this but it would be nice to see some estimate by those who trap for a living as to what it would take for a program to be workable. One thought would be to use the Alberta Trappers association and have them pay a top up bounty on every wolf hide a trapper runs through the auctions. Easy to track and administer and fair across the board to those who are catching the wolves. As far as fair to the poor trapper, as far as I know, if you don't catch fur no one is making a charitable payment to them while they learn, no reason wolf shouldn't work the same. You get paid for success in pretty much everything.
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Old 01-16-2018, 01:22 PM
nube nube is offline
 
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Nube

Take a chill pill buddy. I was NOT trying to be an ahoe. I used GP meat processors as an example because they are ones I am familiar with. I presume there would be something similar close to you. I know Superstore and groceries with in house butchers are pretty prevalent across the province.

If, as you say, driving even a half hour for unlimited bait is not feasible then you are probably right, baiting Wolves is not a feasible deal in your view. Does however make me wonder just what the return per wolf would have to be for it to make economic sense in your books if even $450 (150 for hide and 300 bounty) isn't enough to make it feasible.

Personally I would be quite happy to contribute to someone who does want to do this but it would be nice to see some estimate by those who trap for a living as to what it would take for a program to be workable. One thought would be to use the Alberta Trappers association and have them pay a top up bounty on every wolf hide a trapper runs through the auctions. Easy to track and administer and fair across the board to those who are catching the wolves. As far as fair to the poor trapper, as far as I know, if you don't catch fur no one is making a charitable payment to them while they learn, no reason wolf shouldn't work the same. You get paid for success in pretty much everything.
No chill pill needed bud lol Just saying it how it is.
So your idea is to get the ATA to pay a top up? Where do they get the money?
They have been fighting for a wolf bounty for years from the Gov't so please let me know how the money is to be found for wolf trappers?

As far as meat processing facilities do you guys realise that coyotes are worth $125 a piece on average? How many people out there do you think are wanting bait and it's not just the trappers? Kinda tough to find a location to load up on bait. Even the closest butcher shop to my trapline is saving it all for spring bear hunts for an outfitter all winter long.
I get what I can from a guy close to me here but it is enough to run one or 2 coyote baits a year is all.
Like I said you need truckloads.

As for your question on what it takes to make sense for me to do it price wise I mentioned that earlier. I can run 1 bait and catch 15-30 coyotes at $125 a piece of I can run 5-6 half arsed wolf baits like I do and hook into 8-13 wolves a year. And like I said half at least of those wolves will be useless fur wise so would only be good for bounty purposes. I think you can do the math to see what is worth catching and how much it would take to even make it as equal for your time and energy.
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Old 01-16-2018, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Dean2 View Post
Nube

Take a chill pill buddy. I was NOT trying to be an ahoe. I used GP meat processors as an example because they are ones I am familiar with. I presume there would be something similar close to you. I know Superstore and groceries with in house butchers are pretty prevalent across the province.

If, as you say, driving even a half hour for unlimited bait is not feasible then you are probably right, baiting Wolves is not a feasible deal in your view. Does however make me wonder just what the return per wolf would have to be for it to make economic sense in your books if even $450 (150 for hide and 300 bounty) isn't enough to make it feasible.

Personally I would be quite happy to contribute to someone who does want to do this but it would be nice to see some estimate by those who trap for a living as to what it would take for a program to be workable. One thought would be to use the Alberta Trappers association and have them pay a top up bounty on every wolf hide a trapper runs through the auctions. Easy to track and administer and fair across the board to those who are catching the wolves. As far as fair to the poor trapper, as far as I know, if you don't catch fur no one is making a charitable payment to them while they learn, no reason wolf shouldn't work the same. You get paid for success in pretty much everything.
"Personally I think a dead wolf takes as much work as me killing 20 coyotes. Coyotes are worth more right now and if I was in it just for the money there is no way I would even bother with wolves unless u paid me $2K or more per wolf. Basically that is what the Gov't pays out when they wage their war on them from what I have heard. Wish that was in my pocket instead of doing it for free."


$2k a wolf lol
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Old 01-16-2018, 01:43 PM
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I WOULD CONTRIBUTE SERIOUS MONEY TO THE ATA SO THEY COULD PAY A TOP UP BOUNTY IF ATA SETS IT UP. If it really takes $2000 per marketable hide or $1,850 bounty, don't think it is going to work, but at a more reasonable $250 top up bounty per hide I think there would be a lot of interest from hunters. I firmly believe there are a lot of other hunters willing to do the same. Is that clear and succinct enough?

Nube - you are a member. If ATA is really interested in doing something get them to give me a call. It would only take 25,000 bucks to take another 1000 wolves out of the system.
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Old 01-16-2018, 01:48 PM
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Bait, bait and more bait. I get some butcher scraps (but expensive and irregular), some friends deer/elk scraps, but it is never enough. Road kill is not possible in my area, as it gets picked up the same day, and my RFMA is in a different WMU so I cannot transport it anyways. It always seems like once a bait gets good, there is no bait left. If anyone is in the Bonnyville, Lac La Biche, Cold Lake, St.Paul area with bait....shoot me a PM!

The biggest hit I have taken to Wolf trapping is the change in the regulations not allowing me to use whole beef carcasses anymore. When I could do that, bait wasn't an issue, and neither were wolves.

Spruce
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Old 01-16-2018, 01:54 PM
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I WOULD CONTRIBUTE SERIOUS MONEY TO THE ATA SO THEY COULD PAY A TOP UP BOUNTY IF ATA SETS IT UP. If it really takes $2000 per marketable hide or $1,850 bounty, don't think it is going to work, but at a more reasonable $250 top up bounty per hide I think there would be a lot of interest from hunters. I firmly believe there are a lot of other hunters willing to do the same. Is that clear and succinct enough?

Nube - you are a member. If ATA is really interested in doing something get them to give me a call. It would only take 25,000 bucks to take another 1000 wolves out of the system.
There is a program starting through the ATA and AB GOV, but it only applies to RFMA's in the Caribou areas. Not sure on $ amounts, or details. I am in a caribou area and am not a part of said program....and I spend half my trapping time chasing said ghosts (or at least I did, like others, I am using most of my bait for coyotes now).

Wolf trapping is a precarious thing.

Spruce
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Old 01-16-2018, 02:01 PM
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I like the idea. And I think we could get a fund together for trappers. Or even start donating scraps.
But it's nice to hear What Nube has to say. I'm not a trapper but I've taken the wolf management course from Trapper Gord. And what Nube is saying, I remember Gord mentioning as well.
Gord specializes in wolves and he even says that they aren't worth it compared to coyotes. A coyote can be processed very quickly, but a wolf takes a long time so time/cost isn't good.
As for helping out, wolves are reclusive so ton of new human scents probably won't help, I remember Gord saying he has dedicated trapping clothes and sometimes he doesn't even get off the snowmobile because wolves seems acclimatized to the gas/oil smell but boots on ground will throw them off.
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Old 01-16-2018, 03:53 PM
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Nube

Take a chill pill buddy. I was NOT trying to be an ahoe. I used GP meat processors as an example because they are ones I am familiar with. I presume there would be something similar close to you. I know Superstore and groceries with in house butchers are pretty prevalent across the province.

If, as you say, driving even a half hour for unlimited bait is not feasible then you are probably right, baiting Wolves is not a feasible deal in your view. Does however make me wonder just what the return per wolf would have to be for it to make economic sense in your books if even $450 (150 for hide and 300 bounty) isn't enough to make it feasible.

Personally I would be quite happy to contribute to someone who does want to do this but it would be nice to see some estimate by those who trap for a living as to what it would take for a program to be workable. One thought would be to use the Alberta Trappers association and have them pay a top up bounty on every wolf hide a trapper runs through the auctions. Easy to track and administer and fair across the board to those who are catching the wolves. As far as fair to the poor trapper, as far as I know, if you don't catch fur no one is making a charitable payment to them while they learn, no reason wolf shouldn't work the same. You get paid for success in pretty much everything.
By the time you skin out the paws turn ears flesh board stuff the paws salt or borax the hard drying areas turn the hide you on average have eight to ten hours in. Make one mistake overlook one detail cut a small hole that cant be sewn to cover without noticing ie ears or toes split the lips wrong loose some wiskers have one spot of fur slippage because you didnt use enough salt or were careless and your three hundred dollar wolf turns into a thirty to fifty dollar wolf. now figure in your time to collect bait haul bait set snares check snares wear and tear on equipment and catching wolves is not at all profitable in todays market.
I do think that the goverment could afford to pay a bounty say half of what it costs them to kill a wolf save money and cure there wolf problem. There is nothing wrong with rewarding someone like nube or a dozen other people who haave gone above and beyond to try to reduce wolves on there line everyone benifits from there efforts
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Old 01-16-2018, 03:57 PM
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Here is my take on it as one of the trappers that has done a lot in my area to clean up the wolves.....

I need a ton of bait. This is my biggest issue. I take what I can when I go up and scrounge around to get a bit but I need a lot of it and when you start hauling bait and finding it it costs a ton of money.

Each wolf on the market will fetch $150-$300 on average. I get a bit more for my good ones selling private. I would say half or more of the wolves I have caught are mange and grossly infested useless hides. Garbage basically. Mostly because they are starving and not healthy I must add....

Most times a wolf trapper will catch a couple a year hear or there with limited bait or equipment out. It will not do anything to kill the odd wolf or 2 out of a pack. They still have killing power. You need to wipe out a min. of half a pack to do the ungulates any good.

You ask why trappers don't do more and it all comes down to money. I put bait out and work hard to catch a pile of useless wolves when I have had $125 coyotes running under my wolf snares all season long that I don't catch. I have done it for the fun of catching them and also my area has been destroyed by our so called expert biologists and all the ungulates are scarce.
I have wiped out a few packs now and have seen triple the deer , moose and elk sign this year. It took years but I am now seeing rewards of it. It is getting better.
But... at a cost to me!
I have continued this year because of a new program to save some caribou..... I figured we will see if there is funding at the end of it and maybe cover my costs or make a few bucks but I am skeptical. If it doesn't work out I might just go back to killing coyotes instead of wolves.

If I was supported by funding I would continue.

Also the other issue is that nobody can trap on a registered trapline except the trapper. If I could bait all over Alberta I would for sure be snaring more wolves. Lots of trappers don't even use their lines anymore and they sit there untouched. Most would agree this is not right. I also asked about buying another trapline and was told I already have one so I wouldn't most likely be approved for it.....

In the end it comes down to 2 things and that is money and bait for myself.
My take on it from a guy who actually does it and sees what the effects are.

You have to break those packs down in size. Hunters can not do it. They can't kill enough to make a difference. You need to knock a pack down to 3-4 animals and they will hunt smaller game and not kill a moose a week like a pack of 6-12 will. You have to realise if you got 2-3 packs in an area what that is doing to the moose populations. It's unreal!
That about sums it up
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