Bird Dogs

[Donny Bear]

So people seem to get bent right out of shape over Dogs. As many of you know I own Sharptails Dangerous Dakota I Paid a resonable dollar for a well bred dog and I wanted to let him be all he could in the show& field world for one reason I want him to be able to pass on his gene's. To be honest I know nothing about Trials, show or the rest but will learn over time Dakota is my 4th bird dog the rest have been just dogs I loved and enjoyed them, so my question is simple.

Do you think it is right or wrong or just whatever turns your crank, to try to have your dog be the best it can be. (note: not the best dog, just it's best)

No fighting allowed

[Rackmastr]

All I know is what RyanGSP says around these parts must be truth. Its ignorant of him.....but some guys need to try and measure up and try their hardest at beating others down to get there. Some guys simply know no other way other than to resort to insults....most often over-compensating....

Heck....the rest of us are just doing what we want to do....enjoy our dogs, train them, compete with them, keep them around and share their company....we just dont need to insult other dogs to make ourselves feel good.....that and we understand diversity in dogs and what works for some doesnt work for others....

Thats my take on it....though I'm sure Ryan will chime in and tell me I'm wrong.....hell I've been wrong before (I used to think you couldnt walk across private land to access a lake......hahaha)

[Rackmastr]

Oh and Donny.....yes its awesome to strive to have your dog compete at its best, both at trial or in the field......I think its important to keep any dog working hard and striving to do their best. Its what makes accomplishments feel good when workin with them.....

Main thing is understanding that a relationship with your dog is whatever you want it to be, and it doesnt matter what the next person is doing...so long as you're enjoying it.

[Donny Bear]

Well I'am sure time will take the edge off Ryan that said I encourage everyone to keep the gloves on I have heard from a reliable source that Diego is an exceptional GSP and I won't speak ill of a good dog! or anyone for that matter I try not to brag as such but like to post about Dakota's accomplishments that said if every dog was given the chanc e Dakota has had well nuff said. By the way Rack what is your huntin bud ?

[Rackmastr]

Two labs.....proud as hell of each of them.....and proud enough not to need to knock someone elses dog to feel good about mine....

Sage (3.5 year female)



And Deke (1.5 year male, pictured here at 8 months)



And with his first bird....

[Donny Bear]

Ah I knew thayt just needed the memory jogged your yellow looks like my Goldy except her ears were stunted she never had good training as I was her trainer but she never left us skunked man I miss her! Miss Dakota to never let him go this long again 3 months is too much.

You have a pair of beauty's good sir labs will always be the mainstay of the hunting dog world.

[Rackmastr]

We grew up with a Brittany.....have been wanting one ever since as I shot my first bird over her and it happened to be her last bird. I'd love to have one, but I think for now 2 of them is enough.....haha

[Duk Dog]

Originally Posted by Donny Bear

Do you think it is right or wrong or just whatever turns your crank, to try to have your dog be the best it can be. (note: not the best dog, just it's best)

What you do, or don't do, with your dog is up to each individual owner. Not everyone has the time, money, or interest in trialing a dog. Some people enlist the help of a pro, some don't. What ever makes your canine companion enjoyable to be around is fine. At the end of the day if you are happy with your pooch and your dog is happy it is all good.

Personally I started out running hunt tests in the USA when I lived in BC. They had yet to catch on here in Canada. When I first moved to Alberta I ran NAHRA hunt tests and eventually migrated into field trials. For now my priorities in life have shifted and I no longer compete or train. I've got an older (7 year) retriever that has been through the training and now he gets to live the good life as a house pet, goes camping, hiking, and he hunts in the fall. When we get another dog I will get back into training again, but most likely a modified version from the days when I used to trial. (unless I get back into that again)
When I look back on how much I trained and trialed it was crazy. (glad the gas prices weren't what they are now) Other than the dead of winter I trained pretty well year round and it seems like there was a trial pretty much every weekend from May until September. Heck I would head out to Merritt after work on a Friday, run a trial and head home on Sunday, then the following weekend head out to Logan Lake on the Friday and back home again on the Sunday. Over the years I've competed in Washington, Oregon, BC, Alberta, Saskatchewan and Ontario. Kind of nuts when I think back on it. However it was a ton of fun and I met a lot of great people along the way. I've been at both ends of the dog owning/training spectrum and am happy with both. So like you said "whatever turns your crank".

[sideshowkev]

I have to say I am pretty impressed with anyone that can take the time to train their dog to a competition or show level. I have been working with my Lab for the last year and a half and feel I have a solid field dog and that is as far as I want to take it with this one. I think I have learned as much as she has and it has been a great bonding experience for me and my Lab.

[Gunner22a]

US Army recruiting slogan from a decade ago. Not everyone has the time or resources to make a dog the best they can be. I truly admire those who sacrafice a lot to do just that. Watching a well trained dog work whether it be a field of stubble or a long blind retrieve in a marsh is a thing of joy in my heart. The best thing about it is the joy they take in working for you. Not the "machine trained" ones that work out of fear of punishment but the ones trained wth a soft hand and a kind word. The ones that are devistated when you leave to go to work and even in old age are like puppies again when you come home in the evening. Just being with you and making you happy is all they desire.

For some a family companion is all that is required and good on them. For me its a best friend to do everything with and whatever it is we will both do it to the best of our ability.

[puphood1]

Well I own 11 dogs 7 of them trial dogs (4 not proved yet) and 2 hunting dogs and 2 retired trial/brood dams. If I did not trial/hunt I would not own a dog. These dogs have been breed for a reason some of them very specific. I have been breeding these pointers for 15 years and I am at the point things may come together shortly. Just got back from Circle MT. and 2 weeks before GF MT. trialing. The cost is becoming prohibative for some and a major factor is the cost of $4/gal diesel. The dogs keep me active and busy with something in life I actually know something about after 25 years working pointers. Most of the time you get what you put into it. Hard work by you and your dog combined with a favorable nod from from the judges and it seems like it is worth it.
Being congratulated by fellow trialers after they have just lost to you makes you understand its not such a bad crowd of people either. It does not seem to bother me much after getting my butt kicked in the placements anymore because usually I know I and my dog didn't deserve to place.
A dogs placement in a trial is something to be proud of how you share that win is up to you. It is allways great to see new/young trialers light up when they start winning at trials as the important part is what they do after the win. Some go on to other things as they loose interest after easy wins, some become part of the crowd, others become know it alls very quickly. congratulations...puphood1

[Albertabowhunter]

Rackmaster, where did you get your black lab? He looks almost Identical to my Magnum.... I would love to get another one similar to both of them.

[Versatile]

I think you should put it all into your gun dog. You are going to spend countless seasons behind this dog so why cheap out on time, equiptment, and breeding? Buy the best you can afford and sack the time into it. It only takes 20 minutes a day and maybe a few hours once a week for some bird work.

You want a pet go buy pomeranian. These dogs are bred hunt first and thats what they do best.

Nothing more I hate to see than a dog with so much potential ruined because the owner doesnt want to put the time or effort into the dog.

[cohod]

Originally Posted by Donny Bear

Well I'am sure time will take the edge off Ryan that said I encourage everyone to keep the gloves on I have heard from a reliable source that Diego is an exceptional GSP and I won't speak ill of a good dog! or anyone for that matter I try not to brag as such but like to post about Dakota's accomplishments that said if every dog was given the chanc e Dakota has had well nuff said. By the way Rack what is your huntin bud ?

Well I missed the AO gathering fun so I’ll get in here … Donny maybe I missed something here but I don't see any one bashing Diego just ryans attitude from what I've herd he is a good dog... good dogs are not necessarily a reflection of their trainer/owner some,are good despite their trainer/owner.
I wounder how many nasty PMS I'll get this time.

bird dogs should be just that whether you trial or just hunt them is up to the individual.



cohod

[Versatile]

Rack if your happy with your dogs so be it fine. But I brag because I know when Diego hits the ground birds are being found. He gives it 100% from the time he gets that Find Birds command to the time I kennel him. People love hunting over him because of his manners on birds, the amount of training in him, and the fact I dont need to yell scream or use an ecollar on him to get him to listen. 1 command said once and he does what he is asked. He is what he is and like Donny said he is an exceptional dog.

[Duk Dog]

Originally Posted by RyanGSP

I think you should put it all into your gun dog. You are going to spend countless seasons behind this dog so why cheap out on time, equiptment, and breeding? Buy the best you can afford and sack the time into it. It only takes 20 minutes a day and maybe a few hours once a week for some bird work.

You want a pet go buy pomeranian. These dogs are bred hunt first and thats what they do best.

Nothing more I hate to see than a dog with so much potential ruined because the owner doesnt want to put the time or effort into the dog.

You truly are something else. Again you prove your closed minded attitude. So you are saying I have ruined my current dog?

So every person on this board that does not have the time or money should get rid of their field dog (be it retriever, pointer etc) and go get a lap dog? All I can say is wow.

[TheClash]

i think it all depends on what you want and why you want it. i do agree with the mentality that in MOST cases going with purebred dog bred for a specific purpose usually offers a greater percentage of success because you know the blood lines, the history etc. that being said.....i am sure there are countless cases of of "pound" dogs that have been adopted by great parents and turned into incredible, reliable pets and hunters.....what i don't like is the snobbery that goes along with some dog owners/hunters......i am just happy to see anyone out with any dog enjoying the hunt and enjoying each other. hell if you have a poodle that will find birds for me...i am all over that!!

[catnthehat]

I have a good friend who has a lab that goes everywhere with him, they are constaant cmpanions.
he hasn't hunted that much, no time, so thee dog is not up to what it could be.
however, thhat does not take away from the fact that he loves his lab and when they do get out, both enjoy the time.
Another friend has a lab/chessie cross.
good dog, pretty smart, andd tireless.
it is not the best retriever, but it both have fun when they do get out.
I think fun is the key word, whether or not the dog is at its full potential is not a obligation, however, if the owner has the time, it is good to get out whenever possible.
The original breeding for an animal, be it horse, gun dog, or working dog, has nothing to do with the owners obligation except that they treat the animal properly and with respect.
Cat

[Jamie]

Ryan.. Have you lost your mind?

People get dogs for all different reasons. Not one of which is a bad idea.
Some people live to hunt them, others just want to train, others want a good family dog that goes hunting 2 times a year with them.
Sorry Ryan.. I just don’t get what you are saying.
Though I only had the pleasure of hunting behind Brook for one season, and I didn’t have a clue what in the heck I was doing. (I still don’t) My fondest memories are of driving back late in the afternoon and brook sleeping in the back. Her company was amazing to me.
I only had her for one season but the bond I had with that dog could not be measured. I only hope this new pup has 1/2 the personality she did BUT becomes a better family dog.

You really have to quit this bit about being so high and mighty as to how a dog is trained and what it is used for. Your attitude is revolting.

Jamie

[Rackmastr]

Originally Posted by RyanGSP

Rack if your happy with your dogs so be it fine. But I brag because I know when Diego hits the ground birds are being found. He gives it 100% from the time he gets that Find Birds command to the time I kennel him. People love hunting over him because of his manners on birds, the amount of training in him, and the fact I dont need to yell scream or use an ecollar on him to get him to listen. 1 command said once and he does what he is asked. He is what he is and like Donny said he is an exceptional dog.

Thats great....and I bet he's a great dog. No guff....

HOWEVER......you need to learn to shut up about other people's dogs and worry about your own. I am a passionate big game hunter and put a lot of time into what I do, but I dont call you or others down for the way you hunt big game and I dont need to call you down to feel good about my hunting skills.

You're insecure....plain and simple. Some people know how to brag and enjoy their accomplisments, other people simply are so damn insecure that they need to worry about the 'other' guy and attempt to bring them down to make them look good.

Maybe one day when you're not so worried about the next guy you can just learn what hunting and competing is about and go out there and enjoy it and being proud of your accomplishments, without feeling the need to look better than everyone else on the net by attempting to bring them down.....its gettin old...

[Winch101]

And I thought it was going to be a slow morning

Bill Tarant ( famed outdoor writer ) said ...

If a Man cant find one thing he likes about a dog ,
than there is something wrong with the man."

I was approached by a kid ( who was running aGSP )

at the Brit field trial and was given some unsolicited advice
about my dog ..I told him exactly what my dear sainted father used to say
when the painfully obvious was pointed out to him .

" LOOK , when it comes to Hunting dogs and specifically

Verstile dogs .... I was in Bagdad when you were in Dads Bag "

I have met a lot of Guys who have dogs they dont deserve .

And every once in a great while you get lucky and buy a real

crackerjack . We only hunt 3 mos of the year , so I lean to a 50/50

split between good pet and good birddog . If you get both and are a

long time Experienced trainer , than you know how to get the most

out of a dog , but if its your first dog and he is a good one than count

your blessings . When you have had a string of reasonably good dogs

than you can puff up a little .God you see some of these geniuses at

these dog trials , struttin around , layin claim to havin some magic touch .

They got a dog ( one of the smartest animals on four legs ) to do

something they been doin for thousands of years . Hunting

Like most other things , you get out what you put in ..

I have a dog that is known as " The Supreme Gundog "

I think the name says it all..

I have seen cases where the owner becomes more like the dog .

It doesnt happen often , the country of origin is somewhat

important in the temperament of the dog .

The Griffon and the Brit are french dogs , so your just lucky the

birds arent able to take them prisoner. The GSP ,well they did

try to take over the world twice and had they suceeded the only

dog you'd be looking at is a shepherd or dobbie and youd be looking over your shoulder at them .

Man that is a good looking Black Lab....W101

[Donny Bear]

Ok this is not about Ryan or his opinion its about yours thats all I wanted! It is what it is and no no one has ever bashed Diego I am just saying Ryan has a right to be proud. Some comments are strong but look at the hockey thread people get zelous and thats there right.

Cat is right all the way if you love the dog thats what wmatters first and foremost. Wisdom trumps Knowledge every time!

[TheClash]

Originally Posted by Rackmastr

Thats great....and I bet he's a great dog. No guff....

HOWEVER......you need to learn to shut up about other people's dogs and worry about your own. I am 10 times the big game hunter that you'll ever be but I dont call you or others down for trying it out and I dont need to call you down to feel good about my hunting skills.

You're insecure....plain and simple. Some people know how to brag and enjoy their accomplisments, other people simply are so damn insecure that they need to worry about the 'other' guy and attempt to bring them down to make them look good.

Maybe one day when you're not so worried about the next guy you can just learn what hunting and competing is about and go out there and enjoy it and being proud of your accomplishments, without feeling the need to look better than everyone else on the net by attempting to bring them down.....its gettin old...

true accomplishments get recognized by others.....

[Rackmastr]

Sorry for the hijack Donny.....I'm guessin you had to expect the thread to go somewhat in this direction when you've got a guy calling other people out because they dont run the same dog as him....

Diego sounds like a great dog....but that is easily tarnished by an owner who is so insecure that he needs to bring others down to feel good. There are guys out there that earn more respect by just being proud of their accomplishments and not worrying about the next guy...

I'll leave your thread.....god knows I'd end up goin in circles with this guy....hell he's still teaching me about laws regarding private land....

[Rackmastr]

Originally Posted by Albertabowhunter

Rackmaster, where did you get your black lab? He looks almost Identical to my Magnum.... I would love to get another one similar to both of them.

I got him from a breeder in Cardston area. His dad is owned by Bill Morton, a bird outfitter in the area. Deke's sister is actually having a litter soon but I dont know about the male she's bred to. Nice lookin dog ya got there for sure....

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by Donny Bear

So people seem to get bent right out of shape over Dogs. As many of you know I own Sharptails Dangerous Dakota I Paid a resonable dollar for a well bred dog and I wanted to let him be all he could in the show& field world for one reason I want him to be able to pass on his gene's. To be honest I know nothing about Trials, show or the rest but will learn over time Dakota is my 4th bird dog the rest have been just dogs I loved and enjoyed them, so my question is simple.

Do you think it is right or wrong or just whatever turns your crank, to try to have your dog be the best it can be. (note: not the best dog, just it's best)

No fighting allowed

Ok, back to the origanal question

I think its up to whatever the owner wants out of his dog. If you want to spend $1,000's on a sure fire pup.. Then turn it into a big lap dog.. Go ahead.
If you want to head to the local Animal rescue, grab a mongrel dog and turn it into the next world beater.. Get er done!!

Jamie

[catnthehat]

A thread like this just kills me, because although I am very experienced in gun dogs as a handler and have shot countless birds over many different types of dogs both efficiant and "other!", I do not have the good fortune to have one as a companion these days.

I love dogs, all kinds, but especially labs, and really enjoy seeing the pics of everybody's favorite !

Although I come from a lab household, the all out , best all around- bar none retreiver and hunter I ever owned was a lab sheaperd cross.
I used him for retrieving beavers, 'rats, a guard dog, tracker, bear fighter and companion,
Buck could do it and did it all .
my father, a true blue lab man and award winning handler and trainer , did not even once sniff or turn up his nose at Buck, but always praised his abilities.
THAT is the sign of a good dog man, IMHO......
Cat

I can't believe what I have read here - self proclaimed experts on dogs and hunting. You guys need to get a grip and maybe try to focus on something other than yourselves. It just might give you a more enjoyable experience.

I realize I am a crappy dog trainer, a crappier hunter and my dog can attest to the fact that I'm a lousy shot.

He has as many bad habits as I do.

But he likes me and he likes hunting and we have a pretty good time together.

[Rackmastr]

Great post Chevy427......and kinda sums it up nicely....

[Jamie]

Originally Posted by chevy427

my dog can attest to the fact that I'm a lousy shot.

Now thats funny!!!
Thank god they cant talk.

Jamie