Go Back   Alberta Outdoorsmen Forum > Main Category > Hunting Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #91  
Old 01-24-2017, 07:47 PM
KBF's Avatar
KBF KBF is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: WMU 108
Posts: 2,465
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Black View Post
Who's to say it isn't coming? Can you say what I stated is not a legitimate concer?

So maybe now horse guys can maybe understand losing public access to an area for anybody is a slippery slope.

Or maybe they feel they are the only group that don't cause any harm to the environment, and should be exempt from any restrictions?

Back to the beginning. Allow access to all on public land, allowing all to have areas to enjoy the Access they prefer. They can designate areas so you don't interrupt another's access. Done.
Take a breath

I didnt see anything in the full plan but I havent read through it all either. Sure it could be a concern. But we know that the horse is not the primary concern and cause for the closure.
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 01-24-2017, 07:52 PM
Joe Black Joe Black is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 997
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KBF View Post
Take a breath

I didnt see anything in the full plan but I havent read through it all either. Sure it could be a concern. But we know that the horse is not the primary concern and cause for the closure.
Agreed.
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 01-24-2017, 07:56 PM
KBF's Avatar
KBF KBF is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: WMU 108
Posts: 2,465
Default

Dont get me wrong Im an atver and use the area quite a bit and I dont think anyone will disagree something has to be done to fix whats going on but I dont think full on closure is the remedy. Will it happen?Likely.
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 01-24-2017, 08:16 PM
bessiedog's Avatar
bessiedog bessiedog is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,372
Default

Joe take your own advice...... read the DRAFT ( also look up what that means) then present the facts

Instead .... couple posts later.... you're quoting the echo... with wrong stuff.

Was it you that's telling everyone to not do the survey?.... what good will that do?
I'm guessing there'll be a comment box section where I can voice my concerns. That just by itself is better than nothing.
I've seen dipper surveys before.... they sure like to manufacture 'consultation consent'.


Credibility......... ok
__________________
"How vain it is to sit down to write when you have not stood up to live.”
-HDT
"A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends on the character of the user." T. Roosevelt
"I don't always troll, only on days that end in Y."

Last edited by bessiedog; 01-24-2017 at 08:29 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 01-25-2017, 04:32 AM
LKILR's Avatar
LKILR LKILR is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Claresholm
Posts: 1,070
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
You'd ***** your pants where I used to take a truck.
After reading your post I have to comment.
So it is guys like you then who are ruining it for the rest of us.
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 01-25-2017, 05:33 AM
Gordoats26's Avatar
Gordoats26 Gordoats26 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lacombe
Posts: 516
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Black View Post
"Quads...... nope. Them users just don't play nice with other sportsmen."

by bessiedog.

who's generalising now?

How do you know how, and what i use my quad for when i hunt? How do you know i don't play nice? keep your nose in "yer" own buisness


Here's my generalisation. "All non-quad hunters are simply jealous that they cannot afford a quad, and hate the fact that quad users have the upper hand in accessing area" true ,no?

unfortunate. in one of your other posts on this subject, you did show a bit of tolerance to quad users. I thought, ok, maybe we can respect each others forms of hunting. nope. showing your true colours now. just calling spade a spade.
Hahaha you can't actually belive non quad hunters are somehow jeleous of you for having a quad. I have a quad and it stays home or at camp till work needs to be done. I just prefer to shoot elk not push them into the next County.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 01-25-2017, 06:08 AM
ram crazy ram crazy is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,843
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LKILR View Post
After reading your post I have to comment.
So it is guys like you then who are ruining it for the rest of us.
Yup, back in the 80's and early 90's before I bought a quad. But just for your info who do you think pushed the trails into all these areas. Correct me if I'm wrong but was it not the loggers, and the gas/oil. Just using trails that were already there.
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Old 01-25-2017, 06:11 AM
ram crazy ram crazy is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,843
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordoats26 View Post
Hahaha you can't actually belive non quad hunters are somehow jeleous of you for having a quad. I have a quad and it stays home or at camp till work needs to be done. I just prefer to shoot elk not push them into the next County.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
I see elk all the time while riding down the trail.
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 01-25-2017, 06:20 AM
LKILR's Avatar
LKILR LKILR is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Claresholm
Posts: 1,070
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
Yup, back in the 80's and early 90's before I bought a quad. But just for your info who do you think pushed the trails into all these areas. Correct me if I'm wrong but was it not the loggers, and the gas/oil. Just using trails that were already there.
You sir are a real steward of the land .
Reply With Quote
  #100  
Old 01-25-2017, 09:43 AM
Joe Black Joe Black is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 997
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordoats26 View Post
Hahaha you can't actually belive non quad hunters are somehow jeleous of you for having a quad. I have a quad and it stays home or at camp till work needs to be done. I just prefer to shoot elk not push them into the next County.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

guess what. that's exactly what i do as well. others on here would have you believe that ALL quad users strap a 6 pack on the front rack and drive around all afternoon(which some do). that is the point i was making as some on here would have yo believe ALL quad riders don't play nice with other sportsman. that would include you according to bessiedog.
Reply With Quote
  #101  
Old 01-25-2017, 09:54 AM
Joe Black Joe Black is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 997
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bessiedog View Post
Joe take your own advice...... read the DRAFT ( also look up what that means) then present the facts

Instead .... couple posts later.... you're quoting the echo... with wrong stuff.

Was it you that's telling everyone to not do the survey?.... what good will that do?
I'm guessing there'll be a comment box section where I can voice my concerns. That just by itself is better than nothing.
I've seen dipper surveys before.... they sure like to manufacture 'consultation consent'.


Credibility......... ok

FYI. I like Old Milwaukee.
Reply With Quote
  #102  
Old 01-25-2017, 10:31 AM
livinstone livinstone is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 176
Default

If otvs dont damage the area for other users then either buy a piece of your own and do what you have done in the castle and see if your happy with it lam guessing it will be similer to foot ,horse access.Or maybe just plant trees after in your trail areas like the logging companies do to improve there impact and trun a old forest into a young area of life.
Reply With Quote
  #103  
Old 01-25-2017, 11:30 AM
bessiedog's Avatar
bessiedog bessiedog is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,372
Default hey

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Black View Post
FYI. I like Old Milwaukee.
small world!

Its my favorite too!!

..... mmmm pretty lady beers....
__________________
"How vain it is to sit down to write when you have not stood up to live.”
-HDT
"A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends on the character of the user." T. Roosevelt
"I don't always troll, only on days that end in Y."
Reply With Quote
  #104  
Old 01-25-2017, 12:13 PM
Joe Black Joe Black is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 997
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bessiedog View Post
small world!

Its my favorite too!!

..... mmmm pretty lady beers....
well maybe we have more in common that either of us thinks right now.

following website has info on action plan and online petition to sign.

http://castleparks.ca/
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 01-25-2017, 12:46 PM
bessiedog's Avatar
bessiedog bessiedog is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,372
Default I've read the draft proposal

From cover to cover (so to speak)..... have you?

and I still am pouring over it.


It concerns me greatly.

The Pass sees a GREAT deal of economic benefit from sledders coming here and spending their $$ here. I know, my wife waitressed for 10 years here... our family survived on the tips sledders would leave.

Motorized sports supports my community.

But so does hunting

mountain biking (big time growing impact here)

Trail running (try and get a room when Sinister 7 is on)

I will never cut my community's throat economically.... this draft proposal has phrases in it that concern me regarding all these industries.

" Quiet recreation activities..... wtf is that??" .... too dangerous a phrase.

"consult with fish and wildlife regarding future wildlife management priorities for this particular area"...... wtf does THAT mean...?

Personally..... I'd like to see random camping turned to tenting.... cause then more people might come and buy stuff-supplies in town... maybe even stay in town which helps my town.

Currently it seems people just roll into the bush with their second house on wheels and do nothing but wear out their stay here... (see wut I did there..).


I'll support the Quad Squad and only them. Cause they do what they say. They try to make their activity sustainable.

This draft NEEDS to reasonably marry the local community's economic fortunes with the bush... in a more sustainable manner.

Again... hire quad cops, pay for backcountry stays, limit their stays, pay a trail fee..... and make it a goodly amount so we can enforce-maintain a reasonable trail system.

Make quad access unlimited for old timers.... they've earned it and they usually arent the ones ripping up stuff.
__________________
"How vain it is to sit down to write when you have not stood up to live.”
-HDT
"A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends on the character of the user." T. Roosevelt
"I don't always troll, only on days that end in Y."
Reply With Quote
  #106  
Old 01-25-2017, 12:59 PM
Gordoats26's Avatar
Gordoats26 Gordoats26 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Lacombe
Posts: 516
Default

As hunters we pay a lot of money for hunting licenses and tags ect which should be used for conservation efforts and enforcement. Quads use the lands also but I don't belive they have the same view on conservation as hunters do. They don't pay any extra fee to maintain the lands they damage and they do damage lands. But now they want backing from the hunting community because the hammer is begining to fall on their sport. I am all for people quading responsibly on designated trails. But they can't just have a free for all on our lands. To me if your going to quad the back country you should require a licence to do so and that money should be put back into the lands for both enforcement and conservation to make sure the land is the same way it was year in and year out..

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #107  
Old 01-25-2017, 03:50 PM
Joe Black Joe Black is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 997
Default

from the pass herald reporter. this is AFGA comments.


Brian Dingreville, 2nd vice president of the Alberta Fish and Game Association, expressed similar concerns, stating that the government released the draft management plan while discussions were still ongoing.

“Over the last several months, meetings took place with the provincial government with regards to a draft that we were supposed to come up with and present to the provincial government, which would then be brought forward to the public and we would be given opportunities to discuss it,” he said. “The meetings have not concluded, firstly, which is a total slap in the face because it tells me that they have no regard or any respect for any of the people that were involved in the working group.”
While hunting, fishing and trapping are still allowed under the draft regulations, Dingreville indicated that he has lost confidence in the government given that the Quad Squad was initially told that there would be OHV trails available for use.

“So does that mean that in a couple of years, we’re going to get booted out?” he says. “I have lost total respect for anything that they have said the past. I have no respect whatsoever for the NDP government at all. None.”
Reply With Quote
  #108  
Old 01-25-2017, 04:17 PM
silver lab's Avatar
silver lab silver lab is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Stuck between wmu 110, 302 & 305
Posts: 1,023
Default

The NDP does not care what we think. They can and will do what ever they want.
The people on this forum that agree with what they are doing to Alberta should join PETA (or maybe they already have) and should be removed from this "outdoorsmen"site.
Reply With Quote
  #109  
Old 01-25-2017, 05:10 PM
ram crazy ram crazy is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,843
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by livinstone View Post
If otvs dont damage the area for other users then either buy a piece of your own and do what you have done in the castle and see if your happy with it lam guessing it will be similer to foot ,horse access.Or maybe just plant trees after in your trail areas like the logging companies do to improve there impact and trun a old forest into a young area of life.
Hey little buckaroo, Mother Nature has done most of the damage, with two floods and a fire. The quad trails were already there from the logging, and if you think logging companies are for the better you should see some of the mess they leave behind (old broken cable, oil drums, etc.) you people should pull your heads out of sand. I truly feel sorry for you that can't afford a OHV. And for the record I go around the mud holes, cleaning the machine sucks! I Just drive around for the scenery.
Reply With Quote
  #110  
Old 01-25-2017, 05:53 PM
rugatika rugatika is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 17,790
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bessiedog View Post
'

Responsible quads r fine wit me. Responsible quaffing... designated trails... stay on em... but we all know that just don't happen.
So what should we do about people that don't follow the hunting regulations? Ban the hunters that do?
Reply With Quote
  #111  
Old 01-25-2017, 05:57 PM
bessiedog's Avatar
bessiedog bessiedog is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,372
Default Rug....

Quote:
Originally Posted by rugatika View Post
So what should we do about people that don't follow the hunting regulations? Ban the hunters that do?
There's two kinda threads goin on about this.

Read what I posted previously about this.
__________________
"How vain it is to sit down to write when you have not stood up to live.”
-HDT
"A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends on the character of the user." T. Roosevelt
"I don't always troll, only on days that end in Y."
Reply With Quote
  #112  
Old 01-25-2017, 06:40 PM
Dewey Cox's Avatar
Dewey Cox Dewey Cox is online now
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 204
Posts: 5,397
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
Hey little buckaroo, Mother Nature has done most of the damage, with two floods and a fire. The quad trails were already there from the logging, and if you think logging companies are for the better you should see some of the mess they leave behind (old broken cable, oil drums, etc.) you people should pull your heads out of sand. I truly feel sorry for you that can't afford a OHV. And for the record I go around the mud holes, cleaning the machine sucks! I Just drive around for the scenery.


You keep on bringing up Mother Nature, oil and gas, and forestry.
That has nothing to do with atv's.
You are not helping to stop a ban by just pointing fingers at other things that damage nature.
But if it makes you feel better to keep repeating that you cause less damage than a flood with your atv (that apparently no one else can afford), go crazy. (But don't be surprised when there's a total ban)
__________________
"I like to quote my own quotes" ~ Dewey Cox
Reply With Quote
  #113  
Old 01-25-2017, 07:21 PM
ram crazy ram crazy is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,843
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewey Cox View Post
You keep on bringing up Mother Nature, oil and gas, and forestry.
That has nothing to do with atv's.
You are not helping to stop a ban by just pointing fingers at other things that damage nature.
But if it makes you feel better to keep repeating that you cause less damage than a flood with your atv (that apparently no one else can afford), go crazy. (But don't be surprised when there's a total ban)
Can you read? There are those special people that keep saying how it's the OHV's that do all the damage to the land. Ask yourself this, do you seriously think OHV's do more damage than a flood. Have you been in the lost creek area and seen it I can guarantee you no OHV did more destruction than what the flood did. All I'm saying is there are those special people pointing fingers at the OHV's. Its kinda like say they should ban hunting because of poachers, no...
Reply With Quote
  #114  
Old 01-25-2017, 07:39 PM
Dewey Cox's Avatar
Dewey Cox Dewey Cox is online now
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 204
Posts: 5,397
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ram crazy View Post
Can you read? There are those special people that keep saying how it's the OHV's that do all the damage to the land. Ask yourself this, do you seriously think OHV's do more damage than a flood. Have you been in the lost creek area and seen it I can guarantee you no OHV did more destruction than what the flood did. All I'm saying is there are those special people pointing fingers at the OHV's. Its kinda like say they should ban hunting because of poachers, no...


Where did anyone say ohv's do all the damage to the land?
__________________
"I like to quote my own quotes" ~ Dewey Cox
Reply With Quote
  #115  
Old 01-25-2017, 07:55 PM
Ranger CS Ranger CS is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Pincher Creek
Posts: 921
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bessiedog View Post
From cover to cover (so to speak)..... have you?

and I still am pouring over it.


It concerns me greatly.

The Pass sees a GREAT deal of economic benefit from sledders coming here and spending their $$ here. I know, my wife waitressed for 10 years here... our family survived on the tips sledders would leave.

Motorized sports supports my community.

But so does hunting

mountain biking (big time growing impact here)

Trail running (try and get a room when Sinister 7 is on)

I will never cut my community's throat economically.... this draft proposal has phrases in it that concern me regarding all these industries.

" Quiet recreation activities..... wtf is that??" .... too dangerous a phrase.

"consult with fish and wildlife regarding future wildlife management priorities for this particular area"...... wtf does THAT mean...?

Personally..... I'd like to see random camping turned to tenting.... cause then more people might come and buy stuff-supplies in town... maybe even stay in town which helps my town.

Currently it seems people just roll into the bush with their second house on wheels and do nothing but wear out their stay here... (see wut I did there..).


I'll support the Quad Squad and only them. Cause they do what they say. They try to make their activity sustainable.

This draft NEEDS to reasonably marry the local community's economic fortunes with the bush... in a more sustainable manner.

Again... hire quad cops, pay for backcountry stays, limit their stays, pay a trail fee..... and make it a goodly amount so we can enforce-maintain a reasonable trail system.

Make quad access unlimited for old timers.... they've earned it and they usually arent the ones ripping up stuff.
Old buddy, you know well foot or horse hunting is far more environmentally friendly. I still remember crossing the castle river on horseback with you. As I recall you stayed pretty dry once you got on. Would love to see those atv's gone.
__________________
Ranger
Reply With Quote
  #116  
Old 01-25-2017, 08:14 PM
bessiedog's Avatar
bessiedog bessiedog is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,372
Default Your right...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranger CS View Post
Old buddy, you know well foot or horse hunting is far more environmentally friendly. I still remember crossing the castle river on horseback with you. As I recall you stayed pretty dry once you got on. Would love to see those atv's gone.
Hunting on horseback with you and your boy is always a good time.

My only regret in life is I don't own a horse. It's a priceless experience.
__________________
"How vain it is to sit down to write when you have not stood up to live.”
-HDT
"A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends on the character of the user." T. Roosevelt
"I don't always troll, only on days that end in Y."
Reply With Quote
  #117  
Old 01-25-2017, 08:53 PM
Don_Parsons Don_Parsons is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 1,827
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bessiedog View Post
From cover to cover (so to speak)..... have you?

and I still am pouring over it.


It concerns me greatly.

The Pass sees a GREAT deal of economic benefit from sledders coming here and spending their $$ here. I know, my wife waitressed for 10 years here... our family survived on the tips sledders would leave.

Motorized sports supports my community.

But so does hunting

mountain biking (big time growing impact here)

Trail running (try and get a room when Sinister 7 is on)

I will never cut my community's throat economically.... this draft proposal has phrases in it that concern me regarding all these industries.

" Quiet recreation activities..... wtf is that??" .... too dangerous a phrase.

"consult with fish and wildlife regarding future wildlife management priorities for this particular area"...... wtf does THAT mean...?

Personally..... I'd like to see random camping turned to tenting.... cause then more people might come and buy stuff-supplies in town... maybe even stay in town which helps my town.

Currently it seems people just roll into the bush with their second house on wheels and do nothing but wear out their stay here... (see wut I did there..).


I'll support the Quad Squad and only them. Cause they do what they say. They try to make their activity sustainable.

This draft NEEDS to reasonably marry the local community's economic fortunes with the bush... in a more sustainable manner.

Again... hire quad cops, pay for backcountry stays, limit their stays, pay a trail fee..... and make it a goodly amount so we can enforce-maintain a reasonable trail system.

Make quad access unlimited for old timers.... they've earned it and they usually arent the ones ripping up stuff.
^^^ I like button on the above idea.

Don
Reply With Quote
  #118  
Old 01-30-2017, 01:12 PM
khruby khruby is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 3
Default No Highway Vehicals/ Atv's off road

Quote:
Originally Posted by Redcoat27 View Post
Unfortunately off road vehicles have done it to themselves. This maybe be the start of more closures. I think it is up to responsible Atv users to take a stand, if you see someone acting in an appropriate manner then report it to authorities.
There's not many areas that large off road trucks can go in the castle , there are areas where smaller trucks can get but they are good trails and not many places to get off those trails. For the most part if your driving In the south from my perspective is the damage comes from ATV's and not trucks. The trucks stay on the trails turn around and come out. The quads push through the holes, stir up the trails and make more mud holes from getting stuck. I've never seen a pick up going more then 20 k's an hour on the trails but yet you could get past by 15 quads that go 60 to 100 km's an hour tearing up the trail... Its amazing to see that but no one says anything about that.

I think that there should have been more enforcement in the castle instead of all the cutbacks and we would not even been in this situation. We will now see hunting go right down the drain along with your camping in your favorite spots, We will be quading an 4x4'ing but we will be crammed into the already crowded rec areas in the south. Wait till we see the first hotel, or gas bar come up in the Lynx Carbondale junction and think well that wasn't in the plan. Well it is! it in the online survey about how much development are you willing to have in the Castle Wildlife area, you can't give a proper response to that question or many others on the survey. I believe it was in another report I read and i'll link to it.

And goodbye to hunting in the south... Since I was 5 when I took my first elk with my Father and Uncle I've been hunting the same grounds, it has changed.. roads and bridges are added.... trails rebuilt. But you can still go find a bull or chase a big mule but you have to work for it. That's all going to be gone for everyone, but you'll be able to go hike and go for a mountian bike ride!. It dose not say that now but I'd be willing to bet that will change just like they said when this first came through that quads and highway traffic would be allowed but restricted, but now not allowed.

Voice your opinions to MLA!
Reply With Quote
  #119  
Old 01-30-2017, 02:14 PM
Headdamage Headdamage is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Calgary
Posts: 697
Default

The area was great before the quads and such got loose in the place. When it was only 4x4 trucks the damage was very limited and the trails where in much better shape. In the 90's when I used to go back there there would often be grass growing on the trails because there was so little traffic. As quads got popular the trails and surrounding areas started to bet torn up to the point that it was difficult to even drive a 4x4 truck on the trails anymore.
Reply With Quote
  #120  
Old 01-30-2017, 08:34 PM
mclean mclean is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 114
Default

This is pretty much the same reaction we had prior to the making of K-Country a number of years ago at the meetings in Calgary, we made much the same requests such as reasonable access to the back country, quadding and 4x4 , biking areas, Areas to set up hunting camps in hunting seasons, We can all see what happened in what is now K-Country, It is great for some i guess, but without a horse getting into the back country is just about impossible. The bottom line is in Westcastle we do have too many people using a quite small area, and a few people abusing the area does make it bad for everyone, I love using the back country and think the government has their mind made up and it is a done deal, Again i hate to lose access to the area.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.