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  #181  
Old 05-15-2018, 01:48 PM
Kurt505 Kurt505 is offline
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Originally Posted by Salavee View Post
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WoW ! You really have things figured out.

If you find time, try some of this stuff in the real world and let us know how it goes.
What good would that do? Proof has proven not to be proof enough for you.

Maybe you should practice shooting more so you'll realize that when you actually hit an animal in the correct place, they die even if you're not using a magnum. I understand it's hard to believe until you actually do it.
  #182  
Old 05-15-2018, 01:50 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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WoW ! You really have things figured out.

If you find time, try some of this stuff in the real world and let us know how it goes.
Just how i shop/compare, chances i'd shoot a deer at 600 with a grendel very slim lol, coyotes yes, the theoretical is all there and that's simply how i shop a new build to compare one to the next, that's all. A friend just bought a 28 nosler, likely not shoot past 600 and probably still kill like the rest of us at 350 or less, but he's talking about shooting the super high bc stuff at rediculous speeds, the theoretical goes so far i can't imagine lol. He likes overkill, big booms and that's just his style, nothing wrong with that. Apparently he wants to make sure he can hit them harder at 500 than a 300 win mag at the muzzle lol. I have a 520 yrd deer and a 620 yrd coyote on dial ups with a .270 set up and a .270 wsm set up, but stick to traditional ranges almost always, i don't look for long range opportunities but will take advantage once in a blue moon, like to set up for potential but never use it. 99% of my big game lands under 300 so not a biggie what i choose really. Nice to know the maximum potentials though and be set up for it, like to do thorough job in set up. Every now and then you have to finish something and i always like to be able to dial up a hung coyote no matter the rig i'm carrying. Oh, and i'm straight up a ballistics nerd, proud of it.
  #183  
Old 05-15-2018, 01:54 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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What good would that do? Proof has proven not to be proof enough for you.

Maybe you should practice shooting more so you'll realize that when you actually hit an animal in the correct place, they die even if you're not using a magnum. I understand it's hard to believe until you actually do it.
You two make a great tag team. .. that's about as far as it goes. Entertaining though, that's for sure.
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  #184  
Old 05-15-2018, 01:59 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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What good would that do? Proof has proven not to be proof enough for you.

Maybe you should practice shooting more so you'll realize that when you actually hit an animal in the correct place, they die even if you're not using a magnum. I understand it's hard to believe until you actually do it.
very delicately put

but i'm in that camp, i'd rather be deadly af with something that's far more suited to the task with the least recoil as possible than hate pulling the trigger (braked or not etc.)

not interest in going 800 plus so my .270 wsm is gone now, what a rig too, still have my .270 sheep rig but do wish it was a 6.5 creedmoor instead, it's a blaser k95 so just have to find someone who wants a barrel so i can buck up 1800 plus for another barrel...yikes, so i will stick with it as it's a tack driver too and set up to go 600 which is plenty, so i'll have to run into money and time before i look at that switch...shopping now and the choice would be easy creedmoor now, do the same with less powder

i am adding grendels to the fleet now for me and the boys who are 9 and 11 now, they won't outgrow them and can always have for their predator/big game rigs and add whatever guns they want down the road themselves but can always just fall back on the grendels too, i'll have no problem doing what i want for local big game work with a grendel and have a riot on the predators primarily, my super accurate .204 ruger is for sale to make the move to grendel, it has amazing pbrz and drives tacks but i can't shoot deer with it and i like bit more versatility

Last edited by Stinky Coyote; 05-15-2018 at 02:13 PM.
  #185  
Old 05-15-2018, 02:07 PM
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Apparently the 6.5's will beat the 308 all day long!!
*Language warning!!*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOLhadyt3_0
Cat
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  #186  
Old 05-15-2018, 02:18 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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Originally Posted by Salavee View Post
You two make a great tag team. .. that's about as far as it goes. Entertaining though, that's for sure.
you'd do likewise with my 28 nosler friend

Kurt and I will quietly and efficiently put them down while you two empty your mortar launchers tearing up the hillside knocking off legs etc. hoping for the best

kidding, you can both probably shoot super magnums just fine, definitely not worried about 28 nosler man, he gets it done!, not many can though, not many want too nor need too either

Last edited by Stinky Coyote; 05-15-2018 at 02:29 PM.
  #187  
Old 05-15-2018, 02:32 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote View Post
you'd do likewise with my .28 nosler friend

Kurt and I will quietly and efficiently put them down while you two empty your mortar launchers tearing up the hillside knocking off legs etc.

kidding, you can both probably shoot super magnums just fine, definitely not worried about .28 nosler man, not many can though
Well Bud, you take far too much for granted .. I don't own a magnum of any type. All gone long ago. You and your sidekick just carry on putting them down as you so aptly do. Maybe someday I'll be blessed with witnessing such a performance. When the Green Flag drops, the BS stops.
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  #188  
Old 05-15-2018, 02:43 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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Well Bud, you take far too much for granted .. I don't own a magnum of any type. All gone long ago. You and your sidekick just carry on putting them down as you so aptly do. Maybe someday I'll be blessed with witnessing such a performance. When the Green Flag drops, the BS stops.
Lol, sure does. Just came into this to stop the spread of misinformation and lend perspective to balance things out. A ten thousand foot viewer. Could care less what you shoot or anyone else really but sure seemed people weren't getting the picture on why the creedmoor is so successful now, commercially or otherwise. I think goal achieved. We've had a little fun along the way. Peace
  #189  
Old 05-15-2018, 02:51 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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Lol, sure does. Just came into this to stop the spread of misinformation and lend perspective to balance things out. A ten thousand foot viewer. Could care less what you shoot or anyone else really but sure seemed people weren't getting the picture on why the creedmoor is so successful now, commercially or otherwise. I think goal achieved. We've had a little fun along the way. Peace
Seeing that that was your purpose, thanks for intervening and getting things sorted out.
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  #190  
Old 05-15-2018, 05:03 PM
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[QUOTE=catnthehat;3785959]Apparently the 6.5's will beat the 308 all day long!!
*Language warning!!*
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOLhadyt3_0[/

Well that settles that!
  #191  
Old 05-15-2018, 05:07 PM
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[QUOTE=cowmanbob;3786040]
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Apparently the 6.5's will beat the 308 all day long!!
*Language warning!!*
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOLhadyt3_0[/

Well that settles that!
Pass the Koo-Aid,Please!
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  #192  
Old 05-15-2018, 05:45 PM
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I am a sucker for wading into this discussion. I own a 308 and a 6.5x47 and love them both. They are just different. I will admit that It is much easier to hit targets at 600m with the 6.5x47. Your wind calls are much more forgiving due to the better ballistic co-effcient. Elevation is going to be constant, gravity doesnt change. So that is basically a wash (just get a shooting solution from your ballistics software 3.8 mills on the 6.5x47 lapua or 6.3 on my 308 of elevation). The gong does ring much louder and swings more when hit with the 308. It(the 308) also has more recoil. I can shoot over 50 rounds on the 6.5 in a day and have very little to no fatigue. I guess it would be like comparing your old 1970's corvette with a V8 to your Porsche Cayman. Both are great but they are quite different.

Hunting wise I can add nothing to the discussion as I use my 6.5 exclusively for targets.

I love hunting I just suck at finding animals.
  #193  
Old 05-15-2018, 06:38 PM
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Default 6.5

All I know is I'm in the market for a 6.5x55 and hope to use it for hunting this year.
My buddy has a 6.5 cm and shot a big cow elk at about 120yds died within 30 yds of where it was hit. 140gr bullet out of a creed is very effective game killer just as is a 130/270, 95-100/243, 140/ 7-08, and on and on. Anyone who thinks the creed is unsuitable for putting meat in the freezer would do better to stop flapping their gums about how it's a crappy game getter and learn how to make good hits on their intended targets. Put a well constructed bullet used within its design parameters into the vitals of any animal and it will kill.
  #194  
Old 05-15-2018, 07:51 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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All I know is I'm in the market for a 6.5x55 and hope to use it for hunting this year.
My buddy has a 6.5 cm and shot a big cow elk at about 120yds died within 30 yds of where it was hit. 140gr bullet out of a creed is very effective game killer just as is a 130/270, 95-100/243, 140/ 7-08, and on and on. Anyone who thinks the creed is unsuitable for putting meat in the freezer would do better to stop flapping their gums about how it's a crappy game getter and learn how to make good hits on their intended targets. Put a well constructed bullet used within its design parameters into the vitals of any animal and it will kill.
I don't think I saw anywhere on this whole thread where anybody even suggested the 6.5 CM was a crappy game getter or unsuitable for hunting BG. It was however mentioned ,more than once, by some gum flapper that it would be a crappy large game getter at 600 yds. Quite possibly that somebody was me. Your buddy shooting a cow Elk at 120 yds with a 140 is well within the CM's parameters .. another 480 yds to go and there would be a distinct difference. You sound like a marksmanship instructor as well. Any other suggestions?
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  #195  
Old 05-15-2018, 08:02 PM
Kurt505 Kurt505 is offline
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I don't think I saw anywhere on this whole thread where anybody even suggested the 6.5 CM was a crappy game getter or unsuitable for hunting BG. It was however mentioned ,more than once, by some gum flapper that it would be a crappy large game getter at 600 yds. Quite possibly that somebody was me. Your buddy shooting a cow Elk at 120 yds with a 140 is well within the CM's parameters .. another 480 yds to go and there would be a distinct difference. You sound like a marksmanship instructor as well. Any other suggestions?

Do yourself a favor and read these two links. At least after that when you flap your gums there will be a glimmer of knowledge in what you're flapping about. And please don't say that Hornady is just posting fake news. If you need help understanding the tables just ask.

https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifl...43-gr-eld-x#!/

https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/r...sion-hunter#!/
  #196  
Old 05-15-2018, 08:15 PM
Nyksta Nyksta is offline
 
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Holy smokes this thread is getting hostile between a bunch of mathematicians arguing over internet numbers. Choose your tool and go enjoy it. Figure out what your advantages and limits are and use them within reason.
  #197  
Old 05-15-2018, 08:24 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Kurt505 View Post
Do yourself a favor and read these two links. At least after that when you flap your gums there will be a glimmer of knowledge in what you're flapping about. And please don't say that Hornady is just posting fake news. If you need help understanding the tables just ask.

https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifl...43-gr-eld-x#!/

https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/r...sion-hunter#!/
So just what are you trying to say ? I've been running ELD-X 143's in my 6.5x55's since they first came out. I also use a lot of their Interlocks , Match and SST's in various calibers as well. I never have and never will have anything negative to say about Hornady products. Again, what's your point ?
Seriously Kurt, I think you had best bone -up on some of the basics.
Re-read your tag line.
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  #198  
Old 05-15-2018, 08:49 PM
Kurt505 Kurt505 is offline
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So just what are you trying to say ? I've been running ELD-X 143's in my 6.5x55's since they first came out. I also use a lot of their Interlocks , Match and SST's in various calibers as well. I never have and never will have anything negative to say about Hornady products. Again, what's your point ?
Seriously Kurt, I think you had best bone -up on some of the basics.
Re-read your tag line.
Obviously you need help with the tables.

In table one it shows that the 143 ELDX still has its terminal performance at 1800 fps. In table two it shows the 6.5 Creedmoor launching a 143gr ELDX out of their factory ammunition still is moving 2030fps at 500yds.

Now I'll help you put table one and table two together. When you shoot a 143gr ELDX out of a 6.5 Creedmoor, the velocity at 600yds will be right at 1800fps, and going with the specs given from Hornady, the bullet will still be traveling fast enough for the bullet to still have terminal performance as claimed by Hornady.

It works out on paper, and it works out in the practical.

You don't believe what you see on YouTube when the guy flattens an elk at 600yds with the Creedmoor. You don't believe what Hornady claims about the 143gr ELDX and the 6.5 Creedmoor, but for some reason I'm the one who has to bone up???

Bahahahaha!!! Why am I not surprised.

Last edited by Kurt505; 05-15-2018 at 09:11 PM.
  #199  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:24 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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Obviously you need help with the tables.

In table one it shows that the 143 ELDX still has its terminal performance at 1800 fps. In table two it had it shows the 6.5 Creedmoor launching a 143gr ELDX out of their factory ammunition still is moving 2030fps at 500yds.

Now I'll help you put table one and table two together. When you shoot a 143gr ELDX out of a 6.5 Creedmoor, the velocity at 600yds will be right at 1800fps, and going with the specs given from Hornady, the bullet will still be traveling fast enough for the bullet to still have terminal performance as claimed by Hornady.

You don't believe what you see on YouTube when the guy flattens an elk at 600yds with the Creedmoor. You don't believe what Hornady claims about the 143gr ELDX and the 6.5 Creedmoor, but for some reason I'm the one who has to bone up???

Bahahahaha!!! Why am I not surprised.
I really don't need to see the tables. I'll take them as gospel.
If you want to hunt Game at factory ammo minimums that's your call.
I think I've had enough experience with various 6.5's in all scenarios over the years to at least have a clue as to their capabilities. I don't need charts or gunwriters for that, nor do I need you or any of the YouTube stuff.

In that one UT video you refer to, you saw a guy with a rifle and a cartridge telling you how great it was. Then, in another frame you saw a Cow Elk, In a following frame you saw him on the trigger and a shot. In yet another frame you saw a Cow Elk take a hit.. Never once did you see all events in the same frame. . If you can't convince them with facts, dazzle them with B---S---. one of the oldest sales schemes on the Globe and used by most advertisers in one form or another to this day.. So yes, I'm always a bit skeptical of promo stuff . Not saying it didn't happen but ...
Anyway. I'll leave this topic from this point and you can continue with your chart reading.. . Have fun.
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  #200  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:40 PM
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I don't think I saw anywhere on this whole thread where anybody even suggested the 6.5 CM was a crappy game getter or unsuitable for hunting BG. It was however mentioned ,more than once, by some gum flapper that it would be a crappy large game getter at 600 yds. Quite possibly that somebody was me. Your buddy shooting a cow Elk at 120 yds with a 140 is well within the CM's parameters .. another 480 yds to go and there would be a distinct difference. You sound like a marksmanship instructor as well. Any other suggestions?
My remarks were not directed at you specifically. Earlier on in the thread there was some guy posting about it's lack of performance on pronghorn. I have made 2 one shot kills on whitetail deer out past 400yds with my 243 shooting 95 gr partitions. I would not even hesitate to stretch the 6.5 cm to 600yds on big game. As for my marksmanship instructor qualifications if your ever out my way I'd love to do some shooting with you. I'm sure there's things I could learn from your experience. I am a decent long range shooter with kills out past 800 yds but there's always room for improvement and your never done learning. To be fair I'm not interested in ever getting a 6.5 cm but it is capable to 600yds as a big game rifle. It's been proven. To state otherwise is just incorrect
  #201  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:47 PM
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At least we didn’t have to sift past all the cartridge drawings this time
  #202  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:59 PM
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What’s the big deal about action length anyway? This is the land of mostly wide open spaces. If I can’t get ze old Mauser 98 Swede with the 28” barrel turned around I just get out the chainsaw and make room. Accuracy is definitely not an issue, but I guess if you run an AR short is good.
  #203  
Old 05-15-2018, 10:06 PM
Pathfinder76 Pathfinder76 is online now
 
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Originally Posted by Salavee View Post
I really don't need to see the tables. I'll take them as gospel.
If you want to hunt Game at factory ammo minimums that's your call.
I think I've had enough experience with various 6.5's in all scenarios over the years to at least have a clue as to their capabilities. I don't need charts or gunwriters for that, nor do I need you or any of the YouTube stuff.

In that one UT video you refer to, you saw a guy with a rifle and a cartridge telling you how great it was. Then, in another frame you saw a Cow Elk, In a following frame you saw him on the trigger and a shot. In yet another frame you saw a Cow Elk take a hit.. Never once did you see all events in the same frame. . If you can't convince them with facts, dazzle them with B---S---. one of the oldest sales schemes on the Globe and used by most advertisers in one form or another to this day.. So yes, I'm always a bit skeptical of promo stuff . Not saying it didn't happen but ...
Anyway. I'll leave this topic from this point and you can continue with your chart reading.. . Have fun.
That cow elk had horns. I can clearly see you were paying attention. And now you are claiming it was staged? Priceless.
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  #204  
Old 05-15-2018, 10:21 PM
Kurt505 Kurt505 is offline
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What’s the big deal about action length anyway? This is the land of mostly wide open spaces. If I can’t get ze old Mauser 98 Swede with the 28” barrel turned around I just get out the chainsaw and make room. Accuracy is definitely not an issue, but I guess if you run an AR short is good.
In my case a short action is a big deal because my whole purpose of buying another Nula was to get the original ultra light rifle Melvin Forbes was famous for designing. So far all of my shots on big game have been under 600yds so that set the parameters for my range requirement of this particular rifle. Having a 308 and a 243 already, I was first thinking 7-08, but having a 280rem and a couple 280ai's I figured the 284 caliber was already taken care of. So I decided on a 6.5, then after weighing in all the pros and cons I went with the Creedmoor.
  #205  
Old 05-15-2018, 10:28 PM
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Where in the name of common sense did common sense go??

You guys truly quoting a youtube video?? Really ??

Like, like, like, Hey Dude, I can jump this skateboard 100 feet & do two flips in the air whilst doing it!! DUDE. You know what the diff is? The dude on the skateboard is only going to hurt himself, or some drunk that tries it & will wake up & wished he hadn't!!

The 600 yard CM gurus ( experienced hunters I think) would believe the marketing hype, here grab this newest technology go start shooting big game @ 600 yards!!Anyone else see a problem with that??

The real fact is every expert shooter/hunter/marksman(as well as the average hunter) here will have cleaner, more ethical kills at 60 yards vs 600, same day, same game, often enough that we need to be a little careful touting something so borderline.

Even the OP said it was deer & varmint only, not once did he mention it as a long-range rig, capable of miracles clearly shown on youtube. I think he's got it figured!!
  #206  
Old 05-15-2018, 10:39 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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My remarks were not directed at you specifically. Earlier on in the thread there was some guy posting about it's lack of performance on pronghorn. I have made 2 one shot kills on whitetail deer out past 400yds with my 243 shooting 95 gr partitions. I would not even hesitate to stretch the 6.5 cm to 600yds on big game. As for my marksmanship instructor qualifications if your ever out my way I'd love to do some shooting with you. I'm sure there's things I could learn from your experience. I am a decent long range shooter with kills out past 800 yds but there's always room for improvement and your never done learning. To be fair I'm not interested in ever getting a 6.5 cm but it is capable to 600yds as a big game rifle. It's been proven. To state otherwise is just incorrect
Fair enough. I may have been a bit too defensive on my assumption that it was me . Sorry... and I hear you on the Pronghorn episode.

It's rather interesting that I have three 6.5x55's -two with modern actions with high pressure loads that I have used quite a lot. I really adore the cartridge and found it to be literally lethal on Deer sized Game to around three hundred yards, mostly closer, but I have not, nor would I consider using it on Larger Game much further than 300 yds. I have larger calibers and cartridges that fill that bill much better although the 6.5x55 would be quite capable using 160 grainers. Until the CM is truly proven to be a consistent 600 Large Game cartridge, I will remain very skeptical in spite of all the speculation and I would have to see it done more than once... in real life or darn close to it, before I became a disciple. I know the more capable 6.5 Swede is not up that task. If you had one, I think you might agree.
My range is about 15 minutes from home and I'm usually there a couple of times a week during the milder months. If the opportunity arises I would welcome the opportunity to share a shooting session with you. You probably wouldn't learn anything but I might, and it would be fun.
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  #207  
Old 05-15-2018, 10:53 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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That cow elk had horns. I can clearly see you were paying attention. And now you are claiming it was staged? Priceless.

You must have been looking at the Goat up on the hill behind it.
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  #208  
Old 05-15-2018, 11:01 PM
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Fair enough. I may have been a bit too defensive on my assumption that it was me . Sorry... and I hear you on the Pronghorn episode.

It's rather interesting that I have three 6.5x55's -two with modern actions with high pressure loads that I have used quite a lot. I really adore the cartridge and found it to be literally lethal on Deer sized Game to around three hundred yards, mostly closer, but I have not, nor would I consider using it on Larger Game much further than 300 yds. I have larger calibers and cartridges that fill that bill much better although the 6.5x55 would be quite capable using 160 grainers. Until the CM is truly proven to be a consistent 600 Large Game cartridge, I will remain very skeptical in spite of all the speculation and I would have to see it done more than once... in real life or darn close to it, before I became a disciple. I know the more capable 6.5 Swede is not up that task. If you had one, I think you might agree.
My range is about 15 minutes from home and I'm usually there a couple of times a week during the milder months. If the opportunity arises I would welcome the opportunity to share a shooting session with you. You probably wouldn't learn anything but I might, and it would be fun.
No problem, I have never shot a 6.5 at any game before but have shot them on steel. But my 243 has been used successfully out to 400 yds on big at does with one shot kills so the larger heavier 6.5 would be just as effective or more in my mind.
My range is in my backyard and stretches out past 1500yds so I consider myself blessed to be able to shoot whenever I want.. I learn something new almost every time I send a round down range and it's surprising who you learn from
  #209  
Old 05-15-2018, 11:26 PM
Kurt505 Kurt505 is offline
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Serious question here,


What happens to a 143gr 6.5 caliber eldx bullet that is traveling 2000fps that makes it non lethal?
  #210  
Old 05-15-2018, 11:32 PM
Salavee Salavee is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obsessed1 View Post
No problem, I have never shot a 6.5 at any game before but have shot them on steel. But my 243 has been used successfully out to 400 yds on big at does with one shot kills so the larger heavier 6.5 would be just as effective or more in my mind.
My range is in my backyard and stretches out past 1500yds so I consider myself blessed to be able to shoot whenever I want.. I learn something new almost every time I send a round down range and it's surprising who you learn from

You are blessed, that's for sure. Trigger time galore and at those distances I'm sure you do learn something each time.

With all the previous CM chatter condensed, it's all about the CM being a reliable and consistent Large Game cartridge (Elk/Moose) at ranges of 600 yds plus. It's not about the cartridge itself being an effective Game Cartridge at nominal ranges. As a small cased 6.5 the CM will either prove itself in that LR capacity or it won't. One LR promotional Vid posted on YouTube doesn't really cut it , for me anyway.. You have read the rest. To each their own.
Enjoy your Range !
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