243 weatherby vanguard thoughts

[Fish along]

I purchased a 243 last fall ,thinking that the recoil would be easier on the shoulder,i found out that it also has a good kick is this common ?also i got this gun to take deer mainly, since i may get a moose tag this fall could it be effective within 200yds,i have 7mmrem mag i know it will definetly do the trick ,but like your thoughts ;also i would like some advice on which ammo would be best for moose and deer .thanks in advance..

[Alberta Bigbore]

Ive been playing alot with my .243. I got it mainly as a wolf/coyote gun. But ive really been gaining confidence with it and am considering trying to use it for elk this coming season. Ive seen people shoot moose with them on here... i dont plan on risky shots or long range. But a nice broadside shot in the boiler with premium bullets will do the trick. Im loading up some Nolser Partitions and tryimg to work up a load.

[TriggerHappyHippy]

I have a Weatherby Vanguard 243 also
Mine shoots half inch groups at 150 yards
and 1 inch groups at 250 yards with my handloads
If you can consistantly shoot in the same spot, I would not think twice about Elk with the right bullet. I myself would use something bigger on moose, but I am sure it is possible to get a clean kill.
Some of my friends shoot larger calibers, but are not nearly as accurate

[I.R.Chevy]

Your 243 is more than sufficient.

If you can make the shot it will perform. Use premium bullets and you will do fine.

Edit: I would use the 7mm mag. With that option though, I just really like the way it performs considering recoil. Still kicks but its a good kick I guess

[sns2]

Certainly it can be done, but why try when you have something you know can do a better job? Big game deserve nothing less.

[Bobby B.]

Hopefully, I'll be drawn for cow moose this fall. If so, I plan on killing her with a 70 grain 6mm ballistic tip with a muzzle velocity of 4000 fps. I've killed alot of deer, antelope and coyotes with that bullet at 3950 fps in my old 240 Gordy. I'll be sure to hit her broadside in the lungs. With some help, I might even get the kill on video.

There's no reason why a 243 won't kill a moose if hit properly. The 260 rem and it's equivalents regularly kill elk, moose, deer, etc.. My 7 rm hasn't seen any use since my last trip to Namibia. I'll be using my 260 with 130 Bergers on bear this spring.

Bobby B.

[Fish along]

Originally Posted by Bobby B.

Hopefully, I'll be drawn for cow moose this fall. If so, I plan on killing her with a 70 grain 6mm ballistic tip with a muzzle velocity of 4000 fps. I've killed alot of deer, antelope and coyotes with that bullet at 3950 fps in my old 240 Gordy. I'll be sure to hit her broadside in the lungs. With some help, I might even get the kill on video.

There's no reason why a 243 won't kill a moose if hit properly. The 260 rem and it's equivalents regularly kill elk, moose, deer, etc.. My 7 rm hasn't seen any use since my last trip to Namibia. I'll be using my 260 with 130 Bergers on bear this spring.

Bobby B.

So what sort of yardage would you be shooting?

[savage shooter]

cow moose this fall. If so, I plan on killing her with a 70 grain 6mm ballistic tip with a muzzle velocity of 4000 fps.

Bobby, respectfully, that bullet is not rated for game kills at that velocity according to Nosler. It will 'splash' if it hits heavy bone. Maximum speed rating is 3200FPS.

If you want to shoot a light bullet at 4000 fps at a moose might I suggest a TSX/TTSX or an Accubond or similarly constructed bullet?

[BigJon]

Originally Posted by savage shooter

Bobby, respectfully, that bullet is not rated for game kills at that velocity according to Nosler. It will 'splash' if it hits heavy bone. Maximum speed rating is 3200FPS.

If you want to shoot a light bullet at 4000 fps at a moose might I suggest a TSX/TTSX or an Accubond or similarly constructed bullet?

By reading Bobby's entire post it seems he has some experience killing game (other than varmints) with that bullet...

To Bobby...what does that bullet do to a coyote at high speed if you poke one into the ribs, avoding shoulder, spine, etc.?

[Bobby B.]

Originally Posted by BigJon

By reading Bobby's entire post it seems he has some experience killing game (other than varmints) with that bullet...

To Bobby...what does that bullet do to a coyote at high speed if you poke one into the ribs, avoding shoulder, spine, etc.?

I can't recall the exact number of game animals I killed with the 240 Gordy but my guess it would be around 15-20. From what I recall, they all died with one shot. Most died RIGHT NOW. Based on personal experience, that 70 grainer killed deer and antelope noticably quicker than my 7 RM.

I kill coyotes just to kill coyotes. I do not kill coyotes to collect their fur. To me, a coyote is a pest animal to be killed on sight. So, it's been a long, long time since I've walked up to a coyote just to see how the bullet performed. To me, the bullet did its job if the coyote drops dead.

Nonetheless, from what I remember, the 70 grain BT always existed the coyote and always tore a big exit hole. Of course the hole was bigger if shoulder bones or the spine was struck.

Hope that helps.

Bobby B.

[Bobby B.]

Originally Posted by savage shooter

Bobby, respectfully, that bullet is not rated for game kills at that velocity according to Nosler. It will 'splash' if it hits heavy bone. Maximum speed rating is 3200FPS.

If you want to shoot a light bullet at 4000 fps at a moose might I suggest a TSX/TTSX or an Accubond or similarly constructed bullet?

I couldn't give a ratsass what Nosler says. I've personally experienced what that bullet will do at that velocity. I don't need to read about it. How many animals have you personally killed with 70 grain bullets at 4000 fps?

Bobby B.

[45/70/500]

what are you loading and what barrel length to get a 70gn bullet going 4000fps?

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Bobby B.

I couldn't give a ratsass what Nosler says. I've personally experienced what that bullet will do at that velocity. I don't need to read about it. How many animals have you personally killed with 70 grain bullets at 4000 fps?

Bobby B.

I zipped a deer with a 90gr btip bullet out of a 240wby going 3450ish..,.was told it was too fast and too light by many.....hands on field tests trumps paper recommendations IMHO.

Btw....that deer went 15 feet or so....

LC

[Bobby B.]

Originally Posted by 45/70/500

what are you loading and what barrel length to get a 70gn bullet going 4000fps?

284 win necked down to 6mm. Hart handlapped 26" barrel. Don't remember the twist rate but was specified for 70 grain BT's.

Bobby B.

[Bobby B.]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

I zipped a deer with a 90gr btip bullet out of a 240wby going 3450ish..,.was told it was too fast and too light by many.....hands on field tests trumps paper recommendations IMHO.

Btw....that deer went 15 feet or so....

LC

I'm with you on this one. Too many shooters recite what they read as though somehow it's the gospel. Here's a suggestion to them. Quit reading and starting doing. Facts are better facts when they're YOUR facts.

Reminds me of when the 2, yes 2, PH's in Namibia were politely skeptical about my choice of the 168 Berger 7mm on their PG animals. Well, they ain't now. And, neither am I. The proof is in the pudding and I made a lot of pudding.

Bobby B.

[purgatory.sv]

Is that the picture on the Berger bullet display mat?
I like the 24 cal bullet.

[Bobby B.]

Originally Posted by purgatory.sv

Is that the picture on the Berger bullet display mat?
I like the 24 cal bullet.

Can't vouch for it personally, but according to both sns2 and Lefty-Canuck it is.

Bobby B.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Bobby B.

Can't vouch for it personally, but according to both sns2 and Lefty-Canuck it is.

Bobby B.

I always thought the guy on the mat looked taller....

LC

[savage shooter]

I'm sure it can kill if you put it exactly where you're aiming. Things happen, though, and it won't fare well against an elk or moose shoulder. Have you see results of the bullet fired into cow femur? It's a pancake.

There are simply better constructed bullets available which will give you more penetration should you accidentally hit big bone...

[Bobby B.]

Originally Posted by savage shooter

I'm sure it can kill if you put it exactly where you're aiming. Things happen, though, and it won't fare well against an elk or moose shoulder. Have you see results of the bullet fired into cow femur? It's a pancake.

There are simply better constructed bullets available which will give you more penetration should you accidentally hit big bone...

No, I've never shot a cow with this load, only deer, antelope and coyotes.

If you want to present theories, that's one thing but actual field experience carries more weight. Still, I present some firsthand experiences for your consideration.

When I developed the 240 Gordy, I settled on a load of 3950 fps with the 70 BT. The next step was to test on something. Other than paper, the first thing I shot with it was a magpie. I had just finished sighting in for a 200 zero and my rifle was still resting in the sand bags. This magpie came flying along and landed on the rail of the 200 yd backstop. I couldn't resist the opportunity. After the shot, I wasn't sure if I had hit solidly him or not but did see some feathers floating in the air. Curiousity got the better of me and I walked to the 200 yard stopper and started searching for the magpie. At first, I couldn't find him. Then, I started finding pieces of him, like a leg with some skin still attached, like a piece of something here and there. It seemed to me as though the damn thing had been exploded. I had never seen or heard of anything like this before. Bear in mind this was 20-30 years ago. The concept of "Red Mist" is now quite common.

The next thing was to test it on steel. We placed some gongs out at the 200 yard marker with the gong resting snugly against the 4x4 upright post. Sorry, but I don't recall what steel the gong was. Anyway, we tested the effect of the 70 BT and any other load from any other rifle we could get our hands on. The 240 Gordy created craters in the steel significantly deeper than anything we tried out of a 7RM, a 300 Winnie, a 270 Weatherby, a 270 Win, a 30/06 loaded with FMJ's, a 223 loaded with FMJ's, etc., etc.. Whoever was willing to add to the experiment, we asked to shoot our gong. Nothing penetrated steel like that 70 BT zipping along at 3950. Nothing.

The first gophers shot with the Gordy surprised and delighted us. The gophers were either tossed 10-15 feet in the air or simply disintegrated. Damn impressive stuff.

The effect on deer, antelope and coyotes had to be witnessed to be believed. The only way to describe most of the kills is to say the animal died INSTANTLY. Some of the deer folded up their legs into somewhat of a sleeping position then dropped to the ground. Due to bad placement, some of the deer were hit in the spine and some in the shoulder. NEVER, and I do mean NEVER, did that bullet ever fail to bust bone.

Bobby B.

[Metalmike123]

Good choice, I love the Vanguard rifles. Nice, heavy, simple actions.

[couleefolk]

quote:"I purchased a 243 last fall ,thinking that the recoil would be easier on the shoulder,i found out that it also has a good kick is this common?"

Not sure, but are you saying the 243 is kicking fairly hard? i have shot the 243 vanguard and found the recoil to be very light, especially with the heavy weight of the rifle. maybe the loads are wrong in some way if it is kicking hard?