35 Whelen Ron Smith Re-Bore Success

[Double Dropper]

Dropped off a clean stainless Remington 700 in 06 to Ron Smith in Alberta for a re-bore. He was quite the character and great to chat with. Went with a gain twist 1-12 on the factory 24 inch barrel. Excellent Christmas gift for me as it was done ahead of schedule and during the break drove down to pick it up. Rifling was smooth as glass and chamber looked beautiful. Rifle is stock save a Limbsaver recoil pad and a Trigger Tech trigger set to 2.5lbs. Sooooo how does it shoot? I played with 4 loads using 225 grain Sierras, 225 Grain Accubonds, and 250 grain Speers Hot Cors, It did not take much, 225 Grain Accubonds and Varget produced 3 rounds touching at 100 yards, amazing! Shot one through buddies Chrono for 2755 fps! Thats moving, it is gonna hit like a hammer. OH ya, the cost....phone Ron but less than half the cost of a new barrel.

[Dean2]

He is a great guy and produces some wonderful barrels. Glad yours worked out so well. That will make a tremendous all round hunting rifle.

[Double Dropper]

I may have to squeak another rifle in there lol hes getting on in the years. He keeps saying hes not sure how much longer hes gonna punch out barrels but the next day, there he is. Great to deal with.

[58thecat]

very nice, accurate and practical combination. Congrats.

[Pioneer2]

Yes, you would have a hard time getting a barrel from him that wasn't gain twist.I had him re-bore a 50's Marlin 336/30-30 to 38-55 1-16" .376" groove to make use of both .375 and .377 bullets.Scoped shoots around an inch at 100 yards 1600fps with cast 276gr GC

[Double Dropper]

I have a friend with wild boar running loose on his farm....may have to christen the Whelen this month.

[Pioneer2]

I'll send you a nice wild boar Italian sausage recipe I tried last week.

[fps plus]

Hope you enjoy your 35. I have owned a couple 35 Whelen and currently own a 350 mag. For plinking trailboss and pistol bullets are fun. I have just tried the Barnes 180 x in my 350 and it’s very accurate. Glad it’s working out for you

[Double Dropper]

Thought about the 180's but when you punch the bullets from 180-250 and calculate the energy at 300-400 yards the 225 wins. Its about as flat as the 200 grain bullets and more retained energy, but you got me thinking to look at the 180's again lol

[Kapustacrk]

Yes the man has made a lot of great barrels and rebored a few for me. Last one was an older rem. 700 from 30-06 to .338-06 LH twist, and shoots like all of his barrels. GREAT !! Hope to get a couple more done before he retires" !! Always have a good visit with him and his wife and son(Gerald) !! They don't make em like that no more. !! KAPCRK. !!

[270person]

Originally Posted by Double Dropper

Thought about the 180's but when you punch the bullets from 180-250 and calculate the energy at 300-400 yards the 225 wins. Its about as flat as the 200 grain bullets and more retained energy, but you got me thinking to look at the 180's again lol

I thought about Barnes 180's as well. Shot a few 200's at the range and they performed very decently. BUT we don't own Whelens to shoot 180's and 200's right? Like you I settled on 225 AB's and I can say honestly that I haven't grouped anything tighter at 100-200 through any of my other rifles including the Creedmoor.

Great caliber. Very understated. Quite similar to the 338 for speed and thump out to 250ish with 225's and 250's with a lot more manners. Cheap brass being an added bonus. It has become the only rifle of the 9 I own that I will never sell.

[bubba300]

Ron did a 308 model 88 winchester to 358 win for me.I was very happy with it.Not to many gunsmiths doing rebore's anymore,hopefully when he retire's Gerald will continue rebore's.

[Double Dropper]

Last we spoke he was working on both boys to take over. One was farming and the other was in school. I sure hope one of them takes over, was great meeting Ron.

[catnthehat]

I stopped by the other day, but sadly the job we were discussing involved a very short carbine in 30/40 Krag (16.5" barrel) that would do me no good at all re-bored . Looks like I am getting yet another RKS gain twist 6.5 barrelled single shot!
A re-bore would have been great if it was doable However.
Looks like you have a winner with yours , congratulations!
Cat

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by 270person

I thought about Barnes 180's as well. Shot a few 200's at the range and they performed very decently. BUT we don't own Whelens to shoot 180's and 200's right? Like you I settled on 225 AB's and I can say honestly that I haven't grouped anything tighter at 100-200 through any of my other rifles including the Creedmoor.

Great caliber. Very understated. Quite similar to the 338 for speed and thump out to 250ish with 225's and 250's with a lot more manners. Cheap brass being an added bonus. It has become the only rifle of the 9 I own that I will never sell.

Absolutely! He builds them right. I have one in .35 Ai and it's a jewel. Wouldn't
ever be without it. It loves Woodleigh 250 gr PPSN and 225 Accubonds.

[Double Dropper]

35 AI how much real gain? This has intrigued me a ton! could clean up that chamber and go LOL

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Double Dropper

35 AI how much real gain? This has intrigued me a ton! could clean up that chamber and go LOL

Not much to gain velocity wise.. maybe 40 or 50 fps, but the Ai configuration seems to be easier on brass. Never had to trim yet and thats after about 8 fairly stiff reloads .

[Dean2]

Originally Posted by Salavee

Not much to gain velocity wise.. maybe 40 or 50 fps, but the Ai configuration seems to be easier on brass. Never had to trim yet and thats after about 8 fairly stiff reloads .

I agree, most AI get 50-150 fps. Some cartridges benefit more from widening the body than others. The 300 H&H is a heavily tapered body with a low angle shoulder and benefits quite a bit velocity wise. AIing a 308 would be a total waste of time.

The one thing I did find with AIs is many, though not all, did not feed near as good as the smoother tapered original rounds. A 7x57 AI is a prime example of a cartridge that no longer feeds near as well. For a hunting gun I will give up 50 or 100 FPS for dead reliable feeding any time.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Dean2

I agree, most AI get 50-150 fps. Some cartridges benefit more from widening the body than others. The 300 H&H is a heavily tapered body with a low angle shoulder and benefits quite a bit velocity wise. AIing a 308 would be a total waste of time.

The one thing I did find with AIs is many, though not all, did not feed near as good as the smoother tapered original rounds. A 7x57 AI is a prime example of a cartridge that no longer feeds near as well. For a hunting gun I will give up 50 or 100 FPS for dead reliable feeding any time.

I think a gain of 150 fps might be stretching it a bit but in some rifles,maybe.

As far as feeding is concerned, I have never had an issue with my Mark X action but I agree, it probably could cause feeding grief in some rifles.
I use regular .35 Whelen ammo(for the headstamp) and fire form. Have'nt noticed a whole lot of difference between the two cartridges except as I noted previously, but I will say, either is a mighty fine hunting round.

[Homesteader]

Originally Posted by Double Dropper

35 AI how much real gain? This has intrigued me a ton! could clean up that chamber and go LOL

Skip the AI!

59g Reloader 15 and 250g Bullet and watch the chrony

Work up of course, but that was my go to load in my 7600. On a warm day it would break 2600, and in the hunting season 2550 all day long. Great for taking core samples on Bull Elk lungs.

[Double Dropper]

Played with Reloader 15 last week, I cannot get over 56 grains with a 225 grain bullet. Not sure if the recipe has changed so to speak but a 250 grain bullet.....I couldnt see getting 59 grains in there. With newer powders specifically CFE223, Alliant Power Pro Varmint and 2000MR gents are comfortably getting over 2600 fps with these ones. The new Speer manual has these going up to 2700 fps but they do not indicate barrel length. CFE223 will be the next try but with the success of Varget and 2750 not so sure I am in a hurry.

[Flight01]

I hear he does great work.

Thinking of getting my Rem 673 bored from .308 win to 338 federal or if he thinks he can I’d go 358 win. I feel the Mohawks were meant to hit hard up close. So a 358 win sounds just right.

You guys and gals Think there’s enough meat to bore out to 358?
Not that a 308 can’t get the job done

[EZM]

Genuinely curious to read studies (actual experiments) to show the effects of gain twist, and a few other things like 5 grove/ 4 grove barrels and what the results are for velocity and, more importantly accuracy.

If anyone has any neat articles ….. shout it out. Would make for an interesting read.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Homesteader

Skip the AI!

59g Reloader 15 and 250g Bullet and watch the chrony

Work up of course, but that was my go to load in my 7600. On a warm day it would break 2600, and in the hunting season 2550 all day long. Great for taking core samples on Bull Elk lungs.

I get 2600 with the same powder charge of Ramshot Big Game using a 250
Woodleigh on a cool day. As mentioned , not much dif with the Ai other than
extended case life. There just may be some additional benefit by using a more temp stable powder as well.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by EZM

Genuinely curious to read studies (actual experiments) to show the effects of gain twist, and a few other things like 5 grove/ 4 grove barrels and what the results are for velocity and, more importantly accuracy.

If anyone has any neat articles ….. shout it out. Would make for an interesting read.

I don't have any documented evidence but what I have found is that gain twist eliminates the possiblity of pressure spikes and is easier on projectiles, especially those with lighter jackets.
My reasoning is that std rifling is trying to do two things simultaneously with the projectile- allowing them to accelertate and starting rotation at the same instant , causing higher pressures upon the bullets contact with the lands. Slowing the initial rotation down by 50 %, or more, at the outset requires less pressure and causes less bullet stress resulting in a pressure curve rather than a possible spike.
Secondly, there is no real need to have the bullet spinning at over 150,000 rpm, for almost the complete length of the barrel. A few (4 or 5) inches of a given twist rate near the muzzle is enough to give it the required rotation.
Accuracy is not affected in any way and may even be enhanced as all my RKS gain twist barrels have proven to be exceptionally accurate, probably due to the progressive twist rate more than anything else I can think of, including lapping. Just my thoughts, cloudy as they are.

[Double Dropper]

Originally Posted by Flight01

I hear he does great work.

Thinking of getting my Rem 673 bored from .308 win to 338 federal or if he thinks he can I’d go 358 win. I feel the Mohawks were meant to hit hard up close. So a 358 win sounds just right.

You guys and gals Think there’s enough meat to bore out to 358?
Not that a 308 can’t get the job done

358 Winnie is perfect in a short action, never run out of 308 cases (I do have a bag of 20 358 Win doing nothing) I do think he could bore it to .358. Alot of gents love that calibre.