7x61 Sharpe & Hart

royal coachman · #1 11-23-2021, 05:28 PM

Hello all, i just picked up a Model 65 Schultz & Larsen in 7x61 Sharpe & Hart. Just looking for some load information & thoughts on this caliber from the depth of knowledge that this group has. I have dies and brass and know this is a reloading proposition but have been intrigued by this caliber for quite awhile. Anyone have favorite loads they have worked up that you would share?
Many thanks in advance

brewster29 · #2 11-23-2021, 07:21 PM

I inherited a S&L model 60 in 7x61 from my father. As a teen I shot my first mule and wt bucks with this rifle. Mine has the 1-12" twist so works best with 150gr or lighter bullets. I have some old manuals and load data that I could copy and send you if you like. These rifles can be prone to case head separation if loaded hot and full length resized, due to the rear bolt lockup, so easy does it.

I have had good success forming brass from 7 rem mag as well.

Hawkeye · #3 11-23-2021, 08:46 PM

I happened to find this on the web:
https://loaddata.com/articles/PDF/LD-44%20Thomas.pdf

I cannot vouch for it, but based on a very quick look, it seemed credible.

There are two kinds of Norma brass: 'original' 7x61 S&H brass and a 'second-generation' that was marked 7x61 S&H Super. The outside dimensions are similar but the Super version weighs less and has greater internal volume.
Apparently, brass can be formed from 7 Rem Mag.

Good luck in your quest

Dean2 · #4 11-24-2021, 05:27 AM

The 7x61 ad 7x64 are very similar performance wise, the big difference being belted versus not. I have never loaded for a 7x61, but from loading for the 7x64 and 7x65R (Same cartridge as the 7x64 but with a Rim for break action rifles) you will have no issues getting good accuracy and performance. I tend to load on the lighter side to preserve brass. There is however no need to worry about the strength of your gun. The Schultz and Larsen 65 are a tremendously smooth, accurate and beautiful operating rifle so well worth keeping in the family. They are a rear lug but they have 4 rear lugs and are a very strong action. You do not have to download out of worries about the strength of the action. The Norma super ammo gave 7 Rem mag performance out of this very gun.

Just as an aside, Schultz and Larsen actually made MKV actions for Weatherby for a while, and kept a version in their own line up for many years so they know a lot about building great, strong actions. Look forward to updates as you develop loads.

1886 · #5 11-24-2021, 07:07 PM

Mine was a model 60 with 1 in 12 twist. I used to use imr 4350 behind a 139 grain hornady bullet in 7x61 super brass . Loaded close to max.

leo · #6 11-24-2021, 09:22 PM

They’re extremely well made rifles. Back in the day they were worth 1/3 more than a Weatherby MK V. I have load data I will share with you if you like. PM me.

6.5 shooter · #7 11-24-2021, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean2

The 7x61 ad 7x64 are very similar performance wise, the big difference being belted versus not. I have never loaded for a 7x61, but from loading for the 7x64 and 7x65R (Same cartridge as the 7x64 but with a Rim for break action rifles) you will have no issues getting good accuracy and performance. I tend to load on the lighter side to preserve brass. There is however no need to worry about the strength of your gun. The Schultz and Larsen 65 are a tremendously smooth, accurate and beautiful operating rifle so well worth keeping in the family. They are a rear lug but they have 4 rear lugs and are a very strong action. You do not have to download out of worries about the strength of the action. The Norma super ammo gave 7 Rem mag performance out of this very gun.

Just as an aside, Schultz and Larsen actually made MKV actions for Weatherby for a while, and kept a version in their own line up for many years so they know a lot about building great, strong actions. Look forward to updates as you develop loads.

^^^ Pretty much say's it all ^^^

elkhunter11 · #8 11-24-2021, 09:40 PM

Schultz and Larsen built 378 Weatherby rifles using their model 54 action, before the Mark V was developed . The 7x61 seems like a nice cartridge, but the selection of cases is limited.

Pioneer2 · #9 11-25-2021, 05:30 AM

Norma or Norma

Pioneer2 · #10 11-25-2021, 05:40 AM

Norma or Norma.........Not covered is the 1-12 rifling twist which may work best with 140-150gr bullets although they did make a factory 160gr load. As well the two different brass and their internal capacity varies between regular and "super".

Dean2 · #11 11-25-2021, 06:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Schultz and Larsen built 378 Weatherby rifles using their model 54 action, before the Mark V was developed . The 7x61 seems like a nice cartridge, but the selection of cases is limited.

True and more accurate than my statement with respect to the action Schultz and Larsen used for Weatherby rifles they were contracted to build. As to brass, Norma is the only one that makes it with a 7x61 head stamp but you can make it from any 7 Rem Mag case if you can't find Norma cases.

6.5 shooter · #12 11-25-2021, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pioneer2

Norma or Norma

Not true, I have 3 different brands of factory rounds. Federal, S&B, PPU.
Plus once you have the brass you can reload with any bullet weight/brand your heart desires.

1886 · #13 11-25-2021, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6.5 shooter

Not true, I have 3 different brands of factory rounds. Federal, S&B, PPU.
Plus once you have the brass you can reload with any bullet weight/brand your heart desires.

Where did you find the other types of factory ammo for a 7x61?

brewster29 · #14 11-25-2021, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pioneer2

Norma or Norma.........Not covered is the 1-12 rifling twist which may work best with 140-150gr bullets although they did make a factory 160gr load. As well the two different brass and their internal capacity varies between regular and "super".

As a point of interest I weighed several fired cases:
Norma 7x61 S&H. 258.5 gr
Norma 7x61 Super. 223.0 gr
WW 7 RM formed case 229.6 gr

There is considerable volume difference between the regular and Super versions of the Norma, definitely enough to cause problems if your load for the Super brass gets into a regular case.

Another bit of weirdness- the 7x61 Super cases I have didn’t really want to fit in my #4 shellholder…they are all well used and I don’t have new ones to compare.

1886 · #15 11-25-2021, 02:10 PM

Thee rim on new norma 7x61 super ammo is .528 and on new Remington and federal 7mm mag ammo in .526

royal coachman · #16 11-25-2021, 05:07 PM

Thanks everyone for the comments and data sent, gives me a great starting point. I have some 4350 powder and was thinking of using that to start with. The rifle is a very smooth action with a short bolt throw, really looking forward to working this up.
Cheers!

1886 · #17 11-25-2021, 08:49 PM

I found with mine it was 200 fps fast than what my manual said.

traderal · #18 11-25-2021, 09:05 PM

I had an S&L in 308 Norma magnum back in 1964 that I made difficult to cycle the action after a few hot loads so I do not consider it a better action than a MKV. I had one in 7x61 and had it rechambered to 7RM for $99 at Custom Gun just because brass was not easy to find. Every time I see an S&L 68DL listed I feel my credit card vibrating.

ken1989 · #19 04-27-2022, 07:31 PM

Well one of my elderly friends brought me today a Shultz & Larsen M68DL in 7 X 61 S&H, 70s vintage 3 x 9 Leupold that he wants to sell for him. Said he bought it new and put about 60 rounds thru it, 200 plus new Norma brass, factory ammo and dies, 80-85 % condition. What is it worth?