11,000 AHS workers to lose their jobs

[CaberTosser]

Originally Posted by Jokey75

Seems like you only wanna toss that out there when it's someone else having a hard time.

Were you spouting off that bit of wisdom to the O&G guys here when they started losing their jobs or only towards the people you don't like?

Rhetorical question there....we all know the answer.

They already knew life wasn’t always fair. Some lessons take a while to set in for others, if the lesson even takes at all, such as in your oblivious case

[sns2]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

I don't get it.

How does it make sense to cut health care workers just when we need them the most?

I know no profession is perfect, but honestly, from what I've seen we could get by very well with a lot fewer politicians but not with a substandard health care system.

I've encountered a few doctors that didn't impress me much but I can honestly say I have never met a nurse or housekeeper in any hospital that did not impress the heck out of me. I never get to interact with kitchen staff so I can't say about them but as near as I can tell they do their jobs well and work as hard as anyone.

There aren't a lot of professions I see as essential, health care workers are one exception.

I wouldn't want to live in a world without doctors and nurses or policemen and firemen.
And their support staff.

I could get by just fine with one tenth the politicians and lawyers. As far as I can see they contribute little to improving life for the rest of us.

All they do is pass laws that restrict law abiding citizens and offer loopholes for criminals to slip through.

I say leave our health care workers alone. If you want to make cuts that make a real difference, make your cuts on parliament hill.

Agreed 1000%

[obsessed1]

Chop chop. Start at the top and end at the bottom. Lots of these so called amazing front line workers use and abuse the system requiring 3-4 people to cover 1 job. Bloated system from the top to bottom. Snip snip

[saskbooknut]

Stand by to hear -
Friends of the UCP got the contracts
The savings are illusory to negligible
Cleaning in hospitals is substandard
Families step in to help with hospital cleaning
The food is inedible, prison fare, not healthy for salt and fats
We've seen this movie before

[elkhunter11]

When it comes right down to it, this isn't about who isn't doing a good job, or who doesn't deserve their job, it's about numbers. The government needs to cut expenses, and it has to come frome somewhere. If it isn't from Healthcare, it has to be from another department, like education, or another department, who feels that their job is just as important. No matter which department it effects someone won't be happy.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by rem338win

Oh no. I have teachers in the fam. I crap on the system.

And you made this about you, your magical education and how much more relevant it makes you. Don't deflect; own what you said.

My education came at a great cost, I appreciate it and refuse to make it sound like someone owes me. That's degrading to other's sacrifice.

My service to society would likely be equivalent to yours, as would many of people on this forums, including those you feel the right to chastise.

Your stepping up to a line you used to quickly suspend and ban people for. Be a little more objective and the response might be as well.

Nope. Not even close. Go back and read the exchange. It started on post 36 when someone took a swipe at me to get my head out of my union bubble, and directly implied that I need to take a wage reduction to do my part, when in fact I have been taking zeros coming up on ten years when inflation keeps on going.

Why would any of you expect any of us guys who belong to unions to lay down and happily be your whipping boys any time the subject comes up? Most just tap out because they know there is no changing attitudes on this subject, but I have time on my hands this week, so I will keep typing.

But hey, if you are really convinced that I have broken a rule, you can always report it.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by obsessed1

Chop chop. Start at the top and end at the bottom. Lots of these so called amazing front line workers use and abuse the system requiring 3-4 people to cover 1 job. Bloated system from the top to bottom. Snip snip

You are correct, there are many changes that could be made. Wouldn't it make sense to then fix the parts of the system that encourages or allows abuse rather than to tear the entire system apart??

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Scott h

You are correct, there are many changes that could be made. Wouldn't it make sense to then fix the parts of the system that encourages or allows abuse rather than to tear the entire system apart??

So what do you suppose happens when you make changes that make the system more efficient? The end rest is that you require less staff to operate, so you end up laying off the excess staff. And the more efficient you become, the less staff you require. And that is why some departments don't try to hard to become more efficient.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

When it comes right down to it, this isn't about who isn't doing a good job, or who doesn't deserve their job, it's about numbers. The government needs to cut expenses, and it has to come frome somewhere. If it isn't from Healthcare, it has to be from another department, like education, or another department, who feels that their job is just as important. No matter which department it effects someone won't be happy.

I'm sure you are right that to the government it's about numbers.

But for me it has nothing to do with numbers.
For me it's about who is most important to society.

To my mind we need politicians the least. So they should suffer the first and deepest cuts.

Frankly I think nurses and other health care providers deserve a raise, not a cut in numbers.

If we added up what all involved in politics cost us and what our Police, Nurses, teachers, fireman and soldiers cost us, I would be very surprised if politicians did not cost us more then double all the other professions combined.

Keep in mind it's not just their salaries that cost us. One has to also consider the money they give to foreign dictators who pocket our money, plus what they give to the likes of LNC Lavalan and WE.

Plus what was spent on monogrammed golf balls to give to rich friends of the government not to mention paying $36.00 for a cotter key that ACE sells for .69 cants.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

I'm sure you are right that to the government it's about numbers.

But for me it has nothing to do with numbers.
For me it's about who is most important to society.

To my mind we need politicians the least. So they should suffer the first and deepest cuts.

Frankly I think nurses and other health care providers deserve a raise, not a cut in numbers.

If we added up what all involved in politics cost us and what our Police, Nurses, teachers, fireman and soldiers cost us, I would be very surprised if politicians did not cost us more then double all the other professions combined.

Keep in mind it's not just their salaries that cost us. One has to also consider the money they give to foreign dictators who pocket our money, plus what they give to the likes of LNC Lavalan and WE.

Plus what was spent on monogrammed golf balls to give to rich friends of the government not to mention paying $36.00 for a cotter key that ACE sells for .69 cants.

Unfortunately, politicians are not going to cut their own wages, although I agree they are greatly overpaid .As for the billions that Trudeau gives away , that is the federal government, not our provincial government.

[AndrewM]

Originally Posted by sns2

Nope. Not even close. Go back and read the exchange. It started on post 36 when someone took a swipe at me to get my head out of my union bubble, and directly implied that I need to take a wage reduction to do my part, when in fact I have been taking zeros coming up on ten years when inflation keeps on going.

Why would any of you expect any of us guys who belong to unions to lay down and happily be your whipping boys any time the subject comes up? Most just tap out because they know there is no changing attitudes on this subject, but I have time on my hands this week, so I will keep typing.

But hey, if you are really convinced that I have broken a rule, you can always report it.

I never said you or any other teacher needs a wage cut. Sorry if you implied that as that was not my intention. I was meaning we all took wage cuts and we are still spending more than the government can afford so we need to clean up the system as there is no more money left in our pockets to pay more taxes. No way I want teachers, nurses or any other front line workers fired. I would like to see the system cleaned up of all the ones taking advantage. Example: Teachers taking sick days to mark or fill out report cards. Nurses picking shifts that pay more because they have seniority yet refusing to work full time.

[Sooner]

Originally Posted by Albertadiver

I've worked directly with AHS for a number of years.

The gross amount of waste with management is insane. I can't get into specifics, but it makes my blood boil whenever I have to deal with 6 or 8 'managers' attending one meeting for a very minor item.

Keep the front line workers. Get rid of 60% of the managers. Make it run efficiently just like any business has to in order to be effective.

Too much fearmongering about this.

Agree.

Every time I have heard the Gov of the day say they are reducing a budget, the first thing that dept and union heads say in the media is that it's the front line workers, teachers etc will be the first to go. Long before they look internally and cut fat in their management pyramid. It seems like these dept heads always sacrifice the workers before they look in the management mirror.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by AndrewM

I never said you or any other teacher needs a wage cut. Sorry if you implied that as that was not my intention. I was meaning we all took wage cuts and we are still spending more than the government can afford so we need to clean up the system as there is no more money left in our pockets to pay more taxes. No way I want teachers, nurses or any other front line workers fired. I would like to see the system cleaned up of all the ones taking advantage. Example: Teachers taking sick days to mark or fill out report cards. Nurses picking shifts that pay more because they have seniority yet refusing to work full time.

I think we agree on more than we disagree. Regardless, thanks for your response. Talking in sound bytes often leads to misunderstandings. On both our parts. And, all of us are on edge because there is no magic bullet that is gonna solve our economic problems right now. Have a good one.

[AndrewM]

Originally Posted by sns2

I think we agree on more than we disagree. Regardless, thanks for your response. Talking in sound bytes often leads to misunderstandings. On both our parts. And, all of us are on edge because there is no magic bullet that is gonna solve our economic problems right now. Have a good one.

Completely agree. Deep down we all like control and unfortunately there is tons going on right now that have no control over so we are all on edge. But lots to be thankful for so trying to focus on the good things so I can sleep at night! It could always be worse.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by AndrewM

Completely agree. Deep down we all like control and unfortunately there is tons going on right now that have no control over so we are all on edge. But lots to be thankful for so trying to focus on the good things so I can sleep at night! It could always be worse.

Indeed it could be.

[bsmitty27]

:
Originally Posted by bsmitty27 View Post
There are labourers in the kitchen, but there are also Chefs who go to nait just like plumbers, electrtions. Give them the same respect. Or give all trades the same respect. 37.00 to pull wire? Farm it out!
Come on!

Originally Posted by rem338win

What a silly comment. Apples to oranges to pudding.
.

I know a young woman who works in a health care kitchen.
And i know a lot of wire pullers. They get paid a lot more money. And the chef works equally as hard or harder. You think trades are much more skilled? Do explain?
Think you got your fruit mixed up.

[blacknorthernjk]

Originally Posted by bsmitty27

I know a young woman who works in a health care kitchen.
And i know a lot of wire pullers. They get paid a lot more money. And the chef works equally as hard or harder. You think trades are much more skilled? Do explain?
Think you got your fruit mixed up.

And there lay what I believe to be the biggest issue at hand. Those that have deemed their contribution to be of greater value than the other guy. Few are willing to walk a mile in the others shoes.

[saskbooknut]

First and foremost this is a political statement.
Broad brush moves like this are not about saving big bucks. The savings never, ever match the promises.
Obviously, the Alberta government is in a deep hole.
There is much cutting of expenses to be done.
There is another side to a budget - increasing revenues.
That means taxes, or direct billing things that used to be covered.
The majority of Albertans are still working at the same jobs, despite the hardships of some, and they will need to help out.
Adamant refusal to consider a sales tax has been part of the Alberta problem in balancing the budget.
The cleaners, laundry workers, food service workers are not the high wage earners killing the Alberta budget, but they will pay the price in this move.
Despite the knee jerk savagery of some on this topic, I think more thought, and more care, needs to go into balancing the budget.

[badbrass]

Ya! Farm it out!
All I can say is the heath care is going down! I was in it in the early 90's with AHS. ( not same name)! I was head cook at the time at a Hospital, and I was asked to go to another Hospital who was serviced by contract! Because they were thinking of going that way.(outside source ).
Myself and a Dietary Technician came with me! to check it out! We arrived what I believe was their coffee break! Wow the kitchen was a mess! knives on the floor, food on the counter! which should not be there! Just not a clean kitchen. And just not to our standards! These standards, are not standards, today! We went back and told the board what we found, and were not impressed! So stayed with same! Cheaper is not always better!

[Dewey Cox]

Originally Posted by badbrass

Ya! Farm it out!
All I can say is the heath care is going down! I was in it in the early 90's with AHS. ( not same name)! I was head cook at the time at a Hospital, and I was asked to go to another Hospital who was serviced by contract! Because they were thinking of going that way.(outside source ).
Myself and a Dietary Technician came with me! to check it out! We arrived what I believe was their coffee break! Wow the kitchen was a mess! knives on the floor, food on the counter! which should not be there! Just not a clean kitchen. And just not to our standards! Today these standards, are not standards! Not what we had. We went back and told the board what we found, and were not impressed! So stayed with same! Cheaper is not always better!

Your use of exclamation points really drove home the message.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by blacknorthernjk

And there lay what I believe to be the biggest issue at hand. Those that have deemed their contribution to be of greater value than the other guy. Few are willing to walk a mile in the others shoes.

People are quick to criticize others as being overpaid, yet most of those doing the criticizing would not live where the others live, or work under the conditions that they work under. Some jobs pay a lot more due to location and working conditions.

[hal53]

Originally Posted by sns2

How many of those 86 are included in the 11,000 layoffs, Hal?

Apparently "at least 100" middle to upper management will be gone. and a lions share of the rest will be achieved through retirement and attrition, according to Tyler Shandro. Im sure quite a few will be hired by the people who take on the service contracts as well...but then the news stations and the unions like to make it sound like 11.000 will get their walking papers at 0900 tomorrow morning....

[badbrass]

Thanks you! We are going down in Alberta! The Health Care for sure.

Originally Posted by Dewey Cox

Your use of exclamation points really drove home the message.

[Bergerboy]

Originally Posted by badbrass

Ya! Farm it out!
All I can say is the heath care is going down! I was in it in the early 90's with AHS. ( not same name)! I was head cook at the time at a Hospital, and I was asked to go to another Hospital who was serviced by contract! Because they were thinking of going that way.(outside source ).
Myself and a Dietary Technician came with me! to check it out! We arrived what I believe was their coffee break! Wow the kitchen was a mess! knives on the floor, food on the counter! which should not be there! Just not a clean kitchen. And just not to our standards! These standards, are not standards, today! We went back and told the board what we found, and were not impressed! So stayed with same! Cheaper is not always better!

It would take all one 1 week to fix all of these non conformance issues. Worth the savings.

[bessiedog]

So!

Read this....

Alberta Diver totally knows what he’s talking about.

He hit it completely right on the head.

Most AHS people have been harping about How middle management is so way too bloated!!

Guys I know in AHS upper management have told me it’s exactly what he’s describing. They’re even embarrassed by it....

Privatizing the system is a joke..... has ANYONE looked into how Shandro and his gang of Private Healthcare agencies are standing to benefit from this privatization ???????

No one is commenting on this???

It’s Trudeauesque I tell ya.

Like right from Sparkle Sock’s playbook!!


Let’s all bitch about the We Scandal when this crap is going on in our own back yard.


Good god! We are soo stupid.


It’s like the RedQueen never left.....


We just gotta blow the Union Bad whistle!!!!!!!!

And presto ....

[badbrass]

That was just the start, lots of issues! But thats the end for me! I'M retired! Thank God!

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by obsessed1

Chop chop. Start at the top and end at the bottom. Lots of these so called amazing front line workers use and abuse the system requiring 3-4 people to cover 1 job. Bloated system from the top to bottom. Snip snip

Exactly
We can no longer afford All the perks that they were given during the good times

[obsessed1]

Originally Posted by Scott h

You are correct, there are many changes that could be made. Wouldn't it make sense to then fix the parts of the system that encourages or allows abuse rather than to tear the entire system apart??

Sure but then all we would hear is how many jobs are not needed anymore and hard the ones left have it now that the rules have changed out of their favor.

[marky_mark]

Two biggest hits to the provincial budget
Healthcare and education
Both have been the greatest recipients of the glory days
Both need to be reforms to realign them with the new economic situation at hand.
Union bad because union takes takes takes and there is no give back
High paying cradle to the grave jobs aren’t sustainable anymore
How many unions supported the ndp and their anti oil agenda?
That was the golden goose that paid your salaries
Now that goose is cooked

[MountainTi]

Originally Posted by marky_mark

Two biggest hits to the provincial budget
Healthcare and education
Both have been the greatest recipients of the glory days
Both need to be reforms to realign them with the new economic situation at hand.
Union bad because union takes takes takes and there is no give back
High paying cradle to the grave jobs aren’t sustainable anymore
How many unions supported the ndp and their anti oil agenda?
That was the golden goose that paid your salaries
Now that goose is cooked

Oh the irony