I agree that saying all rancher support this would be wrong, however expecting all beef producers to voice their opinion on this and get it changed is not wrong.
To their credit I'm having very good success getting beef producers to do just that, but make sure every rancher you know is aware of this, and contacts the ABP to get this ditched.
OK, call me an idiot (hey, many of you have LOL) but what exactly do we mean by "road hunting"? Even the Pres of the Beef producers uses the term without definition in his letter. I sense people are often talking about different things.
When we say "road hunter" are we talking about:
1. Someone who discharges a firearms illegally from a roadway?
2. Someone who drives around scouting and then trespasses (enters land they don't have permission to hunt) to access an animal they have seen?
3. Somone who drives up and down roads scouting, then attempts to get permission to access once they have seen game?
When people on here gripe about "road hunters" I'm never sure exactly which group they are referring to. The first two are already illegal and the third, while disdained by many here, is perfectly legal and more an issue of hunting preferences (or ethics if you will).
Allright, since nobody else will do it, I will, you're an idiot. I would say all three would classify as road hunters. Which one of the three being refered to in any particular thread can usually be deciphered by the context in which the term "road hunter" is used. I think it's pretty obvious which two of the three the ABP proposal is targetting.
__________________
Never say "Whoa" in a mud hole.
The letter says they will stay with this piece of garbage policy. There are only 3 guys on the committee, they've all signed off on it according to the release we saw a couple days ago. There is the first crock of crap from them. Next it goes to the main board of directors where it could still pass, or it might not. If it does pass the main board then off to the larger stakeholders meeting it will go. They obviously have no intention of simply pulling the plug on this. They've gone on to explain exactly how it will proceed. They have tried to shift blame to other groups if and when it passes. The ABP seem to be weasels. We need to make noise and be sure this doesn't ever get any further than the main board at ABP.
Only idiots believe having two laws dealing with the same problem will help. If something is already illegal, what the hell good does making it "double" illegal do.
We need to get mad and defend our rights like the NRA does. If you give an inch they'll take a mile, look at the mess we are in now with the Federal laws. If every Canadian gun owner had gone off on that issue like Albertans have on this we might be in a very different situation than the one we are facing now.
Call you local reporter and describe the situation.
They always love fights.
Tell the media that a bunch of rich land hungry money grubbing slobs want to
control hunting in Alberta just like in the grazing leases of past.
Most important is that you provide FACTS.
I will be emailing Graham Thompson of the Edmonton Journal as soon as I can get the above information together. He is a liberal, but I hope he can be useful given his hatred for the Stelmach government.
Since the media hates Stelmach, a cattle farmer, things might get interesting.
I just sent them an email informing them that I would no longer be purchasing alberta beef until I received information from them that this proposal was OFF the books.
And frankly I now regret not demanding they can the morons that came up with this brain fart.
To whom it may concern:
I have been a huge supporter of the Alberta Beef industry. I am also a hunter. I am sure you are by now more than familiar with the proposal put forward by yourselves that would outlaw the carrying of ammo and firearms in the vehicle without being in separate containers.
I look forward to your reply informing me that you are withdrawing this proposal. Until then I will no longer be purchasing Alberta Beef.
I just sent them an email informing them that I would no longer be purchasing alberta beef until I received information from them that this proposal was OFF the books.
And frankly I now regret not demanding they can the morons that came up with this brain fart.
To whom it may concern:
I have been a huge supporter of the Alberta Beef industry. I am also a hunter. I am sure you are by now more than familiar with the proposal put forward by yourselves that would outlaw the carrying of ammo and firearms in the vehicle without being in separate containers.
I look forward to your reply informing me that you are withdrawing this proposal. Until then I will no longer be purchasing Alberta Beef.
Thanks for addressing this issue immediately,
They say a picture is worth a thousand words. I believe this sums it up:
__________________
Tyler
"Here's how you have to figure it in Canada: The NDP are communists, the Liberals are socialists, the Conservatives are liberal, and the media is totally left-wing" -- Don Cherry, March 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by lindy rig
... i didnt know if i should shoot, yell, or throw my bow at him and run. ...
This has been put forward to SRD for proposed change in 2011. Can someone please get me the details on this including the party that proposed it? Thanks.
I don't agree with this proposal for two reasons. The first is that it will be inconvenient to lock and unlock both the gun and ammunition from its case and container. However, the main reason is that it may cause road hunters to start hunting in the bush where I conduct most of my hunting, except when or if I ever get picked for a trophy antelope. I don't agree with road hunting, although it is considered a hunting method, I perfer to see them on the gravel road then in the bush interfering with my stock on a big whitetail or mulie buck.
Call you local reporter and describe the situation.
They always love fights.
Tell the media that a bunch of rich land hungry money grubbing slobs want to
control hunting in Alberta just like in the grazing leases of past.
Most important is that you provide FACTS.
I will be emailing Graham Thompson of the Edmonton Journal as soon as I can get the above information together. He is a liberal, but I hope he can be useful given his hatred for the Stelmach government.
Since the media hates Stelmach, a cattle farmer, things might get interesting.
Isn't that interesting painting all farmers and ranchers with the same brush as they are painting hunters with.
I am a beef producer.
I do not like the Alberta Beef Producers.
They are an old-boys club of some old school ranchers with a large dose of arrogance and ignorance. They like to influence government and meddle on just about anything they see as affecting rural life.
They are largely ineffective on anything important, they ineffectiveness was readily apparent during the BSE days, so they like to flex a little muscle with small potatoe issues that really don't help ranchers much. But it gives them something to put in their monthly newsletter so that the peopel who they rely on for their existence think they are doing something besides running up their expense accounts.
They are pathetic. If everyone sends them a letter or e-mail voicing their displeasure with their petty B.S., they may well back off and come up with somebody else to pester with their petty attempts to make their members think they aren't actually asleep by the switch.
They say a picture is worth a thousand words. I believe this sums it up:
Let's be careful not to condemn all the beef producing farmers here. Our beef is with the executive of the ABP. I love Alberta beef and respect most of the hard working farmers and ranchers in this province. I think that you will find that many marketing boards such as the ABP are out of touch with reality and usually the arrogant and power hungry float to the top of these organizations. They should stick to the promotion and marketing of the Alberta beef...period. I would much prefer this logo though.
I'm on board! Emails are to be sent out sometime today. I don't understand the logic behind this proposal at all. How about stricter enforcement of the existing laws and harsher punishments for anyone that breaks them. The guys that created this proposal are definitely out of touch to say the least.
Condemning all Alberta beef producers for what the board of the ABP does seems very similar to the Police Chiefs speaking for all of the front line officers with regards to the effectiveness and necessity of the long gun registry.
Do we believe the Chiefs or the people on the front lines.
We want to be careful who we go after when these things happen.
Condemning all Alberta beef producers for what the board of the ABP does seems very similar to the Police Chiefs speaking for all of the front line officers with regards to the effectiveness and necessity of the long gun registry.
Do we believe the Chiefs or the people on the front lines.
We want to be careful who we go after when these things happen.
The big difference between the two organizations is that the Police Chiefs were not elected by the police officers that they are representing. They were appointed to that position and cannot be fired by the people that they represent.
The delegates of the ABP are elected by the beef producers whom they are supposed to be representing. If the board of directors and delegates are going to make proposals in the name of the grass roots members but they don't have their support it is much easier for the membership to deal with.
The beef producers need to step up and take care of their own if they are not in support of this proposal. If they do support it and some hunters demonstrate their disapproval by boycotting their products then that is of their own doing. I have always supported our cattle people and I hope that this proposal is quashed as soon as possible before the animosity increases between ranchers and hunters. Honest hunters are not the problem.
Someone is blowing smoke up someones *****. I've been told that it isn't the ABP, but the cow/calf portion of ABP. Hate to tell them this but the cow/calf group is under the ABP umbrella. When something is sent out on ABP letterhead and signed by the members of the ABP sub committee, I'd have to say it is the ABP that is creating the stir.
On another note I haven't been able to find anything out about the NRA thing Chuck. Have you seen anything concrete on it?
I have been told by more than one source that this is not ABP or ABP policy. The odd thing is, I have the proposal on ABP letter head.
Technically, they are right chuck, "this is not ABP or ABP policy". First, it's not a policy yet, it's a proposal. Secondly, it wasn't proposed by ABP itself it was proposed by a sub-committee of ABP. The proposed change was developed by the Wildlife sub-committee of the Cow Calf Council of Alberta Beef Producers (ABP).
What it sounds like you were told was that ABP is saying is that the Cow Calf Council came up with the proposal and, even though that sub-committee is a part of ABP, whatever they say should not be construed as anything that ABP is proposing or trying to achieve.Technically anyone can say that the Cow Calf Council and the ABP are two different entities and be correct.
Try now to bring common sense into it because you'll just get confused.
It's either all smoke and mirrors or, people in the ABP are trying to distance themselves from the sub-committee that proposed this new law in the first place. Either way, if there's any leadership in the ABP at all, they'd better step in fast to do a little damage control before this goes too far.
Someone is blowing smoke up someones *****. I've been told that it isn't the ABP, but the cow/calf portion of ABP. Hate to tell them this but the cow/calf group is under the ABP umbrella. When something is sent out on ABP letterhead and signed by the members of the ABP sub committee, I'd have to say it is the ABP that is creating the stir.
On another note I haven't been able to find anything out about the NRA thing Chuck. Have you seen anything concrete on it?
Condemning all Alberta beef producers for what the board of the ABP does seems very similar to the Police Chiefs speaking for all of the front line officers with regards to the effectiveness and necessity of the long gun registry.
Do we believe the Chiefs or the people on the front lines.
We want to be careful who we go after when these things happen.
I agree that it isn't time to start abandoning Alberta beef yet, but it is time to pressure every beef producer we know to contacting ABP and getting that proposal revoked.
Unfortunately if they don't manage to do that, then they get lumped in with the ABP same way all the officers who don't speak up get lumped in with the Chiefs. I just hope with enough pressure from ranchers themselves, who I know are doing a lot to try and curb this, that the ABP actually listens to their members.
Since we have not received a retraction yet, tonight I hope to find time to visit both butchers in town with this information, and I intend to have it readily available at the auction market this week, we need to get as many ranchers aware of this as possible, because I know most ranchers are not for this, but they will be the ones paying for it if ABP doesn't smarten up.
I agree, Iam sure that this proposal will not make past the next level. No need to go boycotting anything right now.
I doubt it will make it to the next level, but that doesn't mean this doesn't need to be addressed by ABP. We can't stand for idea's like this coming from someone who we should be on the same side with in most issues. Worse yet I don't think all the beef producers that would be caught up in this should stand for it.
Things like this have occasionally caught the ear of the right bureaucrat, who then goes on a crusade, after all they have stakeholder support. I've chased too many issues where I keep getting told that the government has this stakeholder or that stakeholder that is asking for it, yet I can't find any members of the said groups that support it.
I don't think we should boycott beef, but we seriously need to give ABP a wake up call.
As a former ABP delagate I have already sent a letter dissaproving of this proposal. The reply I recieved back , made me feel this issue will die quickly.
As a former ABP delagate I have already sent a letter dissaproving of this proposal. The reply I recieved back , made me feel this issue will die quickly.
We don't need it to die, we need it to be retracted. As long as it stays on the books as is, even if it goes no where it still shows the ABP as supporting it. They need to retract it and do so publicly. Anything less is not acceptable to me, and should not be acceptable to it's members unless they agree with the position.
Call you local reporter and describe the situation.
Guys, guys, hold on for a moment. We do NOT want to make this a media issue. Think of the general public. I may be wrong on this, but I think the average uninformed member of the public would say "What? you mean you can drive around in Alberta with a rifle between your legs? Holy crap! That should be illegal!"
Better to get the members to pressure their organization to withdraw the suggestion. Second best is to pressure SRD through our other organizations (Like AFGA) to not accept the proposal.
We don't need it to die, we need it to be retracted. As long as it stays on the books as is, even if it goes no where it still shows the ABP as supporting it. They need to retract it and do so publicly. Anything less is not acceptable to me, and should not be acceptable to it's members unless they agree with the position.
I agree, the ABP has bigger concerns to deal with. It should be retracted.
We don't need it to die, we need it to be retracted. As long as it stays on the books as is, even if it goes no where it still shows the ABP as supporting it. They need to retract it and do so publicly. Anything less is not acceptable to me, and should not be acceptable to it's members unless they agree with the position.
I expressed this exact sentiment to Rich Smith today over the phone. Unfortunately I don't think he saw it the same way I did. I hope I am wrong.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”
I would say all three would classify as road hunters. Which one of the three being refered to in any particular thread can usually be deciphered by the context in which the term "road hunter" is used. I think it's pretty obvious which two of the three the ABP proposal is targetting.
What a case of the pot calling the kettle black
Beef
Linear Mode
