Suffield Update

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by dbllung

This isn't a judgement of your character
BUT
Don't know for sure but I'm guessing you'd be singing a different tune if this uncontrolled slaughter of trophy animals was in your back yard! What if this was happening to whitetails near your home?

It wouldn't be right if happened there, and it's not right here!

It actually happens all over Alberta, just not in a cull situation.
It seems that people are only upset because natives are taking trophy bulls as well as cows and calves.
I don't get the whole resentment thing, but then, I don't hunt antlers.
Cat

[rednuck]

Originally Posted by dbllung

This isn't a judgement of your character
BUT
Don't know for sure but I'm guessing you'd be singing a different tune if this uncontrolled slaughter of trophy animals was in your back yard! What if this was happening to whitetails near your home?

It wouldn't be right if happened there, and it's not right here!

They should open up a ewe "cull" on the cadomin mine site. Then people would care.

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by dbllung

This isn't a judgement of your character
BUT
Don't know for sure but I'm guessing you'd be singing a different tune if this uncontrolled slaughter of trophy animals was in your back yard! What if this was happening to whitetails near your home?

It wouldn't be right if happened there, and it's not right here!

This is my back yard

[fish_e_o]

and here i am all excited for a suffield bull this fall

i'll have fun no matter what!

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

This is my back yard

I was going to mention that I was pretty sure it was right in your back yard!

[dbllung]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

This is my back yard

My mistake then!! I thought you were from Saskatchewan

I digress !

[Don K]

It wasn't unrealistic to expect to get a 350" bull if you put your time in and accessed the right land. We aren't expecting a 400" bull, maybe dreaming of them, but that's it. Unfortunately things here aren't what they were and look to get much, much worse (speaking as a 'trophy' hunter). We have seen a VERY SMALL handful of cows off the block and that is it.
The one large landowners land we have access on was not happy when asked about the native hunting. They ground a couple bulls with only heads removed and another big bull in August with only the back straps cut out and the rest left in the community pasture for the coyotes.

Sorry to anyone who disagrees, but it is beyond a joke...

[cottonwood]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

This is my back yard

I dont know what train your riding sir, but to take the stance that the devastation befalling our mule deer and antelope right now is simply okay,,, is sick, shortsighted, and brutally untasteful. This is a problem of serious proportions that has long lasting ramifications, and it needs to be rectified immediately. This unregulated slaughter of any and all prairie animals unfortunate to stand in front of native firearms, should be instantly stirring up into a frenzy, all conservation minded and mandated outdoor and hunter related organizations. Alberta fish and wildlife should be strung up for allowing this to occur, and control needs to be obtained immediately.

[crownb]

Originally Posted by iceburg

Crown b you are absolutely bashing, re-read your post and don't backtrack. A lot of people (you figure it out if you're one of them)whining they can't go shoot in a barrell. This whole thing is more like a low fence hunt. I'ne posted this in the past, but I'll repeat. I remember in approx '95 when they implemented Metis rights here in Sask, all of a sudden alot of the pl who used to get twisted about 1st Nation hunting were all of a sudden Metis! All you had to do was self-indicate in order to get Metis card. Don't kid yourself for a second that it would be different in Alta. Wonder why there are no cool stories( other than a couple seasons ago when that guy had the footage of all the elk crossing the river) posted about the 'hunt'? Because there are very few.

Btw, there are no excuses for illegal activities, please report them...

Excuse me, exactly where was I bashing? I have never hunted suffield, I never want to and I never will. Not sure where you are coming from.

[dbllung]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

This is my back yard

Then you'd be o.k. With a trophy whitetail cull/massacre in "your back yard"

Would be no different!

[7mmremmag]

Originally Posted by crownb

Oh I am not bashing natives, I am just stating facts, and if that feels like bashing to you maybe there is something wrong. Hmmmm

Agreed

[MooseRiverTrapper]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

It is a cull, I can't control the amount of licenses issued and to be honest all we are doing is sustaining the 8000 that roam these parts. Fiasco as the original plan was 800 - 1100 in CFB.



Sorry moose but this transplant was never to materialize into a trophy hunt, pizz poor management (none) has turned this into a cull. Look back a decade and show me the draw code for this trophy hunt



My reference is many threads on this subject turn into bash the rights of this group. I bet that a larger portion of "our" group would act probably worse than these if we were allowed the same rights. It really gets old and the dealings I have personally had with the natives was nothing but positive.

It has the habitat, genetics and potential to be managed as a premium trophy hunt. Why shouldn't it be?

[crownb]

Originally Posted by Don K

It wasn't unrealistic to expect to get a 350" bull if you put your time in and accessed the right land. We aren't expecting a 400" bull, maybe dreaming of them, but that's it. Unfortunately things here aren't what they were and look to get much, much worse (speaking as a 'trophy' hunter). We have seen a VERY SMALL handful of cows off the block and that is it.
The one large landowners land we have access on was not happy when asked about the native hunting. They ground a couple bulls with only heads removed and another big bull in August with only the back straps cut out and the rest left in the community pasture for the coyotes.

Sorry to anyone who disagrees, but it is beyond a joke...

So iceburg, is this bashing or fact?

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by crownb

So iceburg, is this bashing or fact?

And how was it proven that it was native hunters?
With Treaty status they would not have to leave the meat, unless they were there without permission, then it would not matter who they were, would it?
Cat

[dbllung]

Originally Posted by dbllung

Then you'd be o.k. With a trophy whitetail cull/massacre in "your back yard"

Would be no different!

Crickets chirping!!

That's what I thought !

[Don K]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

And how was it proven that it was native hunters?
With Treaty status they would not have to leave the meat, unless they were there without permission, then it would not matter who they were, would it?
Cat

Just a hunch... Lol
There's 2 landowners/leasees that we've spoken to that want nothing to do with the natives now. Hopefully they shoot themselves in the foot and close it down for themselves.

[Don K]

Last post before we go on another 'Death March' lol.

Sorry as well to those who take offence to anything I said or posted. We are just calling it like we see it down here. We've scouted and hunted hard. Walked 6+ hours each of the last couple days, sat in prime spots and glassed MILES of land. It's tough and likely changed forever. If you can't handle the heat stay out of the kitchen!
To bad that the powers that be can't get the parties together and figure out a way to compensate landowners (landowner tags?) or figure something out to keep a world class resource available. It's disgusting what is happening down here and will continue to get worse through the year.
Rant over, I'm gonna go hike some Sandhills to relax...

[Muckwa]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

And how was it proven that it was native hunters?
With Treaty status they would not have to leave the meat, unless they were there without permission, then it would not matter who they were, would it?
Cat

That's what I was thinking Cat. I know a bunch of aboriginal hunters that would never ever leave anything. They eat everything and I mean everything. Sounds more like a poacher of who knows what nationality did this and the easiest people to pin it on is aboriginals.

[iceburg]

"Thanks natives, well done!!!"- I'd call that bashing crownb

What DK stated that he heard from a guy who heard from a guy is called hearsay....

[270WIN]

Originally Posted by cottonwood

I dont know what train your riding sir, but to take the stance that the devastation befalling our mule deer and antelope right now is simply okay,,, is sick, shortsighted, and brutally untasteful. This is a problem of serious proportions that has long lasting ramifications, and it needs to be rectified immediately. This unregulated slaughter of any and all prairie animals unfortunate to stand in front of native firearms, should be instantly stirring up into a frenzy, all conservation minded and mandated outdoor and hunter related organizations. Alberta fish and wildlife should be strung up for allowing this to occur, and control needs to be obtained immediately.

Best post I've seen on this topic in a long time and if everyone who truly cares about the future of hunting in Alberta were honest about it, they'd agree with you.

[drake]

Good Luck OP! Stay positive and hunt hard!

[rednuck]

Originally Posted by Don K

Last post before we go on another 'Death March' lol.

Sorry as well to those who take offence to anything I said or posted. We are just calling it like we see it down here. We've scouted and hunted hard. Walked 6+ hours each of the last couple days, sat in prime spots and glassed MILES of land. It's tough and likely changed forever. If you can't handle the heat stay out of the kitchen!
To bad that the powers that be can't get the parties together and figure out a way to compensate landowners (landowner tags?) or figure something out to keep a world class resource available. It's disgusting what is happening down here and will continue to get worse through the year.
Rant over, I'm gonna go hike some Sandhills to relax...

Do you have access to a boat? the river is probably the best bet for finding a good elk now.

[Muckwa]

To the OP sounds like your putting in the time, hope it all comes together for you.
Cheers

[iceburg]

"Thanks natives, well done!!!"- I'd call that bashing crownb

What DK stated that he heard from a guy who heard from a guy is called hearsay....

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by crownb

Wow, fortunately we will never be given the chance to find out, that wouldn't be FAIR right?

Sorry but the dilemma of being "fair" was established many moons ago and I assume neither of us will ever see the day where this becomes a level playing field.

Originally Posted by cottonwood

I dont know what train your riding sir, but to take the stance that the devastation befalling our mule deer and antelope right now is simply okay,,, is sick, shortsighted, and brutally untasteful. This is a problem of serious proportions that has long lasting ramifications, and it needs to be rectified immediately. This unregulated slaughter of any and all prairie animals unfortunate to stand in front of native firearms, should be instantly stirring up into a frenzy, all conservation minded and mandated outdoor and hunter related organizations. Alberta fish and wildlife should be strung up for allowing this to occur, and control needs to be obtained immediately.

I would place the blame on the lower numbers of the Mule deer on ESRD's shoulders, not the natives myself. CWD has been the demise of the donkey deer with the powers to be trying to keep numbers as low as possible to prevent the spread of this disease. With regards to the speeders, well 2010 was brutal and they are slowly recovering which again not a native issue to my knowledge. To think that I am not a conservation minded person is silly, if you had any idea of my role, well you may not make such asinine remarks.

Originally Posted by dbllung

Then you'd be o.k. With a trophy whitetail cull/massacre in "your back yard"

Would be no different!

Holy, you ever been in this area ? The trophy potential in the prairies I would think would be the worst for all of Alberta actually... You can see for miles and miles, a trophy here is measured by number of points on the racks

Originally Posted by MooseRiverTrapper

It has the habitat, genetics and potential to be managed as a premium trophy hunt. Why shouldn't it be?

The transplanting of the elk was NEVER intended to provide trophy opportunity for anyone, so your point is mute.

[elkoholik]

Originally Posted by jayboots

I'm not against the natives having their hunting right, They were here first, they should be able to hunt what they need. That being said they should have to follow the same hunting hours (1/2 hour before dawn, 1/2 hour after dusk), and if a animal is protected, not be able to shoot them either, like the caribou, grizzles etc.

By law they are not allowed to shoot in non daylight hours. Fish and feathers will prosecute but you have to have video footage which shows the illegal activity with the persons face present and identifiable. Basically they say screw it as it is too much trouble and costly to take it to court. Sad reality is if it were any other ethnic group they would have you arrested and charged. I personally is getting sick of this as back in the day tribes did not travel hundreds of miles to gather food. Allow them to hunt on their reserves as they wish but leave all other properties to be followed by everyone the same, tags issued and regulations followed by all.

[MooseRiverTrapper]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

Sorry but the dilemma of being "fair" was established many moons ago and I assume neither of us will ever see the day where this becomes a level playing field.



I would place the blame on the lower numbers of the Mule deer on ESRD's shoulders, not the natives myself. CWD has been the demise of the donkey deer with the powers to be trying to keep numbers as low as possible to prevent the spread of this disease. With regards to the speeders, well 2010 was brutal and they are slowly recovering which again not a native issue to my knowledge. To think that I am not a conservation minded person is silly, if you had any idea of my role, well you may not make such asinine remarks.



Holy, you ever been in this area ? The trophy potential in the prairies I would think would be the worst for all of Alberta actually... You can see for miles and miles, a trophy here is measured by number of points on the racks



The transplanting of the elk was NEVER intended to provide trophy opportunity for anyone, so your point is mute.

When they started mining cadomin it wasn't intended as a bighorn habitat. The examples go on and on.

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by MooseRiverTrapper

When they started mining cadomin it wasn't intended as a bighorn habitat. The examples go on and on.

Do some research on CFB, habitat is natural...

[iceburg]

"back in the day tribes did not travel hundreds of miles to gather food. "
-actually they did, it's well documented that 1st Nation ppl travelled along ways to get to Cypress hills etc.

The government can shut down any and all hunting at any time (to all ppl), if they see the need to do so.

[kujoseto]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

To think that I am not a conservation minded person is silly, if you had any idea of my role ...

So are you going to tell us or do we just have to believe you that it should provide more weight for your opinion than someone without an alleged "role"?