Changes for all

The Spruce · #1 07-14-2016, 03:04 PM

Something to stew over. Not going to be easy to sell a line anymore. Be diligent with your records this season folks.

HunterDave · #2 07-14-2016, 04:15 PM

Interesting stuff, thanks for posting.

Why ask for fur receipts? It won't include mange coyotes and other damaged fur that doesn't get sold. My declaration is more accurate than my receipts.

They are going to start enforcing taking trap lines if there's no fur production in one year?

KegRiver · #3 07-14-2016, 04:54 PM

Pandering to the complainers again are they.

They are understaffed and overworked as it is. This is just another "from the top" decision that the front line people have no time or resources to enforce.

The biggest offenders, outfitters who buy trap lines as exclusive hunting territories have friends in high places and they will get a pass for obvious reasons.

A few honest trappers will loose their lines and the problem will continue unabated.

Am I jaded, you bet. After sixty years of seeing how it works I absolutely am jaded.
I've seen too many little guys get spanked for a little of nothing while the big offenders go about their business untouched. And the biggest of them all are top government people.

Paying top dollar does not buy the best of the best, it only buys the most successful crooks.

nube · #4 07-14-2016, 06:31 PM

I don't like #2. T me it reads I can sell my line but there is no gaurantee the guy buying it will be given the line which to me means there is no way anyone would hand over any money for a line if they were not gauranteed to get it and therefore no sale lol
Sounds like it will all be placed back into the Govt hands and done with what they may.....

Also the other new change that if you die as the senior holder your family can no longer trap unless they have a license. If they do not have a license does this mean they take the line from you and put it up for auction? None of my family has a license right now as my kids are too young and my wife doesn't want to get a license as it's not her passion like mine. Would be sad to buy a line and have it stripped from you and you loose all that money you put into buying a line.....

They want fur sale receipts as it is important in seeing if fur species management is being done correctly? lol That's a huge joke. There are so many variables there I won't even get into. What a crock of crap.......

If the biologist has an issue with what is going on with your line he can strip it from you and or provide a probation period and make you take courses or take a JR on? Hope you don't get a biologist with an attitude and wants to make you take a pile of courses for no reason.......

Looks like if you forget to submit a fur harvest by Sept 30th you can loose your line. I hope I don't get forgetful the older I get or my line is gone.......

If you fail to renew your license by Sept 30th again your line can be stripped from you? BS. Hopefully a friendly reminder is given if your again brain does not remember.......

Licenses will be given to Resident trappers for Private and crown land not in an RFMA. I like that. I know it can be done now to trap crown land not in an RFMA but it is not easy to get it. Hopefully this change is that you can trap all crown land and it is an easier process......

I like that they want to make changes to make sure guys are trapping. I agree with that but in doing so it sounds like it can possibly be a hassle for a lot of reasons with some new changes. A lot of this kinds of info worries me to be honest.

Also I would like to know how they are making this known to trappers. If you are not looking on AO right now you wouldn't have a clue. Where is my registered letter telling me to keep my fur receipts from this year and I may need to provide them?
If trappers are not notified of these changes the correct way I see some major issues in the future

martinnordegg · #5 07-15-2016, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nube

I don't like #2. T me it reads I can sell my line but there is no gaurantee the guy buying it will be given the line which to me means there is no way anyone would hand over any money for a line if they were not gauranteed to get it and therefore no sale lol
Sounds like it will all be placed back into the Govt hands and done with what they may.....

Using a lawyer and putting the money in trust will work.

Also the other new change that if you die as the senior holder your family can no longer trap unless they have a license. If they do not have a license does this mean they take the line from you and put it up for auction? None of my family has a license right now as my kids are too young and my wife doesn't want to get a license as it's not her passion like mine. Would be sad to buy a line and have it stripped from you and you loose all that money you put into buying a line.....

Always have an exit strategy to protect your assets. It may be prudent to formally have your Wife take the ATA Course and get a licence. She will also have to show fur sales as well though. Finding a qualified buyer for lines will be difficult. It will take a Jr. Partner a few years to qualify.

They want fur sale receipts as it is important in seeing if fur species management is being done correctly? lol That's a huge joke. There are so many variables there I won't even get into. What a crock of crap.......

Just another one of the changes. No choice here.

If the biologist has an issue with what is going on with your line he can strip it from you and or provide a probation period and make you take courses or take a JR on? Hope you don't get a biologist with an attitude and wants to make you take a pile of courses for no reason.......

We have one with a big attitude here which I experienced during the transfer of our line. It's very sad to say but I'm glad we got out of our line when we did.

Looks like if you forget to submit a fur harvest by Sept 30th you can loose your line. I hope I don't get forgetful the older I get or my line is gone.......

If you fail to renew your license by Sept 30th again your line can be stripped from you? BS. Hopefully a friendly reminder is given if your again brain does not remember.......

This use to be the deadline date for renewal so I guess now they are going to enforce it.

Licenses will be given to Resident trappers for Private and crown land not in an RFMA. I like that. I know it can be done now to trap crown land not in an RFMA but it is not easy to get it. Hopefully this change is that you can trap all crown land and it is an easier process......

I like that they want to make changes to make sure guys are trapping. I agree with that but in doing so it sounds like it can possibly be a hassle for a lot of reasons with some new changes. A lot of this kinds of info worries me to be honest.

Also I would like to know how they are making this known to trappers. If you are not looking on AO right now you wouldn't have a clue. Where is my registered letter telling me to keep my fur receipts from this year and I may need to provide them?
If trappers are not notified of these changes the correct way I see some major issues in the future

I am sure all RFMA holders will get a notice in the mail as we did concerning the Public Land Issues. Or they could hand it out when you renew.

JMO some of the "changes" were in place previously and now going to be enforced. Some of them may ensure lines are trapped properly and are active. Some good, some bad but that's the way it is I guess.

BEST GET TO KNOW THE BIOLOGIST THAT WILL BE ADMINISTRATING YOUR LINE.

Marty S · #6 07-15-2016, 07:14 AM

We got it better than the poor saps in Ontario, maybe too good tho. They have quotas that have to be filled annually or they will lose their lines, and on top of filling their quotas, they MUST sell all their fur in that season. So like now, when beaver are practically worthless, you must trap them, which isn't all bad, it's okay, BUT you are forced to sell them for practically nothing, when instead you could either hold them for a more favourable price another year, or do something more creative such as tan and build hats, novelties, etc.

sourdough doug · #7 10-03-2019, 05:48 PM

BEST GET TO KNOW THE BIOLOGIST THAT WILL BE ADMINISTRATING YOUR LINE.[/COLOR][/QUOTE]

Would anyone care to guess, how any of these BIOLOGISTS ..are fisherpersons, hunters or trappers....Same goes for the CO's and Parks people who have the authority and "budge" on their sleeve..It's on the horizon

jawa · #8 07-18-2016, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Pandering to the complainers again are they.

They are understaffed and overworked as it is. This is just another "from the top" decision that the front line people have no time or resources to enforce.

The biggest offenders, outfitters who buy trap lines as exclusive hunting territories have friends in high places and they will get a pass for obvious reasons.

A few honest trappers will loose their lines and the problem will continue unabated.

Am I jaded, you bet. After sixty years of seeing how it works I absolutely am jaded.
I've seen too many little guys get spanked for a little of nothing while the big offenders go about their business untouched. And the biggest of them all are top government people.

Paying top dollar does not buy the best of the best, it only buys the most successful crooks.

This is in my opinion the most accurate statement as to what the purposed changes will amount to
A lot of what is being purposed in my opinion is intended to appease some special interest groups tighten up requirements in regards to experience training etc so the most qualified person gets the line smell a lot like everyones favorite wolf critic and cronies at work
think keg summed it up best when he said a few honest trappers will loose there lines I will take it a step farther and say I bet they wind up in the hands of friends of government
time will tell if im right or wrong hopefully wrong and no one looses

HunterDave · #9 07-18-2016, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jawa

A lot of what is being purposed in my opinion is intended to appease some special interest groups tighten up requirements in regards to experience training etc so the most qualified person gets the line smell a lot like everyones favorite wolf critic and cronies at work.

I'm going to disagree with that. Our little friend would be happy to see all traplines not being used. The government didn't come up with this initiative on their own though, IMO it was Alberta trappers that pushed for it. Read post #51. It sucks for guys who recently purchased a line and/or made costly improvements but for non-RFMA holders, affordable lines is good news. That's the way that I see it.

209x50 · #10 07-18-2016, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

I'm going to disagree with that. Our little friend would be happy to see all traplines not being used. The government didn't come up with this initiative on their own though, IMO it was Alberta trappers that pushed for it. Read post #51. It sucks for guys who recently purchased a line and/or made costly improvements but for non-RFMA holders, affordable lines is good news. That's the way that I see it.

We came within a whisker of losing it all a few years backs. The GOA was getting rid of the RFMA system south of highway 16 and creating a free for all. The ATA had to agree that traplines must be utilized for trapping. That was the agreement but as usual a few years, a few round table discussions and we see the abortion that came out of the simple premise. I don't see this changing the prices or how traplines change hands. The GOA fears litigation on this and know they can't win in court.

HunterDave · #11 07-14-2016, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

Why ask for fur receipts? It won't include mange coyotes and other damaged fur that doesn't get sold. My declaration is more accurate than my receipts.

Never mind, the receipts are likely to prove that you actually caught the fur that you declare. Not sure why they'd want them from resident trappers though.

Marty S · #12 07-14-2016, 10:30 PM

It could prove to be quite comical for putting some folks under the scope. We have some very creative trappers these days. I wonder what they will do with the info? Overall though, seems like a senseless thing, the fish cops can't even wade through the records that we currently submit.

Lefty-Canuck · #13 07-14-2016, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterDave

Never mind, the receipts are likely to prove that you actually caught the fur that you declare. Not sure why they'd want them from resident trappers though.

Government wants their cut of your take.

LC

Talking moose · #14 07-15-2016, 05:37 AM

"The biggest offenders, outfitters who buy trap lines as exclusive hunting territories have friends in high places and they will get a pass for obvious reasons"

How does an outfitter keep hunters off his line?

58thecat · #15 07-15-2016, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Talking moose

"The biggest offenders, outfitters who buy trap lines as exclusive hunting territories have friends in high places and they will get a pass for obvious reasons"

How does an outfitter keep hunters off his line?

He does this by having tree stands, blinds, etc all over the area in which any "nice" hunter sees this would back out of the area and let those who already occupy it have a great enjoyable hunt, now it never stops the other wanker hunter who would shinny up a tree right beside you, light up a smoke and say "howdy" ...

KegRiver has it pretty much spot on in his post.

Life goes on....

wolf1 · #16 06-11-2022, 05:25 PM

You can't prove out trapline activity by an office armchair check or by paper forms and receipts/declarations that may or not be honourable. In order to get an accurate audit who is or is not trapping on a given RFMFA, there need to be actual field checks done by Fish & Wildlife personnel throughout the trapping season (unannounced). This is the only way to know who is really trapping, how much fur they are really taking, and any other non-authorized activity that is occurring on the line. Means some actual hard-slugging fieldwork to flesh out the real trappers (who likely are the silent ones).

I understand this was the case when the Fish & Wildlife enforcement staff still had that mandate and they had a handle what was happening out in the field. Now, with it being the responsibility of biologists, limited to the office and budget constraints, the far-off RFMA's are a disconnect without answers. No way to make any logical decisions if they have no idea which lines are truly being trapped in a given winter.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk