20gr 17cal bullets

[aardvaark]

I’ve had much better success reloading this finicky17Hornet with the 20gr bullets than with the 25gr bullets. But now I can’t find any 20gr bullets anywhere. Cabela’s doesn’t list them on their website, and both stores here in REd Deer don’t have them. Any ideas anyone?

With the 20gr and 12.4gr cfeblk powder I can get around 1in. groups. That was with VArmageddon bullets. I’ve tried lilgun (disaster), imr4198, and cfeblk with the 25gr and can’t get any better than 1.5in. And it’s a CZ525 which a lot of people speak highly of, but so far I have been very disappointed with.

[amosfella]

I found in the 527 that the 25 gr bullets worked quite well. Maybe try H322.

[Faststeel]

Originally Posted by amosfella

I found in the 527 that the 25 gr bullets worked quite well. Maybe try H322.

Me too 12gr of H335, 25gr anything...FS

[pikergolf]

https://x-reload.com/reloading-compo...tml?grains=740

[elkhunter11]

Prophet River has the 20gr v-max in stock. My Cooper likes the 20gr with CFE-BLK as well.

[BKG]

I have had good accuracy with AA1680 in my CZ. Both 20 and 25 Gr Vmax

[Dean2]

If the best you can get is one inch after trying lots of different loads I would be looking at the gun. Are you using the set trigger when shooting targets, is the barrel properly floated or is it binding somewhere, pretty common on CZs for the right side to contact the stock here in super dry Alberta, is the action bedded. I would float the barrel and bed the action and then see how it shoots. My bet is it will shoot a whole bunch better. I have never seen a bad barrel on a 527 and most of the CZ 17 HH are capable of better than half inch groups.

[aardvaark]

Originally Posted by Dean2

If the best you can get is one inch after trying lots of different loads I would be looking at the gun. Are you using the set trigger when shooting targets, is the barrel properly floated or is it binding somewhere, pretty common on CZs for the right side to contact the stock here in super dry Alberta, is the action bedded. I would float the barrel and bed the action and then see how it shoots. My bet is it will shoot a whole bunch better. I have never seen a bad barrel on a 527 and most of the CZ 17 HH are capable of better than half inch groups.

Thanks for the input, Dean. I have used the set trigger, but the after travel is so bad that it’s actually worse than the regular trigger which also has considerable after travel. Not to mention the creep. I had the trigger adjusted by someone that was supposed to be good at setting these up, so I’m assuming that it’s as good as can be, which would still be pretty good compared to the rest of the workings of this gun. When I first got this gun the barrel was up against the stock, and the recoil lug was bedded in crooked and it shot about 4 inch groups so I bedded it and now have the barrel properly freefloated and the action properly bedded. But at the end of the day it’s still a third world manufactured gun that I paid Cdn $ for. Long long ways from any Savage or Tikka that I’ve ever owned or shot.

But that’s my rant, please forgive me bc I read where an awful lot of you rave about the CZ’s. But me and my CZ are definitely not one of them. But I’m sure if I threw some more money at this thing the first place would be a decent trigger. I know I could tighten up those groups at least a bit with a proper trigger. Any ideas who makes a decent trigger for this gun?

[aardvaark]

Also, I want to try the powders mentioned above. Thanks for the replies on that, guys.

[aardvaark]

I was going by memory which, obviously, is not a good thing for me to do. As was pointed out, it is a 527, not 525. And the best charge behind the 20gr pill that I have found is 12.1gr not 12.4

On both the 20gr and the 25gr I went with max length that will still fit in the mag (such that the mag is). Has anyone tried using longer COAL with better results? And then single shot loading it. I know that it is a real pita to single shot load, without one of the followers required to do that. But I would like to see if it’s a worthwhile investment or not.

[Dean2]

I take no offense, I like CZ but not everyone does and they have had some QC issues the last couple of years. That said, if you set trigger or main trigger has creep it isn't set up right. They should break clean. After travel is a different issue. Most European triggers have some after travel to ensure reliable releases and it is not something I mind.

As far as seating longer than the mag, it may help, measure your max length and see how far you are from the lands now. You don't want to be jammed, just barely touching or just off and then work your way back to see what shoots best. Many do better with a little jump, some like to be touching. As far as single loading, just drop the round on top of the mag, it will feed fine. Follower from Calhoon is prettier but not entirely necessary.

Another thing to check is your ES and SD using a chronograph. Using the right primer and powder combo can often really reduce that. I use Federal match and Remington 7 1/2 match (try these in your gun and make sure they don't pierce, some they work in some they don't but the Federal SR match works for sure) in the HH. If that doesn't bring your ES down in the 10-20 fps range try using a Lee crimp die and give it a light, then med, then full crimp and see if that drops your ES.

[Faststeel]

Originally Posted by aardvaark

Thanks for the input, Dean. I have used the set trigger, but the after travel is so bad that it’s actually worse than the regular trigger which also has considerable after travel. Not to mention the creep. I had the trigger adjusted by someone that was supposed to be good at setting these up, so I’m assuming that it’s as good as can be, which would still be pretty good compared to the rest of the workings of this gun. When I first got this gun the barrel was up against the stock, and the recoil lug was bedded in crooked and it shot about 4 inch groups so I bedded it and now have the barrel properly freefloated and the action properly bedded. But at the end of the day it’s still a third world manufactured gun that I paid Cdn $ for. Long long ways from any Savage or Tikka that I’ve ever owned or shot.

But that’s my rant, please forgive me bc I read where an awful lot of you rave about the CZ’s. But me and my CZ are definitely not one of them. But I’m sure if I threw some more money at this thing the first place would be a decent trigger. I know I could tighten up those groups at least a bit with a proper trigger. Any ideas who makes a decent trigger for this gun?

If you are a handy sort of fellow there is an excellent bit on you tube for the trigger adjusrment on a 527 rifle. The trigger on mt 20 Extreme rifle is fantastic, as is . the trigger on my 19 Calhoon, both are factory 527 triggers....FS

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by aardvaark

Thanks for the input, Dean. I have used the set trigger, but the after travel is so bad that it’s actually worse than the regular trigger which also has considerable after travel. Not to mention the creep. I had the trigger adjusted by someone that was supposed to be good at setting these up, so I’m assuming that it’s as good as can be, which would still be pretty good compared to the rest of the workings of this gun. When I first got this gun the barrel was up against the stock, and the recoil lug was bedded in crooked and it shot about 4 inch groups so I bedded it and now have the barrel properly freefloated and the action properly bedded. But at the end of the day it’s still a third world manufactured gun that I paid Cdn $ for. Long long ways from any Savage or Tikka that I’ve ever owned or shot.

But that’s my rant, please forgive me bc I read where an awful lot of you rave about the CZ’s. But me and my CZ are definitely not one of them. But I’m sure if I threw some more money at this thing the first place would be a decent trigger. I know I could tighten up those groups at least a bit with a proper trigger. Any ideas who makes a decent trigger for this gun?

I was able to remove the creep in both of my 527 triggers, quite easily.. The hardest part was releasing one locknut, so I could adjust the screw on my 17 Hornet, as it was very tight. I found the procedure explained with pictures online.

[6.5 shooter]

25gr. bullets, Hornady and Berger shoot very well out of my CZ527, tried little gun not a big fan, H4198 seems to be a much better choice...PRIMERS will make a huge difference...I like the 25 gr. bullets better less walking wounded, and a higher BC. CCI 400 and rem 61/2 have worked best for me..And I seat my bullets LONG and shoot my rifle as a single shot.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by 6.5 shooter

25gr. bullets, Hornady and Berger shoot very well out of my CZ527, tried little gun not a big fan, H4198 seems to be a much better choice...PRIMERS will make a huge difference...I like the 25 gr. bullets better less walking wounded, and a higher BC. CCI 400 and rem 61/2 have worked best for me..And I seat my bullets LONG and shoot my rifle as a single shot.

While 6-1/2 primers are my choice for the 22Hornet, gases leaked around them when I tried them in the 17Hornet. That was in new cases, and the primers fit snug.

[6.5 shooter]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

While 6-1/2 primers are my choice for the 22Hornet, gases leaked around them when I tried them in the 17Hornet. That was in new cases, and the primers fit snug.

Had that issue with a couple that did not fit square and peeled an ever so small piece off the cup. The .17 is a finicky little lady but when she dances she really dances.

[Groundhogger]

Reading this thread is interesting, as I have a 527 Varmint in 17 Hornet...and I'm getting great results with factory 20gr. Hornady. Now, I DO handload...and had started the load development process when last years varmint hunting "Season" got underway..so I never really finished. Best results were with 20gr. bullets, but I was honestly getting 3/4 MOA (some better) on average with the factory stuff..so load development took a bit of a back seat.

3 weeks ago, in the snow, I shot it for the first time since last August, and the POI was about 1" left..so I corrected=all good. First outing was in the snow (bad weather won't F-off here in S. Ontario it seems) this past Saturday. I was letting my buddy do the trigger work, but after missing a relatively close one..we set-up a target @ 75 yards so I could re-check. Everything was fine, I'm guessing he pulled it, or overcompensated for the wind. Only mentioning because the improvised target was a pc. of a cardboard box we found~no actual target or even a pen to draw a circle with. I took a shot, then tried to hit the hole on 2 subsequent shots. The second shot landed less than 1/2" away, and the third shot went through the second hole almost perfectly. Probably a fluke (I ain't THAT good ) but without too much effort, using factory ammo, shooting prone off only a bipod with frozen fingers...a very tight group was the result.

I don't say any of that to brag, but it DOES make me wonder whether or not the OP has tried the factory ammo, how it shot, etc. Wondering if he has a gun issue, but I'd try the factory ammo first. For economy-reasons, I will be hand-loading for this gun before long...but with the way it shoots with factory ammo~that's clearly not been a priority.

My trigger~heavy when not set, pretty decent set. Breaks clean, a little over-travel after..but thats of zero concern. Because of my luck with Rifle Basix triggers I've put in my Marlin rimfires...I'm awfully tempted to pick-up one of theirs for my 527; https://riflebasix.com/product/ceska...rigger-cz-527/ However, I have guns with triggers WAY WAY worse than the set one on my 527, so it hasn't happened yet.

Single-shot adapter~I got one from Calhoon, it took some tweaking of the mag release to get it to seat right, but once in...rounds do not feed at all. I've had some offers from well-meaning people to look at the problem/make suggestions..but to no avail. It's an exceedingly well-machined/polished/finished thing~but hanging on my shop wall in a ziploc bag. I actually like the look of the mag in the gun, so I don't mind NOT using it as a single shot...but it would also be nice to have the option of single-loading.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by 6.5 shooter

Had that issue with a couple that did not fit square and peeled an ever so small piece off the cup. The .17 is a finicky little lady but when she dances she really dances.

They seat fine, they just won't hold the pressure. I went to 7-1/2 primers, and no issues.

[aardvaark]

Thanks for the reply, GRoundhog,I have tried factory ammo. The one thing that’s consistent with this gun, after I bedded the action, is that it consistently shoots 1.5-2” groups with everything except the 20’s that I’ve finally managed to get down to 1” groups. Only thing that really changes is the location on the target. All of the ladder work I did with the 25’s, the different powder kinds, factory ammo be it 20 or 25gr, even during the ladder work with the 20’s UNTIL I got to the sweet spot (11.9 and 12.3 was 1.25” and 12.1 was 1”) that I’m now using as my go-to round. Looking at what I’m now printing, it sounds like there’s a bedding problem, so I think I’ll take it apart again and just make sure that’s all okay. Have to take it apart anyway to get at the trigger.

BTW, the pattern that it shoots, is that the string is always mostly horizontal, with about about .25 - .50” vertical variation, if that means anything

Also, I’m using CCI 400 primers, and no blow-by issues at all. With Hornady bulk brass. The brass that the factory rounds are in has a fairly large variance in weight which, I know, changes the case capacity so I haven’t used it yet for my reloads. All of my brass that I use has been weighed and kept within a fairly tight weight variance. I don’t remember what the variance is, but I do remember there were quite a few that were over and under my spec so they were culled.

[aardvaark]

So I took the gun apart tonight. Action beddings appears good. Really snug fit, barrel is entirely free floating. Played with the trigger. Got it to break clean with no creep and no after travel to speak of. I’m very impressed with how that trigger works now. As good as my Tikka triggers and also my Timney on my 270.

Loaded up 3 rounds of 25gr Hornady. 10 thou off the lands. Too long for the mag. Book calls for a min start of 12.4gr of H335. 1st 2 rounds were an inch apart on an exact horizontal. 3rd round was 1inch down from the first for a total of about 1.5”. Not much has changed.

[6.5 shooter]

I stole this from one of the long range forums it may answer your question.


I just did a test the other day shooting from a bipod at 100yds. For the first group I shot 5 rounds with the rear bag ,bipod,rifle set up perfectly as if it were in a bench rest setup and shot with my best form.
The 5 shot group measured .269"
For the next group I pulled the rifle hard to my shoulder without carefully aligning the rifle ,bipod and rear bag and shot a 5 shot group.
It was nearly a perfect horizontal line with all bullets touching...
I made the horizontal.

[andy1]

Xreload and rps international in edm area. Rps has had lowest pricing. Clay is @ prophet is also a good option.

[Groundhogger]

Originally Posted by aardvaark

Thanks for the reply, GRoundhog,I have tried factory ammo. The one thing that’s consistent with this gun, after I bedded the action, is that it consistently shoots 1.5-2” groups with everything except the 20’s that I’ve finally managed to get down to 1” groups. Only thing that really changes is the location on the target. All of the ladder work I did with the 25’s, the different powder kinds, factory ammo be it 20 or 25gr, even during the ladder work with the 20’s UNTIL I got to the sweet spot (11.9 and 12.3 was 1.25” and 12.1 was 1”) that I’m now using as my go-to round. Looking at what I’m now printing, it sounds like there’s a bedding problem, so I think I’ll take it apart again and just make sure that’s all okay. Have to take it apart anyway to get at the trigger.

BTW, the pattern that it shoots, is that the string is always mostly horizontal, with about about .25 - .50” vertical variation, if that means anything

Also, I’m using CCI 400 primers, and no blow-by issues at all. With Hornady bulk brass. The brass that the factory rounds are in has a fairly large variance in weight which, I know, changes the case capacity so I haven’t used it yet for my reloads. All of my brass that I use has been weighed and kept within a fairly tight weight variance. I don’t remember what the variance is, but I do remember there were quite a few that were over and under my spec so they were culled.

Hey aardvark~occurred to me that I might not have mentioned I'm using CCI BR4 primers. Not sure whether or not they're considered to be the "right" ones or not, but I've always had good results with them.

Also, while my load testing has all but stalled...I believe I could dig-up my notes, and get you my specs. Happy to try and do that, if I find them..I can post them here.

[Faststeel]

Originally Posted by aardvaark

So I took the gun apart tonight. Action beddings appears good. Really snug fit, barrel is entirely free floating. Played with the trigger. Got it to break clean with no creep and no after travel to speak of. I’m very impressed with how that trigger works now. As good as my Tikka triggers and also my Timney on my 270.

Loaded up 3 rounds of 25gr Hornady. 10 thou off the lands. Too long for the mag. Book calls for a min start of 12.4gr of H335. 1st 2 rounds were an inch apart on an exact horizontal. 3rd round was 1inch down from the first for a total of about 1.5”. Not much has changed.

Try 12.0 gr of 335 powder, its below book, but it was my best group

[Darrenjos]

swamp donkey in Edmonton...cheapest place in Canada to buy tips ..