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  #211  
Old 06-30-2010, 10:04 AM
Rafter Rafter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Boss442 View Post
Personally, what the Metis Nation of Alberta should have fought for was Hunting Rights "not" Subsistence Hunting.
Boss442,

Thank you for the informative post. It's an eye opener for every one on this forum.

It sure dispels the myth that is floating on this site regarding the "Convenience Metis" and the mass flooding of applications by people to become a Metis because of nothing more than just gaining hunting rights.

In reality there are only 15,000 Metis in Alberta that can justifiably claim and prove that they are Metis as set out by Powley. This is actually a drop in the 46,000 Metis that claimed to be Metis prior to Powley. The myth that there are more Metis is false. In actuality there are less Metis in the Province that are rights bearing, or in other words allowed to hunt for food.

There are 86,000 people in Alberta who claim to be Metis on the census, there were 46,000 that claimed to be Metis to the Metis Nation of Alberta, and there are only 15,000 Metis that can prove they are Metis.

Of the 15,000 Metis that are rights bearing Aboriginals there are only 1000 +/-individuals that actually hunt. In other words if any other people that claim they are Metis but can not prove it will be found guilty in a Court of Law. Also they will not be defended by the Metis Nation of Alberta.

The misinformation that has gone on this forum has no fact behind it whatsoever.

Thanks for bringing the truth to us.

Rafter
  #212  
Old 06-30-2010, 10:10 AM
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In reality there are only 15,000 Metis in Alberta that can justifiably claim and prove that they are Metis as set out by Powley. This is actually a drop in the 46,000 Metis that claimed to be Metis prior to Powley. The myth that there are more Metis is false. In actuality there are less Metis in the Province that are rights bearing, or in other words allowed to hunt for food.
Rafter, I'm not saying you are wrong but are you sure that the number of Metis in Alberta spiked prior to Powley? By my recollection, the rexamination of Metis rights came after Powley because of the huge influx of "new" Metis created by Powley. Basically the Metis of convenience. I have all the numbers somewhere in my files but I thought you might know off hand.
  #213  
Old 06-30-2010, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
Well said Sporty and I agree that trophy hunting isn't rampant throughout the Metis community but it has to be a concern. I don't think it can just be swept under the rug either. And yes, I have seen the results. You make some great points about the Metis and what it means to be Metis and it's unfortunate that an unscupulous faction is riding your coat tails for nefarious reasons.
Sheephunter,

I believe you are right, as in any society or culture there is always a percentage that bring shame upon the rest.

I also believe that the numbers are low for the unscrupulous fraction of the Metis.

I think the Government of Alberta is focussing on who are the rights bearing Metis in this Province in their fight against the Metis Nation of Alberta. In my opinion this is a good thing as so many wannabes claim to be Metis when they are not. Once this gets settled there will be less bad apples(wanabes etc...) out there to bring shame on the the true Metis rights bearing society.

Thanks,
Rafter
  #214  
Old 06-30-2010, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
Rafter, I'm not saying you are wrong but are you sure that the number of Metis in Alberta spiked prior to Powley? By my recollection, the rexamination of Metis rights came after Powley because of the huge influx of "new" Metis created by Powley. Basically the Metis of convenience. I have all the numbers somewhere in my files but I thought you might know off hand.
Sheephunter,

No. What I am saying is that there are less Metis that are rights bearing in Alberta, post Powley. There were 46,000 people claming to be Metis prior to Powley, but of that, the vast majority have no proof. To date there are only 15,000 that have proven to be rights bearing Metis in the Province. The vast majority of the 46,000 have no status, therefore no Metis rights or legal representation from the Metis Nation of Alberta. In retrospect Powley was a good thing as not every person claiming to be Metis have hunting rights, only the people that can prove they are part of the rights bearing group. This equates to only 15,000 compared to the census of 86,000. Therefore the number has drastically diminshed post Powley, a good thing for the true Metis.

Thanks,
Rafter
  #215  
Old 06-30-2010, 11:37 AM
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Well....

I cannot believe that I have waited so long to post on this thread because this issue (and many others that are VERY similar) are ones that I feel very strongly about. I have read every post thus far and I would like to say a few things:

First...I would like to congratulate everyone for keeping this to a civil discussion (for the most part) that I feel has shed some light on a few things. I would hazard to guess that I am not the only one who feels they have learned something here. And I would also like to thank the mods for not closing this thread and allowing this discussion to continue. I think we all benefit..

Second...I would also like to thank those members that posted some well-thought out, researched, constructive posts for both sides of the issue. I cannot name them all, but suffice it to say that I was not surprised by who some of them were...they are members that I have come to respect for their opinions. I have also found some new respect for other members that I didn't before.

I have many opinions on this subject, a lot of which has been expressed by others so I won't re-hash what has already been discussed. But after reading all of the posts, I am left with one question that I seem to be asking a lot over the past few years...particularly after 9/11/2001:

If we all know that each group (whatever type of group that may be) has some bad apples in it that are casting a dark shadow on the rest of the group by their improper actions, what are the "upstanding" members of the group doing to police their own?

I honestly feel that if the rest of the world could see that you, as a fine upstanding member of your group, was doing something to identify the situation...remedy it....or potentially oust the bad apples from the group, the animosity that is directed towards your group would decrease.

Muslims vs. extremist Muslims, law-abiding hunters vs. poachers, Metis vs. "Convenience Metis", motorcycle riders who ride safely vs. immature punks who wreak havoc on the roads, etc. etc.

The list can go on and on and the model can be applied to any group. The solution has to come from within first before any other outside influences can affect change.

Just my 2 cents...hopefully it makes good sense.
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  #216  
Old 06-30-2010, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
You really live by the credo "Never let the facts get in the way of a good story" don't you.

Go troll on someone else's posts Gary.....I've got no interest in getting in a debate with you or your family. It seems inventing lies about someone's personal life is the Vallmarie first line of attack(Ty is exempt from this statement)....I'm not playing.

Tuck tail and slide out the back door again. You talk on both sides of your mouth and always get caught. Your discipline through magazines and video's is about your personal life in the hunting world and likewise with everyone else who contribute on this forum. Not many but some issues and comments you have made I take with a grain of salt. You can complicate the obvious and trivalize the momentous accompanied by fraudulent innuendoes. When you lie, don't tell half lies.
  #217  
Old 06-30-2010, 01:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Jack&7 View Post
Well....

I cannot believe that I have waited so long to post on this thread because this issue (and many others that are VERY similar) are ones that I feel very strongly about. I have read every post thus far and I would like to say a few things:

First...I would like to congratulate everyone for keeping this to a civil discussion (for the most part) that I feel has shed some light on a few things. I would hazard to guess that I am not the only one who feels they have learned something here. And I would also like to thank the mods for not closing this thread and allowing this discussion to continue. I think we all benefit..

Second...I would also like to thank those members that posted some well-thought out, researched, constructive posts for both sides of the issue. I cannot name them all, but suffice it to say that I was not surprised by who some of them were...they are members that I have come to respect for their opinions. I have also found some new respect for other members that I didn't before.

I have many opinions on this subject, a lot of which has been expressed by others so I won't re-hash what has already been discussed. But after reading all of the posts, I am left with one question that I seem to be asking a lot over the past few years...particularly after 9/11/2001:

If we all know that each group (whatever type of group that may be) has some bad apples in it that are casting a dark shadow on the rest of the group by their improper actions, what are the "upstanding" members of the group doing to police their own?

I honestly feel that if the rest of the world could see that you, as a fine upstanding member of your group, was doing something to identify the situation...remedy it....or potentially oust the bad apples from the group, the animosity that is directed towards your group would decrease.

Muslims vs. extremist Muslims, law-abiding hunters vs. poachers, Metis vs. "Convenience Metis", motorcycle riders who ride safely vs. immature punks who wreak havoc on the roads, etc. etc.

The list can go on and on and the model can be applied to any group. The solution has to come from within first before any other outside influences can affect change.

Just my 2 cents...hopefully it makes good sense.
It makes perfectly good sense, finding a judgement council to pass punishment with out being labeled as biased would be the first of many hurdles.
  #218  
Old 06-30-2010, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
Well said Sporty and I agree that trophy hunting isn't rampant throughout the Metis community but it has to be a concern. I don't think it can just be swept under the rug either. And yes, I have seen the results. You make some great points about the Metis and what it means to be Metis and it's unfortunate that an unscupulous faction is riding your coat tails for nefarious reasons.

I can't speak on behalf of others, I myself don't agree with many aspects of this agreement and because of that I chose to buy my tags as I always did after the agreement went through. I can only be responsible for myself. That being said, I don't know if I would turn the other cheek if I knew of someone personally abusing this right, as of now I know no one that has abused it.

I have different opinions of what constitutes "subsistence" and what doesn't but that is also something that I've kept to myself because I'm not walking in anyone else's shoes. I do know of people that have hunted, within season, with their harvesting rights but they also do what Metis have done traditionally. They share their kills with elders and the less fortunate, it is something they've always done, long before Powley and I can't judge them on that. One thing for certain is that I was Metis long before Powley as was my family. We have a strong proud line of Metis people going as far back as Red River Manitoba. My great great grandfather and 2 of his brothers fought along side Louis Riel in the Red River Rebellion and the Battle of Batoche, Metis to me is my life, not a fad, not something I found because of some new rights and for that I will defend Metis people, not because of some harvesting agreement.

I said in my original post that Trophy hunting is not allowed, there are guidelines from the Metis Nation themselves on their website. If people know of Metis abusing these rights and stepping out of the guidelines, report them.
  #219  
Old 06-30-2010, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafter View Post
Boss442,

Thank you for the informative post. It's an eye opener for every one on this forum.

It sure dispels the myth that is floating on this site regarding the "Convenience Metis" and the mass flooding of applications by people to become a Metis because of nothing more than just gaining hunting rights.

In reality there are only 15,000 Metis in Alberta that can justifiably claim and prove that they are Metis as set out by Powley. This is actually a drop in the 46,000 Metis that claimed to be Metis prior to Powley. The myth that there are more Metis is false. In actuality there are less Metis in the Province that are rights bearing, or in other words allowed to hunt for food.

There are 86,000 people in Alberta who claim to be Metis on the census, there were 46,000 that claimed to be Metis to the Metis Nation of Alberta, and there are only 15,000 Metis that can prove they are Metis.

Of the 15,000 Metis that are rights bearing Aboriginals there are only 1000 +/-individuals that actually hunt. In other words if any other people that claim they are Metis but can not prove it will be found guilty in a Court of Law. Also they will not be defended by the Metis Nation of Alberta.

The misinformation that has gone on this forum has no fact behind it whatsoever.

Thanks for bringing the truth to us.

Rafter
WOW !...I was under the impression that were many many many more Metis status hunters than those numbers...

Does that 15,000 include men women and children? I'm sure it must.

with only 1000 legally hunting under status,...and of that 1000 I wonder what the percentage is of those that are taking advantage or concentrating on trophies...

Is it possible, based on the numbers above, that this whole thing is blown way out of proportion?

Depending on the number of "convenience metis" that make that 1000 hunters, i'd almost suspect that the issue with Metis hunting rights is smaller issue than non metis poachers...
  #220  
Old 06-30-2010, 01:55 PM
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^^^ It has been blown out of proportion. People are not going by facts, they are reacting emotionally to the agreement and who it was given to. There has been more of the "I heard of this one guy" rather than "I know someone". There is a lot of he said she said going on and people shouldn't be so quick to believe everything they hear as though its the gospel truth.
  #221  
Old 06-30-2010, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Sporty View Post
^^^ It has been blown out of proportion. People are not going by facts, they are reacting emotionally to the agreement and who it was given to. There has been more of the "I heard of this one guy" rather than "I know someone". There is a lot of he said she said going on and people shouldn't be so quick to believe everything they hear as though its the gospel truth.
I believe that is true. I also think that some of the hunting rights seem so contradictory to people that are not Metis, or first nations or.... that it seems much bigger than it really is. What I mean is that there is much ado about a deer shot in June... It just seems so wrong to those who are restricted to seasons. and becasue it seems so wrong, it gets much more talked about, and elongated and on and on,..until one would believe that that every hour of the day, somewhere in their hunting WMU, during the month of June ..a Metis is killing deer.
  #222  
Old 06-30-2010, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Arn?Narn. View Post
I believe that is true. I also think that some of the hunting rights seem so contradictory to people that are not Metis, or first nations or.... that it seems much bigger than it really is. What I mean is that there is much ado about a deer shot in June... It just seems so wrong to those who are restricted to seasons. and becasue it seems so wrong, it gets much more talked about, and elongated and on and on,..until one would believe that that every hour of the day, somewhere in their hunting WMU, during the month of June ..a Metis is killing deer.
I see nothing wrong with a Metis shooting a deer in June and I see nothing wrong with a Metis hunter taking several deer in June to feed others in the Metis community. This is a big part of the Metis heritage. What I and I think most non-status hunters do have a problem with is Metis driving from Medicine Hat to Pincher Creek to target trophy bighorn rams. Correct me if I'm wrong but this is not part of the Metis hertitage that I'm aware of nor does it fall under the definition of subsistence.

There's nothing contradictory at all about Metis hunting rights when excercised in the spirit the right was granted.

Last edited by sheephunter; 06-30-2010 at 02:21 PM.
  #223  
Old 06-30-2010, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
I see nothing wrong with a Metis shooting a deer in June and I see nothing wrong with a Metis hunter taking several deer in June to feed others in the Metis community. This is a big part of the Metis heritage. I do have a problem with Metis driving from Medicine Hat to Pincher Creek to target trophy bighorn rams. Correct me if I'm wrong but this is not part of the Metis hertitage that I'm aware of nor does it fall under the definition of subsistence.

There's nothing contradictory at all about Metis hunting rights when excercised in the spirit the right was granted.
My question is, how big a portion of the legal (status) Metis are doing this.
Anyone else can be charged, including Metis who are not status.

Do you think there are more Metis doing this than non Metis (white) as poachers?

If in fact it is illega to target trophies, than have they been reported?

I read that all cases on Metis hunting would go to court with the burden being to prove legal right.


If there are only 100 ststus Metis hunters... just how many are driving up to pincher Creek form Medicine Hat.

One is too many, if it is illegal...

again, I'm pretty sure I read that trophy hunting was not a right and that all cases of Metis hunting based on status would go to court...

Is this wrong?

Still reading what I can...
  #224  
Old 06-30-2010, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
I see nothing wrong with a Metis shooting a deer in June and I see nothing wrong with a Metis hunter taking several deer in June to feed others in the Metis community. This is a big part of the Metis heritage. What I and I think most non-status hunters do have a problem with is Metis driving from Medicine Hat to Pincher Creek to target trophy bighorn rams. Correct me if I'm wrong but this is not part of the Metis hertitage that I'm aware of nor does it fall under the definition of subsistence.

There's nothing contradictory at all about Metis hunting rights when excercised in the spirit the right was granted.


Not everyone sees as you do... I know of many people who have issue with a deer being taken in June,...put a decent growing rack on that deer, and even more problem.
  #225  
Old 06-30-2010, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Arn?Narn. View Post
WOW !...I was under the impression that were many many many more Metis status hunters than those numbers...

Does that 15,000 include men women and children? I'm sure it must.

with only 1000 legally hunting under status,...and of that 1000 I wonder what the percentage is of those that are taking advantage or concentrating on trophies...

Is it possible, based on the numbers above, that this whole thing is blown way out of proportion?

Depending on the number of "convenience metis" that make that 1000 hunters, i'd almost suspect that the issue with Metis hunting rights is smaller issue than non metis poachers...

Arn?Narn,

The 15,000 includes old ladies in wheel chairs, old men, and many non hunters

Yes this has been blown way out of proportion.

There are no stats that I am aware of but I hazard a guess of less than 1% are just hunting for trophies when they are only supposed to be hunting for food. These opportunists are breaking Metis rules

Yes, I agree that Metis hunting numbers does not even come close in comparison with non Metis poachers. In saying that there are bad apples in the Metis bunch also but the numbers obviously would be very low in comparison to non Metis numbers just because of the sheer volume of non Metis hunters. It's all relative. Metis 1% of 1,000 = 10 All others 1% of 100,000=1000.

Thanks,
Rafter
  #226  
Old 06-30-2010, 03:12 PM
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So why the fight to extend the rights beyond how the province interprets Powley? If the numbers of Metis are so insignificant, isn't there enough game available under the current provincial interpretation to keep the Metis fed? Why would Metis need to travel hundreds of miles at great expense just to hunt for food? I keep seeing the Metis say one thing but hear another.

There is nothing preventing Metis hunters from obtaining tags through the regular season should they wish to trophy hunt and if the Metis numbers are truly so insignificant, I can't see the need to hunt away from the Metis communities for subsistence as granted in Powley. Something just doesn't add up here.

The skeptic in me says this has very little to do with subsistence hunting.....
  #227  
Old 06-30-2010, 03:13 PM
Rafter Rafter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Sporty View Post
I can't speak on behalf of others, I myself don't agree with many aspects of this agreement and because of that I chose to buy my tags as I always did after the agreement went through. I can only be responsible for myself. That being said, I don't know if I would turn the other cheek if I knew of someone personally abusing this right, as of now I know no one that has abused it.

I have different opinions of what constitutes "subsistence" and what doesn't but that is also something that I've kept to myself because I'm not walking in anyone else's shoes. I do know of people that have hunted, within season, with their harvesting rights but they also do what Metis have done traditionally. They share their kills with elders and the less fortunate, it is something they've always done, long before Powley and I can't judge them on that. One thing for certain is that I was Metis long before Powley as was my family. We have a strong proud line of Metis people going as far back as Red River Manitoba. My great great grandfather and 2 of his brothers fought along side Louis Riel in the Red River Rebellion and the Battle of Batoche, Metis to me is my life, not a fad, not something I found because of some new rights and for that I will defend Metis people, not because of some harvesting agreement.

I said in my original post that Trophy hunting is not allowed, there are guidelines from the Metis Nation themselves on their website. If people know of Metis abusing these rights and stepping out of the guidelines, report them.
Sporty,

I like the idea of reporting a Metis who is in violation of their own laws.

On the lighter side we could get front license type plates that read: "Report A Metis" to go along with the Report A Poacher plates one sees out there.

Thanks,
Rafter
  #228  
Old 06-30-2010, 03:21 PM
Rafter Rafter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Jack&7 View Post
Well....

I cannot believe that I have waited so long to post on this thread because this issue (and many others that are VERY similar) are ones that I feel very strongly about. I have read every post thus far and I would like to say a few things:

First...I would like to congratulate everyone for keeping this to a civil discussion (for the most part) that I feel has shed some light on a few things. I would hazard to guess that I am not the only one who feels they have learned something here. And I would also like to thank the mods for not closing this thread and allowing this discussion to continue. I think we all benefit..

Second...I would also like to thank those members that posted some well-thought out, researched, constructive posts for both sides of the issue. I cannot name them all, but suffice it to say that I was not surprised by who some of them were...they are members that I have come to respect for their opinions. I have also found some new respect for other members that I didn't before.

I have many opinions on this subject, a lot of which has been expressed by others so I won't re-hash what has already been discussed. But after reading all of the posts, I am left with one question that I seem to be asking a lot over the past few years...particularly after 9/11/2001:

If we all know that each group (whatever type of group that may be) has some bad apples in it that are casting a dark shadow on the rest of the group by their improper actions, what are the "upstanding" members of the group doing to police their own?

I honestly feel that if the rest of the world could see that you, as a fine upstanding member of your group, was doing something to identify the situation...remedy it....or potentially oust the bad apples from the group, the animosity that is directed towards your group would decrease.

Muslims vs. extremist Muslims, law-abiding hunters vs. poachers, Metis vs. "Convenience Metis", motorcycle riders who ride safely vs. immature punks who wreak havoc on the roads, etc. etc.

The list can go on and on and the model can be applied to any group. The solution has to come from within first before any other outside influences can affect change.

Just my 2 cents...hopefully it makes good sense.
Jack&7,

This thread, for the most part, has been so far very informative with differing opinions given back and forth freely in a cordial manner.

I believe we are all getting a better picture of the situation.

I think we should congratulate ourselves collectively and celebrate with a JACK&7.

Thanks,
Rafter
  #229  
Old 06-30-2010, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
So why the fight to extend the rights beyond how the province interprets Powley? If the numbers of Metis are so insignificant, isn't there enough game available under the current provincial interpretation to keep the Metis fed? Why would Metis need to travel hundreds of miles at great expense just to hunt for food? I keep seeing the Metis say one thing but hear another.

There is nothing preventing Metis hunters from obtaining tags through the regular season should they wish to trophy hunt and if the Metis numbers are truly so insignificant, I can't see the need to hunt away from the Metis communities for subsistence as granted in Powley. Something just doesn't add up here.
The skeptic in me says this has very little to do with subsistence hunting.....

I see no reason for any extension beyong the Powley interpretation by AB...but admittedly I don't know all the ins and outs...
  #230  
Old 06-30-2010, 06:57 PM
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Thin edge of the wedge guys... Thin edge of the wedge.

Jamie
  #231  
Old 06-30-2010, 07:13 PM
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Wow this thread has come a long way. Some may not like this but i feel metis, full status natives and everyone else should be on a level playing field. The native community doesnt deserve anything more than anyone else. And as far as them not paying taxes...........Lets not even go there.
My 2 cents, which I am Legally entitled to
  #232  
Old 06-30-2010, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by 7mmremmag View Post
Wow this thread has come a long way. Some may not like this but i feel metis, full status natives and everyone else should be on a level playing field. The native community doesnt deserve anything more than anyone else. And as far as them not paying taxes...........Lets not even go there.
My 2 cents, which I am Legally entitled to
Where and when exactly do Metis not pay taxes..
  #233  
Old 06-30-2010, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
So why the fight to extend the rights beyond how the province interprets Powley? If the numbers of Metis are so insignificant, isn't there enough game available under the current provincial interpretation to keep the Metis fed? Why would Metis need to travel hundreds of miles at great expense just to hunt for food? I keep seeing the Metis say one thing but hear another.

There is nothing preventing Metis hunters from obtaining tags through the regular season should they wish to trophy hunt and if the Metis numbers are truly so insignificant, I can't see the need to hunt away from the Metis communities for subsistence as granted in Powley. Something just doesn't add up here.

The skeptic in me says this has very little to do with subsistence hunting.....

Very wise and inquisitive words T.J.. Why indeed ??

But this question runs much farther than just hunting rights.. Why free education ?? when at times I have struggled to pay my children's school fees.. Why a house supplied at minimum costs for metis and firsts nations at times when I have a hard time to put food on my children's plate when at the same time working until I can't walk.. Why did my children and many other white children in our town go to a kindergarten school that is an abandoned 1964 wood shop when a block away the metis children attend a $300,000.00 state of the art facility. Why have I in the past walked by countless grocery carts full of voucher filled grocery carts while my wife was picking through the sale bin just to make the month ??? Why are countless construction contractors in the north turned away from work because they are white while government subsidised metis and first nation contractors granted work based on race and not company history or bid ??

All this just to get a kick in the teeth after years of picking through the rules and trying to find some little hole some place that I could actually find a little lake that I GOD forbid could keep a God damn walleye for the family to eat.. Spent what all we possibly had just to sneak away for a week out of a finger bleeding year of work to get a moose to feed the family and all this in the name of equality ?? Give me a break

All I have seen on here so far is the argument of what happened 200 years ago.. I could give a damn what happened 200 years ago and what the metis did 200 years ago.. Do me a favour and tell me what hey did the last 200 years then we have a conversation..


There is more bigotry and discrimination going on right now in this country than has ever happened to the natives its just that the tables have turned and some are to stupid to see the truth..

Last edited by lilsundance; 07-01-2010 at 12:27 AM. Reason: language
  #234  
Old 06-30-2010, 08:30 PM
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Boss442 Boss442 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by 7mmremmag View Post
Wow this thread has come a long way. Some may not like this but i feel metis, full status natives and everyone else should be on a level playing field. The native community doesnt deserve anything more than anyone else. And as far as them not paying taxes...........Lets not even go there.
My 2 cents, which I am Legally entitled to
Sorry to burst your bubble, I'am Metis and have paid taxes all my life, started working part time at eleven years old sweeping floors in a auto shop my father managed in Calgary. Employed full time since I was seventeen (also married at 17, just celibrated our 29th anniversary). At one time was working three jobs at the same time, family buisness, Canadian Forces Reserves, and Solictor General of Alberta. I social drink (not a rageing alchoholic or crack head) that many Natives are made out to be!

No I don't need to subsistance hunt and have'nt hunted since the IMHA was suspended, I hunt because its a right and priviledge my ancestors never got to enjoy as they were promised.
  #235  
Old 06-30-2010, 08:33 PM
Walleyes Walleyes is offline
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No I don't need to subsistance hunt and have'nt hunted since the IMHA was suspended, I hunt because its a right and priviledge my ancestors never got to enjoy as they were promised
Promised at a different place and time !!!
  #236  
Old 06-30-2010, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Boss442 View Post
Sorry to burst your bubble, I'am Metis and have paid taxes all my life, started working part time at eleven years old sweeping floors in a auto shop my father managed in Calgary. Employed full time since I was seventeen (also married at 17, just celibrated our 29th anniversary). At one time was working three jobs at the same time, family buisness, Canadian Forces Reserves, and Solictor General of Alberta. I social drink (not a rageing alchoholic or crack head) that many Natives are made out to be!

No I don't need to subsistance hunt and have'nt hunted since the IMHA was suspended, I hunt because its a right and priviledge my ancestors never got to enjoy as they were promised.
  #237  
Old 06-30-2010, 08:38 PM
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nevermind

Last edited by Arn?Narn.; 06-30-2010 at 08:58 PM.
  #238  
Old 06-30-2010, 09:16 PM
ishootbambi ishootbambi is offline
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Originally Posted by sheephunter View Post
I see nothing wrong with a Metis shooting a deer in June and I see nothing wrong with a Metis hunter taking several deer in June to feed others in the Metis community. This is a big part of the Metis heritage. What I and I think most non-status hunters do have a problem with is Metis driving from Medicine Hat to Pincher Creek to target trophy bighorn rams. Correct me if I'm wrong but this is not part of the Metis hertitage that I'm aware of nor does it fall under the definition of subsistence.

There's nothing contradictory at all about Metis hunting rights when excercised in the spirit the right was granted.
did you hear about the same guy that i know? not one of the guys in the court case, but a metis of convenience who shot 4 rams in the first year of the imha, and sold 3 of them?
  #239  
Old 06-30-2010, 10:14 PM
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lead chucker lead chucker is offline
 
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Originally Posted by S.A.S View Post
An interesting topic. I personally don't see why anyone is allowed to hunt year round. The charter of rights and freedoms say we are all equal and should be treated as such, Allowing minority groups special privileges goes against said charter. It seems like no one on that side is happy with what they are given, you give an inch and they want a mile. In 2010 very few people in Canada need to sustenance hunt, If you can't afford a pack of ground beef down at the safeway then you have bigger problems to deal with besides where and when you can hunt.

And before anyone goes off calling me a racist and what not, I have no issue with Indians, full blooded or half, that work for their living, are not addicted to drugs or alcohol and do not complain about the government all the time. Hard working clean Indians are alright in my books.
x2
  #240  
Old 07-01-2010, 06:58 AM
Rafter Rafter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Walleyes View Post
Very wise and inquisitive words T.J.. Why indeed ??

But this question runs much farther than just hunting rights.. Why free education ?? when at times I have struggled to pay my children's school fees.. Why a house supplied at minimum costs for metis and firsts nations at times when I have a hard time to put food on my children's plate when at the same time working until I can't walk.. Why did my children and many other white children in our town go to a kindergarten school that is an abandoned 1964 wood shop when a block away the metis children attend a $300,000.00 state of the art facility. Why have I in the past walked by countless grocery carts full of voucher filled grocery carts while my wife was picking through the sale bin just to make the month ??? Why are countless construction contractors in the north turned away from work because they are white while government subsidised metis and first nation contractors granted work based on race and not company history or bid ??

All this just to get a kick in the teeth after years of picking through the rules and trying to find some little hole some place that I could actually find a little lake that I GOD forbid could keep a God damn walleye for the family to eat.. Spent what all we possibly had just to sneak away for a week out of a finger bleeding year of work to get a moose to feed the family and all this in the name of equality ?? Give me a break

All I have seen on here so far is the argument of what happened 200 years ago.. I could give a damn what happened 200 years ago and what the metis did 200 years ago.. Do me a favour and tell me what hey did the last 200 years then we have a conversation..


There is more bigotry and discrimination going on right now in this country than has ever happened to the natives its just that the tables have turned and some are to stupid to see the truth..
Walleyes

Aboriginals fought in both World Wars and the Korean war so that all Canadians enjoy freedom.

Indians actually had to give up their status when they joined up.

Rafter
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