Bear Hunting rifle recommendations

[Real Batman]

If there's one thing I've learned from lurking in this great forum... it's that a couple of you guys have opinions!

I am looking for advice on a gun that would primarily be used for protection against bears. Most likely short range (less than 100 yards). Since it won't be used often (I hope), price would be a consideration.

Thanks in advance!

[kw5891]

Originally Posted by Real Batman

If there's one thing I've learned from lurking in this great forum... it's that a couple of you guys have opinions!

I am looking for advice on a gun that would primarily be used for protection against bears. Most likely short range (less than 100 yards). Since it won't be used often (I hope), price would be a consideration.

Thanks in advance!

Remington 7600 pump 35 whelen 250gr kill anything

[Scott N]

Just my opinion, but I'd say look at a short barreled shotgun instead. Remington 870s are a proven design.

[MountainTi]

Probably a 12 gauge defender, preferably stainless-less maintainence. No plug, first 3 shells 00 buckshot, followed by 2 slugs. Slugs are available first, buckshot next in case things ended up getting real close and personal.

[surhuntsalot]

After guiding bear hunts for 16 years, at an average of 60+ bears per year, I have seen every bow, rifle, shotgun, combination used that you can immagine. So it is with that that I speak from experience. I have found that the large magnum rifles with the heaviest of bullets kill bears with well placed shots. That said, The most damage, and some of the quickest kills I have seen have come from cartriges such as the 270 win. with 130 grain ballistic tips, or a 7 mag with 140's. In my opinion these are much better suited to Black Bears in comparrison to a 375 wit 270gr. or a 338 with 250 grain bullets. Black bears are not overly huge, just look at one skinned out. A lighter bullet that causes more initial shock and trauma is better than one with high weight retention. Once a bullet exits the target, the weight it retains, and it's remaining energy are a waste. Anything that will work for whitetails is more than enough for bears, but if your looking for an excuse to get a 45-70 guide gun....It will work too, I know mine does.

...Had to add that if versatillity doesn't matter at all, and it is for a purely defense, which in most cases will be less than 20 yards, You can't beat a defender 12 guage. At that range stick with 00, or 000 buck, as a slug needs to be placed with more precision to be effective, a trait not many shooters posses in the heat of a true defense situation.

Hope that helped...

[Dick284]

Anything in a Remmy pump or auto in the carbine configuration.

[Kutenay]

I have three different custom Grizzly protection rifles plus a Browning Safari CRF .458WM and excellent loads for all of them, I can still even shoot them a little bit at my advanced age.

That said, my first really nice rifle was a Browning Safari LE .30-06 that I bought myself for my 21st birthday and took on my first fire lookout. With appropriate bullets, I consider this or something like it, that YOU are TOTALLY familiar with to be the best choice....Surehuntsalot makes a really sound point, IMHO.

[Dick284]

KUTE:
Why must you constantly list rifles which are no longer being produced, and too boot cost a small fortune to own?

Ever stop to wonder why they are no longer made?

Because they were to expensive to start with, and second they were not mainstram enough to fit into what people now consider either practical, or price wise.

Practical, and functional does not pay the bills, items must fit the perceived criteria for the masses, else wise you gotta change, or close the doors.

[Bobby B.]

Here's an interesting perspective from P.H. Capstick's 'Death in the Dark Continent'.

"No. 1 buck is .30 caliber, only ten percent less in diameter than 00 buck and but thirteen grains per pellet lighter. However, because of the way the pellet mass fits into the shotshell, the same shell can fire an incredible seventy-five percent MORE pellets than the Magnum 00 load!"

Needless to say, Capstick, who has finished off more wounded cats than any of us will deal with bears wounded or not, preferred the 0 load to the 00 load. He alos preferred to hold his fire to distances measured in feet rather than yards. Obviously, he must have been quite a cool headed hnuter even when the situation was quite far beyond where 'things get a little dicey'. Reminds me of when Fast Freddy stepped on the wounded bear's neck and instructed me to hit it again.

Bobby B.

[duffy4]

Originally Posted by Real Batman

If there's one thing I've learned from lurking in this great forum... it's that a couple of you guys have opinions!

I am looking for advice on a gun that would primarily be used for protection against bears. Most likely short range (less than 100 yards). Since it won't be used often (I hope), price would be a consideration.

Thanks in advance!

Hmmmmm! what would batman use? Probably the Bat-gun. Which would have a black synthetic stock and a black "parkerized" barrel. It would have a bat shaped rear peep sight and a bat head front bead.

A "Batchester" defender 12 gauge filled with slugs and the bat sence to not get into a situation to need it.

Robin in Rocky

P.S. The title of your post is "bear hunting rifle..." but you are not actuall asking about a "bear Hunting" rifle at all but a close range last resort bear defence gun. There is a really big difference. Between hunting bears and defending from an attack from one.

[550 CAT]

I like this..Rem 870 with Winchester Supreme copperplated buckshot..

[550 CAT]

I like ..Rem 870 with Winchester Supreme copperplated buckshot..

[Real Batman]

Originally Posted by duffy4

Robin in Rocky

P.S. The title of your post is "bear hunting rifle..." but you are not actuall asking about a "bear Hunting" rifle at all but a close range last resort bear defence gun. There is a really big difference. Between hunting bears and defending from an attack from one.

Good point Robin! I don't intend to HUNT bear. My bad.

Thank you for all the input so far. I think I am leaning towards the Remington 870. Good all round gun from what I've read, and switchable barrels available.
As far as bear protection, it will be used in close in support (less than 100 yards) so ammo load/type will be important.

Thanks for the advice. I am interested in what you guys (and gals) have to say!

[Rigg dogg]

I bought a Ruger 44 mag, semi auto rifle awhile back through a link I got off of this forum. I don't think they make them anymore but if you look around you should be able to find one.
Although I haven't killed any bears with it yet. I think it would do a pretty fair job in close with it's 240 Gr hollow point.
Not to mention it's a blast shooting

[NBFK]

remington 870 with synthetic stock, 7 shot tube, 18" barrel 360 bucks wholesale

[Dick284]

Originally Posted by Rigg dogg

I bought a Ruger 44 mag, semi auto rifle awhile back through a link I got off of this forum. I don't think they make them anymore but if you look around you should be able to find one.
Although I haven't killed any bears with it yet. I think it would do a pretty fair job in close with it's 240 Gr hollow point.
Not to mention it's a blast shooting

Actually a 240gr. hollow point is not the best choice as a bear defence bullet, they are designed to open reliably at 1000 to 1200fps, not the 1700ish fps they come out of rifles at.
All that being said, hard cast lead, and specialty bullet weights designed for rifle velocities do make the 44 Rem Mag a possable contender for bear defence, although it may get trumped by more than a hand full of calibers.

[drake]

Ill take a defender shotgun over a rifle any day.....

[drake]

Originally Posted by Real Batman

If there's one thing I've learned from lurking in this great forum... it's that a couple of you guys have opinions!

I am looking for advice on a gun that would primarily be used for protection against bears. Most likely short range (less than 100 yards). Since it won't be used often (I hope), price would be a consideration.

Thanks in advance!

If you want a gun for bear defence then your range will be more in the 5-20 yrd range. Keeping this in mind, i think buckshot and slugs would be preferable to a rifle bullet.

Ask some of the bear guides in AB what they pack when walking into baits and such.....

[ABDUKNUT]

Originally Posted by Bobby B.

Here's an interesting perspective from P.H. Capstick's 'Death in the Dark Continent'.

"No. 1 buck is .30 caliber, only ten percent less in diameter than 00 buck and but thirteen grains per pellet lighter. However, because of the way the pellet mass fits into the shotshell, the same shell can fire an incredible seventy-five percent MORE pellets than the Magnum 00 load!"

Needless to say, Capstick, who has finished off more wounded cats than any of us will deal with bears wounded or not, preferred the 0 load to the 00 load. He alos preferred to hold his fire to distances measured in feet rather than yards.

Bobby B.

A Leopard is a much different animal than a black or grizzly bear. Last I checked, we don't have leopards in Alberta or BC, so I would suggest forgetting all the folk lore you've read about buckshot and getting a decent rifle.

[Donny Bear]

Originally Posted by ABDUKNUT

A Leopard is a much different animal than a black or grizzly bear. Last I checked, we don't have leopards in Alberta or BC, so I would suggest forgetting all the folk lore you've read about buckshot and getting a decent rifle.

True a leopard is much different and a Lion even more so and as a fan of triple 0 I find this interesting I will say if it can knock down a lion it will take down a bear thats spec not experiance.

[ABDUKNUT]

At close range, buckshot doesn't offer any advantage over a slug- both have to be aimed with precision. LE actually chooses buckshot (#4) because of it's inherrent LACK of penetration- that is, you can shoot it at a person and not kill or maim another person, unseen downrange, possibly behind a wall or vehicle.

Alaska Department of Fish & Game has the job of dispatching many problem bears each and every year, both black and brown, and they use mostly Marlin 1895 .45-70 rifles. Yes, shotguns are great too, but ask anybody who has ever shot a bear with the .45, they flat knock a bear on his ass, and with proper bullets can penetrate the length of a bear's body taking out everything along the way.

Shotguns are cheap, portable and slugs are easy to find almost anywhere. I keep a short 12 gauge in my vehicle almost everytime I venture in the bush. But the rifle is better-

As far as hunting black bears, pretty much anything that works for deer is great. I used a 6mm Remington years ago and these days I use a .270- Never had a problem anchoring black bears with a well placed shot. To quote ADF&G again, they actually go as far as recommending the .270 and .30-06 for Grizzly in the AK hunting regulations.

[Bobby B.]

ABDONUT,

Your response to my post offering a different perspective is offensive and clearly narrow minded. Of course there are no leopards in either AB or BC. Leave it to a sarcastic _________ to point out the obvious. In addition, I doubt that Capstick's opinions are defined as folklore as he spent considerable time as a PH both in SA and Africa plus working for various agencies responsible for finishing off game others had wounded. What's your credentials?

Bobby B.

[drake]

Dont mind him BobbyB, he is just one of the resident "know it alls".

[ABDUKNUT]

Bobby and Drake; please fill out a 'Hurt Feelings Report' and file it with the moderators.

I don't read anything into my post other than sound logic based on personal experience and advice offered by a professional Game Agency. So what gives?

You quoted an African PH and his advice for wounded lions and leopards; interesting, but I really don't see the point you were trying to make.

I'll stand by my advice that a good rifle bullet will dispatch a bear much cleaner and quicker than any combination or number of slugs and buckshot. Of course, there are very good 12 G shotgun slugs that consist of a .45 cal or similar jacketed bullet in a sabot... But the problem is most guys buy the cheap deer slugs from WSS or Canadian Tire, which aren't nearly as effective.

Oh yeah, and I apologize for being critical- I will go hide under a rock and cry now...

[Bobby B.]

ABDONUT,

My feelings aren't hurt. I'm not surprised you don't see my point as there's no room in your thoughts for other than your own point a view. Maybe someone with more patience for your 'style' would be willing to explain the point of my post to you. If you lack the ability to comprehend the short message I posted, I doubt any further explainations by me would clear your mind sufficiently to grasp the content.

At this point, I am thoroughly convinced that Drake has accurately assessed your character and I'm in full agreement.

Bobby B.

[Real Batman]

Hey Boys... before we get too far off track, I would like to thank everyone for their opinions! As I said at the beginning, I know most of you folks HAVE opinions, and I'm grateful that you will share them!

I think, after reading all the above, I am leaning towards a Remington Model 870 Express 12 ga. It comes with a 26" barrel and a 20" rifled barrel for a reasonable price. (http://www.remington.com/products/fi...ess_combos.asp)

1. Any opinions on this?

2. If I used the rifled barrel, what ammo would you recommend?

Thanks again!

[ABDUKNUT]

Originally Posted by Real Batman

2. If I used the rifled barrel, what ammo would you recommend?

With the rifled barrel, there is really only one choice, and that is saboted slugs. This is an excellent choice for your intended purpose. Federal, Winchester, Hornady, and Remington all make good ones.

A smooth bored barrel is a little more versatile, but the barrel you are planning to buy comes with rifle sights, and will work for just about anything in a 'survival' situation. You can also keep the longer (ribbed) barrel on hand for hunting, just make sure you have the plug in your gun if you do.

Add a AA maglite and some black electrical tape, and you will be sleeping soundly in bear country in no time.

[Kutenay]

For those times when I carry my Merkel drilling, Browning o/u combo gun or Benelli Nova, (the UGLIEST MOFO gun I have EVER seen!), all of which are 12 bores, I always pack Brenneke slugs with me. I use the 2.75" ones and have tested these to where I am confident using them in Grizzly country; however, after seeing about 12 Grizzlies and quite a few Blacks shot, I prefer a .45-70 with 400 gr. tough bullets, a .375 H&H or 9.3 with 286 NPs....but, a good .30-06 will do the job.

I would avoid buckshot and soft Foster type slugs totally, as they do not penetrate enough and I have not tried the Winchester sabots with the 385 gr. Nosler partition inside, but, it should be excellent.

Still, use the gun, within reason, that YOU are most comfortable with and if that is an 870 with Brennekes or sabots, you will be OK, if you practice with it. The quickest bear kill I have ever seen was with an old .30-40 Win. 95 using C.I.L. KKSP 180 ammo, bang, drop, not even a twitch and it was a lung shot...the worst was a 7mmRem., using 150 CoreLokts and the shooter simply was a meathead......