Go Back   Alberta Outdoorsmen Forum > Main Category > Guns & Ammo Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-09-2017, 03:45 PM
Dean2's Avatar
Dean2 Dean2 is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Near Edmonton
Posts: 14,970
Default Updated Apr 20, 2018 - Zastava Classic English Stalking Rifle

I have always wanted a classic English Stalking rifle in 7x57, problem was I could never locate a LH 7x57. Sabattie makes one for about $900 but the importer quit bringing them in, Heym starts at $2600 and Montana Rifle company will do one for $1500 but not with the stock design I want. Cooper will but they want $5000 plus, but if I was going to pay that I would order a custom out of Die Kesselerin in Germany.

http://www.waffen-kessler.de/kessler...ft-handed.html







So just to get started it was going to be 1500 bucks to get a barrelled action in 7x57. I just got lucky and found a Zastava in 7x57 for $700.





Now all I have to do is make the stock. First step is I am going to reshape and trim down the existing stock, total additional cost, zero, bed the action, change the front swivel to a barrel band etc so just my time and work. Next step, If I want fancy wood, get the stock duplicated and make a Full Stock Mannlicher or leave as a conventional stalking rifle.

Wondered what you all thought of this project and despite making a version of my own I was wondering if anyone else is interested in the Kesselerin Customs on their website? I have an email intothem to check pricing.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:15 PM
catnthehat's Avatar
catnthehat catnthehat is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ft. McMurray
Posts: 38,529
Default

Mt Ruger single shot was built with an English Stalking rifle in mind.
Cat
__________________
Anytime I figure I've got this long range thing figured out, I just strap into the sling and irons and remind myself that I don't!
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:19 PM
gitrdun gitrdun is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: High River, AB
Posts: 10,788
Default

Truly a worthwhile project. And speaking of 7x57's , after the High River flood of 2013, a fellow brought in a firearm that he had purchased from the P.O. Ackley estate. It apparently was his favourite sheep hunting rifle. Unfortunately, it was completely immersed in water as it was stored in his basement gun safe. The stock was a custom Fajen, badly damaged and cracked. I had someone else take care of the bluing. The stock was so badly damaged that I had to glue cracks and tape some of it the mount it in my duplicator. I searched and waited to find a decent piece of raw walnut. Once I cut a new stock and my duplicator and received the finished metal, this is what it looked like. My client actually told me that it looked better than when he bought it and wrote a testimonial for it. Truly, this had to be the finest (smallest) pistol grip that I've ever worked on. Mr. Ackley had small hands apparently. It was a real honor to work and restore this firearm. A fellow AO member purchased it.



Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:54 PM
Nyksta Nyksta is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,543
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by catnthehat View Post
Mt Ruger single shot was built with an English Stalking rifle in mind.
Cat
x2 Ruger no. 1 are very classy and handy rifles! 7x57 (275 Rigby) is actually for sale at Prophet River right now for one of this year's chamberings. Iron sights and comes with rings for the integral ring mounts.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-09-2017, 05:00 PM
catnthehat's Avatar
catnthehat catnthehat is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ft. McMurray
Posts: 38,529
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyksta View Post
x2 Ruger no. 1 are very classy and handy rifles! 7x57 (275 Rigby) is actually for sale at Prophet River right now for one of this year's chamberings. Iron sights and comes with rings for the integral ring mounts.
Mine is not a typical Ruger however!!
Cat
__________________
Anytime I figure I've got this long range thing figured out, I just strap into the sling and irons and remind myself that I don't!
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-09-2017, 05:19 PM
Salavee Salavee is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Parkland County, AB
Posts: 4,249
Default

The Zastava project sounds interesting. Once you get the profile completed, a real nice blank could have it looking much like that awesome Kesslerin.
There are some real nice (Walnut & Exotic) blanks available right here in Edmonton... a warehouse full of real nice wood if you have the time to sort through it,
but if that's the Zastava in the pic, it's a pretty nice piece of wood in itself.

Enjoy your winter !
__________________
When applied by competent people with the right intent, common sense goes a long way.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-09-2017, 06:03 PM
Bushrat's Avatar
Bushrat Bushrat is offline
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 6,898
Default

Salavee, where is this place with the gunstock blanks?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-11-2017, 01:28 PM
Dean2's Avatar
Dean2 Dean2 is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Near Edmonton
Posts: 14,970
Default

I will keep this thread alive and post pictures from time to time with progress on the project. First step is to bed the action and shoot the gun to make sure it shoots well. Would hate to completely reshape the stock and find out the gun needs to be re-barrelled or something, though the Zastavas I have tried to date have all shot under 1 MOA.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-11-2017, 02:01 PM
catnthehat's Avatar
catnthehat catnthehat is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ft. McMurray
Posts: 38,529
Default

That Zastava is a really nice rifle Dean!
Are you going to change to a Mannlicher or keep it half stocked?
Cat
__________________
Anytime I figure I've got this long range thing figured out, I just strap into the sling and irons and remind myself that I don't!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-11-2017, 02:10 PM
maudite maudite is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 51
Default

Here s mine BSA Lee speed

Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-11-2017, 04:25 PM
gitrdun gitrdun is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: High River, AB
Posts: 10,788
Default

I eagerly await to seeing the final product. I don't know whether there is a Black Forest retail outlet in Edmonton, but in Calgary that is where is shop for blanks.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-11-2017, 09:17 PM
Dean2's Avatar
Dean2 Dean2 is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Near Edmonton
Posts: 14,970
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by catnthehat View Post
That Zastava is a really nice rifle Dean!
Are you going to change to a Mannlicher or keep it half stocked?
Cat
If it shoots well as is, I will eave it as a half stock. If I have to re-barrel I will do it in 20-21" and then do a full length German Style stock. For this one I am really hoping to stay with a traditional English half stock stalking rifle and do the next one based on a LH Tikka/Sako in 6.5x55 or a Zastava 9.3x62 as a Full Stock.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-11-2017, 09:54 PM
CMichaud's Avatar
CMichaud CMichaud is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New Beijing, Canada
Posts: 1,470
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by maudite View Post
Here s mine BSA Lee speed
and here is mine (although technically not a Lee-Speed I suppose)...

Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-12-2017, 07:07 AM
Pathfinder76 Pathfinder76 is online now
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 15,768
Default

New safety (necessitates a new stock), new bolt handle (necessitates a new stock), new bottom metal (necessitates a new stock). I think you get the picture.
__________________
“I love it when clients bring Berger bullets. It means I get to kill the bear.”

-Billy Molls
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-12-2017, 10:08 AM
CMichaud's Avatar
CMichaud CMichaud is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: New Beijing, Canada
Posts: 1,470
Default

Re-reading all this makes me think that the original intent is more of a German style stalking rifle?

My design considerations for an traditional English stalker would be

- pistol grip butt with no cheek weld
- horn tipped half stock
- express sights
- overall light and stream lined

Found this article. Has some info

https://huntforever.org/2015/08/31/the-stalking-rifle/

Sounds like a Ruger M77 would actually be a great start state for an English style stalker. Even have a tang safety. Add express sites and a horn cap and you are off to the races. Pretty sure they came in 7x57 (but I am no Ruger guy).


Last edited by CMichaud; 12-12-2017 at 10:28 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-12-2017, 01:51 PM
Nyksta Nyksta is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,543
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CMichaud View Post
Re-reading all this makes me think that the original intent is more of a German style stalking rifle?

My design considerations for an traditional English stalker would be

- pistol grip butt with no cheek weld
- horn tipped half stock
- express sights
- overall light and stream lined

Found this article. Has some info

https://huntforever.org/2015/08/31/the-stalking-rifle/

Sounds like a Ruger M77 would actually be a great start state for an English style stalker. Even have a tang safety. Add express sites and a horn cap and you are off to the races. Pretty sure they came in 7x57 (but I am no Ruger guy).

Whats the process for adding express sights? Ive heard a huge variance from different people in what is involved
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-12-2017, 02:09 PM
Flieguy's Avatar
Flieguy Flieguy is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Kananaskis
Posts: 2,612
Default

Zastavas are really underrated rifles and that looks like an awesome project!

I've been thinking about doing a similar thing with a husqvarna 9.3x57
__________________
the bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of a low price is forgotten

instagram: @schrodo_of_the_shire
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-12-2017, 02:14 PM
catnthehat's Avatar
catnthehat catnthehat is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ft. McMurray
Posts: 38,529
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyksta View Post
Whats the process for adding express sights? Ive heard a huge variance from different people in what is involved
Banded front sight and three leaf express rear sight from NECG
D&T and you are set!
Cat
__________________
Anytime I figure I've got this long range thing figured out, I just strap into the sling and irons and remind myself that I don't!
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-13-2017, 09:07 AM
sinawalli sinawalli is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Stony Plain, Alberta
Posts: 1,170
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CMichaud View Post
Re-reading all this makes me think that the original intent is more of a German style stalking rifle?

My design considerations for an traditional English stalker would be

- pistol grip butt with no cheek weld
- horn tipped half stock
- express sights
- overall light and stream lined

Found this article. Has some info

https://huntforever.org/2015/08/31/the-stalking-rifle/

Sounds like a Ruger M77 would actually be a great start state for an English style stalker. Even have a tang safety. Add express sites and a horn cap and you are off to the races. Pretty sure they came in 7x57 (but I am no Ruger guy).

Yes, Ruger does have a M77 in 7X57. I have one.
__________________
"Send lawyers, guns and money, the *hit has hit the fan" W.Z.

"She took all my money, she wrecked my new car, now she's with one of my good time buddies, and they're drinkin' in some cross town bar"!
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-13-2017, 10:43 AM
Dean2's Avatar
Dean2 Dean2 is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Near Edmonton
Posts: 14,970
Default

CMichaud

I agree with your broad description of an English Stalking rifle. To me the Half Stock German ones are very close to the same. Most guys would have trouble telling the two apart at more than 5 feet, though the German ones much more often came with quick removable scopes.

Where the German influence shows up is in the Hogs back stocks, which I don't care for, and in the Stutzen type rifles (short), one style of which are the full stocked rifles. Both the Hump back and Stutzens clearly say GERMAN hunting rifle to me and the full stocked rifles just scream it.

The Zastava came with very good open sights and a great bluing job so while not express sights I will likely leave them alone

I too have seen the Ruger 77 in 7x57 but never in LH. If anyone knows where there is one for sale, please let me know, it would make a great base for my next project.

I stated work on the gun yesterday. Stock weighs 2 Lbs 6 oz and the action and bottom metal weigh 4 Lbs 12 ounces, so just a hair over 7 Lbs as she sits.

Did a little hand fitting of the barrel and action to the stock and got a much better metal to wood fit. Also relieved the action area and bedded it with Devcon. Will bed the rear tang in a couple of days once the Devcon has had time to completely set and I can remove the barrelled action. There was a lot more empty space in and around the action than I expected. I should have mixed more bedding material as I had almost no bleed out once the action was seated. Will post pictures of the bedding job once I separate it.

So for any of you the were interested in those beautiful Kesselerin Mausers I posted at the beginning of the thread I got a note back from them this morning. How does 19,000 Euro sound for the base LH model, only 18,000 for the RH. Only one year wait though. As much as I love how their guns look I think I will just keep producing my own versions.

Last edited by Dean2; 12-13-2017 at 11:01 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 12-13-2017, 01:44 PM
maudite maudite is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 51
Default

Here s a pic of a german style post war full stock rifle I own.The pic is deceiving making the barrel look long when actually it is only 20 inches .The only thing I don t like about it is the recoil pad which one day will be replaced.

Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 12-16-2017, 02:03 PM
357Maximum 357Maximum is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Edmonton Area/Candle Lake SK
Posts: 208
Default

http://www.rjrenner.com/pre-war-77.html

Check out the #1's as well

357
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 12-19-2017, 11:45 PM
Dean2's Avatar
Dean2 Dean2 is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Near Edmonton
Posts: 14,970
Default

Progress to date. Bedded front recoil lug and barrel,
along with before and after initial shaping progress. Quite a bit more shaping to go yet.







Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 02-24-2018, 02:09 AM
Dean2's Avatar
Dean2 Dean2 is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Near Edmonton
Posts: 14,970
Default Jan 24 Update

This is what she looks like after heavily reshaping the factory stock and refinishing it. Has been glass bedded, floated. LOP shortened to 13.25" and the trigger set to a nice crisp 3 Lbs. Now to put a scope on it and try it out.

Personally I think this makes the rifle look a lot more elegant and it now weighs in at about 6 LBs 6 ounces.

Before



AFTER










Last edited by Dean2; 02-24-2018 at 02:15 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 02-24-2018, 08:49 AM
Smokinyotes Smokinyotes is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: onoway, Ab
Posts: 6,956
Default

Looks very good Dean. Hope it works great.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 02-24-2018, 09:50 AM
vcmm's Avatar
vcmm vcmm is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Vulcan Ab
Posts: 3,871
Default

Nice work Dean. Looks like a different rifle.
__________________
"It's like bragging that it's 10 CENTIMETERS LONG! (when really, it's 4" dude, settle down)"
Huntinstuff


"Me neither but it's all in the eye of the beer holder"
norwestalta

.....out of bounds.....but funny none the less!

LC

"Funny how when a bear eats another bear, no one bats an eye, but......

when a human eats another human, people act like it's the end if the friggin world. News coverage, tweets, blogs, outrage, Piers Morgan etcetc.

Go figure." -Huntinstuff
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 04-20-2018, 09:09 AM
Dean2's Avatar
Dean2 Dean2 is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Near Edmonton
Posts: 14,970
Default

Well finally got a chance to take the new rig out to the range. I am extremely happy to say that it shoots just great. I loaded Rem Peters 270 Brass necked down to 7x57. Loaded with CCI 250 mag primer, Hornady 139 grain SP flat base bullets, COAL 3.050 and from 45.5 to 50 grains of IMR 4350.

EVERY single load shot under 1". The 47-50 grain loads shot 3 hole clover leafs, with the point of impact rising as the load increased. The 50 grain load hits almost exactly 3.5 inches higher than 46 grains and a bit further left. No pressure signs of any kind but 50 grains is slightly compressed and I doubt you could get much more than another grain in the case. AS I have said before I don't like loads much over 100% for hunting loads.

I am going to Chrono the 49 and 50 grain loads when there is far less snow in front of the benches. I am guessing by what the load book says and performance the 50 grain load is running about 2950 fps. As long as it is at least 2900 fps I will stick with that for the load.

Hope this helps some others who are playing with Zastavas. I have yet to shoot one that was not exceptionally accurate, at least after the bedding was cleaned up, though many shot well even factory bedded.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.