280AI or 270WSM

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by Mike_W

Maybe you want to explain your version of ballistics then?

ballistics is everything that happens after your bullet leaves the barrel. drop is but one of the many things

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Mike_W

And I said the ballistic performance goes to the 270 WSM over the 280 AI

Yes, but it doesn't.

The point bergerboy is making, is that ballistics aren't just about drop, they account for windage. Because a 280ai can conceivably shoot a 195gr bullet it will ballistically out perform a 270wsm, like bergerboy said, drop is predictable but the 280 will be able to buck the wind better.

[Mike_W]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Yes, but it doesn't.

The point bergerboy is making, is that ballistics aren't just about drop, they account for windage. Because a 280ai can conceivably shoot a 195gr bullet it will ballistically out perform a 270wsm, like bergerboy said, drop is predictable but the 280 will be able to buck the wind better.

Ok fair enough. I will change my statement to the 270 WSM will be flatter shooting. Leave it to AO to take what people are saying and turn it around based on a definition.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Mike_W

Ok fair enough. I will change my statement to the 270 WSM will be flatter shooting. Leave it to AO to take what people are saying and turn it around based on a definition.

If you would have said it's flatter shooting with the same grain bullet I would have agreed with you 100%, but ballistics is about drop, windage, sectional density, kinetic energy, velocity, and a bullets ballistic coefficient tells you how it'll handle these conditions. I was only pointing out that 7mm bullets will give the op a ballistic advantage, because it's been the deciding factor for me in the past.

[warriorboy10]

280 all the way!! You won't regret it.

[rembo]

Originally Posted by warriorboy10

280 all the way!! You won't regret it.

7mm Rem Mag,...the 280 with a supercharger....

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by rembo

7mm Rem Mag,...the 280 with a supercharger....

280 ai is a 7mm rem mag without a belt

[RAMPAGE]

280 AI because the 2-3 grain powder gain over the factory 280 remington and the 40 degree shoulder make it an automatic out to 1000 yards and faster than a 7mm remington.

[RAMPAGE]

honestly the ballistics on either of these are a wash either way in any practical hunting sense, I'd much rather focus on which will function and feed smoothly and reliably vs a 20fps speed advantage and .01% less wind drift but thats another topic entirely.

[rembo]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

280 ai is a 7mm rem mag without a belt

Funny,...I can never get my 280AI to within 100 fps of my 7 Rem Mag without blowing a primer. Guess I'm not holding my tonque right.......

[RAMPAGE]

Ackley magic buddy, thats how

[Gade81]

mine would be 270wsm. Mainly because i don't reload and 270 wsm ammo is readily available in any store.

[raised by wolves]

I have used both, settled on the 270WSM. Nothing wrong with the 280Rem or the 280AI but I prefer the 270WSM. In my mind, it gives me velocity, accuracy, long range, low recoil, and a short action, lightweight rifle.

I have already used a 6mm Rem with 100grain Powershocks to take any of the big game in the province so I know my 270WSM gives me enough gun wherever I go and for whatever I am hunting.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Mike_W

Apples to apples the advantage is the .277"
Comparing a 170 grain bullet to a 195 grain bullet isn't a direct comparison.

A 140 grain bullet in each will yield the same speed with the BC advantage going to the .277"

With identical bullets of the same weight, I thought the BC advantage went to the smaller caliber .. due to it's higher SD. No ?

[Nyksta]

I also would vote 7mm over 270. 270 doesnt have the bullet selection to support it. 160 to 180 grains is nice, would be a dandy in that 280 AI

[700-223]

Sounds like you're talking about choosing between two new rifles. Both aren't super common, but not rare as hens teeth either. Really comes down to secondary factors, possibility of slightly shorter overall length with 270WSM and one more round capacity in the 280AI in most cases. Or, if you already reload the possibility of sharing components with something else you already have.

In terms of ballistics, killing power, etc so close as to be indistinguishable. I looked at a couple of ballistics calculators today and winchesters factory ammo was very close. .007 difference in diameter, about that much difference in everything that matters between the two.

My bro-in-law has a 280ai and really likes it. As far as ammo availability, both seem fairly similar to me. Have seen them both in store and online, but not in every gas station either. If the rifles AREN'T identical, shoulder both and go with the one that feels more natural. I would be shocked if you were disappointed with either.

[700-223]

Realized I never actually voted. If I had to pick, I'd go with the 270 WSM. Simply for the reason that I haven't tried one of the modern short mags yet and I am curious to see if they're all they're cracked up to be.

Craig Boddington raves about it in some of his articles as well, though he is undoubtably a bigger fan of those obsolete 30 cal magnums

[Slicktricker]

I'm going through same thing have decided on a browning shoot 270 wsm

[243 wild cat]

280 Ackley magic slam dunk!! on choosing between the two rifles. lol

[Throttle_monkey1]

Originally Posted by RAMPAGE

280 AI because the 2-3 grain powder gain over the factory 280 remington and the 40 degree shoulder make it an automatic out to 1000 yards and faster than a 7mm remington.

You sure about that? I'm getting 3250fps out of my 7mm Rem mag with a 150gr ABLR. You can obtain higher velocity with a 280AI?

[rembo]

Originally Posted by Throttle_monkey1

You sure about that? I'm getting 3250fps out of my 7mm Rem mag with a 150gr ABLR. You can obtain higher velocity with a 280AI?

why , haven't you heard,...old PO bestowed upon the 280 Ackley the uncanny ability to propel the same bullet faster than the 7 Rem Mag by decreasing the powder capacity,...magic I tell you,...pure magic...:-)

I have a 280AI, have the reamer and have chambered probably 6 or 8 of them.....I like it, nothing wrong with it but it's not magic and it's not a 7 Mag without a belt.....but close you say....but then the 280 is "close" to the 280AI, and the 7-08 is "close" to the 280.....and the 7 Rem Mag is "close" to the 7 Wby and the 7 Wby is "close" to the 7 STW....

[7mmremmag]

I have owned a 280rem in the past and currently own a 7mm rem mag and 270wsm. I dont think real world performance between a 280AI and a 270wsm is even a topic worth arguing.
Do I believe a 280AI will perform like a 7mm rem mag. Hell no. Show me the 280AI that launches 168 LRAB's at 3120fps.
I am new to the Ackley world, I just purchased a 243AI.
I would honestly pick the rifle which fits you better, lighter, etc. Magazine capacity, Ballistic Coefficient, etc is most likely a very minor detail.
I shoot a Browning X-Bolt Stainless Walnut LH in 270wsm. I am in love with this rifle, shoots 130 TTSX's into 0.75" groups at 3340fps. Nice and hot. Have 3 reloads on this remington brass. No issues so far.
Nice short 23" Barrel & detachable mag. Pretty hard to beat if you ask me.
Ive got a 4000$ custom 7mm rem mag that seems to get left home lots now that the 270wsm came home.

[Outcast]

Just to clarify. Same rifle model. Both Kimbers. I have a Fierce 7mm mag that weighs 9 lbs all in. It serves a different purpose.

Just wondering which you would pick and why.

[sns2]

Hate to see my buddies arguing over which tastes better: Coke or Pepsi. I've had both. They're both quite nice cartridges really.

Get the AI, as it will sell much easier when you are bored of it. For some reason it seems 270 whizbangs don't sell that quickly.

[sikwhiskey]

Pick the one that the bullet measures exactly 7mm diameter.

I'd pick whichever weighs the least and has a short-er barrel.

[colroggal]

I'd take the short mag. Wide fat cartridges are good for short actions and short barrels, meaning a lighter rig. Don't worry about feeding issues because you have one in the pipe and at Mountain ranges there is no follow-up shot.

Colin

[Mike_W]

Originally Posted by Salavee

With identical bullets of the same weight, I thought the BC advantage went to the smaller caliber .. due to it's higher SD. No ?

Yes that is correct.

[700-223]

Originally Posted by Outcast

Just to clarify. Same rifle model. Both Kimbers. I have a Fierce 7mm mag that weighs 9 lbs all in. It serves a different purpose.

Just wondering which you would pick and why.

I have a fierce 7mm myself which weighs a similar amount due to the optics it's wearing, so have thought lots about adding a lighter rifle as an alternate or for hunting in the mountains. I've mostly planned on adding another 7mm cartridge like the 280AI for reloading purposes (which I don't currently do , possibility of sharing ammo w/ my BIL who has one, etc.

With all that said, I'd still get the 270 WSM. There's just something about it. In an 8lb rifle, it'll kick about the same as your 7mm and shoot as flat. Finally, Kimber does offer different action lengths, which in a lightweight rifle is another slight advantage for the WSM. Supposedly, the WSM are designed to be more efficient than traditional magnums out of a short barrel, which is exactly this scenario.

270 WSM it is!

[leeelmer]

If they are both Kimbers, I would go with the 280AI as that is built on the 84L action. The 270wsm is built on the 8400 action.
I have had both and the 84L is lighter and slimmer.
My opinion. They both feed well and work well I just prefer the 84L over the 8400.
Kimber makes a excellent rifle and they fit me better than most.
You can't make a bad decision here.
280AI will match some factory 7mag ballistics, but will never match handloads.
Trust me I have loaded for a lot of 280ai rifles. Just look in any reloading manual.
But none the less, I think it is the best of the non magnum 7mm .

[Ivo]

I'd go for the lighter one, your mountain hunting after all.