How we have changed

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by bobtodrick

Cambridge Dictionary defines 'scenario' as the possible outcomes of an imagined event.
No one here is claiming any of these are true.

So if they aren't true, what's the point of this thread?

[fargineyesore]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

On a related note, I like what South Caroline basketball coach Frank Martin said...

"You know what makes me sick to my stomach? When I hear grown people say that kids have changed. Kids haven’t changed. Kids don’t know anything about anything.

We’ve changed as adults. We demand less of kids. We expect less of kids. We make their lives easier instead of preparing them for what life is truly about. We’re the ones that have changed. To blame kids is a cop out."

My wife (a retired teacher)'s view is similar. She thinks 98% of todays kids are great. There are a few ruined by bad parents, and a lot of older people thinking the youth of today have gone to heck, just like their parents thought the youth of yesterday had gone to heck.

Too bad she wasn't still teaching, I always thought that a person would be a better teacher if they actually liked kids.

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by MAC

So Tolerance and acceptance are bad. We must remain constantly enraged in order to meet your views. I agree with sjemac. Our youth would surprise you.
There is no tolerance by the youth regarding an invading army marching into a country.

MAC

Originally Posted by fitzy

I saw this before I had to join a conference call and came back to find it answered perfectly. Thanks sjemac

Our youth of today is very patriotic. I don't think you're giving them the credit they deserve.

Ok, I am probably wrong on the patriotic part. They may be very patriotic.

But what is a more realistic threat today, an overt invading army, or subversive toxic social policies that undermine the well grounded moral and mental strength needed to fight any kind of battle.

My point is that it is unlikely that we will see another D-Day. But today's first world youth are simply not prepared for adversity like they were 70 years ago should there be another D-Day. I didn't invent the term snowflake as a description of a person, but it's there, and it's used, often appropriately.

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by Newview01

Ok, I am probably wrong on the patriotic part. They may be very patriotic.

But what is a more realistic threat today, an overt invading army, or subversive toxic social policies that undermine the well grounded moral and mental strength needed to fight any kind of battle.

My point is that it is unlikely that we will see another D-Day. But today's first world youth are simply not prepared for adversity like they were 70 years ago should there be another D-Day. I didn't invent the term snowflake as a description of a person, but it's there, and it's used, often appropriately.

Go back read post 29 and 30. Kids are kids some rise to a challenge some don't. What's really changed its your generation is becoming the old guy yelling get off my lawn and cut your hair instead of needing the hair cut.

Social media has shrunk the world down to staggering closeness, kids see it as normal and interact globally openly and with understanding. Older people see the negatives and gloss over the positives.

I think you'll see acceptance and understanding becoming the norm. Social media has the power to keep changing the world for the better.

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by fitzy

Go back read post 29 and 30. Kids are kids some rise to a challenge some don't. What's really changed its your generation is becoming the old guy yelling get off my lawn and cut your hair instead of needing the hair cut.

Social media has shrunk the world down to staggering closeness, kids see it as normal and interact globally openly and with understanding. Older people see the negatives and gloss over the positives.

I think you'll see acceptance and understanding becoming the norm. Social media has the power to keep changing the world for the better.

You are over estimating my age. I am not even 30 yet.

As far as change for the better - depends on your idea of 'better'.

[MAC]

Originally Posted by Newview01

You are over estimating my age. I am not even 30 yet.

As far as change for the better - depends on your idea of 'better'.

What has changed in the last 10 years that makes you any better.
Maybe a few more years under your belt and you will undeerstand.

MAC

[silverdoctor]

So a question for the 40+ crowd...

Scale of 1 to 10, where do you think your "importance" sat with your parents?

We were the "get out and play" generations. We were the "I'll smack your arse" generation. We were the herd, parents got us sick with all the childhood ailments - our parents made us prepare to get into the world - and most of us got forced out of the nest when high school was over.

We were not the most important thing in our parents' life.


Kids today, unfortunately they are growing up being told they are the most important thing, the most important commodity society has.

Parents are the ones that need to grow up - the kids haven't changed, they've just been elevated in status.

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by MAC

What has changed in the last 10 years that makes you any better.
Maybe a few more years under your belt and you will undeerstand.

MAC

Where did I say I was better?

This is why the changing times are not improving the younger generations.

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-...ad-party-theme

Following a controversial “cowboys and Indians”-themed graduation party in Lethbridge, indigenous student Tieja Medicine Crane is speaking out against the “racist” celebration.

How is this news worthy? How is it racist? So many levels of pathetic. Many of todays youth feel the need to turn non-issues into social justice causes. That is something to be concerned about.

Another problem is gender identity. Teens are pushed to be who they feel like, instead of asking for help with mental illness.

I could go on.

[MAC]

Originally Posted by Newview01

Where did I say I was better? So you hold the same views as the group you are judging

This is why the changing times are not improving the younger generations.
Not improving, by whos standard. Yours

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-...ad-party-theme



How is this news worthy? How is it racist? So many levels of pathetic. Many of todays youth feel the need to turn non-issues into social justice causes. That is something to be concerned about.

Another problem is gender identity. Teens are pushed to be who they feel like, instead of asking for help with mental illness.
Mental illness by what definition. Or do you mean your OPINION they are different

I could go on.
Please do

I must apologize as I am making assumptions here but at less than 30years old I lump you right in there with who you criticize. You say in the last 10 years the world has changed enough to leave you well adjusted but has now since failed our youth. Or rather the youth themselves are responsible for their downfall. Sorry but nothing new here every generation has lamented the youth for not being up to snuff and in the 50 years I can remember every subsequent generation managed not to screw up as bad as they were told they would. If you are OK by your standards, surely there must be more

MAC

[Redfrog]

Everything isn't just black or white.

Not everything was perfect in the 40's and 50's, but if I had a choice, I'd rather be a child then. In the early 60's the world began to make major both societal and technological changes, some good , some not so much. the changes are still coming, but at a much more rapid pace. Tech changes I think are mostly for the good, societal changes not so much.

Like said, I'd rather be a child then.

[MAC]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

Everything isn't just black or white.

Not everything was perfect in the 40's and 50's, but if I had a choice, I'd rather be a child then. In the early 60's the world began to make major both societal and technological changes, some good , some not so much. the changes are still coming, but at a much more rapid pace. Tech changes I think are mostly for the good, societal changes not so much.

Like said, I'd rather be a child then.

Completely agree with you,things do change for good or bad. Im sure both happen.

Also agree I would prefer to be young a while back instead of now.
I guess that is just a comfort level and not a judgement for todays youth.

MAC

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

So a question for the 40+ crowd...

Scale of 1 to 10, where do you think your "importance" sat with your parents?

We were the "get out and play" generations. We were the "I'll smack your arse" generation. We were the herd, parents got us sick with all the childhood ailments - our parents made us prepare to get into the world - and most of us got forced out of the nest when high school was over.

We were not the most important thing in our parents' life.


Kids today, unfortunately they are growing up being told they are the most important thing, the most important commodity society has.

Parents are the ones that need to grow up - the kids haven't changed, they've just been elevated in status.

yes we were the get out and play generation, because our parents were the you gotta stay home and work generation. My father along with many other rural kids stayed home from school a lot to help on the farm. At 14 he was working away from home all summer long. He wanted better than that for his kids.

I think for the vast majority of our generation we were the most important thing in our parents life, in my case they spent all their time working to provide for us so we had to be self sufficient.

If you weren't the most important thing in your parents life I feel bad for you... that does start to explain why you'd rather have a dog than kids.

In a lot of cases I see parents need more discipline for their kids, a lot of the kids I grew up are giving their kids all the things they couldn't have growing up, just like our parents did.

I don't know the answer I'm just doing the best I can do be the best Dad I can, I make my kids save up their money to buy the things they want. It's hard when their friends get it handed to them but they have to learn the value of hard work and a dollar some way. I do it because they are the most important thing in my life, they're my whole world and I'm doing my best by them.

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

Everything isn't just black or white.

Not everything was perfect in the 40's and 50's, but if I had a choice, I'd rather be a child then. In the early 60's the world began to make major both societal and technological changes, some good , some not so much. the changes are still coming, but at a much more rapid pace. Tech changes I think are mostly for the good, societal changes not so much.

Like said, I'd rather be a child then.

unless of course you were a jewish child in Germany in around 1943, or had to watch your father beat to death during the race wars ...

Society has made a lot of good changes.

[Redfrog]

Originally Posted by fitzy

unless of course you were a jewish child in Germany in around 1943, or had to watch your father beat to death during the race wars ...

Society has made a lot of good changes.

Or watch ISIS behead or burn someone alive or be forced to be a child soldier in Africa, or kidnapped and raped by the Boko Haram.

There wasn't a lot of that stuff you mention going on in my neighbourhood.

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

Or watch ISIS behead or burn someone alive or be forced to be a child soldier in Africa, or kidnapped and raped by the Boko Haram.

There wasn't a lot of that stuff you mention going on in my neighbourhood.

OK. Residential schools then. Catholic priests raping altar boys.
The things you mentioned aren't happening in your neighborhood either Red.

[Redfrog]

You brought up the horrific things and presented them like it was a daily occurrence. When was the last Jew burned in Canada or anyone beat to death in a race war. or even been a race war for that matter in Canada.

Of course my examples didn't happen here. I posted them to show you how ridiculous your statements were.

Now you'd have us believe that the residential schools were set up as some sort of sex camps for catholic priests to molest kids. Were there abuses??? Of course there were, but not everyone who went there was abused and not every priest is an abuser.

My childhood was as ....challenging ...as anyone's in my neighbour hood and moreso than 99 % of the kids there. As I said. look for black and white if you must, but the world is not black and white. As tough as my childhood was I would still choose it over what kids have for a childhood today.

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by fitzy

yes we were the get out and play generation, because our parents were the you gotta stay home and work generation. My father along with many other rural kids stayed home from school a lot to help on the farm. At 14 he was working away from home all summer long. He wanted better than that for his kids.

I think for the vast majority of our generation we were the most important thing in our parents life, in my case they spent all their time working to provide for us so we had to be self sufficient.

If you weren't the most important thing in your parents life I feel bad for you... that does start to explain why you'd rather have a dog than kids.

In a lot of cases I see parents need more discipline for their kids, a lot of the kids I grew up are giving their kids all the things they couldn't have growing up, just like our parents did.

I don't know the answer I'm just doing the best I can do be the best Dad I can, I make my kids save up their money to buy the things they want. It's hard when their friends get it handed to them but they have to learn the value of hard work and a dollar some way. I do it because they are the most important thing in my life, they're my whole world and I'm doing my best by them.

They are your world, you live for your kids. Do you think that's right? What about your life? That comes after they move out right?

I never had kids - but not for the reasons you suspect. I've been doing my own thing for longer than I can remember. I never have been married - nor will I - and I will never be in a situation where divorce destroys me or kids. Been dragged through too many divorces by other people, seen intimately what it does to people. Happy just the way I am thanks. Everyone calls me nuts until their wife files divorce papers.

Nothing to feel sorry about either fitzy, had a long heart to heart with my parents. We were all the same growing up.


As for society's take on kids... We are screwed.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

We were not the most important thing in our parents' life.
.

I'm from the 40+ crowd, and I do think we were the most important thing in our parents life. They just had different theories and practices of child rearing than today. Mom stayed at home to care for us, and Dad often worked two jobs to pay for a house and put food on the table. They didn't buy toys or trips for themselves, they took care of the family. They let me run the streets at an early age not because they didn't care about me, but because the media hadn't yet scared the wits out of them with tales of child molesters around every corner.

[Redfrog]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

I'm from the 40+ crowd, and I do think we were the most important thing in our parents life. They just had different theories and practices of child rearing than today. Mom stayed at home to care for us, and Dad often worked two jobs to pay for a house and put food on the table. They didn't buy toys or trips for themselves, they took care of the family. They let me run the streets at an early age not because they didn't care about me, but because the media hadn't yet scared the wits out of them with tales of child molesters around every corner.

Interesting concept. too bad it didn't catch on. Look how you turned out

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

I'm from the 40+ crowd, and I do think we were the most important thing in our parents life. They just had different theories and practices of child rearing than today. Mom stayed at home to care for us, and Dad often worked two jobs to pay for a house and put food on the table. They didn't buy toys or trips for themselves, they took care of the family. They let me run the streets at an early age not because they didn't care about me, but because the media hadn't yet scared the wits out of them with tales of child molesters around every corner.

Ask your parents for an honest answer.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

Ask your parents for an honest answer.

I can't. They moved and I don't know where to....

[Newview01]

Originally Posted by MAC

I must apologize as I am making assumptions here but at less than 30years old I lump you right in there with who you criticize. You say in the last 10 years the world has changed enough to leave you well adjusted but has now since failed our youth. Or rather the youth themselves are responsible for their downfall. Sorry but nothing new here every generation has lamented the youth for not being up to snuff and in the 50 years I can remember every subsequent generation managed not to screw up as bad as they were told they would. If you are OK by your standards, surely there must be more

MAC

I have had to hire several people from the generation that is younger than me, and out of 5 or 6, one is worth keeping. Maybe the same goes for others my age, not sure.

I know what you mean about every generation complaining about the younger, but maybe it is true, every generation just declines that much more

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by Redfrog

You brought up the horrific things and presented them like it was a daily occurrence. When was the last Jew burned in Canada or anyone beat to death in a race war. or even been a race war for that matter in Canada.

Of course my examples didn't happen here. I posted them to show you how ridiculous your statements were.

Now you'd have us believe that the residential schools were set up as some sort of sex camps for catholic priests to molest kids. Were there abuses??? Of course there were, but not everyone who went there was abused and not every priest is an abuser.

My childhood was as ....challenging ...as anyone's in my neighbour hood and moreso than 99 % of the kids there. As I said. look for black and white if you must, but the world is not black and white. As tough as my childhood was I would still choose it over what kids have for a childhood today.

My statement was to show that just because it's the old days doesn't mean its better. I never said there was ever a Jew burner in Canada. You said you'd rather grow up in the 40s or 50s I said unless you're a Jewish kid in Germany in 1943. There wasn't a lot of fun times and simple life for those kids. I'd go out on a limb and say kids today have it way better.

You said none of those problems happened here. I said residential schools or catholic priests raping boys. Both of which happened here. I'd hate to imagine growing up in a Catholic orphanage in the 40s.

Just offering a different opinion Red. I think there's a lot of good to be found growing up in any time frame. It's whether it's utilized or not. I loved growing up when I did. I wouldn't change it at all.

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

They are your world, you live for your kids. Do you think that's right? What about your life? That comes after they move out right?

I never had kids - but not for the reasons you suspect. I've been doing my own thing for longer than I can remember. I never have been married - nor will I - and I will never be in a situation where divorce destroys me or kids. Been dragged through too many divorces by other people, seen intimately what it does to people. Happy just the way I am thanks. Everyone calls me nuts until their wife files divorce papers.

Nothing to feel sorry about either fitzy, had a long heart to heart with my parents. We were all the same growing up.


As for society's take on kids... We are screwed.

Yeah I do think that's right. I have a life. A great one. My kids aren't an anchor. I go on fishing trips my wife and I take holidays with and without the kids.

Yeah life changes a lot when you have kids but in all honesty that's when it really becomes something to live for.

[MAC]

[QUOTE=Newview01;3550763]I have had to hire several people from the generation that is younger than me, and out of 5 or 6, one is worth keeping. Maybe the same goes for others my age, not sure. If they are in the 18 to 22 year old range some are not ripe yet. Most come around. I found this with about 20 years worth of hiring for construction. The young ones started in specific areas of work for evaluation. I did not throw anyone into an apprenticeship, without a little work evaluation. Some took longer than others.
But most come around. Like Notley she used to picket oil, now that she knows where her income comes from, shes a little more pro oil

I know what you mean about every generation complaining about the younger, but maybe it is true, every generation just declines that much more
What you call the decline is just change. Its been going on for longer than most people alive can remember, good or bad its everyones right to have an opinion. Many things that are new annoy me. Fidget spinners WHAT THE HECK



I was just thinking that what you appear to be complaining about has already come about by a demographic much different than the youth. How many in the 18 to 20 range went out to vote. We now have Trudeau in office. Who put him there. Not the youth. Many of the values you attribute to the youth are already entrenched in many that are your seniors.

Hope you are having a good day.
MAC

[nekred]

There are some meat headed kids out there, some brats but there are also some wonderful kids too, in fact most of the kids are great kids and a few are brats probably in same proportion as years ago.

Here is a little story I witnessed this weekend.

At an event one older kid was watching the gate and taking payment at the entrance and there was a great dinner going on, everyone left and went in to eat dinner and an 8 year old kid came the teenager watching the door and asked if he had his dinner yet, when the older boy said not yet he took the boys plate asked what he wanted and went in and brought him a full dinner.... ALL ON HIS OWN... No parent telling him to do it he just did it, he saw something he could help with and just stepped up an did it...at 8 years old...

You know that boy is taught well at home. That young fella is a great example for even me to follow.

It really touched me to see the someone so young be so thoughtful....

If kids like that are going to be running the world in 30 years... I am good with it.

[wags]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

So a question for the 40+ crowd...

Scale of 1 to 10, where do you think your "importance" sat with your parents?

We were the "get out and play" generations. We were the "I'll smack your arse" generation. We were the herd, parents got us sick with all the childhood ailments - our parents made us prepare to get into the world - and most of us got forced out of the nest when high school was over.

We were not the most important thing in our parents' life.


Kids today, unfortunately they are growing up being told they are the most important thing, the most important commodity society has.

Parents are the ones that need to grow up - the kids haven't changed, they've just been elevated in status.

I'm 42, i have 19, 16, 10 year old girls, 8 year old boy.

I make them go out and play, get dirty, get in trouble, learn about your neighbourhood and environment.

They get their butts spanked when it's warranted, otherwise, groundings or things taken away.

I'm not overly concerned about illnesses because they are vaccinated. What they do get sick from, they get sick, they get better.

They are the most important commodity. They will shape our society's future.

They are also taught that people are equal. That it's not OK to bully someone cause you don't like their skin colour, religion, sexual preference or otherwise. They are also taught to stand up for themselves and others facing those bullies.

They are not allowed to use this forum and what many members say as a guide to how life should be lived, or how people should be treated.

Cheers

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by wags

I'm 42, i have 19, 16, 10 year old girls, 8 year old boy.

I make them go out and play, get dirty, get in trouble, learn about your neighbourhood and environment.

They get their butts spanked when it's warranted, otherwise, groundings or things taken away.

I'm not overly concerned about illnesses because they are vaccinated. What they do get sick from, they get sick, they get better.

They are the most important commodity. They will shape our society's future.

They are also taught that people are equal. That it's not OK to bully someone cause you don't like their skin colour, religion, sexual preference or otherwise. They are also taught to stand up for themselves and others facing those bullies.

That's called parenting.

Originally Posted by wags

They are not allowed to use this forum and what many members say as a guide to how life should be lived, or how people should be treated.

You're worried about how this motley crue is going to affect your kids?

There's a whole internet out there telling them how to live...

[wags]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

That's called parenting.




You're worried about how this motley crue is going to affect your kids?

There's a whole internet out there telling them how to live...

I'm not worried about it, they just are taught better is all.

They don't have much exposure to internet (at kitchen table while doing homework), no cell phones, no tablets, minimal video games (not online games) - OUTSIDE! rain or shine

[MAC]

Originally Posted by nekred

There are some meat headed kids out there, some brats but there are also some wonderful kids too, in fact most of the kids are great kids and a few are brats probably in same proportion as years ago.

Here is a little story I witnessed this weekend.

At an event one older kid was watching the gate and taking payment at the entrance and there was a great dinner going on, everyone left and went in to eat dinner and an 8 year old kid came the teenager watching the door and asked if he had his dinner yet, when the older boy said not yet he took the boys plate asked what he wanted and went in and brought him a full dinner.... ALL ON HIS OWN... No parent telling him to do it he just did it, he saw something he could help with and just stepped up an did it...at 8 years old...

You know that boy is taught well at home. That young fella is a great example for even me to follow.

It really touched me to see the someone so young be so thoughtful....

If kids like that are going to be running the world in 30 years... I am good with it.

Good story I believe there are more like that out there, at the very least they think like that and only need a little guidance and encouragement to get them to do it.

Another good kid story happened to me.
My Father passed away last August, his birthday is in April.
My Mother asked if we could do a little graveside Birthday visit.
Its a Birthday we need cupcakes and juice boxes. We are all on site small group 10 or so. Myself, wife and kids. The same for my siblings.
An older gentleman arrives and looks pretty sombre, visits a nearby grave.
I notice my daughter and one of her cousins, pick up the plate of cupcakes and a few juice boxes without asking and head straight for the older gentleman. At this point all the adults have noticed and are watching.
They introduce themselves and ask if he would like a cupcake and juice.
His smile was all we needed to know we are doing a great job with our kids.
He joined us for a few minutes. It was a bright spot for him to be acknowledged visiting his wifes grave site.
It may have been an intrusion for some, but the fact that they saw someone down and tried to lift them up, it was a pretty proud moment for me.

MAC